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I bring this up Because of the recent balance test they are Trying out in WOL
The ravens spells cast ranges are pretty short ranged(which is stupid and I'll post about that at some other point).
PDD and Auto Turret cast range is 3 and Seeker missle cast range is 6
VS funguls cast range of 9
If ravens were Psionic they would atleast have a chance of excaping fungul and also casting spells.
So basically I'm asking the Raven to be a Psionic unit, for the sake of balance and good gameplay.
This recent patch Favors the ZVP match up more then the ZVT match up,
Concidering all of the Psionic units protoss has, compared to the only Psionic unit Terran has is the ghost.
So if you change the Raven to Psionic it will help TVZ aswell.
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Because lore. it`s basically an unmanned drone with strategic utilities. http://starcraft.wikia.com/wiki/Raven
Operationally linked to an AI,[7] the Raven is an all-around workhorse that combines the functions of a surveillance drone and a combat engineer. A common sight among the Fringe Worlds, these robust air-mobile vehicles are built to operate independently in harsh climates. Ravens excel in protection and reconnaissance due to their defensive auto-turrets and their advanced sensors, which can detect cloaked or burrowed enemies. The Terran Dominion initially designed the Raven to give low-level protection to its most isolated outposts, but recently the Raven has been used in escalating levels of conflict to replace the older and costlier science vessel.[8]
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On November 24 2012 11:47 Madkipz wrote:Because lore. it`s basically an unmanned drone with strategic utilities. http://starcraft.wikia.com/wiki/RavenOperationally linked to an AI,[7] the Raven is an all-around workhorse that combines the functions of a surveillance drone and a combat engineer. A common sight among the Fringe Worlds, these robust air-mobile vehicles are built to operate independently in harsh climates. Ravens excel in protection and reconnaissance due to their defensive auto-turrets and their advanced sensors, which can detect cloaked or burrowed enemies. The Terran Dominion initially designed the Raven to give low-level protection to its most isolated outposts, but recently the Raven has been used in escalating levels of conflict to replace the older and costlier science vessel.[8]
So you use Lore as a excuse and link a Starcraft.wiki page...... huh
Could a Mod Move this Thread to the SC2 General?
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An "excuse?" When these groups were decided, there were no units or spells which had any disadvantages or advantages against Psionic. Lore was literally the only deciding factor. It is now subject to change due to gameplay, which has much higher importance in everyone's perspective.
Now that the Raven being Psionic can make a difference, the Raven may change. However, as stated in the notes about the Raven HSM change, Blizz wants to buff the Raven slightly in this test map to increase its usage, but without affecting the lategame too much. To me it seems that they want to confirm or disprove any thoughts they have about why Ravens are neglected. After Blizz knows for sure what is wrong with Ravens, then they'll buff accordingly.
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On November 24 2012 12:00 Antylamon wrote: An "excuse?" When these groups were decided, there were no units or spells which had any disadvantages or advantages against Psionic. Lore was literally the only deciding factor. It is now subject to change due to gameplay, which has much higher importance in everyone's perspective.
Now that the Raven being Psionic can make a difference, the Raven may change. However, as stated in the notes about the Raven HSM change, Blizz wants to buff the Raven slightly in this test map to increase its usage, but without affecting the lategame too much. To me it seems that they want to confirm or disprove any thoughts they have about why Ravens are neglected. After Blizz knows for sure what is wrong with Ravens, then they'll buff accordingly.
Whats wrong with ravens...... hmmm lets see
1) Short cast ranges
2) its abit slow
3) HSM costs to much energy
4) Durable materials should be built in.
oh and it doesn't help that blizzard isn't directly addressing the "root" of funguls problems.
But anyways, look at the current planed patch.
the raven will still not get in range to cast the spells aslong as fungul roots them.
if the fungul change goes threw, then why not make the raven Psionic so that the raven can get in range to cast the missles, PDD's/Auto turrets?
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ravens are not psyonic, because they are not psyonic. does that make sense? auto turret and pdd arent psyonic spells at all. as well as the raven, which isnt a psyonic unit itself. that might be the reason why the raven isnt a psyonic unit. I agree that the raven is too week, but Its doubtful that your idea would help balancing tvz oh so much...
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On November 24 2012 12:48 AoWGoDLiKe wrote: ravens are not psyonic, because they are not psyonic. does that make sense? auto turret and pdd arent psyonic spells at all. as well as the raven, which isnt a psyonic unit itself. that might be the reason why the raven isnt a psyonic unit. I agree that the raven is too week, but Its doubtful that your idea would help balancing tvz oh so much...
Did you even read the recent call to action:Balance testing?
