[H] ZvP Double Stargate Double Robo

Hi,

I quite frankly have no idea what I should have done in this replay:

http://drop.sc/242700

To give a breif description of what happened, a Protoss cannon rushes me, then goes double stargate, double robo, high templar and just takes a bunch of expansions while I can't kill him.

I don't really think macro was an issue, I spent my money, maybe on the wrong things. I guess going Hydras was stupid and I should have went pure infestor roach corruptor. Obviously my macro wasn't perfect, I'm Platinum and still learning.

I guess the main reason I lost is I let the Protoss get a base advantage against me. I don't really know how to prevent that as I can't really send out Overlords vs 6 pheonixes and void rays.

His final army composition was just silly, but yet Zerg can't do anything against it without Infestor Broodlord it seems.

Matches like this really just make me think Starcraft 2 doesn't favor people who try really hard to learn the game. Chess seems to be what SC2 pros like to compare their game to, but Chess is so much deeper in terms of strategy and does not favor people who know little opening traps but favors those who can read into position.

Thanks in advance,

Cranium

Last edit: 2012-08-24 07:03:08

Rossbacher August 24 2012 07:29. Posts 26

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Ok writing this as I'm watching.

cannon rush: wow you fucked that up. The problem began when you didnt make an overlord on 15/16, leaving you supply blocked at 18. second problem is that you spend all your larva on drones. save 2 larva, make 4 lings and 1 queen. against the cannon rush, dont pull all your workers. you have lings incoming. maybe pull 4 if you are afraid, not more. make more lings. and the spine was a waste of money as well.

28/28. supply blocked again. and you are not spending the energy on your queen.

you are throwing down 3 gas and roach warren at around 6:30 for no reason at all. toss just lost 3 pylons and 2 cannons. Your Overlord can see that the cybercore just started. You dont have a third base yet. you have 26 drones. There is no reason at all to start your tech for quite a while.

8 min. you are starting roach production. on two bases with 4 gas. against a two base toss. I'm not sure why you are doing this. there is zero aggression coming from your opponent. YOU HAVE 32 DRONES. You're going for roach ling. Which works perfectly with 60 drones and 4 hatcheries.

9:30 you go for an all-in attack. toss has 41 probes to your 32 and 1 stalker. and 4 cannons. You simply dont have the ressources to bust a ramp with 4 cannons.

Alright I'm not gonna watch the rest.

I don't really think macro was an issue, I spent my money,

At 10:30, you have 1300 mins and 300 gas. that is not what 'spending your money' means. you are supposed to have no more than 300 minerals. Go fix your build and most importantly start thinking when you're playing. chess is about thinking and adapting and so is SC2.

Oh and for the question what you should have done differently. For zerg there is only one answer: more drones! ;-)

Last edit: 2012-08-24 07:31:40

cythaze August 24 2012 07:43. Posts 252

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Your cannon rush defence was quite bad, pulling all the drones because u didnt (couldnt) build any lings and you did not build a third hatch after it was cleared up (maybe because u lost your focus, dont know...)
The roach/ling attack you did was pretty much allin afterwards and totally played in his hands as he went 2x stargate but didnt lose any eco at all to your bust.

(meanwhile your macro is slipping)

When u had 20 roaches or so you didnt kill the rocks to your third, therefore lost the hatch, could have been avoided.
Scouting the toss third base: you can use speedlings aswell for scouting dont have to rely on oviescout.
The first few Hydras were not too bad as he went 2 x Stargate but rebuilding a Hydra force after your army was wiped out by 5+ colossi was just a bad idea.

U never had the eco to play Roach/Hydra/Corrupter (mostly around 50 drones), and ur fights were kinda bad aswell (for example losing all your corrupters at one point flying them in the toss nat.
You would have needed a stable 3 - 4 base eco and constant army trading with that style or try to transition into BL earlier.

Cranium United States. August 24 2012 08:02. Posts 28

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Watched the replay again and I understand the criticisms of the above posters. I guess the moral of the story really is: defend the cannon rush better, never try to kill a protoss before infestor broodlord. God I hate this matchup.

Thanks again.

Last edit: 2012-08-24 08:04:32

RandomRice United States. August 24 2012 08:16. Posts 303

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You can definitely kill Protoss before infestors broodlord. What you can't do is kill is a Protoss with a better economy than you with a tech advantage as well.

courtpanda August 24 2012 08:23. Posts 766

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if youre even/ahead, roach, hydra, corruptor beats toss when the armies are relatively small. (i.e. nowhere near max)

Rossbacher August 24 2012 18:10. Posts 26

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No, that is not at all the moral. The moral is that you have to focus on economy over everything else. You must fight the urge to go autopilot in your games. Rather focus on reaching certain checkpoints in a specific order. Against an FFE toss it would be something like start tech when I have 3 base mineral saturation. start infestors after double evo kicks in. go spire+hive after 5 infestors are out. If you look at Stephano's play on a very basic level, he just wins because he has a lot stuff. That's what zerg is all about.

gl & hf