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| WaveofShadow Canada. July 13 2012 16:25. Posts 5230 | Profile Blog # |
On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
What? That's not the numbers I saw...it looked to me as though her ult had a 1%/25 AP ratio and her E was less than a 1:1 AP ratio (unless you mean because it hits twice?), I'm almost sure of it. Her Q and E each have AD ratios now as well though...can't remember the exact numbers.
Her ult is AMAZING. I think it's going to need to be nerfed honestly. At ult level 3 if she hits 5 champions she will be shielded for 1500 HP. (300 shield/champ. It's 150 at level 1, 225 at level 2)
The range of her losing stealth is pretty huge honestly. You will need mobilities and to use her W activate every time you want to close in on someone, but if you do that they will in all likelihood not be able to get out without taking SOME damage at least, and then as you spam spells on them you chase like a motherfucker. The ONLY thing I don't like about the Eve change is her re-stealthing time.
It's fucking like 10 seconds after the last tick of whatever damage she takes. Ugh.
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| | twitch.tv/waveofshadow ||| Winner of AHGL's So You Think You Can Cast!! GG Soniv! |
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| Ryuu314 United States. July 13 2012 16:28. Posts 5315 | Profile # |
On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
So with new Xin you'd go what? 9/21/0 then get FH, Randuins, Ghostblade for near-max cdr? I suppose that could work. His new ulti is fuckign ridiculous tho. Massive damage, massive armor+mr buff if you hit enough targets, and it's basically a melee gragas ult that isolates the guy you're beating up. I'd have to play him/see him played, but yea iunno. He might be worth picking up in competitive teams if only for his ulti lol.
On July 13 2012 16:25 WaveofShadow wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
What? That's not the numbers I saw...it looked to me as though her ult had a 1%/25 AP ratio and her E was less than a 1:1 AP ratio (unless you mean because it hits twice?), I'm almost sure of it. Her Q and E each have AD ratios now as well though...can't remember the exact numbers. Her ult is AMAZING. I think it's going to need to be nerfed honestly. At ult level 3 if she hits 5 champions she will be shielded for 1500 HP. (300 shield/champ. It's 150 at level 1, 225 at level 2) The range of her losing stealth is pretty huge honestly. You will need mobilities and to use her W activate every time you want to close in on someone, but if you do that they will in all likelihood not be able to get out without taking SOME damage at least, and then as you spam spells on them you chase like a motherfucker. The ONLY thing I don't like about the Eve change is her re-stealthing time. It's fucking like 10 seconds after the last tick of whatever damage she takes. Ugh.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-0ewERMI9JtE/T_--hbTTrLI/AAAAAAAACeM/dalkelp7oqc/s1600/eveabilities.png
That screenshot shows AP on E scaling at 0.5 per hit. It hits twice so it's still 1.0. Guy has 50 AP and his ult gets +1%, so it should be 1%/50 AP.
Her ratios should be:
Q: 0.45 AP + 0.4 bonus AD
W: nothing
E: 0.5 AP + 0.4 bonus AD
R: 1%/50 AP
She should probably be built tanky AP. Abyssal Zhonyas into more tank or something like that.Last edit: 2012-07-13 16:33:21 |
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| Sufficiency Canada. July 13 2012 16:30. Posts 7280 | Profile Blog # |
On July 13 2012 14:49 Ryuu314 wrote:
I'm hoping that her seed generation rate goes down with levels. The number of seeds you can store at once shouldn't be an issue if the seed generation rate is fast enough. It doesn't appear that there's a hard cap on the number of plants/seeds you can have on the field at a time though; it seems only limited by cooldown.
Her skills having bad ratios I can be okay with so long as she can summon enough stuff to make up for it. From the looks of it, lvl 2 plants with 50 AP deal 70 damage a hit, which imo is very respectable (unless they have super slow attack speeds or something).
Looking at how her kit works from SkinSpotlight, the non-plant, non-ultimate part looks a LOT like Lux's kit in range and in effect. E actually passes through enemies AND seeds. |
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| Sufficiency Canada. July 13 2012 16:34. Posts 7280 | Profile Blog # |
On July 13 2012 16:25 WaveofShadow wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
What? That's not the numbers I saw...it looked to me as though her ult had a 1%/25 AP ratio and her E was less than a 1:1 AP ratio (unless you mean because it hits twice?), I'm almost sure of it. Her Q and E each have AD ratios now as well though...can't remember the exact numbers. Her ult is AMAZING. I think it's going to need to be nerfed honestly. At ult level 3 if she hits 5 champions she will be shielded for 1500 HP. (300 shield/champ. It's 150 at level 1, 225 at level 2) The range of her losing stealth is pretty huge honestly. You will need mobilities and to use her W activate every time you want to close in on someone, but if you do that they will in all likelihood not be able to get out without taking SOME damage at least, and then as you spam spells on them you chase like a motherfucker. The ONLY thing I don't like about the Eve change is her re-stealthing time. It's fucking like 10 seconds after the last tick of whatever damage she takes. Ugh.
