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Ah darn it, this is starting to become a bad trend. Deadline for major project on my university is about ~1 week from now so I can't see how I can participate in this game without going that unhelpful-doing-unexplained-actions-in-one-lines route which I absolutely cannot see contributing to the town's well-being.
Thereafter, I will be asking for replacement and will take the ban if necessary. Really not happy about this as I truly wanted to annihilate mafia- I really did
Quickly throwing out my last nugget of contribution before I disappear: my gut tells that Pandain is town. Admittedly I did not even choose to iso him yet, so feel free to judge this opinion with some degree of skepticism :p
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Goddamnit Hess...it's like 6 hours till the vote. You couldn't last 5 more hours?
After much deliberation I've decided to vote Pandain. It was hard but it ultimately came down to this question:
Show nested quote +It's called creating your own information. Day 1 is all about that. In most day 1's, we have no information at all. With the exception of Nemesis, all of my accusations day 1 were not serious, they were just to get them talking as well as generate discussion from others. I do this in all my games as town, I pressure people until they talk enough. For example, the reason why I unvoted Nemesis and waited was to see if he would actually start to help scum hunt. If they weren't serious, why did you vote for Shockey? And why did you switch to LSB, not Nemesis, if he was the exception? Something's not adding up...
If you were only serious about Nemesis, why vote for Shockey? Why switch to LSB? Could have broken the tie with a vote on Nemesis as well. If you're town, please don't play like this in the future, there are better ways of getting info and conversation. If you're mafia, nice try, but just cause you played the same style as previous games does not mean much to me. I don't enjoy looking at things from a meta-perspective and I think some games are lost solely because people depend too much on it, especially if they only looked at it in a shallow manner.
##Vote: Pandain
Going to class, it ends at 9:30. Hopefully I'll be back before 10.
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I was serious on LSB too >.>. Sorry if I can't remember all of the 5 people I pressured. And how could I have broken the tie with a vote on nemesis? If I switched to nemesis, Shockkey still would've gotten lynched.
As for my playstyle, I heavily disagree. I feel I have done well this game so far, albeit I admit whether Nemesis is mafia will determine just how well I've gone. I've been THE most active player this game, generated the most information(and how is it bad for town, getting people to talk is ALWAYS good).
Great, now if even one townie voted for me, we lose.
Jackal, if you're really serious about wanting me lynched, and not just mafia, then please respond to my coments to you. You still have really nothing that you yourself are lynching me for besides "I'm unlucky"(got one thing wrong? wtf?).
And still, I'm the only person actually trying to scum hunt. I'm the only person pressuring people.
How am I mafia?
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hai jackal u just posted in the other mafia game -.- sup?
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On January 25 2011 07:09 Pandain wrote: I was serious on LSB too >.>. Sorry if I can't remember all of the 5 people I pressured. And how could I have broken the tie with a vote on nemesis? If I switched to nemesis, Shockkey still would've gotten lynched.
As for my playstyle, I heavily disagree. I feel I have done well this game so far, albeit I admit whether Nemesis is mafia will determine just how well I've gone. I've been THE most active player this game, generated the most information(and how is it bad for town, getting people to talk is ALWAYS good).
Great, now if even one townie voted for me, we lose.
Jackal, if you're really serious about wanting me lynched, and not just mafia, then please respond to my coments to you. You still have really nothing that you yourself are lynching me for besides "I'm unlucky"(got one thing wrong? wtf?).
And still, I'm the only person actually trying to scum hunt. I'm the only person pressuring people.
How am I mafia? You didn't miss one. You missed two. Shockevvy = green LSB = Green and then BC mod killed = green. You were voting for all 3 at various times. Pushing hard for LSB and then voting Shockevvy when you were afraid of a tie. It's just too convenient.
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United States22154 Posts
##Vote Nemesis
Nemesis is the only player that feels defiantly scummy to me, Pandain I don't have a definite feel for, and I feel like people are jumping on him for being mistaken, rather than actually acting scummy. I think Jackal is just acting like a hyper aggressive townie, it is possible he is mafia, but I believe he is just town, and happens to be tunneling on another member of the town.
