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| NewSunshine United States. July 10 2012 08:06. Posts 1011 | Profile # |
Megafossil - version 1.1 Made by NewSunshine Published on [NA].
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/ELxey.jpg) *note - full bounds. see analyzer images.
Introduction/Inspiration: Let's get worthy stuff out of the way first: the aesthetic. The tileset is borrowed largely from Condemned Ridge, as you might guess, but I find Blizzard's execution of it lacking in places, as anyone might. With this map, I wanted to not only emulate it, but take it a step further, making a complete atmosphere with it. This is reflected in-game, and is exactly what I was aiming for. Layout-wise, I tried to make the expansion progression, and the map in general, feel as natural as possible, with a bit of a twist in the center.
Pictures (Aesthetics - old): + Show Spoiler +
Texture Set: + Show Spoiler +
Lighting: Agria
Pictures (Analysis): + Show Spoiler [Analyzer Images] +
Data (Gameplay): Playable Bounds: 144x128 Nat - Nat Walk Distance: 137.0 Expansion Count: 8 normal, 2 6m1hyg Xel'Naga Towers: 1
This is the first of my MotM entries for the Summer. All feedback/criticism/hatred is welcome, just know I won't pay the hatred any mind  Last edit: 2012-07-12 01:17:32 |
| | [ESV mapmaking team member] [Former DF map team founder] [@ESVNewSunshine] |
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| FlaShFTW United States. July 10 2012 08:10. Posts 4957 | Profile Blog # |
great third placement. map is complete. my job here is done.
jk uhhh but a great map. really nice. only thing i dont like are the corner expos, and the areas in front of the half bases where the area is split. those could be problem areas as they are a bit too chokey. otherwise, great map. |
| | Never Surrender. Never GG. Always Fighting. BW4LYF. Woo Jung Ho Never Forget. |
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| Yonnua United Kingdom. July 10 2012 08:16. Posts 1038 | Profile Blog # |
| I really don't like this kind of centre (with the watchtower). It wrecks pathing so much and makes you babysit units you really shouldn't have to. Also, the fact that Colossi can walk over the tower (usually) means protoss often lose half their army when they move to or away from the tower. This kind of set up causes a lot of issues. There are also lots of other issues with even paths but most of them come down to pathing and weird counters. |
| | PartinG | NaNiwa | Creator | Mvp | Bomber | Oz | FanTaSy | JangBi |
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| IronManSC United States. July 10 2012 08:24. Posts 1641 | Profile # |
| Not liking the ramp between the nat and 3rd (where the half base is). How does Zerg attack toss or terran in that area? |
| | ESV Map Maker. || twitter: @ESVironManSC || Author of Ohana, Khalis, Ravage, Khaydaria, Spring |
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| NewSunshine United States. July 10 2012 08:25. Posts 1011 | Profile # |
On July 10 2012 08:16 Yonnua wrote: I really don't like this kind of centre (with the watchtower). It wrecks pathing so much and makes you babysit units you really shouldn't have to. Also, the fact that Colossi can walk over the tower (usually) means protoss often lose half their army when they move to or away from the tower. This kind of set up causes a lot of issues. There are also lots of other issues with even paths but most of them come down to pathing and weird counters.
I get what you're saying, but I don't find that to be an issue. The map isn't riddle with choke points like Cloud Kingdom is, so having to manage your units around the center is an equitable trade-off. The even pathing too is offset by how the tower covers the whole of the center pathing, so if an attack goes around and hits without you noticing, you haven't gotten to the watchtower yet, and can easily move back. Of course, this is all the case granted the players exercise a nominal amount of diligence. This might be a problem, I might be mistaken, but I don't believe so, considering the success of Daybreak, which also has factors to mitigate the effects of even pathing.
As for the corner bases and other such stuff, I'm open to suggestions. There's a bit of leeway with paths I can change or remove, so hit me with a good idea and I'll consider it.
On July 10 2012 08:24 IronManSC wrote: Not liking the ramp between the nat and 3rd (where the half base is). How does Zerg attack toss or terran in that area?