The stealth is good enough if you ask me. If I lane mid, say, and I am off the map, my opponent basically can't push, because I can just circle around and cut off his escape. With her high AP ratio (her AD ratio is also fantastic, so maybe gunblade 1st...) and that crazy shield, she can duel any conventional AP mid and chase like hell.
I will probably try her a few games first. If it works out well I will consider buying dual penetration runes for some lolz.
On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
Wait. Are you saying her Q is now kind of like Twitch's R? That's actually great. If it's around 400 range it's probably good enough as lane harass.Last edit: 2012-07-13 16:40:02 |
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| IMoperator July 13 2012 16:39. Posts 1654 | Profile # |
| What are you supposed to do vs. easy farmers mid? I play champs like veigar, annie and lux and I always fall behind in cs to people like morgana, karthus, ahri, TF, heimer, morde etc. They all have good aoe spells that can hit basically the whole minion wave while things like annie's w or veigar's w only hit a few minions at a time. I'm not sure what to do because they can just get a shit ton more farm than me, and I can't really do much about it. plz don't say pick a different champ btw. |
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| WaveofShadow Canada. July 13 2012 16:40. Posts 5230 | Profile Blog # |
On July 13 2012 16:28 Ryuu314 wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
So with new Xin you'd go what? 9/21/0 then get FH, Randuins, Ghostblade for near-max cdr? I suppose that could work. His new ulti is fuckign ridiculous tho. Massive damage, massive armor+mr buff if you hit enough targets, and it's basically a melee gragas ult that isolates the guy you're beating up. I'd have to play him/see him played, but yea iunno. He might be worth picking up in competitive teams if only for his ulti lol.
Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 16:25 WaveofShadow wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
What? That's not the numbers I saw...it looked to me as though her ult had a 1%/25 AP ratio and her E was less than a 1:1 AP ratio (unless you mean because it hits twice?), I'm almost sure of it. Her Q and E each have AD ratios now as well though...can't remember the exact numbers. Her ult is AMAZING. I think it's going to need to be nerfed honestly. At ult level 3 if she hits 5 champions she will be shielded for 1500 HP. (300 shield/champ. It's 150 at level 1, 225 at level 2) The range of her losing stealth is pretty huge honestly. You will need mobilities and to use her W activate every time you want to close in on someone, but if you do that they will in all likelihood not be able to get out without taking SOME damage at least, and then as you spam spells on them you chase like a motherfucker. The ONLY thing I don't like about the Eve change is her re-stealthing time. It's fucking like 10 seconds after the last tick of whatever damage she takes. Ugh.
That screenshot shows AP on E scaling at 0.5 per hit. It hits twice so it's still 1.0. Guy has 50 AP and his ult gets +1%, so it should be 1%/50 AP. Her ratios should be: Q: 0.45 AP + 0.4 bonus AD W: nothing E: 0.5 AP + 0.4 bonus AD R: 1%/50 AP She should probably be built tanky AP. Abyssal Zhonyas into more tank or something like that.
Sitting in a game with Kage's right now (25AP) and I have the 1% extra AP on ult.
Edit: Hmm.... and at 50 AP it's still 1%? uhhh.... something not right here
And now at 70AP it's STILL 1%???
Ok at 110 it's 2%...I wonder if the 1% at 25AP is a visual bug on the tooltip...?
Ok...at 90AP it's STILL 2%. WTF.
And at 75AP.Last edit: 2012-07-13 16:51:52 |
| | twitch.tv/waveofshadow ||| Winner of AHGL's So You Think You Can Cast!! GG Soniv! |
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| Sufficiency Canada. July 13 2012 16:52. Posts 7280 | Profile Blog # |
On July 13 2012 16:39 IMoperator wrote:
What are you supposed to do vs. easy farmers mid? I play champs like veigar, annie and lux and I always fall behind in cs to people like morgana, karthus, ahri, TF, heimer, morde etc. They all have good aoe spells that can hit basically the whole minion wave while things like annie's w or veigar's w only hit a few minions at a time. I'm not sure what to do because they can just get a shit ton more farm than me, and I can't really do much about it. plz don't say pick a different champ btw.
Against Morgana there really isn't much to do, except you can push the wave back as hard as you can to prevent her from stealing your wraith, or you can harass her. Typically you can win the trade against Morgana so long as she does not land her Q on you regardless if she E herself or not, although you might get outsustained. Also her AA range is pretty sad.
Against Karthus it's really about dodging his Q. The rest is pretty simple imo.
Agains TF you need to punish him for ulting and push lane back as fast as you can. Also keeping pressure up will prevent him from sustaining his mana with blue card.
Against Mordekaiser it really depends on who you are playing. In general he does not pose a great threat to you if you are ranged so you can probably free farm as easily as he can. If he doesn't charge his shield (unlikely!), obviously you can harass him; if he does charge his shield, that means he is pushing the lane, so ask for a gank. Mordekaiser has no escapes and he is very vulnerable to a red buff gank around lvl 3-4.
