 ghermination Croatia. July 01 2009 04:27. Posts 1657 | Profile Blog |
| it just seems that the more and more i hear about sc2 it seems like blizzard has forgotten how to make a good, balanced rts. I just wanted sc1 with 3d graphics ;_; |
| | Blizzard hasn't made a good game since Diablo 2, prove me wrong. *Cannabis brownies: the breakfast, second breakfast, brunch, lunch, tea time, dinner, dessert, and midnight snack of champions.* |  |
|
|
 MoAT Austria. July 01 2009 04:46. Posts 7 | Profile |
| SC1 was not balanced at all at the beginning... Be happy about their testing,beta and the hopefully more balanced status of SC2 then SC1 when it came out.. Don´t flame Blizz... they do a very good job and blizz good balancing was always part of the continued work on their games via patches and addons... |
|
|
 closed Vatican City State. July 01 2009 04:57. Posts 483 | Profile Blog |
I really dont like the larvae economy. It sounds really stupid. It gives super big advantage to faster players. Every X seconds you have to click on queen and do X. Of course in brood war the faster player can get an advantage (e.g. make that one more factory), but it doesnt happen every X seconds.
Basically, in a game where people would only make lings vs lings, the faster player will always be able to macro "better". If you miss just that one larvae injection you are dead. Seriously, blizzard should find a better click-sink. Messing with the economy sounds so unfair.
In regular brood war you can do pretty well up to late game with 100apm. Of course your micro will be bad, but your macro should be ok. In SC2 you miss few larvae injections and you die?Last edit: 2009-07-01 04:59:06 |
|
|
 Cheerio Ukraine. July 01 2009 04:58. Posts 301 | Profile |
On June 30 2009 05:13 zatic wrote:
There is no metal anymore, it's either marines or marauders.
incorrect. There is no metal yet.
P.S. Good info, thanks. |
|
|
 Pape Serbia. July 01 2009 05:04. Posts 207 | Profile Blog |
| First UMS==> Starcraft 1 in 3d |
| |
|
 invy Bosnia-Herzegovina. July 01 2009 05:52. Posts 22 | Profile |
On July 01 2009 04:57 closed wrote:
I really dont like the larvae economy. It sounds really stupid. It gives super big advantage to faster players. Every X seconds you have to click on queen and do X. Of course in brood war the faster player can get an advantage (e.g. make that one more factory), but it doesnt happen every X seconds.
Basically, in a game where people would only make lings vs lings, the faster player will always be able to macro "better". If you miss just that one larvae injection you are dead. Seriously, blizzard should find a better click-sink. Messing with the economy sounds so unfair.
In regular brood war you can do pretty well up to late game with 100apm. Of course your micro will be bad, but your macro should be ok. In SC2 you miss few larvae injections and you die?
Nice point, zerg player would want every X seconds to click queen and spawn larvae... for few hatcheries and queens it equals to robo mechanic style... and thats not fun after all and its not much of a skill either. This should be really somehow changed/improved. |
|
|
| 808y Germany. July 01 2009 06:03. Posts 2 | Profile |
Zatic, you say its more or less impossible to inject larvae with one queen into 2 hatcherys, because queens are so slow to move from the nat to the main.
But what about, if you connect the nat and the main with creep?
And another thing: what about 2 queens using this injection on 1 hatchery does this work too?
Imagine this: connecting the nat with the main with creep, and building 2 queens. Since the "cooldown" seems so low. I would make it possible to inject both queens at the nat, and move to the main, inject there again and move back to the nat. If the cooldown is about as long as the queen needs to move from the nat to the main: 9 Larvae @nat + 9 Larvae @main, with just 2 hatcherys and 2 queens. This would be fucking crazy. Can you comment on this?
|
|
|
| Hieros United States. July 01 2009 06:31. Posts 46 | Profile |
| I recall in the earlier patches of War3 that the AI surrounded units too easily with the mere stroke of the m-key. Hopefully they will be more or less able to fix it here as they did there. |
|
|
| butters742 Canada. July 01 2009 06:32. Posts 1 | Profile |
i love what i hear.
but ur right they need to make micro better.
i suck at it, but i know its a needed quality in SC |
|
|
 zatic Germany. July 01 2009 06:35. Posts 2813 | Profile Blog |
As I mentioned in the updates, the queen does in fact need energy to inject the larvae. It is just enough to keep one hatchery saturated with extra larvae.
2 on 1 hatch doesn't work either since you have to wait the ~30 seconds until the extra larvae spawn before you can inject again. |
| | I know TeamLiquid is known as a massive building |  |
|
|
 Zzoram Canada. July 01 2009 06:43. Posts 2611 | Profile |
On July 01 2009 05:04 Pape wrote:
First UMS==> Starcraft 1 in 3d
More likely, Greener TD or Defense of the XelNaga. |
| |
|
| wrags United States. July 01 2009 07:08. Posts 105 | Profile |
On July 01 2009 06:35 zatic wrote:
As I mentioned in the updates, the queen does in fact need energy to inject the larvae. It is just enough to keep one hatchery saturated with extra larvae.
2 on 1 hatch doesn't work either since you have to wait the ~30 seconds until the extra larvae spawn before you can inject again.
