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| StylishVODs Sweden. January 21 2009 17:17. Posts 4988 | Profile # |
As i said before i think this can really show some skill for the next PR. This is how good they are if they dont prepare for a specific opponent on a specific map i suppose. Anyway some names have just shined so far, luxury yarnc leta etc.
Was hoping to see more from jaedong in lecaf vs estro :/ |
| | According to Reach, he is the fastest learner he has ever seen. He start bw only like 2/3 years ago. Infact, his bw history knowledge is so limited, he didn't even know what the map Guillotine was. |  |
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| Jaeden Romania. January 21 2009 18:26. Posts 1489 | Profile # |
On January 21 2009 17:36 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:
Show nested quote +On January 21 2009 17:17 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
As i said before i think this can really show some skill for the next PR. This is how good they are if they dont prepare for a specific opponent on a specific map i suppose. Anyway some names have just shined so far, luxury yarnc leta etc.
Was hoping to see more from jaedong in lecaf vs estro :/
yep  Winner's League format is the rawest form of competition, it has the highest overall skill requirement for prolonged success
yes but, a lot of potentially good players may not have the chance to prove that they are good, since their teams may win without them...
oh but, Fail Rank is a great idea !!!
stork for #1! (since FailRrank shouldn`t include the worst players, or else way  MuMyung would be imba. Instead it should include the players that FAILED to meet the expectations)Last edit: 2009-01-21 18:27:55 |
| | Boxer: " Lee Jae Dong is the best player. He`s all about the micro; he`s the player which has the most amazing control" |  |
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| Geo.Rion Hungary. January 21 2009 19:15. Posts 5350 | Profile Blog # |
On January 21 2009 18:26 Jaeden wrote:
Show nested quote +On January 21 2009 17:36 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:
On January 21 2009 17:17 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
As i said before i think this can really show some skill for the next PR. This is how good they are if they dont prepare for a specific opponent on a specific map i suppose. Anyway some names have just shined so far, luxury yarnc leta etc.
Was hoping to see more from jaedong in lecaf vs estro :/
yep Winner's League format is the rawest form of competition, it has the highest overall skill requirement for prolonged success
yes but, a lot of potentially good players may not have the chance to prove that they are good, since their teams may win without them... oh but, Fail Rank is a great idea !!! stork for #1! (since FailRrank shouldn`t include the worst players, or else way MuMyung would be imba. Instead it should include the players that FAILED to meet the expectations)
Stork is actaully fulfilling the expectations, (because of the OSL curse, 3-2 in final) he has to fall, so he's doing it in the most unqestionable style, no fail there. |
| | "Protoss is a joke" Liquid`Jinro Okt.1. 2011 |
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| Jaeden Romania. January 21 2009 19:29. Posts 1489 | Profile # |
On January 21 2009 19:15 Geo.Rion wrote:
Show nested quote +On January 21 2009 18:26 Jaeden wrote:
On January 21 2009 17:36 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:
On January 21 2009 17:17 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
As i said before i think this can really show some skill for the next PR. This is how good they are if they dont prepare for a specific opponent on a specific map i suppose. Anyway some names have just shined so far, luxury yarnc leta etc.
Was hoping to see more from jaedong in lecaf vs estro :/
yep Winner's League format is the rawest form of competition, it has the highest overall skill requirement for prolonged success
yes but, a lot of potentially good players may not have the chance to prove that they are good, since their teams may win without them... oh but, Fail Rank is a great idea !!! stork for #1! (since FailRrank shouldn`t include the worst players, or else way MuMyung would be imba. Instead it should include the players that FAILED to meet the expectations)
Stork is actaully fulfilling the expectations, (because of the OSL curse, 3-2 in final) he has to fall, so he's doing it in the most unqestionable style, no fail there.
Well, a whole lot of users picked him for the FPL, so it means that many were believing that he's not dead yet, and instead, he`s been a huge waste of 6 points |
| | Boxer: " Lee Jae Dong is the best player. He`s all about the micro; he`s the player which has the most amazing control" | |
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| redtooth January 21 2009 20:26. Posts 4683 | Profile Blog # |
Man a single all-kill puts you in the running among the greatest that month.