Do you think perhaps the ramp should be widened? The way it is now, swinging through the 3rd is usually a better option, but I don't necessarily want that to be the only one.Last edit: 2012-07-10 08:28:07 |
| | [ESV mapmaking team member] [Former DF map team founder] [@ESVNewSunshine] |
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| monitor United States. July 10 2012 08:26. Posts 2276 | Profile Blog # |
Solid map, but I think its slightly too linear. Thirds these days have to be somewhat linear otherwise they become very difficult to hold, but for example the fourth here doesn't need to be a straight path from the third. I really like maps where the pathing isn't so boring- it curves or varies in direction. Otherwise, the games between highly linear maps can become very similar in the playstyles they encourage. For my evidence, you can examine EVERY single popular brood war map, none will have linear paths between the expansions 
So with that said, I think you should consider making some slight changes to the fourth expansion in order to prevent the linear pathing between third-fourth-fifth. Not really sure exactly what, but at the very least you could angle it so the fifth isn't a straight line from the fourth.
Also another thing I should say is that the rocks at the natural are clever. Good work. And you're improving a ton!!! |
| | Starcraft 2 Mapmaker for TPW || Author of Korhal Compound |
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| NewSunshine United States. July 10 2012 08:30. Posts 1011 | Profile # |
On July 10 2012 08:26 monitor wrote:Solid map, but I think its slightly too linear. Thirds these days have to be somewhat linear otherwise they become very difficult to hold, but for example the fourth here doesn't need to be a straight path from the third. I really like maps where the pathing isn't so boring- it curves or varies in direction. Otherwise, the games between highly linear maps can become very similar in the playstyles they encourage. For my evidence, you can examine EVERY single popular brood war map, none will have linear paths between the expansions  So with that said, I think you should consider making some slight changes to the fourth expansion in order to prevent the linear pathing between third-fourth-fifth. Not really sure exactly what, but at the very least you could angle it so the fifth isn't a straight line from the fourth. Also another thing I should say is that the rocks at the natural are clever. Good work. And you're improving a ton!!!
All this feedback is awesome 
I think the general consensus then would be that the 5th corner base needs some form of adjustment, both for balance and gameplay. If anyone's got a good idea for changes to make, I shall consider it, but I will also look into changes on my own. |
| | [ESV mapmaking team member] [Former DF map team founder] [@ESVNewSunshine] |
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| EatThePath United States. July 10 2012 16:44. Posts 2440 | Profile Blog # |
Good changes. The new 5th makes it a very interesting map... eventually. ^^
I agree with monitor that the 4th is pretty plain straight down the ramp from the 3rd. What if you scooted it over so part of the mineral line was underneath the new ramp that goes up to the 5th? That way attacker could take the long way around past the 5th to harass from the cliff, or a frontal attack could move up the ramp from the low ground to siege it from the cliff. It shares more vulnerability but the main route is the same. |
| | Comprehensive strategic intention: DNE |
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| NewSunshine United States. July 10 2012 16:53. Posts 1011 | Profile # |
On July 10 2012 16:44 EatThePath wrote: Good changes. The new 5th makes it a very interesting map... eventually. ^^
I agree with monitor that the 4th is pretty plain straight down the ramp from the 3rd. What if you scooted it over so part of the mineral line was underneath the new ramp that goes up to the 5th? That way attacker could take the long way around past the 5th to harass from the cliff, or a frontal attack could move up the ramp from the low ground to siege it from the cliff. It shares more vulnerability but the main route is the same.
Hmmm, or I could just extend the high ground ledge to go behind the 4th, and have a harassment ledge, Condemned Ridge style. Yeah, that sounds good.
I love the ideas I get when we start bouncing them around :D |
| | [ESV mapmaking team member] [Former DF map team founder] [@ESVNewSunshine] |
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| EatThePath United States. July 10 2012 17:06. Posts 2440 | Profile Blog # |
On July 10 2012 16:53 NewSunshine wrote: Show nested quote +On July 10 2012 16:44 EatThePath wrote: Good changes. The new 5th makes it a very interesting map... eventually. ^^
I agree with monitor that the 4th is pretty plain straight down the ramp from the 3rd. What if you scooted it over so part of the mineral line was underneath the new ramp that goes up to the 5th? That way attacker could take the long way around past the 5th to harass from the cliff, or a frontal attack could move up the ramp from the low ground to siege it from the cliff. It shares more vulnerability but the main route is the same.