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On January 25 2011 07:21 Pandain wrote: hai jackal u just posted in the other mafia game -.- sup? I'm at work. My posting opportunities are hit or miss. I'll be home in about an hour and a half. Will be able to put more time into it.
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On January 25 2011 07:23 Jackal58 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 25 2011 07:09 Pandain wrote: I was serious on LSB too >.>. Sorry if I can't remember all of the 5 people I pressured. And how could I have broken the tie with a vote on nemesis? If I switched to nemesis, Shockkey still would've gotten lynched.
As for my playstyle, I heavily disagree. I feel I have done well this game so far, albeit I admit whether Nemesis is mafia will determine just how well I've gone. I've been THE most active player this game, generated the most information(and how is it bad for town, getting people to talk is ALWAYS good).
Great, now if even one townie voted for me, we lose.
Jackal, if you're really serious about wanting me lynched, and not just mafia, then please respond to my coments to you. You still have really nothing that you yourself are lynching me for besides "I'm unlucky"(got one thing wrong? wtf?).
And still, I'm the only person actually trying to scum hunt. I'm the only person pressuring people.
How am I mafia? You didn't miss one. You missed two. Shockevvy = green LSB = Green and then BC mod killed = green. You were voting for all 3 at various times. Pushing hard for LSB and then voting Shockevvy when you were afraid of a tie. It's just too convenient.
Let's see: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=184673¤tpage=9#162-say shockkey is town http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=184673¤tpage=9#174 I THINK lsb is mafia
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=184673¤tpage=8#145 That is the only post in which I voted shockkey, and note how I said I don't think he's mafia, but didn't have anyone else to vote for. Later on I thought LSB was our best bet, so I tried for him.
As for BC, originally I thought he was scummy(and keep in mind when I say that I mean keeping in mind that its day1), but then when he was like "you guys have to learN" instead of the typical"I'm busy", that made me think he's town.
Are you really voting me because I was wrong on day1? Because I got ONE person wrong on day 1?
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Well I managed to come home a bit early. Ok, I can't believe I'm wasting my 1500th post on you Pandain.
First of all, you still haven't addressed my post. I also have to add that you are playing like the way you were playing Insane Mafia when you were hyper aggressive and basically mostly used WIFOM as your argument to FoS DoctorH. A lot of your arguments Day 1 was pretty much WIFOM. "He's not contributing so he must be scum" was your main argument for all your FOS.
Just to address your reasons for voting me:
On January 24 2011 11:31 Pandain wrote:Why I believe Nemesis is mafia.Summary: Nemesis to me is scum. From "contributing without really contributing", weak contribution compared to his previous game(such as lack of analysis) to his general posts this game, Nemesis has been playing scummy. Note how when he was town he would contribute alot, and I even waited a day for Nemesis to perhaps post something, but its very likely in my eyes that he's scum, and just wanted the day to go by.
I'm unsure about nearly everyone, but Nemesis in my eyes is our best bet. An analysis of his posts this game + Show Spoiler +On January 20 2011 22:08 Nemesis wrote: @Jackal I wouldn't say that lynching actives is a big mistake. I wasn't paying attention to what happened in XXXVI, but we should lynch scum, and mafia is not always inactive.
And I guess back to the usual first day topic. Lynching inactives. Since lynching a scum is very hard in the very first day. Lynching inactives would be a very good start as it would prevent mafia from lurking.
I'm going to wait a bit for people to talk since the game has just started. I don't like this post. I'm going to be a little lenient since it's a somewhat confusing concept, but again, we don't want to lynch inactives. We want to lynch lurkers. Every person we lynch who's "inactive." is not going to be mafia. On January 20 2011 22:30 Nemesis wrote:Show nested quote +On January 20 2011 22:24 Jackal58 wrote:On January 20 2011 22:08 Nemesis wrote: @Jackal I wouldn't say that lynching actives is a big mistake. I wasn't paying attention to what happened in XXXVI, but we should lynch scum, and mafia is not always inactive.