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| Seuss United States. July 13 2012 16:52. Posts 2981 | Profile Blog # |
On July 13 2012 16:40 WaveofShadow wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 16:28 Ryuu314 wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
So with new Xin you'd go what? 9/21/0 then get FH, Randuins, Ghostblade for near-max cdr? I suppose that could work. His new ulti is fuckign ridiculous tho. Massive damage, massive armor+mr buff if you hit enough targets, and it's basically a melee gragas ult that isolates the guy you're beating up. I'd have to play him/see him played, but yea iunno. He might be worth picking up in competitive teams if only for his ulti lol.
On July 13 2012 16:25 WaveofShadow wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
What? That's not the numbers I saw...it looked to me as though her ult had a 1%/25 AP ratio and her E was less than a 1:1 AP ratio (unless you mean because it hits twice?), I'm almost sure of it. Her Q and E each have AD ratios now as well though...can't remember the exact numbers. Her ult is AMAZING. I think it's going to need to be nerfed honestly. At ult level 3 if she hits 5 champions she will be shielded for 1500 HP. (300 shield/champ. It's 150 at level 1, 225 at level 2) The range of her losing stealth is pretty huge honestly. You will need mobilities and to use her W activate every time you want to close in on someone, but if you do that they will in all likelihood not be able to get out without taking SOME damage at least, and then as you spam spells on them you chase like a motherfucker. The ONLY thing I don't like about the Eve change is her re-stealthing time. It's fucking like 10 seconds after the last tick of whatever damage she takes. Ugh.
That screenshot shows AP on E scaling at 0.5 per hit. It hits twice so it's still 1.0. Guy has 50 AP and his ult gets +1%, so it should be 1%/50 AP. Her ratios should be: Q: 0.45 AP + 0.4 bonus AD W: nothing E: 0.5 AP + 0.4 bonus AD R: 1%/50 AP She should probably be built tanky AP. Abyssal Zhonyas into more tank or something like that.
Sitting in a game with Kage's right now (25AP) and I have the 1% extra AP on ult. Edit: Hmm.... and at 50 AP it's still 1%? uhhh.... something not right here And now at 70AP it's STILL 1%??? Ok at 110 it's 2%...I wonder if the 1% at 25AP is a visual bug on the tooltip...? Ok...at 90AP it's STILL 2%. WTF. And at 75AP.
It's called rounding. You actually only have .5% at 25 AP, but because they don't show fractional percents you see 1.Last edit: 2012-07-13 16:53:14 |
| | Mondays with Monte: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=384187 | Schrödinger's Elo |
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| Kaniol Poland. July 13 2012 16:54. Posts 3097 | Profile Blog # |
WTF SO MANY new skins on PBE.
augumented singed, infernal alistar, rageborn mundo, soul reaver draven, exalted cassiopeia, muah thai lee sin, scorched eareth xerath WTF is there going to be some kind of event? |
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| Punscho July 13 2012 16:55. Posts 60 | Profile # |
Well Q and E seems to deal damage two times if they hit a seed, with similar AP ratios. Also 0.6-0.7 is quite normal on abilities with aoe and secondary utility.
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| Ryuu314 United States. July 13 2012 16:59. Posts 5315 | Profile # |
On July 13 2012 16:40 WaveofShadow wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 16:28 Ryuu314 wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
So with new Xin you'd go what? 9/21/0 then get FH, Randuins, Ghostblade for near-max cdr? I suppose that could work. His new ulti is fuckign ridiculous tho. Massive damage, massive armor+mr buff if you hit enough targets, and it's basically a melee gragas ult that isolates the guy you're beating up. I'd have to play him/see him played, but yea iunno. He might be worth picking up in competitive teams if only for his ulti lol.
On July 13 2012 16:25 WaveofShadow wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
What? That's not the numbers I saw...it looked to me as though her ult had a 1%/25 AP ratio and her E was less than a 1:1 AP ratio (unless you mean because it hits twice?), I'm almost sure of it. Her Q and E each have AD ratios now as well though...can't remember the exact numbers. Her ult is AMAZING. I think it's going to need to be nerfed honestly. At ult level 3 if she hits 5 champions she will be shielded for 1500 HP. (300 shield/champ. It's 150 at level 1, 225 at level 2) The range of her losing stealth is pretty huge honestly. You will need mobilities and to use her W activate every time you want to close in on someone, but if you do that they will in all likelihood not be able to get out without taking SOME damage at least, and then as you spam spells on them you chase like a motherfucker. The ONLY thing I don't like about the Eve change is her re-stealthing time. It's fucking like 10 seconds after the last tick of whatever damage she takes. Ugh.
That screenshot shows AP on E scaling at 0.5 per hit. It hits twice so it's still 1.0. Guy has 50 AP and his ult gets +1%, so it should be 1%/50 AP. Her ratios should be: Q: 0.45 AP + 0.4 bonus AD W: nothing E: 0.5 AP + 0.4 bonus AD R: 1%/50 AP She should probably be built tanky AP. Abyssal Zhonyas into more tank or something like that.
Sitting in a game with Kage's right now (25AP) and I have the 1% extra AP on ult. Edit: Hmm.... and at 50 AP it's still 1%? uhhh.... something not right here And now at 70AP it's STILL 1%??? Ok at 110 it's 2%...I wonder if the 1% at 25AP is a visual bug on the tooltip...? Ok...at 90AP it's STILL 2%. WTF. And at 75AP.
