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[G] TvZ Early-Midgame Aggression

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
 
 Sianos   August 01 2012 00:04. Posts 528
Profile # 
Introduction

+ Show Spoiler +

The idea

+ Show Spoiler +

The build

+ Show Spoiler +

Scouting an adaption

+ Show Spoiler +

Reacting to T3

+ Show Spoiler +

Killing the Zerg

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Weakness

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Replays

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Last edit: 2012-08-01 00:08:01
Old Post

  Grapefruit   Germany. August 01 2012 04:29. Posts 438Profile # 
Nice write-up, but how is this any different from the standard bio-style TvZ right now?

Also I don't want to rain on your parade but a 77% win-rate in Diamond does not imply that it is a solid strat (although this one is).
Starcraft 2 is funny, everybody picks the race, which he considers to be the weakest. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Old Post

  Sc2ttyl   United States. August 01 2012 04:42. Posts 245Profile # 
Any competent zerg would just smash you building nothing but drones, Only viable options koreans GMs are doing is rax CC CC or CC first double rax third CC.
yo
Old Post

 
 netherh   United Kingdom. August 01 2012 06:22. Posts 266
Profile Blog # 

On August 01 2012 00:04 Sianos wrote:
SCV scout at 13 supply:

Leave his base shortly before pool will finishes and hide your scv somewhere near his 3rd base. The most important thing to watch out for is gas. If the Zerg takes a gas before your scv leaves the possibility of allins is higher and you can´t move your first marines arround the map. If he has no gas you can move your first 4 marines to your watchtower for mapcontrol. This is essential because you will deny the Zerg the vision on your 8 minute push as much as possible. To clear the watchtower he needs more than 6 Zerglings, so if you see a lot of zerglings clearing your 4 marines you are in great shape, because he has invested a lot in units instead of economy.



Is there a particular reason to scout at 13? I always scout later (with the SCV that builds my barracks), and generally see pool / gas timing just fine (maybe unless I scout last on a 4 player map).
Old Post

 
 iAmJeffReY   United States. August 01 2012 08:35. Posts 3387
Profile # 
Still no replays?

Just from reading the skeleton, you can do a LOT of changing it up to actually make it refined. The order of upgrades, and their times is all wacked up.

CS is 110 seconds I believe, it should be got last.
Stim is 180, +1 170. Stim should start before CS and +1, with +1 shortly after, and CS after about 50-60 seconds... this way they all end together. It can be done before 10 minutes, and still move out with a same size, if not larger, army.
Last edit: 2012-08-01 08:37:21
iAmJeffReY.267 /// http://www.twitch.tv/iamjeffrey_
Old Post

 
 sAsImre   August 01 2012 08:47. Posts 2962
Profile Blog # 
What is the purpose of the blindd marauders or the early tech lab on the fac ? you know that 6queens will defend in time the 3rd against your early poke. at least get conc before cs/stim if you want to do an early push (i'd love to be proved wrong /w replays)
you get an early starport and you've only 2medivacs at 10min? should prioritize raxes if you want to be aggro or an earlier 3rd.

Imo you tech too quickly while getting bio upgrades (cs/stim) early which is kinda weird.
Last edit: 2012-08-01 08:48:24
Old Post

 
 GornWood   Germany. August 01 2012 09:40. Posts 89
Profile # 
Well "early" pressure at minute 8 is already late and honestly if you move out with 17 marines the zerg will most likely defend the attack without any serious damage. I kind of laughed at your unit count at minute 10 because marines are the core of you army and having only 28 of them is kind of low. Ok you have 3 marauders, 3 hellions and 1 1/2 medivacs but you still haven't got stim or +1 damage upgrade. I don't want to be rude or something but I am awful with zerg and I still manage to have like 70 lings and a few banes at minute 10, while also having a third base and a decent drone count. I think this would kind of demolish your army/ build. Since you are in diamond I think the timings could be improved quite a bit. But in the end it isn't really different from any standard bio build.
If you are on the EU server we could play some games (I would be zerg in that case) just PM me and I will give you my Bnet ID.
Old Post

 
 derpinator   August 02 2012 04:36. Posts 74
Profile # 

Hi guys,
i´m tired of hearing the whines towards Zerg nowadays, so i thought i could share my style aggainst them which gives me a 77% win ratio(23 games total) as a high diamond player. The build is a solid macro oriented build with a lot of opportunities for aggression aggainst Zerg starting after the 8 minute mark. I started to do this build even before the queen patch was released, because i hated to micro my hellions in the beginning.


Please dont start your introduction that way because there are legitimate reasons to whine about this match up.


The current metageme includes a Terran doing a 1 rax fe and a Zerg responding with a fast 3rd base. So i wanted a build, which can punish greedy Zerg players with an early attack towards their 3rd. The solution for me was a bio attack with combat shields and 2-3 marrauders arround 8 minutes.


This has been done since beta and gets crushed by mass speedling very easily. Sure you can surprise greedy zergs with this but that doesnt mean its actually viable. Good luck with your TvZ we all know how hard it is.
Old Post

 
 TDH   Finland. August 02 2012 04:56. Posts 25
Profile # 
I dont think this surprise attack can work without helions since you dont have any map control. As the above postar said the zerg can just make mass lings and overrun you, and you will be way behind.
Everybody are Imba in there own way. Even bronse players like me :)
Old Post

 
 Surgical_Strike   United States. August 02 2012 06:09. Posts 72
Profile # 
This build can either be beaten by MASS drones and only making queens with literally 0 to a few lings to crush your push and be miles ahead of your late third (ive seen an 8-9 minute +1 +CS marine attack with like 20 marines get absolutely destroyed by an 8 queen build with 0 ling support at pro level. 4-5 queens with tranfuse wreck marines without stim/medivac fast [or the zerg will just have a group of ling/bane that will swallow your bio the second you move onto the massive creep]) . Or, a high eco bust can crush you. Maybe if you played better zergs you would realize why pro's and other good terrans have been ("whining") frustrated by the matchup. What you posted is just a sloppy version of a super standard 1 rax expand with a late 3rd that may have worked 6-12 months ago when zerg were not as confident in their defense and would not expand so fast. The builds that work right now are either VERY greedy (usually with hellion/banshee harass 3oc double ups) or a very elegantly performed all in.
I guess what im trying to say is... if your build is working for YOU at YOUR level, that's awesome. But, dont go saying you are tired of terrans being whiners and act like you have some amazing build that solves all the problems of the matchup when its a standard bio build without greed or any kind of scary push.
Anything worth doing, is worth doing right.
Old Post

  StateofReverie   United States. August 02 2012 10:08. Posts 632Profile Blog # 
28 marines by 10 minutes without stim? how do you defend vs teh baneesssss? and roachesssss? and banelings AND roaches :scared face:
Old Post

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