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 kafkaesque Germany. September 23 2012 01:25. Posts 2000 | Profile Blog # |
Hey guys,
I have been quite intent on getting an Ultrabook, but having recently seen some really good use out of a tablet, I'm starting to see the merits of one.
For which reasons do I need the device?
- writing stuff down in lectures, preferably with a "real" keyboard
- replacing paper entirely would be a dream come true, since I suck at "analogue" organization of documents
For which reasons would it be cool to have one?
- mobile media and watching stuff while hanging about in the garden / the bed
- e-reader for newspapers and especially books
- saving tons of paper on sheet music on pdf (a tablet would be preferable to put on the piano)
- guitar tabulature, not being forced to load up the computer for that...
So I have some questions, since my research has brought very ambiguous results so far.
First of, how do tablets get internet? Do I just put in my mobile's "SIM"-card? Or am I reliant on WirelesslLan?
Secondly, can you transfer your documents onto your desktop-pc for safekeeping?
Thirdly, do you suppose Windows 8 for tablets is worth waiting for?
-Will it operate more like a traditional windows or using the app-market-approach?
-Will it be downwards-compatible, i. e. will I be able to simply use old programs designed for Windows XP / Vista on Windows 8?
Fourthly, how comfortable is the 10,x inch viewing experience in general? If I'm not mistaken, 10 inch is less than the diagonal of a Din A4 page, which seems kind of tiny. Is that ever a problem?
That's it so far, thanks a lot! 
Last edit: 2012-09-23 01:49:19 |
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 Womwomwom September 23 2012 01:41. Posts 5556 | Profile Blog # |
Are you in university or starting university? Nothing will replace pen and paper. You can't do formatting or write as fast with a keyboard and the technology simply introduces distractions for you and those around you. A lot of science and mathematics subjects I took had notes that were specifically designed to prevent students from dragging their laptops out. I also don't really believe anyone who says that they can't organise paper notes. Lectures, tutorials, workshops are already set up so you can organise notes easily.
Putting that aside, if you can justify getting a tablet then get a tablet. You're paying for convenience of the form factor at the end of the day and if you can buy the product and actually get proper use out of it, then why not?
Tablets get internet through a SIM card. You have to get a model that specifically states it has 3G/4G or some sort of cellular capability. They cost more than the base Wi-Fi only models, however, so take that into account.
The main software to gather notes would be Microsoft OneNote. I've used it before. Its pretty good but its kind of redundant unless you want to share notes with other people. That's its greatest boon. I still prefer to use a pen and paper because it means you don't have to worry about battery life, software going nuts during the lecture, etc.
Some Windows 8 tablets will have pressure sensitive pen support so it'll kind of work like pen and paper. Windows 8 smashes the traditional windows desktop with a modern tablet GUI (think Windows Phone 7). Everything should be fairly backwards compatible if you're getting a model with an Intel processor; if you get a model using an ARM processor, don't count on running anything.
10" display is fine for media consumption like reading lecture notes and shit. A lot less fun for content creation. Its a hardware paradox that Windows 8 doesn't solve. 13" laptops are better for content creation but they're unwieldy and heavy to be used like a typical tablet; a 10" laptop can be used like a laptop but those 10" laptops aren't going to be as comfortable for content creation as a 13" laptop.Last edit: 2012-09-23 01:45:00 |
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| Rannasha Netherlands. September 23 2012 01:42. Posts 2308 | Profile Blog # |
On September 23 2012 01:25 kafkaesque wrote:
First of, how do tablets get internet? Do I just put in my mobile's "SIM"-card? Or am I reliant on WirelesslLan?
All tablets have WiFi. Some models (typically the more expensive ones) have 3G (or even 4G), in which case you can use a SIM-card to get internet access everywhere.
Secondly, can you transfer your documents onto your desktop-pc for safekeeping?
Yes.
Thirdly, do you suppose Windows 8 for tablets is worth waiting for?
Personally, I don't think it will be a serious competitor to the existing tablet ecosystems, Android and iOS. In any case, I wouldn't be an early adopter for Win8 on tablets, too many unknowns still.
-Will it operate more like a traditional windows or using the app-market-approach?
For tablets, it'll be app-market-based. For laptops and desktops, it'll have both.