It's probably a visual thing. LoL rounds for visual effect. The actual numbers are probably
0.5% at 25 ap -> displays/rounds to 1%
1% at 50 ap -> displays 1%
1.4% at 70 ap -> displays/rounds to 1%
1.5% at 75 ap -> displays/rounds to 2%
1.8% at 90 ap -> displays/rounds to 2%
2% at 100 ap ->displays 2%
On July 13 2012 16:34 Sufficiency wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 16:25 WaveofShadow wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
What? That's not the numbers I saw...it looked to me as though her ult had a 1%/25 AP ratio and her E was less than a 1:1 AP ratio (unless you mean because it hits twice?), I'm almost sure of it. Her Q and E each have AD ratios now as well though...can't remember the exact numbers. Her ult is AMAZING. I think it's going to need to be nerfed honestly. At ult level 3 if she hits 5 champions she will be shielded for 1500 HP. (300 shield/champ. It's 150 at level 1, 225 at level 2) The range of her losing stealth is pretty huge honestly. You will need mobilities and to use her W activate every time you want to close in on someone, but if you do that they will in all likelihood not be able to get out without taking SOME damage at least, and then as you spam spells on them you chase like a motherfucker. The ONLY thing I don't like about the Eve change is her re-stealthing time. It's fucking like 10 seconds after the last tick of whatever damage she takes. Ugh.
The stealth is good enough if you ask me. If I lane mid, say, and I am off the map, my opponent basically can't push, because I can just circle around and cut off his escape. With her high AP ratio (her AD ratio is also fantastic, so maybe gunblade 1st...) and that crazy shield, she can duel any conventional AP mid and chase like hell. I will probably try her a few games first. If it works out well I will consider buying dual penetration runes for some lolz. .
Eh. I wouldn't exactly call a 0.4 bonus AD ratio "fantastic." I don't think it's worth buying AD on her.Last edit: 2012-07-13 17:02:49 |
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| Varpulis United States. July 13 2012 17:07. Posts 2356 | Profile Blog # |
On July 13 2012 16:39 IMoperator wrote:
What are you supposed to do vs. easy farmers mid? I play champs like veigar, annie and lux and I always fall behind in cs to people like morgana, karthus, ahri, TF, heimer, morde etc. They all have good aoe spells that can hit basically the whole minion wave while things like annie's w or veigar's w only hit a few minions at a time. I'm not sure what to do because they can just get a shit ton more farm than me, and I can't really do much about it. plz don't say pick a different champ btw.
I play morde a lot to carry my bad (>lvl 30) friends, and the #1 way to beat him (imho) is to aggressively deny his farm early on. Morde's sustain is really bad until he gets a hextech, so abuse that: force trades when he doesn't have full shield, and force him to keep going back to buy regen. If you can deny his farm for long enough, he has a really hard time getting back into the game.
On the flipside, if you play passive Morde is happy to farm up his hextech and then start steamrolling, just like vlad. The key to beating him is preventing him from getting to that point, especially as champs with shaky laning.
(i'm pretty bad, so take everything i say with a grain of salt) |
| | For he is the Oystermeister, lord of all the oysters. |
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| WaveofShadow Canada. July 13 2012 17:22. Posts 5230 | Profile Blog # |
On July 13 2012 16:59 Ryuu314 wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 16:40 WaveofShadow wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:28 Ryuu314 wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
So with new Xin you'd go what? 9/21/0 then get FH, Randuins, Ghostblade for near-max cdr? I suppose that could work. His new ulti is fuckign ridiculous tho. Massive damage, massive armor+mr buff if you hit enough targets, and it's basically a melee gragas ult that isolates the guy you're beating up. I'd have to play him/see him played, but yea iunno. He might be worth picking up in competitive teams if only for his ulti lol.
On July 13 2012 16:25 WaveofShadow wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
What? That's not the numbers I saw...it looked to me as though her ult had a 1%/25 AP ratio and her E was less than a 1:1 AP ratio (unless you mean because it hits twice?), I'm almost sure of it. Her Q and E each have AD ratios now as well though...can't remember the exact numbers. Her ult is AMAZING. I think it's going to need to be nerfed honestly. At ult level 3 if she hits 5 champions she will be shielded for 1500 HP. (300 shield/champ. It's 150 at level 1, 225 at level 2) The range of her losing stealth is pretty huge honestly. You will need mobilities and to use her W activate every time you want to close in on someone, but if you do that they will in all likelihood not be able to get out without taking SOME damage at least, and then as you spam spells on them you chase like a motherfucker. The ONLY thing I don't like about the Eve change is her re-stealthing time. It's fucking like 10 seconds after the last tick of whatever damage she takes. Ugh.
That screenshot shows AP on E scaling at 0.5 per hit. It hits twice so it's still 1.0. Guy has 50 AP and his ult gets +1%, so it should be 1%/50 AP. Her ratios should be: Q: 0.45 AP + 0.4 bonus AD W: nothing E: 0.5 AP + 0.4 bonus AD R: 1%/50 AP She should probably be built tanky AP. Abyssal Zhonyas into more tank or something like that.