Read it, and then comeback to comment on my idea.
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On November 24 2012 12:55 Zergrusher wrote:Show nested quote +On November 24 2012 12:48 AoWGoDLiKe wrote: ravens are not psyonic, because they are not psyonic. does that make sense? auto turret and pdd arent psyonic spells at all. as well as the raven, which isnt a psyonic unit itself. that might be the reason why the raven isnt a psyonic unit. I agree that the raven is too week, but Its doubtful that your idea would help balancing tvz oh so much... Did you even read the recent call to action:Balance testing? Read it, and then comeback to comment on my idea.
Dude, the fact is it's not psionic. It's like calling my washing machine psionic. Obviously Lore/Multiplayer don't always follow suite, but calling a machine psionic is entering the realm of dumb.
Also no I disagree, once Mass Air Terran Occurs, Terran at most times have an advantage against Zerg, so why should ravens avoid fungal?
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On November 24 2012 11:39 Zergrusher wrote: I bring this up Because of the recent balance test they are Trying out in WOL
The ravens spells cast ranges are pretty short ranged(which is stupid and I'll post about that at some other point).
PDD and Auto Turret cast range is 3 and Seeker missle cast range is 6
VS funguls cast range of 9
If ravens were Psionic they would atleast have a chance of excaping fungul and also casting spells.
So basically I'm asking the Raven to be a Psionic unit, for the sake of balance and good gameplay.
This recent patch Favors the ZVP match up more then the ZVT match up,
Concidering all of the Psionic units protoss has, compared to the only Psionic unit Terran has is the ghost.
So if you change the Raven to Psionic it will help TVZ aswell.
Um... because its a robot? It wouldn't make sense if it was psionic.
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Sentries are robotic and are psionic. So why not Ravens.
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On November 24 2012 12:08 Zergrusher wrote:Show nested quote +On November 24 2012 12:00 Antylamon wrote: An "excuse?" When these groups were decided, there were no units or spells which had any disadvantages or advantages against Psionic. Lore was literally the only deciding factor. It is now subject to change due to gameplay, which has much higher importance in everyone's perspective.
Now that the Raven being Psionic can make a difference, the Raven may change. However, as stated in the notes about the Raven HSM change, Blizz wants to buff the Raven slightly in this test map to increase its usage, but without affecting the lategame too much. To me it seems that they want to confirm or disprove any thoughts they have about why Ravens are neglected. After Blizz knows for sure what is wrong with Ravens, then they'll buff accordingly. Whats wrong with ravens...... hmmm lets see 1) Short cast ranges 2) its abit slow 3) HSM costs to much energy 4) Durable materials should be built in. oh and it doesn't help that blizzard isn't directly addressing the "root" of funguls problems. But anyways, look at the current planed patch. the raven will still not get in range to cast the spells aslong as fungul roots them. if the fungul change goes threw, then why not make the raven Psionic so that the raven can get in range to cast the missles, PDD's/Auto turrets? This is not a debate about balance overall. You made a thread asking why Ravens are not Psionic, and I answered.
That said, The test map is nothing more than an experiment. Instead of bringing down the hammer quickly like they did on HTs and Thors, Blizz is being cautious not to nerf the Infestor to oblivion and/or make the Raven the new Infestor. I, for one, prefer this behavior, because it is much more likely to result in great balance compared to rash changes in which the implications have not been completely thought through.
On November 24 2012 13:07 blug wrote:Show nested quote +On November 24 2012 12:55 Zergrusher wrote:On November 24 2012 12:48 AoWGoDLiKe wrote: ravens are not psyonic, because they are not psyonic. does that make sense? auto turret and pdd arent psyonic spells at all. as well as the raven, which isnt a psyonic unit itself. that might be the reason why the raven isnt a psyonic unit. I agree that the raven is too week, but Its doubtful that your idea would help balancing tvz oh so much... Did you even read the recent call to action:Balance testing? Read it, and then comeback to comment on my idea. Dude, the fact is it's not psionic. It's like calling my washing machine psionic. Obviously Lore/Multiplayer don't always follow suite, but calling a machine psionic is entering the realm of dumb. Also no I disagree, once Mass Air Terran Occurs, Terran at most times have an advantage against Zerg, so why should ravens avoid fungal?
On November 24 2012 13:20 AfricanPsycho wrote:Show nested quote +On November 24 2012 11:39 Zergrusher wrote: I bring this up Because of the recent balance test they are Trying out in WOL
The ravens spells cast ranges are pretty short ranged(which is stupid and I'll post about that at some other point).
PDD and Auto Turret cast range is 3 and Seeker missle cast range is 6
VS funguls cast range of 9
If ravens were Psionic they would atleast have a chance of excaping fungul and also casting spells.