-Will it be downwards-compatible, i. e. will I be able to simply use old programs designed for Windows XP / Vista on Windows 8?
On laptops and desktops, yes. On tablets no. There are fundamental differences in the processor architecture of most tablets and that of laptops/desktops. Consequently, the Windows 8 versions for both will be different, even though they look and function similarly.
Fourthly, how comfortable is the 10,x inch viewing experience in general? If I'm not mistaken, 10 inch is less than the diameter of a Din A4 page, which seems kind of tiny. Is that ever a problem?
That's entirely personal. I can browse, read and watch fine on a 10" screen, but for any serious work, I prefer my screen to be (much) bigger.
Last edit: 2012-09-23 01:43:03 |
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| HomeWorld Romania. September 23 2012 01:42. Posts 569 | Profile # |
If I'm not mistaken diameter is the length of a line that describes a circle rotating it by 180 degrees having the middle point fixed.
To answer your questions:
Tablets do get internet be it by using its wifi or gsm modem (so yes you can use tablets with current mobile infrastructure, if that feature is available)
Second, yes, it's quite easy when you know how your purchased tablet behaves when connected to other devices (easy peasy)
Third, it's up to you, speaking for myself I wouldn't jump on W8 tablets right from the start since those are quite new untested products, give it some time.
Depending, but no, those will not be compatible, unless those tablets are running a x86 windows variant that the manufacturer explicitly said is compatible with existing ecosystem.
Fourthly, , take more geometry lessons  |
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| kafkaesque Germany. September 23 2012 03:19. Posts 2000 | Profile Blog # |
On September 23 2012 01:41 Womwomwom wrote:
Are you in university or starting university? Nothing will replace pen and paper. You can't do formatting or write as fast with a keyboard and the technology simply introduces distractions for you and those around you.
Well I figured everyone around me would use technological aids (mostly macbooks) as well.
I haven't yet started, lectures begin in early 2012for me. Or 2013, whatever year we have now...
As to pen and paper: my handwriting is seriously horrid and I type faster than I write, so that's a plus.
The formatting thing should be a software-issue; I have no idea how office-software has progressed since MS Office 98, the last time I worked in an office and used a computer in that practical sense.
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| Womwomwom September 23 2012 03:37. Posts 5556 | Profile Blog # |
When I was at university, those that used technological aids in lectures and tutorials were mostly not paying attention (watching movies in class) or doing something else like finishing an essay that's due in 2 hours time (that's me). I suspect that hasn't changed at all, students are all the same. Its probably even easier to do that now with tablets and smartphones. However, I imagine a lot of students use tablets legitimately...printing is not cheap.
Anyhow, most subjects I did offered bound reading/lecture booklets. No idea if other universities work differently but seems common across Australia. The organisation of notes is already done for you most of the time, all you do is rock up to lectures and write into the space provided. In subjects that don't offer these things and require you to take actual notes, it is important to write only what is important and not what is obvious. The lecturer will speak faster than you can type/write and most of the lecturer material should be related to any supplementary readings you have.
Its fine if you're going to type notes but be aware you might end up doing more work for no reason. I suggest getting a laptop/tablet for purposes outside "taking notes" - using it as a guitar tab/ebook device or an essay writing machine are more valid reasons than using it as a notetaking machine in my opinion.Last edit: 2012-09-23 03:50:27 |
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| deo1 United States. September 23 2012 03:46. Posts 197 | Profile # |
I think windows 8 is the solution you're looking for and is worth waiting for. Windows 8 comes out in two versions: pro and RT. The pro version will be completely back compatible with all desktop apps with the addition that it is touch optimized. The RT version goes with the app/marketplace approach only.
get this bad boy and take notes with the keyboard cover or use a stylus.
http://www.microsoft.com/surface/en/us/default.aspx
Use windows 8 and a microsoft account and all of your notes/docs will be synced in the cloud across all your devices (tablets, desktop, etc.) Alternatively use another existing service like dropbox.
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| kafkaesque Germany. September 23 2012 03:53. Posts 2000 | Profile Blog # |
Now I've heard 3 different versions regarding the backwards-compatability.