Sitting in a game with Kage's right now (25AP) and I have the 1% extra AP on ult. Edit: Hmm.... and at 50 AP it's still 1%? uhhh.... something not right here And now at 70AP it's STILL 1%??? Ok at 110 it's 2%...I wonder if the 1% at 25AP is a visual bug on the tooltip...? Ok...at 90AP it's STILL 2%. WTF. And at 75AP.
It's probably a visual thing. LoL rounds for visual effect. The actual numbers are probably 0.5% at 25 ap -> displays/rounds to 1% 1% at 50 ap -> displays 1% 1.4% at 70 ap -> displays/rounds to 1% 1.5% at 75 ap -> displays/rounds to 2% 1.8% at 90 ap -> displays/rounds to 2% 2% at 100 ap ->displays 2%
Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 16:34 Sufficiency wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:25 WaveofShadow wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
What? That's not the numbers I saw...it looked to me as though her ult had a 1%/25 AP ratio and her E was less than a 1:1 AP ratio (unless you mean because it hits twice?), I'm almost sure of it. Her Q and E each have AD ratios now as well though...can't remember the exact numbers. Her ult is AMAZING. I think it's going to need to be nerfed honestly. At ult level 3 if she hits 5 champions she will be shielded for 1500 HP. (300 shield/champ. It's 150 at level 1, 225 at level 2) The range of her losing stealth is pretty huge honestly. You will need mobilities and to use her W activate every time you want to close in on someone, but if you do that they will in all likelihood not be able to get out without taking SOME damage at least, and then as you spam spells on them you chase like a motherfucker. The ONLY thing I don't like about the Eve change is her re-stealthing time. It's fucking like 10 seconds after the last tick of whatever damage she takes. Ugh.
The stealth is good enough if you ask me. If I lane mid, say, and I am off the map, my opponent basically can't push, because I can just circle around and cut off his escape. With her high AP ratio (her AD ratio is also fantastic, so maybe gunblade 1st...) and that crazy shield, she can duel any conventional AP mid and chase like hell. I will probably try her a few games first. If it works out well I will consider buying dual penetration runes for some lolz. .
Eh. I wouldn't exactly call a 0.4 bonus AD ratio "fantastic." I don't think it's worth buying AD on her.
Ah, so in other words you get a partial % bonus before you hit 50AP? I didn't know that and am probably an idiot for assuming it didn't work that way for other %dmg AP ratio (ie Amumu).
As far as AD on Eve, you want to rush the shit out of Triforce on her. Like...as fast as humanly possible. Hell, I can see even Rageblade being pretty decent if you just want sheer nuking power.
She will be unkillable in a teamfight if you build her Triforce+tank though so I'm not sure pure damage is the way to go.
In other news, Xerath ult is fixed on PBE. thank god.
On other other news, after trying Zyra, she appears to have potential. You can actually use her abilities and combo them INTO a seed, because each one has a delay, which makes for interesting gameplay. FOr example, if you're laning against someone and you want to use E to root them (which you'll be maxing first for damage and utility on both spell and plants), you can cast E and then drop a seed near the end of where E will hit. The seed will drop before E hits and the plant will then grow, slowing the person you just rooted and allowing her to ult + Q, completing her combo. (Seed delay works for Q as well. )
This makes her teamfighting a lot better than people think, though if people are not slowed or rooted first, it is very easy to run out of her huge ult range before the knockup. |
| | twitch.tv/waveofshadow ||| Winner of AHGL's So You Think You Can Cast!! GG Soniv! |
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| JackDino Gabon. July 13 2012 17:23. Posts 3293 | Profile # |
On July 13 2012 16:59 Ryuu314 wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 16:40 WaveofShadow wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:28 Ryuu314 wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
So with new Xin you'd go what? 9/21/0 then get FH, Randuins, Ghostblade for near-max cdr? I suppose that could work. His new ulti is fuckign ridiculous tho. Massive damage, massive armor+mr buff if you hit enough targets, and it's basically a melee gragas ult that isolates the guy you're beating up. I'd have to play him/see him played, but yea iunno. He might be worth picking up in competitive teams if only for his ulti lol.
On July 13 2012 16:25 WaveofShadow wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
What? That's not the numbers I saw...it looked to me as though her ult had a 1%/25 AP ratio and her E was less than a 1:1 AP ratio (unless you mean because it hits twice?), I'm almost sure of it. Her Q and E each have AD ratios now as well though...can't remember the exact numbers. Her ult is AMAZING. I think it's going to need to be nerfed honestly. At ult level 3 if she hits 5 champions she will be shielded for 1500 HP. (300 shield/champ. It's 150 at level 1, 225 at level 2) The range of her losing stealth is pretty huge honestly. You will need mobilities and to use her W activate every time you want to close in on someone, but if you do that they will in all likelihood not be able to get out without taking SOME damage at least, and then as you spam spells on them you chase like a motherfucker. The ONLY thing I don't like about the Eve change is her re-stealthing time. It's fucking like 10 seconds after the last tick of whatever damage she takes. Ugh.
