| kef June 14 2012 23:04. Posts 282 | Profile # |
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-43767/Worlds-GM-babies-born.html
The world's first geneticallymodified humans have been created, it was revealed last night.
The disclosure that 30 healthy babies were born after a series of experiments in the United States provoked another furious debate about ethics.
So far, two of the babies have been tested and have been found to contain genes from three 'parents'.
The other day I was actually wondering about human cloning: why hasn't it happened yet? My guess is that it already has happened in a secret lab somewhere, it just hasn't been made public; although that could just be wishful thinking on my account.
I understand the reason for people's fear when it comes to human cloning: the rise of a new race of superhumans that wipe out the old-style humans, or creating a world like those of GATTACA or The Sixth Day are scary prospects. However, as we learn more and more about genetics and inheritable disease, it becomes apparent that genetic modification (GM) would be a huge advancement in the prevention/treatment (being one and the same in this case) of such disease.
Anyways, I'd like to open a discussion here on TL about GM and cloning, and see what all you intelligent people think about it.
EDIT: added another source
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/sci/tech/1312708.stm
*Facepalm*
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn712-gm-babies.html
This article is dated may 2001, while the dailymail is dated 14 June 2012
So assuming this happened 11 years ago, what do you guys think the state of human cloning is right now? Could they already be among us?Last edit: 2012-06-14 23:14:43 |
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| VirtuallyJesse United States. June 14 2012 23:07. Posts 288 | Profile # |
On June 14 2012 23:04 kef wrote:The other day I was actually wondering about human cloning: why hasn't it happened yet?
Religion. :/
edit: Apologizes for the low quality post, I'll expand quoting what thegiantnome said, as he/she essientially took the words from my unspoken mouth.
Often ones ethics are based upon ones religion. Whether the religion is based upon a deity is meaningless, however in this situation it is the fault of religions with deities for our lack of exploration in this subject as they believe we are playing the hand of God. Religion is ones belief system, including ethics, so religion is the basis for all arguments. More to the point however religion is what stands in the way of human cloning. I am not an expert on cloning, however if there are no medical issues it is my belief that their is no issue in it. (Don't ban me for religious conversation plox. If I insulted someone in this post I apologize)
User was warned for this postLast edit: 2012-06-15 00:38:18 |
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| anomalopidae Slovenia. June 14 2012 23:07. Posts 216 | Profile # |
| Well myself I have no problem at all with modifying DNA since there are lot of diseases or defects that are based on a single gene and doctors can often notice them before baby is born, it would reduce the burden on parents and state if such defects could be avoided. |
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| SpiffD Denmark. June 14 2012 23:08. Posts 1130 | Profile # |
On June 14 2012 23:07 VirtuallyJesse wrote:
Show nested quote +On June 14 2012 23:04 kef wrote:The other day I was actually wondering about human cloning: why hasn't it happened yet?
Religion. :/
Ethics, more likely.
Other source on this besides dailymail? |
| | Vir prudens non contra ventum mingit |
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| ThePiedPiper Canada. June 14 2012 23:08. Posts 100 | Profile # |
| I feel that with us able to change the genetics, there wont be levels in our society that allow it function the way it does today, but have one level and that would be the top level and the world would crumble |
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| solidbebe Netherlands. June 14 2012 23:11. Posts 3232 | Profile # |
| I don't really have a problem with what they're doing now, but what the future may hold is worrisome. They'll go further and further, when do we stop? I don't think we shoud alter human genes to give them desired properties. |
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| Zahir United States. June 14 2012 23:13. Posts 908 | Profile # |
I'm for it. It should be every parents dream to be surpassed by his children. The same goes for our species as a whole.
However, we should Limit ourselves to... baby steps, at least for a time. The possible benefits of genetic enhancement must be weighed against the danger of accidental degradation. To create even a single human life is an awesome responsibility. Before proceeding with genetic modification, medical professionals should keep to their established standards: first, do no harm, and all that jazz. |
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| Jinsho United Kingdom. June 14 2012 23:13. Posts 3023 | Profile # |
Of course we will genetically modify people. Everyone wants their child to be the best, after all.
It'll be the new Chinese lessons and piano classes for 2 year olds, except it'll take hold earlier.
Don't like it? Too bad. No-one is going to care. |
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| Primal_MK Norway. June 14 2012 23:18. Posts 14 | Profile # |
I understand the reason for people's fear when it comes to human cloning: the rise of a new race of superhumans that wipe out the old-style humans
I never think that would happen. Rather, genetically modified humans would evolve to become the "new" species through time, simply because of darwinism. I don't see it happening like an army of superhumans group up to eradicate the weaker, current species.
To remove sickness and disease from our DNA would undoubtedly make the human species stronger in the long run, but what would the physiological implications of that be? Would we accept nothing but perfect? Even more stress to become something you can't? We see a trend like this already today, so I wouldn't strive to make this trend even stronger.