Next month's (or 1.5 month's) power rank will be so hard to make because you have to include the S-class talent while considering the success of the all-killers (like luxury and yarnc) who wouldn't normally make it but nevertheless performed great. |
| | "Is this really worth 30 dollars?" - MrHoon 2011 // "I actually really like Legos." - MrHoon 2012 |
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| LordWeird United States. January 21 2009 23:33. Posts 3401 | Profile Blog # |
| Luxury has been playing so well lately. I hope he can keep it up and end up on next month's PR. The lack of Z has been concerning lately. Gogo Luxury! |
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| Geo.Rion Hungary. January 22 2009 01:37. Posts 5350 | Profile Blog # |
On January 21 2009 23:33 LordWeird wrote:
Luxury has been playing so well lately. I hope he can keep it up and end up on next month's PR. The lack of Z has been concerning lately. Gogo Luxury!
It seems that zergs found themsleves, more and more of them ae qualifing for the SLs and 2 all-kills up to now were done by zergs, not to mantion against high caliber teams |
| | "Protoss is a joke" Liquid`Jinro Okt.1. 2011 |
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| Solidus_315 January 22 2009 06:31. Posts 212 | Profile # |
| Don't fail me Stork. Snap that losing streak |
| | 어헣↗ 어헣↗ 어헣↗ 어헣↗ 어헣↗ 어헣↗ |  |
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| d_so Korea (South). January 22 2009 08:08. Posts 3150 | Profile Blog # |
On January 20 2009 05:23 SerpentFlame wrote:
Show nested quote +On January 19 2009 21:07 Shikyo wrote:
On January 19 2009 05:49 SerpentFlame wrote:
On January 19 2009 04:32 EleanorRIgby wrote:
there is such a huge misconception that leta is a safe standard player, this is totally wrong i think hes currently the best all around terran player with no current weakness
Watch any of his games versus protoss. Losing a game to BackHo, getting completely destroyed by Jangbi, *almost* losing to Guemchi, and getting steamrolled by Free (these games were far from top-class by Leta)? Granted, Leta's got a good vP, certainly a better one than most gamers, but as far as S class gamers go, his vP is nowhere near those of say, Flash, even though Flash has not been doing too well as of late. Like I think most people have said, Leta still remains largely untested against skilled players in a Bo3 or Bo5, so saying he's "the best all around terran player" is quite a stretch, until he goes far in a starleague.
Well.. vs Guemchi his vulture harrass was really good although Guemchi choked majorly. Against Free, his vulture snipes were insane (Delayed Free's 4th by a few minutes easily). His overall gameplay is a bit flawed but he's really intelligent and is still only improving.
Impressive, but nevertheless, the top-level skill he exhibited in that matchup so far is only mechanical. There are plenty of gamers who have the stellar mechanics needed for a matchup that they still suck at, and Leta has yet to prove himself as different. Yarnc and Luxury, for example, have always had ridiculous mutalisk harassment, but they still manage to lose a good percentage of their games against Protoss.