That screenshot shows AP on E scaling at 0.5 per hit. It hits twice so it's still 1.0. Guy has 50 AP and his ult gets +1%, so it should be 1%/50 AP. Her ratios should be: Q: 0.45 AP + 0.4 bonus AD W: nothing E: 0.5 AP + 0.4 bonus AD R: 1%/50 AP She should probably be built tanky AP. Abyssal Zhonyas into more tank or something like that.
Sitting in a game with Kage's right now (25AP) and I have the 1% extra AP on ult. Edit: Hmm.... and at 50 AP it's still 1%? uhhh.... something not right here And now at 70AP it's STILL 1%??? Ok at 110 it's 2%...I wonder if the 1% at 25AP is a visual bug on the tooltip...? Ok...at 90AP it's STILL 2%. WTF. And at 75AP.
It's probably a visual thing. LoL rounds for visual effect. The actual numbers are probably 0.5% at 25 ap -> displays/rounds to 1% 1% at 50 ap -> displays 1% 1.4% at 70 ap -> displays/rounds to 1% 1.5% at 75 ap -> displays/rounds to 2% 1.8% at 90 ap -> displays/rounds to 2% 2% at 100 ap ->displays 2%
Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 16:34 Sufficiency wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:25 WaveofShadow wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
What? That's not the numbers I saw...it looked to me as though her ult had a 1%/25 AP ratio and her E was less than a 1:1 AP ratio (unless you mean because it hits twice?), I'm almost sure of it. Her Q and E each have AD ratios now as well though...can't remember the exact numbers. Her ult is AMAZING. I think it's going to need to be nerfed honestly. At ult level 3 if she hits 5 champions she will be shielded for 1500 HP. (300 shield/champ. It's 150 at level 1, 225 at level 2) The range of her losing stealth is pretty huge honestly. You will need mobilities and to use her W activate every time you want to close in on someone, but if you do that they will in all likelihood not be able to get out without taking SOME damage at least, and then as you spam spells on them you chase like a motherfucker. The ONLY thing I don't like about the Eve change is her re-stealthing time. It's fucking like 10 seconds after the last tick of whatever damage she takes. Ugh.
The stealth is good enough if you ask me. If I lane mid, say, and I am off the map, my opponent basically can't push, because I can just circle around and cut off his escape. With her high AP ratio (her AD ratio is also fantastic, so maybe gunblade 1st...) and that crazy shield, she can duel any conventional AP mid and chase like hell. I will probably try her a few games first. If it works out well I will consider buying dual penetration runes for some lolz. .
Eh. I wouldn't exactly call a 0.4 bonus AD ratio "fantastic." I don't think it's worth buying AD on her.
It's not a .4 bonus AD ratio. It's a .4bonus AD ratio on a 1.5sec cd ability, huuuuuuuuuuuuge difference. Not to mention if you build AP you'll be pretty worthless aside from Q spam since your autos wont do shit. She also gets bonus attackspeed from E. |
| | This isnt Broodwar so I dont owe anyone respect for beating me. -arb |
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| MiningSchuhu Germany. July 13 2012 17:25. Posts 52 | Profile # |
On July 13 2012 17:07 Varpulis wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 16:39 IMoperator wrote:
What are you supposed to do vs. easy farmers mid? I play champs like veigar, annie and lux and I always fall behind in cs to people like morgana, karthus, ahri, TF, heimer, morde etc. They all have good aoe spells that can hit basically the whole minion wave while things like annie's w or veigar's w only hit a few minions at a time. I'm not sure what to do because they can just get a shit ton more farm than me, and I can't really do much about it. plz don't say pick a different champ btw.
I play morde a lot to carry my bad (>lvl 30) friends, and the #1 way to beat him (imho) is to aggressively deny his farm early on. Morde's sustain is really bad until he gets a hextech, so abuse that: force trades when he doesn't have full shield, and force him to keep going back to buy regen. If you can deny his farm for long enough, he has a really hard time getting back into the game. On the flipside, if you play passive Morde is happy to farm up his hextech and then start steamrolling, just like vlad. The key to beating him is preventing him from getting to that point, especially as champs with shaky laning. (i'm pretty bad, so take everything i say with a grain of salt)
The easiest way to make morde somewhat useless is to gank him early as he has no escape tools besides his summoner's. Ofc that would require a good jungler :O
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| Ryuu314 United States. July 13 2012 17:30. Posts 5315 | Profile # |
On July 13 2012 17:23 JackDino wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 16:59 Ryuu314 wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:40 WaveofShadow wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:28 Ryuu314 wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
So with new Xin you'd go what? 9/21/0 then get FH, Randuins, Ghostblade for near-max cdr? I suppose that could work. His new ulti is fuckign ridiculous tho. Massive damage, massive armor+mr buff if you hit enough targets, and it's basically a melee gragas ult that isolates the guy you're beating up. I'd have to play him/see him played, but yea iunno. He might be worth picking up in competitive teams if only for his ulti lol.