And I guess back to the usual first day topic. Lynching inactives. Since lynching a scum is very hard in the very first day. Lynching inactives would be a very good start as it would prevent mafia from lurking.
I'm going to wait a bit for people to talk since the game has just started. I would argue that lynching the most active players on day 1 is a mistake. Unless of course active player A states "I am scum" which probably isn't going to happen. Duh, of course lynching the most active player day 1 is not the best idea ever (I suggested lynching inactives), but I am saying that we shouldn't be afraid to lynch active players. We shouldn't focus too much on what blues should do. We don't know what blue roles there are and blues will do what they think is best anyways. We should just focus more on scumhunting than whatever blue plans. Okay, focus on scum hunting. However, Nemesis hasn't scum hunted or helped with blues. On January 21 2011 06:11 Nemesis wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2011 01:47 Pandain wrote:Hello everyone its Pandain the Panda, hoping he won't ruin town again for everyone. And as Pandain always learned when young, the best way to get from A to B when theres a brick wall in front of you is to not go around the wall, but keep on running into it until it breaks! In other news, just some general thoughts: 1.Blue's dont claim unless you are about to be lynched. If you find a red, don't claim. Instead prepare an analysis on him and get him lynched without claiming. If you find green, and they're about to be lynched, express support for him, but don't claim unless its near lylo. 2.I agree we should not let inactives survive in this town. But considering we've hardly started, "inactives" is hardly the word to call them. So let's get things moving. ##Vote NemesisOn January 20 2011 22:08 Nemesis wrote: @Jackal I wouldn't say that lynching actives is a big mistake. I wasn't paying attention to what happened in XXXVI, but we should lynch scum, and mafia is not always inactive.
And I guess back to the usual first day topic. Lynching inactives. Since lynching a scum is very hard in the very first day. Lynching inactives would be a very good start as it would prevent mafia from lurking.
I'm going to wait a bit for people to talk since the game has just started. What is this? Clarify this for me, because as I understand right now you just said we should lynch scum, and then say we should lynch inactives. Plus I want to see more contribution. Come on people, pressure is pointless if only one person votes. Let's get things moving. Yes, I did say that we should lynch scum, but day 1, it is very hard to actually lynch scum because we don't have a lot of information available to us. Which is why I suggested that we should lynch inactives for the first day. As it has been said before, inactivity is a big problem which we do not want to see in this game. Lynching inactive first day encourages people to participate more in the discussion and be more active which makes it is easier to find mafia, as the more discussion we have as there is more information available to analyze. ##Vote ShockeyyI haven't seen you post anything useful at all so far other than excuses for being inactive and useless one-liners. Explains himself, but the main problem about this post is his vote. Votes with a one line answer, going for the easy lynch. On January 21 2011 10:53 Nemesis wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2011 06:50 Pandain wrote:On January 21 2011 06:11 Nemesis wrote:On January 21 2011 01:47 Pandain wrote:Hello everyone its Pandain the Panda, hoping he won't ruin town again for everyone. And as Pandain always learned when young, the best way to get from A to B when theres a brick wall in front of you is to not go around the wall, but keep on running into it until it breaks! In other news, just some general thoughts: 1.Blue's dont claim unless you are about to be lynched. If you find a red, don't claim. Instead prepare an analysis on him and get him lynched without claiming. If you find green, and they're about to be lynched, express support for him, but don't claim unless its near lylo. 2.I agree we should not let inactives survive in this town. But considering we've hardly started, "inactives" is hardly the word to call them. So let's get things moving. ##Vote NemesisOn January 20 2011 22:08 Nemesis wrote: @Jackal I wouldn't say that lynching actives is a big mistake. I wasn't paying attention to what happened in XXXVI, but we should lynch scum, and mafia is not always inactive.
And I guess back to the usual first day topic. Lynching inactives. Since lynching a scum is very hard in the very first day. Lynching inactives would be a very good start as it would prevent mafia from lurking.