how the fuck is map-wide vulture harass "mechanical"?. it wasnt the micro that was difficult, it was the game sense to alternatively hit different weak point across the map
and before you parade around leta's loss to free, don't forget leta's ass raping of him a week or so prior |
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| MyLovelyLurker France. January 22 2009 09:28. Posts 137 | Profile # |
| FailRank ftw but most importantly, Anytime in CBNC |
| | "So, kind, average TL user, with your IQ of 130 and perfectly toned body, direct your browser to that page" - Aesop |  |
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| muramasa Canada. January 22 2009 10:49. Posts 1297 | Profile # | |
| | Hong Jin Ho. Nevar forget. |  |
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| SerpentFlame January 22 2009 10:50. Posts 384 | Profile Blog # |
On January 22 2009 08:08 d_so wrote:
Show nested quote +On January 20 2009 05:23 SerpentFlame wrote:
On January 19 2009 21:07 Shikyo wrote:
On January 19 2009 05:49 SerpentFlame wrote:
On January 19 2009 04:32 EleanorRIgby wrote:
there is such a huge misconception that leta is a safe standard player, this is totally wrong i think hes currently the best all around terran player with no current weakness
Watch any of his games versus protoss. Losing a game to BackHo, getting completely destroyed by Jangbi, *almost* losing to Guemchi, and getting steamrolled by Free (these games were far from top-class by Leta)? Granted, Leta's got a good vP, certainly a better one than most gamers, but as far as S class gamers go, his vP is nowhere near those of say, Flash, even though Flash has not been doing too well as of late. Like I think most people have said, Leta still remains largely untested against skilled players in a Bo3 or Bo5, so saying he's "the best all around terran player" is quite a stretch, until he goes far in a starleague.
Well.. vs Guemchi his vulture harrass was really good although Guemchi choked majorly. Against Free, his vulture snipes were insane (Delayed Free's 4th by a few minutes easily). His overall gameplay is a bit flawed but he's really intelligent and is still only improving.
Impressive, but nevertheless, the top-level skill he exhibited in that matchup so far is only mechanical. There are plenty of gamers who have the stellar mechanics needed for a matchup that they still suck at, and Leta has yet to prove himself as different. Yarnc and Luxury, for example, have always had ridiculous mutalisk harassment, but they still manage to lose a good percentage of their games against Protoss.
how the fuck is map-wide vulture harass "mechanical"?. it wasnt the micro that was difficult, it was the game sense to alternatively hit different weak point across the map and before you parade around leta's loss to free, don't forget leta's ass raping of him a week or so prior
Leta didn't rape free's ass any harder than free raped leta's ass, and Leta hasn't been posting good results against top level Protoss. I never said Leta isn't good against protoss, but simply that he's no where near the S-class? Saying he raped free's ass once isn't enough evidence to derail his much more humiliating losses, when all of his wins versus Protoss players are less than sublime.
And let's not forget that vulture harass is against Guemchi, who despite going 3-1 that night, hasn't done anything notable since the Protoss neo-king era (which was a damned long time ago). A reasonably good player will always look like he has excellent gamesense against a much weaker one (E.g, BackHo vs Firefist, Terato vs Freedom, Rock vs Mumyung, etc, etc.). That night wasn't S-class TvP. It also wasn't by any means a low-class TvP, but Leta still has a ways to go in that respect.
EDIT: we're going to have one majorly inverted power rank next month if the trends that are happening in the WLPL continue.Last edit: 2009-01-22 16:10:14 |
| | Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but some abuse the privilege |  |
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| Plutonium United States. January 22 2009 11:33. Posts 2217 | Profile # |
I'm not sure there's any Terrans at the moment out there who can beat the S-Class tosses. Flash and Leta might be able to go toe-to-toe on their very best days, but I don't see any sort of TvP god out there who can dominate with any sort of consistency. There's a whole lot of two-matchup wonders though, like Hwasin and FBH, but there's nobody who can do what Flash was doing on Katrina a year ago.
I do look forward to more of July. There's no doubt in my mind that he is the best protoss killer in the world right now. I anticipate another OSL where he chews through a long line of Protosses like slices of ham on twelve-foot party sub sandwich.
Last edit: 2009-01-22 15:39:30 |
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| Geo.Rion Hungary. January 22 2009 21:46. Posts 5350 | Profile Blog # |
On January 22 2009 11:33 Plutonium wrote:
I'm not sure there's any Terrans at the moment out there who can beat the S-Class tosses. Flash and Leta might be able to go toe-to-toe on their very best days, but I don't see any sort of TvP god out there who can dominate with any sort of consistency. There's a whole lot of two-matchup wonders though, like Hwasin and FBH, but there's nobody who can do what Flash was doing on Katrina a year ago.