Hmmm, or I could just extend the high ground ledge to go behind the 4th, and have a harassment ledge, Condemned Ridge style. Yeah, that sounds good. I love the ideas I get when we start bouncing them around :D
Yeah I was just thinking about that too. I think you could move the 4th a littttle farther away at least. But yeah making a harass ledge works the same for the added vulnerability. ;D
edit: The specific little choices with this kind of terrain arranging can make huge differences, this is the kind of stuff I love where small tweaks can have big consequences. The angles and spaces you choose really define players' opportunities.Last edit: 2012-07-10 17:08:53 |
| | Comprehensive strategic intention: DNE |
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| NewSunshine United States. July 10 2012 17:24. Posts 1011 | Profile # |
K, here's what I have, in both Overview and Close-up form:
+ Show Spoiler +
Now check out Cerberus Plateau, you nerd.Last edit: 2012-07-10 17:27:31 |
| | [ESV mapmaking team member] [Former DF map team founder] [@ESVNewSunshine] |
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| EatThePath United States. July 10 2012 19:01. Posts 2440 | Profile Blog # |
On July 10 2012 17:24 NewSunshine wrote:K, here's what I have, in both Overview and Close-up form: + Show Spoiler +Now check out Cerberus Plateau, you nerd.
Yeah, that'll work.
I have and it looks nice but I haven't thought about it. =) |
| | Comprehensive strategic intention: DNE |
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| OxyGenesis United Kingdom. July 10 2012 19:15. Posts 278 | Profile # |
| This is looking really cool, good job! From an aesthetic point of view, I think I would like to see slightly more variation between high and low ground so that to an observer it is more immediately apparent which base they are looking but really I'm splitting hairs. I'm a little bit dubious about the Xel'Naga tower as it gives terran (with marines being ranged) an advantage, although I know there was that blizzard map that had the same thing. What's the general feeling about this? |
| | Maker of Maps inc. Vector, Uncanny Valley and Fissure | Co-Founder of SC2Melee.net |
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| erazerr Australia. July 10 2012 20:54. Posts 85 | Profile # |
| pretty cool map, reminds me slightly of cloud kingdom |
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| SidianTheBard United States. July 10 2012 23:52. Posts 966 | Profile # |
| What happened to you? You use to be such a noob, a precious precious noob. Then you bust out 2 new maps that are pretty much amazing. I'll post some thoughts later when I get some more time to closely look over your maps but at first glance anyway they are awesome. Keep up the great work! :D |
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| NewSunshine United States. July 11 2012 00:50. Posts 1011 | Profile # |
On July 10 2012 23:52 SidianTheBard wrote: What happened to you? You use to be such a noob, a precious precious noob. Then you bust out 2 new maps that are pretty much amazing. I'll post some thoughts later when I get some more time to closely look over your maps but at first glance anyway they are awesome. Keep up the great work! :D
I know, such a n0od.  The thing is, posting maps on TL and getting feedback is great and all, but that's serious mapping. I, if you haven't noticed, like to take breaks from posting on TL, to just let my creativity run amok. Fun mapping, if you will. I do like posting on TL though, you guys are awesome :D |
| | [ESV mapmaking team member] [Former DF map team founder] [@ESVNewSunshine] |
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| NewSunshine United States. July 11 2012 14:24. Posts 1011 | Profile # |
| Changes are now made, currently uploaded to v1.1 on NA. |
| | [ESV mapmaking team member] [Former DF map team founder] [@ESVNewSunshine] |
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| Trufflez Australia. July 11 2012 20:13. Posts 170 | Profile Blog # |
| holy mother of mutas. I really think you should make the flyable bounds smaller |
| | qxc | Nada | NesTea | Fantasy | Jangbi | BoxeR | Life | MVP | in that order |
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