| bmoneyAK June 16 2012 03:23. Posts 79 | Profile # |
Hi,
I am a believer in the "learn to macro first" school of thought and I'd like to learn some more micro focused play. This thread is predicated on the fact that I'm able to execute basic builds like FilterSC's 1 rax FE tutorials. Are 111 pushes a good way to learn advanced micro?
I was watching ForGG's stream and he seems to 111 a ton, which isn't what I see at tournaments or in most casts. What's the deal with that? Is that his style, something he just likes to practice, or the nature of the KR server?
Thanks TL.
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| -FoX United States. June 16 2012 03:51. Posts 463 | Profile # |
On June 16 2012 03:23 bmoneyAK wrote:
Hi,
I am a believer in the "learn to macro first" school of thought and I'd like to learn some more micro focused play. This thread is predicated on the fact that I'm able to execute basic builds like FilterSC's 1 rax FE tutorials. Are 111 pushes a good way to learn advanced micro?
I was watching ForGG's stream and he seems to 111 a ton, which isn't what I see at tournaments or in most casts. What's the deal with that? Is that his style, something he just likes to practice, or the nature of the KR server?
Thanks TL.
I'd say if anything it's a KR ladder mindset. A lot of one-base play and cheesing on the KR server. It's not used that often in tournaments because it is one of the one-base plays that is seen the most and therefore most players are prepared against it. Also in BO3s, you don't want to be 1-1-1ing every game so it makes sense that it isn't use as often as it is on the ladder. |
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| CapnAmerica United States. June 16 2012 03:57. Posts 484 | Profile Blog # |
The one base builds that you see repeated are solid all-ins, they may not win Bo3s for you, but they can take a game off of someone. The large upside to this from a practice point of view is that if you can have perfect macro and stellar micro on one base, you have at least mastered one piece of the game. Then you can work on your macro as your economy is stronger (2 / 3 base).
Plus, engagements with 1 Base builds are much more critical to your success, so practicing them this way will make you better at, say, low army harassment styles and other technical plays that play a very large role as Terran.
Basically, it's good, yes, there are better things though and you need to focus on learning them, too. |
| | After all this time, I still haven't figured out the correlation between sexual orientation and beating an unprepared opponent. Are homosexuals the next koreans? Many players seem to think it's an unfair advantage. - pandaburn | |
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| architecture United States. June 16 2012 04:23. Posts 554 | Profile Blog # |
I agree with practicing 1 base.
Many 1 base builds are viable strategies, and you will need to learn the micro, and how to adapt to various situations with those builds.
Besides, in TvP, especially, these are legitimate threats - and I would consider 1 base openings as viable as 1raxCC. In contrast to TvZ/T, all of these openings in TvP are gambling that your opponent picked an inferior build. |
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| Jombozeus China. June 16 2012 04:25. Posts 1000 | Profile Blog # |
Practicing 1-1-1 vs. a 1rax expand or reaper expand for 15 games in a row did two things for me:
1. Made my 1-1-1 extremely good
2. Made my siege timings and vision-awareness extremely good
The second part can be applied to any macro situation in tvt and in a lesser extent tvz. It did help me no doubt. 1250 master last season. |
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| ErrorNA United States. June 16 2012 04:33. Posts 86 | Profile # |
| Learn how to macro first, micro and other things are all included. You need to be able to play a standard solid game and the better you get at that, the better you get at the game, The other builds are to get wins like in a best of 3 or something of that type, just winning on ladder doesnt make you better. i could cheese everygame and get wins that doesnt mean i am good at the game, or improving. |
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| Sennin Belgium. June 16 2012 04:35. Posts 50 | Profile # |
On June 16 2012 04:25 Jombozeus wrote:
Practicing 1-1-1 vs. a 1rax expand or reaper expand for 15 games in a row did two things for me:
1. Made my 1-1-1 extremely good
2. Made my siege timings and vision-awareness extremely good
The second part can be applied to any macro situation in tvt and in a lesser extent tvz. It did help me no doubt. 1250 master last season.