I'm going to wait a bit for people to talk since the game has just started. What is this? Clarify this for me, because as I understand right now you just said we should lynch scum, and then say we should lynch inactives. Plus I want to see more contribution. Come on people, pressure is pointless if only one person votes. Let's get things moving. Yes, I did say that we should lynch scum, but day 1, it is very hard to actually lynch scum because we don't have a lot of information available to us. Which is why I suggested that we should lynch inactives for the first day. As it has been said before, inactivity is a big problem which we do not want to see in this game. Lynching inactive first day encourages people to participate more in the discussion and be more active which makes it is easier to find mafia, as the more discussion we have as there is more information available to analyze. ##Vote ShockeyyI haven't seen you post anything useful at all so far other than excuses for being inactive and useless one-liners. I don't like this post either. Let's take a look at it. First off, lynching inactives itself is a bad strategy. I shall be lenient to him because even I make this mistake, but lynching inactives is a horrible thing to do. I believe that I've already went through this, and I'm not gonna repeat myself.When we say "lynch inactives", we mean "lynch lurkers." We want to differentiate the lurkers from the inactives/bored. You are just arguing semantics here. Besides, you can't exactly tell a lurker from an inactive unless they make it obvious.If we say we'll lynch the inactives, the inactives won't respond. IF we say we'll lynch the inactives, the bored won't really respond. Only the mafia will respond if we say lynch the inactives. Which is why you never want to end up LYNCHING an inactive, just pressuring all of them to post. If they don't respond, that does not necessarily mean that they are bored townies. Just take a look at TMM3. Subversion(he was red that game) claimed he was roleblocked, and then disappeared afterwards. There were plenty of FoS on him after that, and he was up for lynch next day, but he still didn't respond. It is pretty much impossible to tell the difference between a lurker and an inactive townie.Furthormore, he just repeated information without actually adding anything to it. Finally he goes for the "easy" kill. There was pretty much nothing else that people were discussing about. I gave my opinion on what we were currently talking about. What else could I have added to the discussion? It is not like anyone else was trying to generate new topic. At least I was trying to further the discussion.
I just woke up, I was still half-asleep when I checked this forum. I rather dislike it when town loses because everyone is inactive, and when I saw Shockeyy post "sorry I'm inactive, I promise I'll be active later," I wanted to pressure him to make sure that he actually keeps his promise and doesn't disappear as soon as we forget about him.This is typical mafia to me. I now offer Nemesis as a viable option for a real lynch. Okay, note what he's saying. 1."I'm just pressuring Shockkey". Yet Nemesis never ends up unvoting him, despite Shockkey becoming considerably more active. 2."Hey, no one else is adding new content." Well for one, that doesn't give you an excuse at all and second, you've done some pretty decent analysis in previous games. Furthormore, other people had actually been actively talking about stuff. On January 21 2011 11:17 Nemesis wrote: Pandain all you did is define inactive/lurker. You still haven't answered how we can differentiate between them.You are just repeating the same points over and over again without really answering that question.
The only thing that we can really do is prevent everyone from heading that way in the first place by pressuring/lynching inactives. Keeps saying "Lynch inactives!" Again, we want to lynch lurkers. But that's really moot, and it's more the philosophy of how to play mafia rather than mafia itself. Notice how rather than actually contributing at all Nemesis has just defended himself and argued over the definitions. You were the one who was arguing over the definition, you basically derailed the thread with your whole lurkers/inactive thing.On January 22 2011 12:52 Nemesis wrote:Show nested quote +On January 22 2011 12:42 Hesmyrr wrote:On January 22 2011 12:35 Nemesis wrote: Ok wait, why are people voting for LSB?
This is a rather a bit of a weird bandwagon. There has been too much speculation on people's actions so far. It's day 1, and people are trying to analyze out of a few posts.