I do look forward to more of July. There's no doubt in my mind that he is the best protoss killer in the world right now. I anticipate another OSL where he chews through a long line of Protosses like slices of ham on twelve-foot party sub sandwich.
i would say the best toss-killer is Bisu, but fro the non-protosses July has a shot. So does Flash btw |
| | "Protoss is a joke" Liquid`Jinro Okt.1. 2011 |
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| Shikyo Finland. January 22 2009 23:30. Posts 20250 | Profile Blog # |
On January 22 2009 10:50 SerpentFlame wrote:
Show nested quote +On January 22 2009 08:08 d_so wrote:
On January 20 2009 05:23 SerpentFlame wrote:
On January 19 2009 21:07 Shikyo wrote:
On January 19 2009 05:49 SerpentFlame wrote:
On January 19 2009 04:32 EleanorRIgby wrote:
there is such a huge misconception that leta is a safe standard player, this is totally wrong i think hes currently the best all around terran player with no current weakness
Watch any of his games versus protoss. Losing a game to BackHo, getting completely destroyed by Jangbi, *almost* losing to Guemchi, and getting steamrolled by Free (these games were far from top-class by Leta)? Granted, Leta's got a good vP, certainly a better one than most gamers, but as far as S class gamers go, his vP is nowhere near those of say, Flash, even though Flash has not been doing too well as of late. Like I think most people have said, Leta still remains largely untested against skilled players in a Bo3 or Bo5, so saying he's "the best all around terran player" is quite a stretch, until he goes far in a starleague.
Well.. vs Guemchi his vulture harrass was really good although Guemchi choked majorly. Against Free, his vulture snipes were insane (Delayed Free's 4th by a few minutes easily). His overall gameplay is a bit flawed but he's really intelligent and is still only improving.
Impressive, but nevertheless, the top-level skill he exhibited in that matchup so far is only mechanical. There are plenty of gamers who have the stellar mechanics needed for a matchup that they still suck at, and Leta has yet to prove himself as different. Yarnc and Luxury, for example, have always had ridiculous mutalisk harassment, but they still manage to lose a good percentage of their games against Protoss.
how the fuck is map-wide vulture harass "mechanical"?. it wasnt the micro that was difficult, it was the game sense to alternatively hit different weak point across the map and before you parade around leta's loss to free, don't forget leta's ass raping of him a week or so prior
Leta didn't rape free's ass any harder than free raped leta's ass, and Leta hasn't been posting good results against top level Protoss. I never said Leta isn't good against protoss, but simply that he's no where near the S-class? Saying he raped free's ass once isn't enough evidence to derail his much more humiliating losses, when all of his wins versus Protoss players are less than sublime. And let's not forget that vulture harass is against Guemchi, who despite going 3-1 that night, hasn't done anything notable since the Protoss neo-king era (which was a damned long time ago). A reasonably good player will always look like he has excellent gamesense against a much weaker one (E.g, BackHo vs Firefist, Terato vs Freedom, Rock vs Mumyung, etc, etc.). That night wasn't S-class TvP. It also wasn't by any means a low-class TvP, but Leta still has a ways to go in that respect. EDIT: we're going to have one majorly inverted power rank next month if the trends that are happening in the WLPL continue.
The vulture sniping against Free is what I meant... And you have to factor in the imbalance of Colosseum.
And if you go 14-5 in your weakest match-up in your last 19 games, that's pretty close to Bonjwa win%'s(iloveoov's TvT or Savior's ZvZ weren't really much better than that in their primes). |
| | "I shall wait for you in death's halls, my Love (love love love love~)" | |
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| d_so Korea (South). January 23 2009 06:36. Posts 3150 | Profile Blog # |
On January 22 2009 10:50 SerpentFlame wrote:
Show nested quote +On January 22 2009 08:08 d_so wrote:
On January 20 2009 05:23 SerpentFlame wrote:
On January 19 2009 21:07 Shikyo wrote:
On January 19 2009 05:49 SerpentFlame wrote:
On January 19 2009 04:32 EleanorRIgby wrote:
there is such a huge misconception that leta is a safe standard player, this is totally wrong i think hes currently the best all around terran player with no current weakness
Watch any of his games versus protoss. Losing a game to BackHo, getting completely destroyed by Jangbi, *almost* losing to Guemchi, and getting steamrolled by Free (these games were far from top-class by Leta)? Granted, Leta's got a good vP, certainly a better one than most gamers, but as far as S class gamers go, his vP is nowhere near those of say, Flash, even though Flash has not been doing too well as of late. Like I think most people have said, Leta still remains largely untested against skilled players in a Bo3 or Bo5, so saying he's "the best all around terran player" is quite a stretch, until he goes far in a starleague.