This is a huge factor for me, but being not very tech savy, I only understand half of what I read on the sources I gewgle. |
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| deo1 United States. September 23 2012 03:54. Posts 197 | Profile # |
On September 23 2012 01:42 Rannasha wrote:
Show nested quote +-Will it operate more like a traditional windows or using the app-market-approach?
For tablets, it'll be app-market-based. For laptops and desktops, it'll have both.
Show nested quote +-Will it be downwards-compatible, i. e. will I be able to simply use old programs designed for Windows XP / Vista on Windows 8?
On laptops and desktops, yes. On tablets no. There are fundamental differences in the processor architecture of most tablets and that of laptops/desktops. Consequently, the Windows 8 versions for both will be different, even though they look and function similarly.
This is wrong. The win8 pro version will run on x86 architecture tablets which gives full back compat for desktop programs as well as app/marketplace access. So it doesn't matter if the device is a tablet/desktop/laptop, it can still do all of the above with the right version of win8 installed. |
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| deo1 United States. September 23 2012 03:56. Posts 197 | Profile # |
On September 23 2012 03:53 kafkaesque wrote:
Now I've heard 3 different versions regarding the backwards-compatability.
This is a huge factor for me, but being not very tech savy, I only understand half of what I read on the sources I gewgle.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_8#Software_compatibility
Quick summary: get a tablet with win8 and you get backcompat and full desktop mode. get a tablet with winRT and you just get the app/marketplace without backcompat. |
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| kafkaesque Germany. September 23 2012 04:01. Posts 2000 | Profile Blog # |
That would be amazing. So in theory, I could play some old school Windows games on a tablet?
That would also guarantee the continued use of my music software, which would be an enourmous plus.
I hope the Surface will have an aspect ratio of 16 : 9?
€: Apparently it will. That shit sounds so futuristic; I'm definitely waiting for that Surface Pro before I decide what to get.Last edit: 2012-09-23 04:05:01 |
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| deo1 United States. September 23 2012 04:13. Posts 197 | Profile # |
On September 23 2012 04:01 kafkaesque wrote:
That would be amazing. So in theory, I could play some old school Windows games on a tablet?
That would also guarantee the continued use of my music software, which would be an enourmous plus.
I hope the Surface will have an aspect ratio of 16 : 9?
€: Apparently it will. That shit sounds so futuristic; I'm definitely waiting for that Surface Pro before I decide what to get.
Yep, old windows games, music software, anything really. I'm getting one for much the same reasons that you want a tablet, it's like the ultimate computing device. I also can't wait to have a portable n64/snes/nes/ps/dreamcast through emulators :D.
Also be on the lookout for OEM tablets (e.g. IBM, samsung) running windows 8 in November timeframe, they may release earlier than surface pro and be cheaper.
http://www.zdnet.com/lenovo-thinkpad-tablet-2-runs-windows-8-pro-includes-keyboard-for-799-7000004666/ |
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| Pusekatten Norway. September 23 2012 04:14. Posts 231 | Profile # |
I will go OT a little, because I dont want to make a whole new thread about this.
Would a Samsung 900X4C (15" 9 series ultrabook) be able to play games like sc2, gw2, cs:go? |
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| kafkaesque Germany. September 23 2012 04:21. Posts 2000 | Profile Blog # |
Given the Intel HD 4000, they will barely be able to play SC2 on low settings.
GW2 and CS:go I don't know about.
Back to tablets, please.  |
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| Rannasha Netherlands. September 23 2012 04:23. Posts 2308 | Profile Blog # |
On September 23 2012 03:54 deo1 wrote:
Show nested quote +On September 23 2012 01:42 Rannasha wrote:
-Will it operate more like a traditional windows or using the app-market-approach?
For tablets, it'll be app-market-based. For laptops and desktops, it'll have both.
-Will it be downwards-compatible, i. e. will I be able to simply use old programs designed for Windows XP / Vista on Windows 8?
On laptops and desktops, yes. On tablets no. There are fundamental differences in the processor architecture of most tablets and that of laptops/desktops. Consequently, the Windows 8 versions for both will be different, even though they look and function similarly.
This is wrong. The win8 pro version will run on x86 architecture tablets which gives full back compat for desktop programs as well as app/marketplace access. So it doesn't matter if the device is a tablet/desktop/laptop, it can still do all of the above with the right version of win8 installed.
