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| Nick_54 United States. November 20 2008 08:55. Posts 2115 | Profile Blog # |
On November 17 2008 20:49 Fwmeh wrote:
Show nested quote +On November 17 2008 15:59 malongo wrote:
On November 17 2008 02:02 raga4ka wrote:
On November 16 2008 18:59 baubo wrote:
On November 16 2008 18:30 Sentenal wrote:
There is no point in looking at stats from several months ago. MSL and OSL groups, which were the last time Bisu lost PvTs, were a while ago. Hell, that loss to Flash was from that Bunker Rush game on Medusa, it wasn't exactly a game that shows Bisu's skill in the MU one way or another.
Faulting Bisu now for those games, is like faulting Bisu for being ranked #8 on the power ranks a month ago. And the PvTs where he has played in recent history, he looked beastly.
I pointed that out to show that Stork isn't just good at PvT, he's pretty much invincible at it. One can argue that Bisu is anywhere from inconsistent to very good in the MU, but you cannot say that Stork is nothing less than Godly in it. I was just going by your standard of Bisu PvZ >> Stork's. Stork has been very good PvZ lately. But I did not disagree with you in the area because he hasn't shown anywhere close to the consistency that Bisu has. If Stork > Bisu PvT, then Bisu > Stork PvZ. The gap between them in these two MUs is about equal. You can either say they're both really close to each other in both MUs(going by very recent record) or both quite better than the other in them(going by long term history).
Yeah but there are more T players in leagues then Zs , althought the best zerg players normaly wins the tournament . I think stork right now is invincible vs Terran and maybe only Flash can challenge him . Stork is better then Flash if he doesn't choke . On the other hand Bisu is not invincible in PvZ and the gap between their PvZ and PvT is different . Yes he is strong but he doesn't boot the record in PvZ that Stork does in PvT with much less games played and Bisu will be 50-50 % at best vs players like JD or July on which he hasn't or couldn't prove his superiorness in PvZ, but Stork will have an advantage vs the best TvP players if he doesn't choke badly.Even if he lost to Flash in recent leagues before he beated him as much . All i know is that July Imo is the favourite vs any and all protoss players  . From all the games i've watched him play ZvP he just plays it by instinct and rapes . Jaedong normaly trys to outsmart players and take slight advantages that then uses them to rape - like drops or muta harras sneaking lings to harras that sort of things. And if he trys it and it doesn't work he gets behind a bit and fights an uphill battle vs toss players but still even behind his mechanics and game sense most time prevails even vs great PvZ players . The Bisu fans should start argueing that Bisu is better then Stork if/after he manages to beat JangBI , because from what i've saw in their PvP he'll struggle a lot .
I wont argue here for stork or bisu but got to say that bisus pvz while not invincible is the best in the world, now and ever, his builds are smart, his timing is sick. In fact ive never seen a pvz where bisu lost bad, its always a good rush, a timed attack or a sick play from the zerg, but ive never seen bisu outplayed on pvz.
How about this game: http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/games/9299_Bisu_vs_ZerO/vod Or do you count that as sick play from the zerg? I'm sure there are like 10 other games just like that one.
This was when Bisu's hand/wrist was injured, it its not fair to judge him based on this game. |
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| Fontong United States. November 20 2008 15:37. Posts 6453 | Profile Blog # |
On November 19 2008 01:03 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:
Show nested quote +On November 18 2008 18:21 MrHoon wrote:
On November 18 2008 16:30 Avidkeystamper wrote:
Stork's PvZ is about to be tested tonight (results will not be conclusive).
