The ramps are very narrow, the map is chokey in very important places (where battles would be fought). It would be hard to go past 4 bases (almost impossible), and the third is very poorly positioned. It is siegable from the back, and even high-ground ranged units can hit it. While this might be alright for a fourth (Cloud Kingdom), here you will see only 2 base all ins from non-zerg races. Also, FFE seems very difficult (metalopolis level difficult). This is because it's very hard to wall in and be safe (lings can sneak around by the side/behind the nexus).
Coppermantis United States. June 17 2012 12:50. Posts 363
Huh, I suspected the exact opposite, I thought the map was too open. I'll reverse the third and move it back so it's not siege-able (This is the same issue that killed another map I made, you'd think I would learn.) and widen the ramps too. Also, I'll make the natural choke smaller to make FFE more viable. That would work, wouldn't it?
Last edit: 2012-06-17 12:52:33
asiantraceur United States. June 17 2012 12:56. Posts 93
i think the rush distances are a bit too long. you can make the map smaller by making the main (bottom one for example) and move it closer to the natural. for the bottom main, move it closer to the third. make the third minerals facing the other direction and get rid of that semi-backdoor. shave off a bit from the middle and compress the map a bit.
the blue mineral bases in the middle should move closer to the middle and more toward the opponent main. (1/2 base moves more to 3, 7/8 base moves more to the 9)
Never Surrender. Never GG. Always Fighting. BW4LYF. Woo Jung Ho Never Forget.
A couple things I noticed about it-- -It seems like it would be too easy for protoss to hold an early third. I think you'd see a lot of boring protoss turtle games. -The fourth is impossible to take. There is no logical direction of expansion. -You'll neved have anyone take the gold bases. No one gets that much of an advantage from gold anymore... at least not when its that vulnerable. I like the idea of making it a risk but do it in a way that makes the risk worth it. Maybe two High Yield Gases on a normal base? That could make for interesting play. -Its really tough to control attack lanes. Daybreak is kinda like that but on DB there's a way to control a lot if you can position yourself at the tower holding the middle base. On this map I feel like the only way I could play would be to turtle on 3 bases and make a doom push, which isn't what anyone wants to happen... Overall I like the ideas and think it has a lot of potential, just needs some tweaks
Coppermantis United States. June 19 2012 02:10. Posts 363
What about adding another base a little between the third and what is currently the opponent's fifth? That would act as a fourth and the current fourth and enemy fifth could be taken as your own fifth and sixth bases. The gold patches with high-yield gas added would remain "neutral" in the center. Essentially instead of the current: Bottom=You, Top=Enemy it would become: Right=You, Left=Enemy.
As for the difficult attack lanes and Protoss turtling, I'll take it into consideration for further versions and if testing reveals a significant issue I'll try to fix anything that pops up. I'm not sure about the easy Protoss third though, what is it that is making it so easy?
I like the idea of splitting it into a right left feel--that could create interesting give and take play. Adding another base would make that better and more fluid. The reason it seems easy for protoss turtling is because the entrance into the natural and the ramp down to the third are right next to each other. So it would be really easy to go from defending the nat to defending the third, while the attacker has to take a much longer route around. On DB its about the same distance for attacking and defense of the third/nat
mostevil United Kingdom. June 19 2012 06:35. Posts 368
You should edit up the OP with the wider ramps image up top, didn't spot the imgur link at first.
This might be the point, but If you go down the left flank the distance to switch around to the right or centre is insane and the high ground covers everything. I can see a planetary and a couple of tanks shutting half the map down, a tank on the corner towers covers the side ramp to/from the gold too which seems very beefy, but maybe its hard to maintain in practice....
Even with the bigger ramp, the back door to the third can be easily walled on the high ground too, making it one entrance to defend 3 bases (it even mostly shuts down air access from that side), I can imagine a force big enough to break that being easily surrounded or open counter attack. Not sure if thats an issue as it doesn't have any spawning bases on the EU version so I can't try it other than to look!
The three towers seems a bit much especially with the two side ones covering the middle one? I kinda feel that two big ramps separated a bit in the middle might be more interesting than one uber ramp onto the high ground? (same overall ramp area but more spread out, this is just a personal thing I wanna see in a map :D)
Again not tried it but is the ramp to the natural close enough to the nexus placement for a sensible FFE? Looks like it will take 3 buildings or too many bustable pylons, it also seems a bit too open to the far side to me. Main ramp seems too wide for a forcefield too, which obviously is bad vs 6pools and for pvp. (might be me looking at it funny)
Genuinely like the different concept and the aesthetics but it looks like a tankers dream and needs some of the more standard elements incorporating for the early game. (Again I might just be viewing it wrong because I can't put buildings on it!!!)