Did you use the same variation in every matchup or do you use others for different matchups. I'm in the same boat as the OP. I can excecute FilterSC's build pretty well but I need some good basic multitask (scout with scv while doing build and such) and micro to get the full power out of my skills. |
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| U_G_L_Y United States. June 16 2012 05:33. Posts 458 | Profile Blog # |
| Specialist's 111 really really helped my drop+attack+macro multitask a TON. Like, practice it against a P friend 20 times and then see how much better your normal 1 rax fe 10 min medivac poke is. |
| | I'm older than NesTea and slower than GoOdy |
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| bmoneyAK June 16 2012 05:41. Posts 79 | Profile # | |
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| Sennin Belgium. June 16 2012 05:45. Posts 50 | Profile # | |
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| U_G_L_Y United States. June 16 2012 07:31. Posts 458 | Profile Blog # |
^^^ What he said.
FYI, vs nexus first, you SHOULD lose to a good player with this build, so you need to scout before your factory is done and if so, get seige mode and 2 tanks as fast as you possibly can (no starport.) I like to proxy a second barracks on maps with a ramp at the natural for high ground vision rather than push a lot later with a banshee. If they go core before expo, you should win at least until high diamond. |
| | I'm older than NesTea and slower than GoOdy |
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| rd United States. June 16 2012 08:53. Posts 2066 | Profile # |
On June 16 2012 03:23 bmoneyAK wrote:
Hi,
I am a believer in the "learn to macro first" school of thought and I'd like to learn some more micro focused play. This thread is predicated on the fact that I'm able to execute basic builds like FilterSC's 1 rax FE tutorials. Are 111 pushes a good way to learn advanced micro?
I was watching ForGG's stream and he seems to 111 a ton, which isn't what I see at tournaments or in most casts. What's the deal with that? Is that his style, something he just likes to practice, or the nature of the KR server?
Thanks TL.
You don't need to go out of your way to practice micro by 1 basing. It won't get you farther than sticking to solid builds that put you into realistic situations. It's as simple as focusing more on controlling your engagements in a normal macro game over everything else. Build handspeed and slowly work being able to handle your money/production whilst you micro, and suddenly you're playing at 240 apm in GM with enough practice.
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| c0sm0naut United States. June 16 2012 10:23. Posts 532 | Profile # |
well i swap back and forth between sessions where i all in and sessions where i macro every game, but i think its more important to learn macro first.
i have tightened up my 1-1-1 to a really high level execution and this has given me a sick tool in a Bo3 especially against other terrans ( i dont 1-1-1 much vs protoss, but i will in a bo3), you have no idea how much of an asset it is to be able to switch between macro builds and all out aggression vs opponents in a series but you have to make sure to be able to do both or you'll get known for one and not do well
edit: another reason you are seeing 1-1-1 in forgg's stream is not only KR server (very cheesy) but because forgg is one of those players that just needs a solid timing to do well in a matchup. he will macro out of the 1-1-1 extremely well (as i'm sure you've seen) and have an opportunity to end the game early or pretty much auto win vs a cc first on certain maps (entombed valley). with his level of execution, 1-1-1 is a solid macro build is what i'm trying to say. it's only because he is able to get maximum value out of his units. this is another reason why i'd say at a high level, 1-1-1 is a harder build to execute than 1 rax fe. with 1 rax fe, all you need to do is survive with equal or slightly less workers, whereas with 1-1-1 if you expo during attack (all good players do) and lose your push, you can find yourself having to fend off 2 dropships of +1/stim marines that have the potential to camp your production and just end the game. Last edit: 2012-06-16 10:28:34 |
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| Freeze967 United States. June 16 2012 10:44. Posts 211 | Profile # |
| If you want to learn to micro, just do things like Marine Split Challenge or Marine Tank Challenge. Or just do a game vs AI and practice stutter stepping marines. Any normal build will work/ |
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| Mstring Australia. June 16 2012 10:54. Posts 420 | Profile # |
| Learning to macro doesn't necessarily mean learning to take extra bases every single game, it means learning to do whatever economic strategy you like but as optimally as possible every single game. |
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| monk United States. June 16 2012 10:58. Posts 6824 | Profile Blog # |
| Simple questions thread. Check strategy forum guidelines. |
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