eh, even if he wins antifans and other fans will argue calm is "Inconsistent" (despite the fact he isn't) edit: Calm, Not Clam
maybe i'll change the TLPD entry and see how long it takes someone to notice
I already write this all the time... |
| | [ＳＥＣＲＥＴ ＦＯＮＴ] "Dragoon bunker" |  |
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| StylishVODs Sweden. November 22 2008 06:56. Posts 4988 | Profile # |
On November 18 2008 11:36 OneOther wrote:July is not a bonjwa. Bonjwas are Boxer, NaDa, iloveoov, and sAviOr
Bisu was Bonjwa for a while there... |
| | According to Reach, he is the fastest learner he has ever seen. He start bw only like 2/3 years ago. Infact, his bw history knowledge is so limited, he didn't even know what the map Guillotine was. |  |
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 OneOther United States. November 22 2008 09:12. Posts 10695 | Profile Blog # |
On November 22 2008 06:56 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
Show nested quote +On November 18 2008 11:36 OneOther wrote:July is not a bonjwa. Bonjwas are Boxer, NaDa, iloveoov, and sAviOr
Bisu was Bonjwa for a while there...
lol you can't be a bonjwa for a while. you are either one or you are not. |
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| StylishVODs Sweden. November 22 2008 11:58. Posts 4988 | Profile # |
On November 22 2008 09:12 OneOther wrote:
Show nested quote +On November 22 2008 06:56 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
On November 18 2008 11:36 OneOther wrote:July is not a bonjwa. Bonjwas are Boxer, NaDa, iloveoov, and sAviOr
Bisu was Bonjwa for a while there...
lol you can't be a bonjwa for a while. you are either one or you are not.
no lol
None of the ones you listed are bonjwas anymore.
Bisu was best for a long time and was classed the bonjwa for that time.
I'll admit jaedong and flash wasnt dominant long enough or alone enough to be classed bonjwas though.
don't lol away this one mr. |
| | According to Reach, he is the fastest learner he has ever seen. He start bw only like 2/3 years ago. Infact, his bw history knowledge is so limited, he didn't even know what the map Guillotine was. | |
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| OneOther United States. November 22 2008 12:08. Posts 10695 | Profile Blog # |
On November 22 2008 11:58 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
Show nested quote +On November 22 2008 09:12 OneOther wrote:
On November 22 2008 06:56 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
On November 18 2008 11:36 OneOther wrote:July is not a bonjwa. Bonjwas are Boxer, NaDa, iloveoov, and sAviOr
Bisu was Bonjwa for a while there...
lol you can't be a bonjwa for a while. you are either one or you are not.
no lol None of the ones you listed are bonjwas anymore. Bisu was best for a long time and was classed the bonjwa for that time. I'll admit jaedong and flash wasnt dominant long enough or alone enough to be classed bonjwas though. don't lol away this one mr.
lol?
you are an idiot. go learn what bonjwa means before you come talk here.
you are fighting a losing battle here bud |
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| OneOther United States. November 22 2008 12:09. Posts 10695 | Profile Blog # |
actually i feel bad for you so i'll just tell what you what it means
bonjwa = the legends, the best of the bests in the history
hence, savior/nada/boxer/oov are the four bonjwas. forever.
they can never lose their status...meaning you can't be bonjwa for a while and not be one anymore.
(bisu isn't a bonjwa, because he doesn't fit in with the ones i listed. at least not yet.)
Last edit: 2008-11-22 12:11:46 |
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| StylishVODs Sweden. November 22 2008 12:16. Posts 4988 | Profile # |
On November 22 2008 12:09 OneOther wrote:
actually i feel bad for you so i'll just tell what you what it means
bonjwa = the legends, the best of the bests in the history
hence, savior/nada/boxer/oov are the four bonjwas. forever.
they can never lose their status...meaning you can't be bonjwa for a while and not be one anymore.
(bisu isn't a bonjwa, because he doesn't fit in with the ones i listed. at least not yet.)
K, i thought bonjwa meant The Best, the one to beat...
Then i take it back. I thought i knew what bonjwa meant since i read the explenation numerous times here on TL.net.
If it means the legends, then i guess Bisu doesnt really count.
Although i think bisu, jaedong and flash might be refered to as Bonjwas in a near future.
Also dont call me an idiot, coz i thought i knew a korean word that i didn't. Doesnt really make me an idiot does it?
Last edit: 2008-11-22 12:22:58 |
| | According to Reach, he is the fastest learner he has ever seen. He start bw only like 2/3 years ago. Infact, his bw history knowledge is so limited, he didn't even know what the map Guillotine was. | |
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| p4fn2w November 22 2008 12:17. Posts 383 | Profile Blog # |
I always thought Boxer wasn't dominant enough at his time to be considered a bonjwa?
