[H] TvZ mech

I don't know why I lost, i should have turtle'd more?

Some tips to improve my gameplay? Thanks.

I had better economy all the game than the Z, more bases, more tech, more upgrades, and i just got killed T__T.

http://drop.sc/207791

Worker Drop Chile. June 26 2012 05:45. Posts 9

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Maybe better Comp?

scudst0rm Canada. June 26 2012 05:57. Posts 861

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Please read:

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=338554

You need to put a little more effort in to your OP if you want people to take the time to watch the replay and give you meaningful feedback.

You're like a one ranger army comin' at me...

Worker Drop Chile. June 26 2012 06:11. Posts 9

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Mmm... I really don't know, I mean.

I should have destroyed the third? My timing were bad? Maybe better composition?

I really don't know why I lost, thats why i'm asking if I should have waited to 200/200 ( The broods would been there if i waited that much) to atack. Also, masybe better composition, in early game more tanks and less Thors.

But i guess I said everything, also, im from Chile, my english is pretty bad. What should have i done? I should have done more damage with my banshees?

I'm asking for help, thats all, I don't really understand this Match-up so I want some help =/. Also, i would love tips to know what my oponent is doing with early Scout, and when to scout/Scan.

PVequalsNRT United States. June 26 2012 06:32. Posts 12

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Hey, I've a 2 year mid master zerg player (40's) that's recently switched over to Terran (currently 13th in my masters division), and I absolutely love mech vs zerg. Without watching the replay, because I am at work, I can't comment on your composition or opening, but I just wanted to talk about scan/scouting timings and locations.

Vs Zerg, I open very aggressive reactor hellion expand, so even into the midgame, I'm getting a scout on units and tech at their front. After the zerg finally shuts down access to their bases, it is important to know when lair tech is out, and what they will be going. Most players that I play vs on the ladder have 1 or 2 likely positions for common tech, which is very often next to their lair/hive building or behind the natural expansion. Constant scans are extremetly important to know when mutas might be coming out, and to be honest, I'm never locked for minerals when I mech, so the loss of mules does not bother my gameplay.

Ultimately, as a meching player, you only want as much AA as you can get away with and stay alive, everything else should be hellions, tanks and mauraders/ghosts. If you do scout a muta transition, then you can build 4-5 thors, and put up as many turrets as you need.

If you scout a BroodLord transition, I immediately put down 3 reactor starports. Pump only hellions and vikings to augment your probably high tank count at this point in the game.

A good time to push a zerg across the map is about 160-170 food, depending on the game of course. I push out and rally all my factories to my push, and pump mostly hellions.

Worker Drop Chile. June 26 2012 06:47. Posts 9

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Thanks, I'm really grateful with your answer. Also, you are right, with mech you always float on minerals, so.. i should scan more often to know exactly what my oponent is doing. I guess i over-mass thors in the beggining ( I'm always scared of mutas), also, i should get marauders? I don't get those.

Actually.. i went Rax fe, into fast banshee with reactored hellions, my harrass was poor, but i don't think it would change the course of the game.

My worst mistake was that my pushes didn't do any damage, but i don't know what to do to change that, I't wasn't a Macro mistake ( Or i think so, i did'nt had enough gas).

Thanks, and I hope you check the rep so you can help me more in this match-up.

Psychobabas United Kingdom. June 26 2012 07:36. Posts 1957

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I watched your replay. I have been playing mech TvZ for 2 years

You could have easily beaten him but you didnt react to his broodlords :/

Just another 2 starports and you would have be fine. I don't understand why you didn't make vikings

Also, when you float minerals, it is a good idea to sacrifice some scvs (OR dont replenish them when they die, OR put them on autorepair to support your army) and make extra orbitals and some defensive planetary fortresses. With mech, minerals arent that important since you can easily have 2k in the bank and very little gas. So try to use that to your advantage.

Additionally, make some sensor towers at key location so your tanks are always ready and slowly add ravens with seeker missile, they are incredibly helpful vs broodlords, corruptors and bunched up ground armies.

But the real mistake you made was not making viking vs his broodlords. There was no excuse for that since you already saw his corruptors when he killed your banshees, remember?

Last edit: 2012-06-26 07:40:19

ChoJJa for life!

CatNzHat United States. June 26 2012 08:16. Posts 1290

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Watched the replay, you should ignore PvequalsNRT on matters of unit comp, not everything he says is wrong, but the parts he has right seem to be by accident.

You had a really nice early game with some harass, of course there's always room for improvement here, some better hellion and banshee control might have been able to do a bit more damage, but in this case it was kind of a wash.

Zerg was sitting on 3 bases making roaches and lings, which mech is quite good at killing.