Well.. vs Guemchi his vulture harrass was really good although Guemchi choked majorly. Against Free, his vulture snipes were insane (Delayed Free's 4th by a few minutes easily). His overall gameplay is a bit flawed but he's really intelligent and is still only improving.
Impressive, but nevertheless, the top-level skill he exhibited in that matchup so far is only mechanical. There are plenty of gamers who have the stellar mechanics needed for a matchup that they still suck at, and Leta has yet to prove himself as different. Yarnc and Luxury, for example, have always had ridiculous mutalisk harassment, but they still manage to lose a good percentage of their games against Protoss.
how the fuck is map-wide vulture harass "mechanical"?. it wasnt the micro that was difficult, it was the game sense to alternatively hit different weak point across the map and before you parade around leta's loss to free, don't forget leta's ass raping of him a week or so prior
Leta didn't rape free's ass any harder than free raped leta's ass, and Leta hasn't been posting good results against top level Protoss. I never said Leta isn't good against protoss, but simply that he's no where near the S-class? Saying he raped free's ass once isn't enough evidence to derail his much more humiliating losses, when all of his wins versus Protoss players are less than sublime. And let's not forget that vulture harass is against Guemchi, who despite going 3-1 that night, hasn't done anything notable since the Protoss neo-king era (which was a damned long time ago). A reasonably good player will always look like he has excellent gamesense against a much weaker one (E.g, BackHo vs Firefist, Terato vs Freedom, Rock vs Mumyung, etc, etc.). That night wasn't S-class TvP. It also wasn't by any means a low-class TvP, but Leta still has a ways to go in that respect. EDIT: we're going to have one majorly inverted power rank next month if the trends that are happening in the WLPL continue.
stop inflating/obfuscating your answers when you don't know what you're talking about.
you say leta's vP success is strictly due to mechanics. you mention this specifically in reference to his play vs geumchi.
my question, which you have yet to answer: wtF about vulture harass is mechanical? specifically, where was the "mechanics" in his match vs geumchi?
simple answer is that microing mass vultures is easy and its effectiveness comes from game sense and positioning, not micro. leta's vulture harass owned that game cuz he constantly hit geumchi's weak points all across the map. it had nothing to do with mechanics.
don't try to pigeonhole him as a "mechanical" player, even vs P, because it's simply not true. |
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| StylishVODs Sweden. January 23 2009 06:54. Posts 4988 | Profile # |
First page of Letas results is 32-8.
Thats like iloveoov and savior had during their bonjwaprimes, except they kept it for almost 2 pages (not quite though).
The big difference is that oov and savior got themselves a few badges from those wins too.
If Leta wins one of the starleagues he'll most likely hit the highest ELO ever?