Shockeyy is pulling an OMGUS. Barundar is just bandwagoning. Pandain just seems to be flip flopping looking for a target that people are willing to follow him with. Would you consider voting for GMarshal if someone else votes for him? I'd ask you to switch now but then it becomes 3-3 tie which is the last thing I want. Want to avoid LSB lynch for now since I did not analyze him much, and this bandwagon seems to have come out of nowhere. I am not really sure about voting for Gmarshal. He seems to be trying a bit of forced activity, but at least he is trying, while shockeyy on the other hand has pretty much been useless. Note how Shockkey has by this point actually been contributing somewhat. At least more than Nemesis. He's changed from "just make sure he doesn't dissapear" to "lynch him, he's useless." And what exactly has shockey contributed? All that shockeyy contributed is pull an OMGUS on LSB and then disappeared again. At this point, I refuse to believe that you are just a bad townie, since you are now making stuff up.
Also who would you rather have my lynch at that point of the game? The only other people that was up for lynch was Gmarshal and LSB, both of which I didn't think was scummy.On January 23 2011 03:58 Nemesis wrote: Hmmm, town is in a bit of a bad position right now with BC getting modkilled.
Right now it is 6-3 5-3 (after tonight) 3-3 (the next day if we mislynch)
So next day is pretty much LYLO, unless medic succesfully protects someone. We need to be careful about the next lynch and not be too rash. States the obvious. His posts, as town, in TMM2 Show nested quote +http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=7478150 Contributes ALOT On January 05 2011 09:54 Nemesis wrote:On January 04 2011 17:29 orgolove wrote: I apologize for being busy.
So we're having a day 1 lynch without any starting information huh. An open setup with unknown roleblockers gives a disadvantage to the town, but as the saying goes, "a challenge means god's afraid of your progress"
All right, lets see. ...
Looking at the past two pages, there's nothing to analyze. There's only been two votes, and the only discussion has been whether to lynch inactives.
no. Bad idea. In a game such as this, planning to lynch an inactive just allows the reds to guide the discussion to whichever inactive green they know isn't a part of them and leads to the town's disadvantage.
I'm not going to post any votes until there's something more concrete to go on. Orgolove comes in, makes one long post and then disappears. If you actually look at his post, he doesn't really say anything except "there's nothing to analyze." and disagrees with lynching inactives without really adding any more. Basically he makes a long post that doesn't really say anything. ##Unvote: Team 3 ##Vote: Team 9 Flamewheel/Orgolove gives a decent reason and vote http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=7517284contributes alot again Note how he failed to mention that flamewheel/orgolove turned up townie even though I had a "good" reason to vote him. What I realized that game is that it is pointless to analyze base on a few post on day 1, which is why I went for who I think would be a useless person to town later in the game(inactives). Also, it would also have the benefit of encouraging activity.
You want analysis? I've been doing analysis since I've come online this day phase. You are just drawing at straws for me not having been online during the first 15 hours or so of day phase.
In summary, Pandain is making a lot of shit up and is mafia.
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Also, chaoser, I have yet to see your analysis on me that you so promised me.
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And Hesmyrr, wtf we have like 4 hours left. :/
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1. Jackal58-What he says doesn't make alot of sense. He could just be really confused, but for instance saying I thought Shockkey was town. So either he is just not understanding everything, or is mafia. 2. Barundar I'm unsure too. But he just isn't as active as before, and while he's done "an" analysis, he isn't really "active" per se. Like he's not actively trying to figure everything out, and seems like he's just chillaxing. 3. Hesmyrr-long analysis, getting replace when you wouldn't need to when mafia(as mafia, don't need to do so much thinking and "real" analysis. 6. Pandain 7. GGQ- Unsure, but he seems to fit his playstyle as town, albeit he's more active/seems to contribute more this game. I think he's town, but unsure. 8. Chaoser- still not getting a "good read", but my gut tells me he's town. Well actually my gut says he's mafia, but my logic says he's town :p. Contributes alot, and really theres only one thing that I can really say might prove:1.Not defending me when he switched to shockkey as well(albeit thats a small thing).. 9. Nemesis Ironically I'm not as sure as before, but I don't really have anyone else that I'm more sure of. 10. GMarshalFor one his vote on Nemesis. If he was mafia, then that means that out of the 3 votes on me, at least one would be town. That means if Gmarshall had voted me, he could've just said "yeah I think he's scum" and gotten me lynched. And mafia would win the game as long as no one got vigi'd/no vet hit/medic protection. Finally has contributed at least a decent amount. Here's the current list from my perspective.