On July 13 2012 16:25 WaveofShadow wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
What? That's not the numbers I saw...it looked to me as though her ult had a 1%/25 AP ratio and her E was less than a 1:1 AP ratio (unless you mean because it hits twice?), I'm almost sure of it. Her Q and E each have AD ratios now as well though...can't remember the exact numbers. Her ult is AMAZING. I think it's going to need to be nerfed honestly. At ult level 3 if she hits 5 champions she will be shielded for 1500 HP. (300 shield/champ. It's 150 at level 1, 225 at level 2) The range of her losing stealth is pretty huge honestly. You will need mobilities and to use her W activate every time you want to close in on someone, but if you do that they will in all likelihood not be able to get out without taking SOME damage at least, and then as you spam spells on them you chase like a motherfucker. The ONLY thing I don't like about the Eve change is her re-stealthing time. It's fucking like 10 seconds after the last tick of whatever damage she takes. Ugh.
That screenshot shows AP on E scaling at 0.5 per hit. It hits twice so it's still 1.0. Guy has 50 AP and his ult gets +1%, so it should be 1%/50 AP. Her ratios should be: Q: 0.45 AP + 0.4 bonus AD W: nothing E: 0.5 AP + 0.4 bonus AD R: 1%/50 AP She should probably be built tanky AP. Abyssal Zhonyas into more tank or something like that.
Sitting in a game with Kage's right now (25AP) and I have the 1% extra AP on ult. Edit: Hmm.... and at 50 AP it's still 1%? uhhh.... something not right here And now at 70AP it's STILL 1%??? Ok at 110 it's 2%...I wonder if the 1% at 25AP is a visual bug on the tooltip...? Ok...at 90AP it's STILL 2%. WTF. And at 75AP.
It's probably a visual thing. LoL rounds for visual effect. The actual numbers are probably 0.5% at 25 ap -> displays/rounds to 1% 1% at 50 ap -> displays 1% 1.4% at 70 ap -> displays/rounds to 1% 1.5% at 75 ap -> displays/rounds to 2% 1.8% at 90 ap -> displays/rounds to 2% 2% at 100 ap ->displays 2%
On July 13 2012 16:34 Sufficiency wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:25 WaveofShadow wrote:
On July 13 2012 16:16 Seuss wrote:
On July 13 2012 15:44 Ryuu314 wrote:
My knee-jerk reaction to Xin rework is that he just got nerfed.
Other than his ulti change, I feel like every other change was for the worse. Moving the cd reduction to his Q means that he can no longer spam abilities the way he used to be, resulting in less overall utility. Moving his passive onto W, while simultaneously removing the passive attack speed buff means that you essentially have to "waste" one level to gain the sustain you had right off the bat before. E seems to be slightly buffed (unless the slow doesn't scale with level which I doubt; the AP ratio and mana buff is more or less irrelevant unless you're doing some troll AP Xin build). I like his R change; does much more damage and can isolate important targets. His new passive seems very meh, especially compared to his old one.
I honestly can't tell what it is. With max CDR Xin's cooldowns are 3s on Q, 7.2 on W, and 5.4 on E. Basically you can E->Q every 3 seconds (50% slow and 1s knockup) and keep the 80% attack speed buff on permanently. It's crazy how fast you burn through mana doing that, but you honestly can spam abilities more than before. New ulti is crazy.
On July 13 2012 16:15 Sufficiency wrote:
It looks like Eve's Q now has 0.45 ap ratio and her E is kept at 1 ap ratio. If her range on Q is increased I am definitely playing her mid :3.
It is and it isn't. The range to activate is slightly higher, but the projectile passes through that point and hits targets behind it as well. Also Eve's level 3 ult does 25% + 1%/50AP of maximum health in magic damage in an AoE.
What? That's not the numbers I saw...it looked to me as though her ult had a 1%/25 AP ratio and her E was less than a 1:1 AP ratio (unless you mean because it hits twice?), I'm almost sure of it. Her Q and E each have AD ratios now as well though...can't remember the exact numbers. Her ult is AMAZING. I think it's going to need to be nerfed honestly. At ult level 3 if she hits 5 champions she will be shielded for 1500 HP. (300 shield/champ. It's 150 at level 1, 225 at level 2) The range of her losing stealth is pretty huge honestly. You will need mobilities and to use her W activate every time you want to close in on someone, but if you do that they will in all likelihood not be able to get out without taking SOME damage at least, and then as you spam spells on them you chase like a motherfucker. The ONLY thing I don't like about the Eve change is her re-stealthing time. It's fucking like 10 seconds after the last tick of whatever damage she takes. Ugh.
The stealth is good enough if you ask me. If I lane mid, say, and I am off the map, my opponent basically can't push, because I can just circle around and cut off his escape. With her high AP ratio (her AD ratio is also fantastic, so maybe gunblade 1st...) and that crazy shield, she can duel any conventional AP mid and chase like hell. I will probably try her a few games first. If it works out well I will consider buying dual penetration runes for some lolz. .
Eh. I wouldn't exactly call a 0.4 bonus AD ratio "fantastic." I don't think it's worth buying AD on her.