He's 2nd now.Last edit: 2009-01-23 06:56:10 |
| | According to Reach, he is the fastest learner he has ever seen. He start bw only like 2/3 years ago. Infact, his bw history knowledge is so limited, he didn't even know what the map Guillotine was. | |
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| SerpentFlame January 23 2009 15:39. Posts 384 | Profile Blog # |
On January 23 2009 06:36 d_so wrote:
Show nested quote +On January 22 2009 10:50 SerpentFlame wrote:
On January 22 2009 08:08 d_so wrote:
On January 20 2009 05:23 SerpentFlame wrote:
On January 19 2009 21:07 Shikyo wrote:
On January 19 2009 05:49 SerpentFlame wrote:
On January 19 2009 04:32 EleanorRIgby wrote:
there is such a huge misconception that leta is a safe standard player, this is totally wrong i think hes currently the best all around terran player with no current weakness
Watch any of his games versus protoss. Losing a game to BackHo, getting completely destroyed by Jangbi, *almost* losing to Guemchi, and getting steamrolled by Free (these games were far from top-class by Leta)? Granted, Leta's got a good vP, certainly a better one than most gamers, but as far as S class gamers go, his vP is nowhere near those of say, Flash, even though Flash has not been doing too well as of late. Like I think most people have said, Leta still remains largely untested against skilled players in a Bo3 or Bo5, so saying he's "the best all around terran player" is quite a stretch, until he goes far in a starleague.
Well.. vs Guemchi his vulture harrass was really good although Guemchi choked majorly. Against Free, his vulture snipes were insane (Delayed Free's 4th by a few minutes easily). His overall gameplay is a bit flawed but he's really intelligent and is still only improving.
Impressive, but nevertheless, the top-level skill he exhibited in that matchup so far is only mechanical. There are plenty of gamers who have the stellar mechanics needed for a matchup that they still suck at, and Leta has yet to prove himself as different. Yarnc and Luxury, for example, have always had ridiculous mutalisk harassment, but they still manage to lose a good percentage of their games against Protoss.
how the fuck is map-wide vulture harass "mechanical"?. it wasnt the micro that was difficult, it was the game sense to alternatively hit different weak point across the map and before you parade around leta's loss to free, don't forget leta's ass raping of him a week or so prior
Leta didn't rape free's ass any harder than free raped leta's ass, and Leta hasn't been posting good results against top level Protoss. I never said Leta isn't good against protoss, but simply that he's no where near the S-class? Saying he raped free's ass once isn't enough evidence to derail his much more humiliating losses, when all of his wins versus Protoss players are less than sublime. And let's not forget that vulture harass is against Guemchi, who despite going 3-1 that night, hasn't done anything notable since the Protoss neo-king era (which was a damned long time ago). A reasonably good player will always look like he has excellent gamesense against a much weaker one (E.g, BackHo vs Firefist, Terato vs Freedom, Rock vs Mumyung, etc, etc.). That night wasn't S-class TvP. It also wasn't by any means a low-class TvP, but Leta still has a ways to go in that respect. EDIT: we're going to have one majorly inverted power rank next month if the trends that are happening in the WLPL continue.
stop inflating/obfuscating your answers when you don't know what you're talking about. you say leta's vP success is strictly due to mechanics. you mention this specifically in reference to his play vs geumchi. my question, which you have yet to answer: wtF about vulture harass is mechanical? specifically, where was the "mechanics" in his match vs geumchi? simple answer is that microing mass vultures is easy and its effectiveness comes from game sense and positioning, not micro. leta's vulture harass owned that game cuz he constantly hit geumchi's weak points all across the map. it had nothing to do with mechanics. don't try to pigeonhole him as a "mechanical" player, even vs P, because it's simply not true.
The post that I initially commented on said that Leta has no weaknesses. This is simply not true; even Flash and Bisu have shown a few pretty glaring weaknesses of late, and Leta is no different. The point I'm trying to make through this is simply that he hasn't been proven up there yet with even the modern By.Flash in TvP.
Oops, I misread your point about vulture harass (by snipes I thought you meant Templar snipes, and somehow managed to misread your post after that). MY bad. Either way, one game vs Free isn't going to prove he's S-class v P when 4/5 times he gets steamrolled by players who are simply better at that matchup (and there are quite a few).
I agree with you that he's an quickly improving and intelligent player; but even the almighty Emperor was never stellar when it came to TvP, and it doesn't look like Leta will be yet.
Still, many very crappy players still have isolated incidents where they somehow show off great gamesense, so even his game vs Free was an isolated incident; Leta hasn't separated himself from the pack in that matchup just yet. |
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