Okay, I ignored the category of x86 tablets. But so far there hasn't been a single x86 tablet that was a convincing competitor to the ARM-based tablets in terms of weight and battery life. And I'm not yet convinced that the new Win8 tablets will change that as the x86 processors simply aren't as efficient as the ARM processors are.
So while you will be able to run older Windows programs on an x86-based Win8 tablet, I have strong doubts whether you'd want to. Even if battery life and weight turn out to be similar to ARM tablets, you still have the issue of all the old programs not being made for a touch-interface, meaning you either have very awkward controls or are forced to use an external keyboard and mouse, losing all advantages of a tablet. |
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| CatNzHat United States. September 23 2012 04:32. Posts 1305 | Profile # |
| Look at the Asus Transformer series of Android tablets, they've got the keyboard dock that you want. You seem to be quite clueless, didn't even bother doing a single search for tablets to find out what they are and how they work even on a general level. This forum is not for supporting or enabling lazy people, it's to help those who have run into problems that they cannot diagnose on their own, or are looking for an expert opinion on a topic they have researched thouroughly but could not make the decision on their own due to lack of information/experience. |
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| Corvi Germany. September 23 2012 04:53. Posts 1358 | Profile Blog # |
| i'm android all the way for smartphones, but for tablets its windows 8 because office 2012. maybe surface for that keyboard. |
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| kafkaesque Germany. September 23 2012 05:04. Posts 2000 | Profile Blog # |
On September 23 2012 04:32 CatNzHat wrote:
Look at the Asus Transformer series of Android tablets, they've got the keyboard dock that you want. You seem to be quite clueless, didn't even bother doing a single search for tablets to find out what they are and how they work even on a general level. This forum is not for supporting or enabling lazy people, it's to help those who have run into problems that they cannot diagnose on their own, or are looking for an expert opinion on a topic they have researched thouroughly but could not make the decision on their own due to lack of information/experience.
That is as unfair as it is untrue.
I did in fact do research and asked the questions I have not been able to answer myself through research.
You will notice that I didn't ask for specific models, I merely wanted to get some angles from people using tablets I might have not considered myself.
So I don't get why after there has been plenty of helpful and pleasant replies, you feel like you have to repremand and try to insult me. |
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| Wishmaster Malta. September 23 2012 18:35. Posts 73 | Profile # |
I am in a similar situation as you right now, since my 6 year old laptop is slowly but surely dying.
I informed myself quite much, about what would be suitable for my needs which are very similar to yours.
I once used a ipad 2, then later an ipad 3, aiming on using it instead of pencil and paper in university. Worked out OK, but not great. I used it throughout a whole semester writing everything with it or annotating pdf´s. I found out, thats its just not optimal because of its screensize.
Ipad size (as most other tablet sizes) is just a 10" screen, that would MAYB be ok, but you also have to write on predefined field, which takes on itself about 1/5 or even 1/4 of the screen. Then add this to the fact that your hand is covering a little bit of the screen that you can see, its just all together too small to be used as effective as pencil&paper. I end up selling them, because i was not satisfied 100% with them...
short sidenote: ipad 2/3 are bad for watching movies because of their 4:3 screen format... I would definetly aim for an 16 screen...
I would asume upcoming 13" tablets, with the right apps (asuming win8 on a tablet) would work much better. There are interesting tablets announced that could fullfill my needs BUT, i don´t think apps for handwriting will be as good as on ios devices for the first 2-3 month of the release of win8 and its not clear where they will aim for pricewise.
I also found out that the weight is an important factor. You won´t believe how much you can feel a 50 gramm difference from ipad 2 (613g) and ipad 3 (662g). Ipad 3 was to heavy for me!
So i would say its a difficult time trying to buy a whatever devices right now... everything is changing so rapidly, so many devices are in the making. And since your described needs are also as wide as mine, if even feel more, that the best would be to observe and wait how the market developes, since the device you are searching for is not yet on the market.
As soon as there is a 12-13" display that manages to keep its weight around 600g (maye not even possible?) with a full hd screen, and good handwriting apps for its ecosystem (ios,android or win8 rt/normal) i would buy it. It may take until the beginning of the next year until this happens, but mayb someone comes up with a intersting devices for christmas time, lets see.
Last edit: 2012-09-23 18:48:40 |
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