| Dark_Chill Canada. July 10 2012 14:52. Posts 1006 | Profile # |
| I used to play Dota at a very low level, so I don't have much experience. I'm considering getting the game at some point, but I'd like to know: what is Dota 2 like for balance? LoL is in a pretty bad state for balance issues, and since Dota has been around for far long, I'd guess that it's better in that department? |
| | http://myanimelist.net/animelist/Chill77 |
|
|
| theDragoon Canada. July 10 2012 15:09. Posts 173 | Profile # |
| Definitely. Unlike Riot, Valve and Icefrog don't make balance changes every 2 weeks so every thing is a lot more stable and players are allowed to figure our strategies and counters instead of whining to Riot and waiting for a patch to "fix things". There are heroes who may seem extremely overpowered known as "pubstompers", these heroes are more often not even picked or banned in pro games. |
|
|
| zeehar Korea (South). July 10 2012 15:17. Posts 2470 | Profile Blog # |
ursa and riki are the only op heroes.
edit: in all seriousness I'm not knowledgeable enough to comment on balance but there is very little balance whining among dota players. very few balance changes have been made in the past year or so.Last edit: 2012-07-10 15:23:31 |
| | I AM THE UNIVERSAL CONSTANT |
|
|
| rabidch Singapore. July 10 2012 15:20. Posts 8061 | Profile # |
On July 10 2012 15:17 zeehar wrote:
ursa and riki are the only op heroes.
statistically proven. |
| |
|
| Spicy_Curry United States. July 10 2012 15:26. Posts 2255 | Profile Blog # |
| There are ways to deal with every hero in the game using items instead of being forced to counterpick etc. Its alot easier to balance around specific items instead of heroes who may have 4+ abilities. In DOTA you will see that there are more on-use items whereas in league items are normally passive. This allows each hero to peak at a different time while remaining relevant throughout the game. Also, balance patches are usually like 3-6 months apart unless there is something completely broken. Heroes are also introduced at a slower rate to further increase stability. |
| | High risk no reward - #RoadToTI3 |
|
|
| Shai Canada. July 10 2012 15:28. Posts 553 | Profile Blog # |
Before Dota 2 beta was released, IceFrog was releasing balance patches every 2 or 3 months, which has mostly just changed the meta from time to time. There have always been the top 15 or so most used heroes, but there have also always been 40 or so competitive viable heroes.
The most recent balance patches were geared towards improving less used heroes as opposed to nerfing less used heroes. IceFrog has said he wants the game to generally last closer to 35 minutes than 55 minutes (which was the old meta). If he continues with this trend, the ideal will be to have most/all of the heroes seeming "op" but all in all being balanced.
Unlike in SC2 there aren't a lot of pros in Dota 2 who seem to think the balance is far off. The general consensus is the game is currently balanced and not particularly stagnant, but if it ever does become stagnant IceFrog and Valve will patch the game so that it becomes more interesting. |
| | A case could be made for "a deistic god, a sort of god of the physicist, a god ... who devised the laws of physics, god the mathematician, god who put together the cosmos in the first place and then sat back ..." - Dawkins |
|
|
| Lavit2099 United States. July 10 2012 15:29. Posts 365 | Profile # |
Riki'd be fine if Gems didn't drop when you died. The silence cloud/Diff Blade slow means it's death against anyone one on one, but then again, for a good 30 minutes in the mid-game Morph with E-Blade can "shotgun" down people quite easily, too.
That being said, all of the heroes have their spot and all can be useful, just depends on your group makeup, like any MOBA. There aren't really any heroes that as so broken that they can't be countered. Riki might own someone 1 on 1 (same could be said for MOST hard carries, but he seems to be the best in pugs), but in a time fight, once he's out of stealth his trick is over and can be burst down really, really fast. But watch pro games, you see some heroes banned out often because, played right, they're awesome. Dark Seer isn't OP in pug games but in pro games, he can take an otherwise losing game and turn it into a win with one team wipe. |
|
|
| TheWarbler United States. July 10 2012 15:44. Posts 1241 | Profile Blog # |
| From experience STR is the least picked in a Competitive standpoint but they are amazing in Matchmaking. |
| | if you can believe you can concieve |
|
|
| dartoo India. July 10 2012 15:58. Posts 2206 | Profile # |
| Dont really worry about balance...the thing is if you let *any* hero farm up nice and easy, the hero is obviously going to be tough to take down. It's a lot more about your team, picking etc. It's a very complex issue even for the pros, just play and have fun. I cant imagine balance being a problem for 99.99% of people who play. |
|
|
| Kabras Romania. July 10 2012 16:08. Posts 466 | Profile # |
| I've been playing dota for about 7 years and i can tell you that a lot of the hero's strength comes from the metagame. Right now, the heroes that are considered very strong in the competitive scene (Dark seer, Lycan, Shadow demon etc) weren't either picked or banned a little over a year ago. Lycan was regarded as a noobish pub stomper and Seer's real power wasn't figured out yet. But in the current very chasing orientated metagame, these are often first picks and bans and the heroes haven't been changed at all. Just look up any chinese game of 2010 and compare it to any game in 2012. The first one will be a 2 hour non-aggression farm fest and the second will end in 50 minutes tops and will have 3 times more kills. All that without the heroes being changed almost at all. This pretty much applies to many of the items as well, does anyone remember how you would never see a vanguard in a pro game? |
| | Anger cannot be dishonest |
|
|
| StoRm_res July 10 2012 16:12. Posts 421 | Profile # |
Can't imagine LoL being so bad ^^
But you should try dota anyway, it's just more fun  |
|
|
| zeehar Korea (South). July 10 2012 16:49. Posts 2470 | Profile Blog # |
On July 10 2012 15:20 rabidch wrote:statistically proven.