Did you try any combination of like 3 hatchery 2 queen, 5 hatchery 3 queen or does one queen suffice for everything? |
|
|
 SoleSteeler Canada. July 01 2009 07:10. Posts 3345 | Profile |
| So the Queen basically means you need half as many hatcheries as you do in SC, would that be accurate to say? |
|
|
| invy Bosnia-Herzegovina. July 01 2009 07:23. Posts 22 | Profile |
On July 01 2009 07:10 SoleSteeler wrote:
So the Queen basically means you need half as many hatcheries as you do in SC, would that be accurate to say?
Hm how much time does it take Hatch to spawn 3 larvae ?! Less then 30, Hatch > Queen, more than 30, Queen > Hatch .. if you dont forget to click Queen. Queen dies easier than hatch, it spawns 3 larvae at the same time if I understood, which has its adv and disadvantages.. its different game than sc1  there will probably be some optimal mix hatch/queen discovered by practice. |
|
|
| kyama United States. July 01 2009 07:30. Posts 9 | Profile |
On July 01 2009 06:03 808y wrote:
Zatic, you say its more or less impossible to inject larvae with one queen into 2 hatcherys, because queens are so slow to move from the nat to the main.
But what about, if you connect the nat and the main with creep?
And another thing: what about 2 queens using this injection on 1 hatchery does this work too?
Imagine this: connecting the nat with the main with creep, and building 2 queens. Since the "cooldown" seems so low. I would make it possible to inject both queens at the nat, and move to the main, inject there again and move back to the nat. If the cooldown is about as long as the queen needs to move from the nat to the main: 9 Larvae @nat + 9 Larvae @main, with just 2 hatcherys and 2 queens. This would be fucking crazy. Can you comment on this?
I remember when they said there will be a limit to how many larvaes a hatchery can have. For example if you inject larvae and don't use it, it won't go over a certain amount of larvaes. So, to have two queens injecting larvae on 1 hatchery is impossible. Unless, they changed it with new build. |
| | Let them hate, So as long as they fear... |
|
|
| Chill Canada. July 01 2009 07:34. Posts 12186 | Profile Blog |
On July 01 2009 07:30 kyama wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 01 2009 06:03 808y wrote:
Zatic, you say its more or less impossible to inject larvae with one queen into 2 hatcherys, because queens are so slow to move from the nat to the main.
But what about, if you connect the nat and the main with creep?
And another thing: what about 2 queens using this injection on 1 hatchery does this work too?
Imagine this: connecting the nat with the main with creep, and building 2 queens. Since the "cooldown" seems so low. I would make it possible to inject both queens at the nat, and move to the main, inject there again and move back to the nat. If the cooldown is about as long as the queen needs to move from the nat to the main: 9 Larvae @nat + 9 Larvae @main, with just 2 hatcherys and 2 queens. This would be fucking crazy. Can you comment on this?
I remember when they said there will be a limit to how many larvaes a hatchery can have. For example if you inject larvae and don't use it, it won't go over a certain amount of larvaes. So, to have two queens injecting larvae on 1 hatchery is impossible. Unless, they changed it with new build.
He meant one Queen / Hatchery I believe. |
| | She also isn't my hero. The only hero's I have is our Founders, specifically Thomas Jefferson and my parents. | |
|
|
| MoAT Austria. July 01 2009 08:18. Posts 7 | Profile |
| Zergs are probably gonna overrun your units if they have a certain amount of hatcherys and queens.. or is there a limit amount of queens allowed to have? Maybe thats the key to overpower tozz and terra.. MASSING"! |
|
|
 lokiM United States. July 01 2009 12:09. Posts 1231 | Profile Blog |
| wait did I miss something? are you saying they removed that gas mechanic? |
| | LID HALP | |
|
|
 AlwaysGG Taiwan. July 01 2009 15:53. Posts 749 | Profile |
| terran infantry shine in sc2 i sure will miss metal |
| | Believe sAviOr! ^^ | #1 HwaSin Fan | CJ & STX fighting | |
|
|
 Krikkitone United States. July 03 2009 04:42. Posts 304 | Profile |
Definite problem wth the Zerg and Protoss Macros (and possibly the Terran)
They are both "cooldown" controlled as opposed to energy controlled
Energy is a resource that must be balanced between multiple uses.
Cooldown doesn't need to be balanced as it is a time limit.
A key problem in the 'type' of cooldown you have for Protoss+Zerg is the 'exact timing' problem
Zerg. If you have sufficient Queens, then you MUST cast Larve exactly every 30 sec.
cast it every 35 sec. and you end up with too few larva
you Can't cast it at 25 sec.
For Zerg, I'd
1) Increase the energy cost of spawn Larva so that it is greater the amount of energy the Queen will regenerate in the amount of cooldown Casting spawn Larva has.
2) Allow Multiple Spawn Larvas on a Hatchery
By increasing the energy cost you can balance it. Cooldowns might be a limiting factor but neither the "Queen cooldown" nor the "Hatchery cooldown" would be the limiting factor. It would be Queen Energy, a useful resource.
For Protoss, The key thing I would do is allow "stacking" Proton charge.
Right now, (assuming the time it lasts is 30 sec.)
If you charge every 35 sec you lose potential minerals
If you charge every 25 sec you waste energy
That is because if you charge twice 25 sec apart you only get 55 sec of Boost
If you charge twice Exactly 30 sec apart, you get the full 60 sec.
If casting 'Proton charge'' on a probe Increased the duration of the probes charge by 30 sec. instead of Setting it to 30 sec, then the exact tedious timing would be gone.... If you charged your probes, you could just 'recharge' them whenever you had spare energy/spare time... as long a you didn't wait too long. |
|
|
| | Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 Next All |