Besides, he deserves a better title! How dare you degrade his name with an unworthy label as "Bonjwa"! Only The Emperor suits him  . |
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| OneOther United States. November 22 2008 12:22. Posts 10695 | Profile Blog # |
On November 22 2008 12:16 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
Show nested quote +On November 22 2008 12:09 OneOther wrote:
actually i feel bad for you so i'll just tell what you what it means
bonjwa = the legends, the best of the bests in the history
hence, savior/nada/boxer/oov are the four bonjwas. forever.
they can never lose their status...meaning you can't be bonjwa for a while and not be one anymore.
(bisu isn't a bonjwa, because he doesn't fit in with the ones i listed. at least not yet.)
K, i thought bonjwa meant The Best, the one to beat... Then i take it back. I thought i knew what bonjwa meant since i read the explenation numerous times here on TL.net. If it means the legends, then i guess Bisu doesnt really count. Also dont call me an idiot. Atleast i admit when i'm wrong.
well how can you not admit it lol
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| StylishVODs Sweden. November 22 2008 12:24. Posts 4988 | Profile # |
On November 22 2008 12:22 OneOther wrote:
Show nested quote +On November 22 2008 12:16 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
On November 22 2008 12:09 OneOther wrote:
actually i feel bad for you so i'll just tell what you what it means
bonjwa = the legends, the best of the bests in the history
hence, savior/nada/boxer/oov are the four bonjwas. forever.
they can never lose their status...meaning you can't be bonjwa for a while and not be one anymore.
(bisu isn't a bonjwa, because he doesn't fit in with the ones i listed. at least not yet.)
K, i thought bonjwa meant The Best, the one to beat... Then i take it back. I thought i knew what bonjwa meant since i read the explenation numerous times here on TL.net. If it means the legends, then i guess Bisu doesnt really count. Also dont call me an idiot. Atleast i admit when i'm wrong.
well how can you not admit it lol
still calling me an idiot for not knowing a korean word is pretty uncalled for..
bonjwa word is also pretty biased right? so some people might say jaedong and bisu are also bonjwas? if not, i still dont really get that word.Last edit: 2008-11-22 12:25:42 |
| | According to Reach, he is the fastest learner he has ever seen. He start bw only like 2/3 years ago. Infact, his bw history knowledge is so limited, he didn't even know what the map Guillotine was. | |
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| OneOther United States. November 22 2008 12:25. Posts 10695 | Profile Blog # |
i called you an idiot not because you didn't know what the korean word meant, but because you tried to argue when you don't even know what it means
On November 22 2008 11:58 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
Show nested quote +On November 22 2008 09:12 OneOther wrote:
On November 22 2008 06:56 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
On November 18 2008 11:36 OneOther wrote:July is not a bonjwa. Bonjwas are Boxer, NaDa, iloveoov, and sAviOr
Bisu was Bonjwa for a while there...
lol you can't be a bonjwa for a while. you are either one or you are not.
no lol None of the ones you listed are bonjwas anymore. Bisu was best for a long time and was classed the bonjwa for that time. I'll admit jaedong and flash wasnt dominant long enough or alone enough to be classed bonjwas though. don't lol away this one mr.
you sure sound like you know what you are talking about there
didn't want to lol away that one, you knowLast edit: 2008-11-22 12:25:49 |
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| OneOther United States. November 22 2008 12:26. Posts 10695 | Profile Blog # |
On November 22 2008 12:24 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
Show nested quote +On November 22 2008 12:22 OneOther wrote:
On November 22 2008 12:16 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
On November 22 2008 12:09 OneOther wrote:
actually i feel bad for you so i'll just tell what you what it means
bonjwa = the legends, the best of the bests in the history
hence, savior/nada/boxer/oov are the four bonjwas. forever.
they can never lose their status...meaning you can't be bonjwa for a while and not be one anymore.
(bisu isn't a bonjwa, because he doesn't fit in with the ones i listed. at least not yet.)