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What do you think of Barundar, Nemesis? Or jackal?
Maybe I'm tunneling a bit.
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Actually now I don't think Barundar is mafia. I didn't realize he was at an airport. Which also means your more likely scum based on my list.
First off, the fact is you really haven't analyzed at all, contrary to beforehand. Just because you got someone wrong doesn't mean you stop trying. Then you've said "well even if he wasn't scummy, then who would I lynch". The point is you find new people.
And I'm tired of people saying I'm derailing the thread so much. Like last time, with my fake claim. People hardly even talked about that, and in return it could've guranteed about 3 days worth of blue actions. Plus at least it generated discussion.
And now just because we're talking about "lynching inactives:yes or no" and the typical day 1 jazz, just because I helped forward that discussion, I'm derailing the thread.
As for what Shockkey had contributed: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=184673¤tpage=5#100 A semi analysis on you http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=184673¤tpage=8#150 A decent post http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=184673¤tpage=8#153 Showed he had been at least helping somewhat
Shockkey had started contributing, that isn't a lie.
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Barundar, I am slightly of suspicious of him. He seems to be lurking(or inactive) quite a bit, and he suddenly seemed to bandwagon with you on your vote for LSB.
jackal, I just took a quick skim over his posts right now. And hmm, he seems to be posting a lot but most of his post seems to be either stating the obvious or useless one liners.
He put some FoS on bc, hesmyrr, and ggq for not contributing but doesn't vote for them. He then proceeds to vote for you but doesn't really say why beyond I'm suspicious of him, and then disappears.
He seems to be lurking quite a bit too. He's been going under the radar for a while now with his "contributing without really contributing" play style.
Hmm, I think he is scummy, but my main bet is still on you Pandain.
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Frick. I'm 75% sure out of you and Jackal, one or both of you are mafia .
Cmon, where are other people? Why am I always nearly alone in trying to figure stuff out?
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I'm sorry but you call shockeyy's posts contributing?
The first post that you mentioned was I admit that he was at least trying.
But really he only responds when he is called out. It was the same thing with the other 2 post that you mentioned. His second post was an OMGUS for him having "2 jobs and school", and his last post is counting the number of post to "prove" he's not lurking/inactive which is pretty useless as it doesn't take into account the content of the posts.
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Hmm where is everyone? :X
We can't win this game without people actually voting :/
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On January 25 2011 08:46 Nemesis wrote: I'm sorry but you call shockeyy's posts contributing?
The first post that you mentioned was I admit that he was at least trying.
But really he only responds when he is called out. It was the same thing with the other 2 post that you mentioned. His second post was an OMGUS for him having "2 jobs and school", and his last post is counting the number of post to "prove" he's not lurking/inactive which is pretty useless as it doesn't take into account the content of the posts. Which is the same as you. You've really only been either defending(and then attacking) from your accuser(me.)
I'm going to be honest I literally I have no idea what to do right now. BC getting modkilled was .
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On January 25 2011 08:48 Pandain wrote:Show nested quote +On January 25 2011 08:46 Nemesis wrote: I'm sorry but you call shockeyy's posts contributing?
The first post that you mentioned was I admit that he was at least trying.
But really he only responds when he is called out. It was the same thing with the other 2 post that you mentioned. His second post was an OMGUS for him having "2 jobs and school", and his last post is counting the number of post to "prove" he's not lurking/inactive which is pretty useless as it doesn't take into account the content of the posts. Which is the same as you. You've really only been either defending(and then attacking) from your accuser(me.) I'm going to be honest I literally I have no idea what to do right now. BC getting modkilled was . I only had 2 post defending myself day 1. As for day 2, I don't exactly have much of a choice when I'm one the current lynch target right now.
I am not attacking you for attacking me. I really think that you are scum, just like my back and forth with L in Insane.
Bzzz, well I'm going to be heading over to the other mafia game until someone actually comes on.
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