As for cloning and genetical experiments in general, I have little problem seeing it being done. I view it sort of as a part of human and technological evolution. |
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| sigma_x Australia. June 14 2012 23:18. Posts 274 | Profile # |
There really is no theoretical problem, though in practice we don't know the ramifications of what they're doing. What I worry about for example, is whether this will have any effect on future generations of people if these genetically modified people have children with people who are born 'normally' (and then they have children, etc.) Will it be harmless? Will it 'contaminate' the gene pool? Or will they have children who will suffer from birth defects? I'm not sure the answers to these are obvious.
Edit: oh, i just read the articles added in the edit section. I suppose these aren't concerns in the present case, but perhaps it useful as a more general point.Last edit: 2012-06-14 23:21:13 |
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| SpiffD Denmark. June 14 2012 23:20. Posts 1130 | Profile # |
No one seems to find this problematic ethically?
Still waiting for confirmation via another source.... |
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| Iranon United States. June 14 2012 23:21. Posts 963 | Profile Blog # |
On June 14 2012 23:08 ThePiedPiper wrote:
I feel that with us able to change the genetics, there wont be levels in our society that allow it function the way it does today, but have one level and that would be the top level and the world would crumble
But how is that substantively different from what already exists? It's worrying, yes, but really there's very little difference between a rich upper class being the only ones with access to superior healthcare and a rich upper class being the only whose chose children are guaranteed to be free of hereditary disorders. |
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| zezamer Finland. June 14 2012 23:22. Posts 1805 | Profile # |
| Well they didn't even alter the real DNA. Only replaced real mother's mitochondria with the healthy donors working ones. |
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 white_horse June 14 2012 23:25. Posts 951 | Profile # |
| gene manipulation would be a great way to fix the tons of diseases out there caused by genes. And somebody cloned a human? Where are you getting your news lol? Cloning something is really hard and takes a lot of trial and error. Successfully cloning even something like a mouse or rabbit is already really hard with current technology. Last edit: 2012-06-14 23:27:17 |
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| Probe1 United States. June 14 2012 23:25. Posts 16445 | Profile Blog # |
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| Zahir United States. June 14 2012 23:27. Posts 908 | Profile # |
On June 14 2012 23:20 SpiffD wrote:
No one seems to find this problematic ethically?
Still waiting for confirmation via another source....
The only problems I see are technical, i.e. can we be acceptably certain that these modifications will help make the individuals lives better.
If we can do it, and can be reasonably sure it will work, not only should we be allowed to, I would argue that its a moral imperative. You can't just sit by and say welp, I could have used gm to save him from that congenital disease...... But Jesus wouldn't be cool with it. |
| | What is best? To crush the Zerg, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of the Protoss. |
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| Bippzy United States. June 14 2012 23:28. Posts 1334 | Profile Blog # |
| It'll be interesting, I even think this was bound to happen. Will it ruin their lives? maybe. Will it ruin our lives? Probably not. |
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| hoby2000 United States. June 14 2012 23:29. Posts 703 | Profile Blog # |
On June 14 2012 23:07 VirtuallyJesse wrote:
Show nested quote +On June 14 2012 23:04 kef wrote:The other day I was actually wondering about human cloning: why hasn't it happened yet?
Religion. :/
Really? Religion? You're saying that people having a set of beliefs is the reason we haven't cloned humans yet?
I know what you really meant because of the context of the conversation, but next time you should choose your words more wisely. Consider yourself warned.
EDIT: My opinion on this subject - I don't see why this is wrong in any way. We've been genetically modifying plants and animals for years. The only reason people are getting their panties in a twist over cloning is because humans seem to think they're better or above every other living thing on this planet. Oh sure, genetically modify everything else but HUMANS?! That's just wrong!
What I'm saying is that if you eat GMO foods (if you don't know what GMO is, then you probably consume said GMO foods on a daily basis) then you're being a hypocrite if you think this is wrong.Last edit: 2012-06-14 23:31:45 |
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| Nightsz Canada. June 14 2012 23:30. Posts 248 | Profile Blog # |
problem with cloning is that, DNA forensics is going to be useless altogether.
Think about metal gear solidLast edit: 2012-06-14 23:30:38 |
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| Nevermind86 Somalia. June 14 2012 23:31. Posts 410 | Profile # |
| We should honestly create a race of super humans. Why not?, wouldn't that be evolution?, the only reason you can be against super humans is because you cannot be one yourself. I rather have a super human kid if I could, that a regular one, imagine stronger, more beatiful, more intelligent humans that could live 300 years or something that would be great, I'd like to be part of that. If we could have the technology there is no reason not to do it, evolution happends this time because of technology, leave the weak behind, if it would only make us better there is no reason not to. Last edit: 2012-06-14 23:32:23 |
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