paralleluniverse where are youLast edit: 2012-07-10 16:51:44 |
| | I AM THE UNIVERSAL CONSTANT |
|
|
| Entertaining Canada. July 10 2012 16:59. Posts 593 | Profile # |
CHAOS KNIGHT IS BALANCED. HES BANNED 90% OF PROGAMES BECAUSE HE IS JUST GOOD. NOT IMBA. VERY FAIR HERO FUN TO PLAY WITH AND AGAINST.
User was warned for this post |
|
|
| [17]Purple United Kingdom. July 10 2012 17:08. Posts 1869 | Profile # |
| Don't worry so much about balance, the game is very dependent on the current running trends. However, if you ever see a free branch lying around, please pick it up, I promise you it isn't Techies. |
| | "Turn Disadvantages into Disadvantages" and "Collect Telephones". The secrets of Chinese success. |
|
|
 ControlMonkey Australia. July 10 2012 17:10. Posts 1508 | Profile Blog # |
IMO the idea of balance isn't really applicable to MOBA games. It is used to refer to having all (or most) of the heroes being competitive picks. But by the nature of the game, where players play 1 role and multiple heroes within that role, I don't think you can say that because a hero is rarely picked, or is picked constantly, that makes the game unbalanced.
An RTS is different, there a player plays 1 race and sticks to it. There are fewer races, 3 in SC2 vs 100+ heroes in Dota. Having half the heroes in Dota be non competitive is not such a big deal as having one race in SC2 be significantly weaker than the others.
IMO as long as there is a decent number of heroes to give variety at the pro level (which IMO there is) I don't think there is a problem. Sure there are about 5 insta ban heroes (Lycan, Chen, prophet, dark seer, chaos knight), but aside from that there is enough variety to make the game enjoyable.
Anyway, rant over. |
|
|
| Appendix Sweden. July 10 2012 17:31. Posts 598 | Profile # |
On July 10 2012 16:08 Kabras wrote:
I've been playing dota for about 7 years and i can tell you that a lot of the hero's strength comes from the metagame. Right now, the heroes that are considered very strong in the competitive scene (Dark seer, Lycan, Shadow demon etc) weren't either picked or banned a little over a year ago. Lycan was regarded as a noobish pub stomper and Seer's real power wasn't figured out yet. But in the current very chasing orientated metagame, these are often first picks and bans and the heroes haven't been changed at all. Just look up any chinese game of 2010 and compare it to any game in 2012. The first one will be a 2 hour non-aggression farm fest and the second will end in 50 minutes tops and will have 3 times more kills. All that without the heroes being changed almost at all. This pretty much applies to many of the items as well, does anyone remember how you would never see a vanguard in a pro game?
Didn't the introduction of smoke play a big role in that change? |
|
|
| DoNotDisturb Singapore. July 10 2012 17:39. Posts 5258 | Profile Blog # |
On July 10 2012 16:49 zeehar wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 10 2012 15:20 rabidch wrote:
On July 10 2012 15:17 zeehar wrote:
ursa and riki are the only op heroes.
statistically proven.
paralleluniverse where are you
you want this thread to go up to 10+ pages huh |
| | Who's more perfect - Florence Welch or Lindsey Stirling? Yes. |
|
|
 CountChocula Canada. July 10 2012 17:44. Posts 845 | Profile # |
On July 10 2012 16:49 zeehar wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 10 2012 15:20 rabidch wrote:
On July 10 2012 15:17 zeehar wrote:
ursa and riki are the only op heroes.
statistically proven.
paralleluniverse where are you
rabidch = paralleluniverse
The truth is revealed. |
| | Those championships owed me over the years, I will take them back one by one. | |
|
|
| Duckvillelol Australia. July 10 2012 18:01. Posts 1123 | Profile Blog # |
| The only totally imbalanced heroes were removed long, long ago. Anyone remember "Gambler" or "Mortar Freaks"? Hehehe. |
| | Australian style SC2 commentary: youtube.com/duckvillelol || twitter.com/duckvillelol | |
|
|
| NeonFlare Finland. July 10 2012 18:06. Posts 913 | Profile Blog # |
At very low level, almost anything goes and some heroes will feel far harder to deal with than they really are. Overall I think the balance is pretty good, recent big patch showed that the less used generally weaker heroes are slowly being brought up (hopefully) on par with the rest, without going too far too fast.
During all these years some heroes/skilks have even seen overhauls (old Naix, storm bolts into their own similar skills etc.) which were pretty needed changes, thankfully those aren't rushed, but still done if for years something seems wrong. |
|
|
| 1 2 Next All |
|
Store