K, i thought bonjwa meant The Best, the one to beat... Then i take it back. I thought i knew what bonjwa meant since i read the explenation numerous times here on TL.net. If it means the legends, then i guess Bisu doesnt really count. Also dont call me an idiot. Atleast i admit when i'm wrong.
well how can you not admit it lol
still calling me an idiot for not knowing a korean word is pretty uncalled for.. bonjwa word is also pretty biased right? so some people might say jaedong and bisu are also bonjwas? if not, i still dont really get that word.
there's a consensus that bonjwas are savior/nada/oov/boxer
Last edit: 2008-11-22 12:27:06 |
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| StylishVODs Sweden. November 22 2008 12:27. Posts 4988 | Profile # |
Yes because i thought i knew what i was talking about. I really thought i knew it.
I read numerous times here @ tl.net what the word meant. Fine, i was wrong.. embarrasing, but still.
I always heard the word with a "the" before.
The bonjaw..
bla bla is the bonjwa.
not bla bla is a bonjwa...
thats why. Anyway, lets drop it. I agree to the powerrank however at the time i'd put flash above jaedong and jangbi. Jangbi doing great now though so its getting better :OLast edit: 2008-11-22 12:33:34 |
| | According to Reach, he is the fastest learner he has ever seen. He start bw only like 2/3 years ago. Infact, his bw history knowledge is so limited, he didn't even know what the map Guillotine was. | |
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| p4fn2w November 22 2008 12:44. Posts 383 | Profile Blog # |
Yo, If Stork continues to drop proleague games like he did against STX, and Bisu finally
enters Baller mode (winning MSL, ballerizing proleague scrublettes, etc.), will Bisu have a
shot at his rightful #1 throne again?
!
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| Dazed_Spy Canada. November 22 2008 16:30. Posts 1683 | Profile Blog # |
On November 22 2008 12:44 p4fn2w wrote:Yo, If Stork continues to drop proleague games like he did against STX, and Bisu finally enters Baller mode (winning MSL, ballerizing proleague scrublettes, etc.), will Bisu have a shot at his rightful #1 throne again? !
Why?
Bottom right of One Others sig.
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| OneOther United States. November 22 2008 17:59. Posts 10695 | Profile Blog # |
On November 22 2008 12:44 p4fn2w wrote:Yo, If Stork continues to drop proleague games like he did against STX, and Bisu finally enters Baller mode (winning MSL, ballerizing proleague scrublettes, etc.), will Bisu have a shot at his rightful #1 throne again? !
actually, yes he does |
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| Polar_Bear Germany. November 22 2008 20:00. Posts 55 | Profile # |
I think there's no doubt that Bisu should be #1 in dec.
+ Show Spoiler + PvP was considered to be his "weak" mu... look what he did to Jangbi this morning. Bisu was kind of unlucky in the first game, I still think it could have been 3-0
And Bisu is a bonjwa imo. + Show Spoiler + 3 MSL titles, another MSL final, two special league titles, 3rd spot in OSL, sky proleague title in 2007, most successful protoss of all time, best PvZ of all time, former Kespa #1 several times; probably 2nd most innovative player of all time...(well not everyone will agree with that) |
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| OneOther United States. November 22 2008 20:03. Posts 10695 | Profile Blog # |
PvP was considered to be his "weak" mu... look what he did to Jangbi this morning. Bisu was kind of unlucky in the first game, I still think it could have been 3-0
are you kidding me? jangbi was definitely the unlucky one in this series. i give credit to bisu for playing amazingly, but come on...give me a break. game 1 was purely a dumb mistake that bisu made, whereas game 3 is a whole another story. everything possible went wrong for jangbi in that game. game 4, bisu gambled again and it paid off. bisu also took a build order risk in game 2 and it paid off as well.
essentially, whatever risk bisu decided to take in every game worked out perfectly for him. which is pretty rare. |
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 disciple Administrator November 22 2008 20:07. | Profile Blog # |
| stork did no major mistake this month to drop out the top spot in the PR, imo he should keep it till the end of the year.. at least |
| | When you play the game of drones you win or you die. |  |
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