So basically I'm asking the Raven to be a Psionic unit, for the sake of balance and good gameplay.
This recent patch Favors the ZVP match up more then the ZVT match up,
Concidering all of the Psionic units protoss has, compared to the only Psionic unit Terran has is the ghost.
So if you change the Raven to Psionic it will help TVZ aswell.
Um... because its a robot? It wouldn't make sense if it was psionic. Why are Hellbats bio? Throw lore out the window; we want a better game, not better lore.
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On November 24 2012 13:21 hayata2.0 wrote: Sentries are robotic and are psionic. So why not Ravens. Terran don't have access to that kinda psionic technology they are probably thousands of years off. Ravens abilities are also very non-psionicy.
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When you look at the category of Psionic, you really are seeing an element of "magic". Something that is not of this world by mechanics or biology. Raven has no magic and is entirely mechanical. Idk why you're shitting on people who answer this question with this reasoning.
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Lore or not they need to make the Raven psionic if they stick with fungal not affecting psionic.
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How about making all mechanical units not psionic? So only bio-psionic units will be immune.
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On November 24 2012 14:02 larse wrote: How about making all mechanical units not psionic? So only bio-psionic units will be immune.
What, you mean buff infestors?
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On November 24 2012 14:01 TranceKuja wrote: Lore or not they need to make the Raven psionic if they stick with fungal not affecting psionic.
and that was the point of my post..... in the first place.
people would have known that IF THEY READ the OP.
I wish I could have posted this thread on the main SC2 forum.... but thats a side issue.
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On November 24 2012 14:10 Zergrusher wrote:Show nested quote +On November 24 2012 14:01 TranceKuja wrote: Lore or not they need to make the Raven psionic if they stick with fungal not affecting psionic. and that was the point of my post..... in the first place. people would have known that IF THEY READ the OP. Nevertheless, the title of the post doesn't really convey the true meaning of your post, which probably is the cause of all this confusion about lore and stuff from the other posters.
Why the Raven wasn't Psionic in the first place was, as others have said, because of lore.
Why the Raven currently isn't Psionic in the test map is because Blizzard wants to experiment cautiously with just a couple of changes: the seeker missile buff and the Fungal immunity for Psionic units. Depending on how things go on the test map, things may or may not be further tweaked accordingly.
Should the Raven be Psionic? Again, it depends on how things actually progress on the test map. If Ghosts become enough of a counter against Infestors, then no change may be needed. If not, then the Raven could be given the Psionic tag in a subsequent test map. It would be great if Ravens weren't shut down by Fungals so easily, but there is always the chance that giving this buff to both Ravens and Ghosts may be too much to be balanced, so it's good approach this cautiously. I imagine that the Psionic tags on Sentries and Warp Prisms are also in question.
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On November 24 2012 14:30 eviltomahawk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 24 2012 14:10 Zergrusher wrote:On November 24 2012 14:01 TranceKuja wrote: Lore or not they need to make the Raven psionic if they stick with fungal not affecting psionic. and that was the point of my post..... in the first place. people would have known that IF THEY READ the OP. Nevertheless, the title of the post doesn't really convey the true meaning of your post, which probably is the cause of all this confusion about lore and stuff from the other posters. Why the Raven wasn't Psionic in the first place was, as others have said, because of lore. Why the Raven currently isn't Psionic in the test map is because Blizzard wants to experiment cautiously with just a couple of changes: the seeker missile buff and the Fungal immunity for Psionic units. Depending on how things go on the test map, things may or may not be further tweaked accordingly. Should the Raven be Psionic? Again, it depends on how things actually progress on the test map. If Ghosts become enough of a counter against Infestors, then no change may be needed. If not, then the Raven could be given the Psionic tag in a subsequent test map. It would be great if Ravens weren't shut down by Fungals so easily, but there is always the chance that giving this buff to both Ravens and Ghosts may be too much to be balanced, so it's good approach this cautiously. I imagine that the Psionic tags on Sentries and Warp Prisms are also in question.
hmm well what If i Told you I know a way to Fix Infestor BL and make hydralisk and Ultralisk more viable all at the same time?
Now thats a post for another day.... or when I am allowed to post on the General SC2 Discussion lol
and I must say the way you responded was very professional, like PR but with Intellect and knowedge..
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Yeah, I kinda agree that Raven should be Psionic. It is pretty funny how Warp prism and Dark Templar are Psionic while Raven isn't. I also think that the Overseer should also be Psionic.
So including the HoTS units, Protoss has 8 Psionic units, Zerg has 3, and Terran only has 1.
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