It's not a .4 bonus AD ratio. It's a .4bonus AD ratio on a 1.5sec cd ability, huuuuuuuuuuuuge difference. Not to mention if you build AP you'll be pretty worthless aside from Q spam since your autos wont do shit. She also gets bonus attackspeed from E.
Yes, it's a 0.4 bonus AD ratio on a 1.5 sec cd ability, but it's also a 0.45 AP ratio skill on a 1.5 sec cd ability. Your E scales really damn well with AP, as does your ulti.
Honestly, I feel like the AD v. AP debate on Eve will end up something like the AD v. AP debate on Poppy. AD gives better sustained damage, but AP lets you potentially 1-shot stuff. The difference is that in this case, Eve's ulti scales with AP pretty damn well and is freaking aoe. I see the merits of both AD and AP on Eve; I just personally think that doing a massive %health nuke to the entire enemy team is preferable to autoattacking one target. Going AP doesn't make you uselss other than Q spam. E has a 1.0 AP ratio. Besides, you can (and probably should) get a lichbane since you'll be proccing it on cooldown with your Q. Your autos won't be neglible.Last edit: 2012-07-13 17:31:33 |
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| wei2coolman United States. July 13 2012 17:35. Posts 9735 | Profile # |
On July 13 2012 16:39 IMoperator wrote:
What are you supposed to do vs. easy farmers mid? I play champs like veigar, annie and lux and I always fall behind in cs to people like morgana, karthus, ahri, TF, heimer, morde etc. They all have good aoe spells that can hit basically the whole minion wave while things like annie's w or veigar's w only hit a few minions at a time. I'm not sure what to do because they can just get a shit ton more farm than me, and I can't really do much about it. plz don't say pick a different champ btw.
Champions that have strength, also usually have weaknesses.
1) don't play bad pushing champions, against champions that have strong pushing power.
2) you can push back, lux/annie, both clear waves fairly fast w/ some ap. Lux's E, and Annie's AoE, should be able to counter push.
3) Most pushing champions often have pretty low kill potential without their ult. So for example, a level 6 annie w/o ulti, is much more dangerous than a morgana w/o one. So play this to your advantage, if you know for a fact that the Morg/Ahri, etc etc. doesn't have ulti, feel free to zone them out.
4) Sometimes, you don't need to have as high of a farm as they do. Your main goal with single target or just burst AP champs in general, is to do as much AoE overall damage in a teamfight (with focus on the ad carry), and then you become useless. And burst champs usually have pretty good scaling in their burst, often not needing much more than a Death Cap + Void Staff to be relevant throughout the game.
5) Also strong pushers often tend to leave lane, for ganks. If this happens often, ward up, and ping out where they're going, so your lanes can play safe, and then you can just counter push when they're out of lane.Last edit: 2012-07-13 17:38:04 |
| | Curse & Doublelift fanboi. |
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| Ryuu314 United States. July 13 2012 17:47. Posts 5315 | Profile # |
On July 13 2012 16:39 IMoperator wrote:
What are you supposed to do vs. easy farmers mid? I play champs like veigar, annie and lux and I always fall behind in cs to people like morgana, karthus, ahri, TF, heimer, morde etc. They all have good aoe spells that can hit basically the whole minion wave while things like annie's w or veigar's w only hit a few minions at a time. I'm not sure what to do because they can just get a shit ton more farm than me, and I can't really do much about it. plz don't say pick a different champ btw.
1. Get better at last hitting. Cannot stress this enough. Think of it this way. If you're missing 1~2 creep per wave, which doesn't really seem like a lot at first, you end up missing 20~40 cs in 10 minutes, which can easily add up to 500~1000 gold. Get better at last hitting.
2. Strong pushers can force you to miss cs by shoving stuff into your tower. There are tips and tricks to getting cs under tower, but for the most part, if you're against a strong pusher when your champ isn't a strong pusher, you will miss cs. Not much you can do about this other than to ask for blue and try to counter-push with your abilities. The vast majority of AP mids have some form of aoe spell to creep clear. The difference between a strong pusher and a not-so-strong one typically lies in mana efficiency. Blue buff equalizes all that.
3. If they're pushing hard, punish them for it by asking for ganks. Tank some creep just outside tower range to make the creeps clash near your tower. They will have to overextend making them easy gank targets. Ofc, this doesn't always work against good players however. |
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| Alaric France. July 13 2012 18:03. Posts 8752 | Profile # |
| I want a MGS skin for Eve with the sound for whenever she gets detected with that "!". Last edit: 2012-07-13 18:03:59 |
| | "This build should be called the Neutron Bomb build - you can win by taking out all the people but leaving all the structures standing." - somebody about iEchoic's 2fac/2port (www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=189624) |
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| wei2coolman United States. July 13 2012 18:09. Posts 9735 | Profile # |
On July 13 2012 18:03 Alaric wrote:
I want a MGS skin for Eve with the sound for whenever she gets detected with that "!".
^Riot, hire this guy. Fucking brilliant idea. TAKE MY MONEY. |
| | Curse & Doublelift fanboi. |
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