Your appear to lack a gameplan with mech, you expand freely (which would get shut down by a few lings if you played a good zerg), and then you attack whenever you feel like.

Your gameplan should be survive everything zerg throws at you as you sit on 3 bases building up a big army, of course you can try to secure a fourth if you want, but don't over-extend a low tank count to try to save it if zerg is clearly trying to kill it, as your primary goal is to keep your army alive.

Clear up creep when you get the chance, your first attack would have killed zerg if you'd controlled it better and been sieged when he engaged you, but if he can see the instant you unsiege then you're going to have way more trouble, so scan and kill the creep before you move forward.

Your first attack went so poorly that you should have lost the game right there, but you had 5 banshees so he eventually retreated (even though he should have just traded the roaches for more damage as banshees don't kill them quickly).

I would say ignore the rest of the game, but since zerg was only on 3 bases and you had 2 hidden expos yourself, you could have still won the game. Here's how you could have made the comeback:

Sending a banshee around to scout for his fourth while building up around a half dozen tanks to secure your third against roach ling aggression, and then maxing out with the rest thors, scanning his main every minute or so, and building 2 extra staports when you see hive starting. Once you max out, you can either attempt to secure more bases, or pull a bunch of scvs and attack (securing the top middle base behind your push).

From there, macro CCs and more production and buildling up raven count and energy, and running banshees and hellions around the map harassing drones, forcing him to build spines/spores to protect his bases.

PVequalsNRT United States. June 26 2012 08:33. Posts 12

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Watched the replay, you should ignore PvequalsNRT on matters of unit comp, not everything he says is wrong, but the parts he has right seem to be by accident.

Hey man, I'm just explaining how I win the majority of my TvZ's. If you dislike what I say, it doesn't mean I'm wrong. If you watched how I play TvZ, I'm sure you'd understand.

Worker Drop Chile. June 26 2012 14:57. Posts 9

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Thanks to both of us, I will try to improve with this tips.. I always atack fast because i want to do a push before broodlords, min 15 its a good timing right??

And you are right, im starting to play mech so i don't really know what my gameplan is, or when to atack, those tips will really help me. One question, with mech is better to push slowly and safe right?

Or i should try to siege near his exp, so i can avoid ultra fast mass roaches?

Also, i should search for chokes? ( Or choques?, I mean, passages).

Procify United States. June 26 2012 23:50. Posts 52

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On June 26 2012 14:57 Worker Drop wrote:
Thanks to both of us, I will try to improve with this tips.. I always atack fast because i want to do a push before broodlords, min 15 its a good timing right??

And you are right, im starting to play mech so i don't really know what my gameplan is, or when to atack, those tips will really help me. One question, with mech is better to push slowly and safe right?

Or i should try to siege near his exp, so i can avoid ultra fast mass roaches?

Also, i should search for chokes? ( Or choques?, I mean, passages).

It's good to experiment with helion runbys and drops. They're just like marines but more annoying because they kill workers faster and are more mobile.

A Zerg will usually have brood tech by 15 minutes. So try to attack around 12 (maybe while taking your fourth base).

The thing about mech is that while it's great in deathball form, if you harass and manage to do damage it's very good at being just plain annoying too.

Needs more breakable rocks.

CtrlShiftAltGrrrrrrr June 26 2012 23:56. Posts 544

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just want to see that workers drops are the best ceremony of all time, especially from cc to build cc underneath, cheers. and yea op is lacking

awaiting the return of the space cowboy

vBr Sweden. June 27 2012 00:10. Posts 175

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Hello.

I used to be an exclusive mech player in TvZ until I reached about 1200~ points in master (and the latest patch was released) and realised that, alas, it is simply not a viable strategy that is to be used in everyday situations. You can reach GM with it, but there's a reason why players like Goody no longer plays mech.

The patch changed the ways that TvZ works and mech was pretty much reliant on zerg not being allowed to take a third until 10~ minutes, because the mech player will not have a sufficient amount of defence to hold a strong roach attack until much later. Today, there is no reliable way to prevent a zerg from grabbing a 6-7 min third and can therefore execute pushes far stronger in the midgame than they previously could (mech can't defend a stephano/drg-esque 12 min 200 roach attack, there is just no way).. Add to this that a meching terran has literally no way to punish any kind of excessive greedyness (such as not getting a baneling nest, such as only building the bare minimum defences etc).

Banshee's used to be the solution until zergs learned how to properly deal with them, but since they all get 4-6 queens now as it is, you will not deal crippling damage to a good zerg player. That, and a Banshee takes 6 hits to kill a Roach.

Until HotS, you are simply better off going bio.

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