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First let me say that i dont know Cheerio personaly but i always found his posts very informative and interesting.
I gather that he broke some kind of warning that he shouldnt be touching Ukraine/Russian related topics (becouse there is nothing offensive in the post for which he was banned).
Still i find this ban very troubling, because he was always more polite and infromative than his (Serbian/Russian) oponents, yet they alwas got away with minor punishment (as far as i can tell) despite being very provocative, vocal and agressive. They often accuse entire countries of being fascist, an accusation some find very offensive.
So please reconsider.
Also, despite being a shithole i still have found Ukrainin thread to be most interesting and informative on TL. Please bring it back! (Yeah i can dream i know....)
Cheers!
Edit:Sorry for mistake in thread name.
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East Gorteau22261 Posts
Without going into the specifics of what the moderation team thinks of specific users and threads, we will not be revoking the ban on Ukraine-related threads any time soon. They were too much of a pain to moderate and invariably descended into incessant shitflinging that served no purpose other than to further the propaganda of one side or another.
Anyway, the rule we imposed on Cheerio (and others) was the following:
You are hereby banned from posting in the General forum ever again...
We decided that, unfortunately, it was in the best interest of the sub-forum to simply keep the posters most commonly responsible for derailing threads in the sub-forum out. Instead of permanently banning them, the above was the solution we arrived at. Cheerio broke that rule and it had to be enforced. I agree that it is unfortunate, and I don't doubt that Cheerio was rather well-read on many of the topics, but after all the trouble we went through in our attempts to moderate the General forum we could not -- and should not -- be so lenient as to go against our own words so quickly..
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( At least i tried. Thank You for answer.
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Please provide evidence that Cheerio was more polite than his 'Serbian opponents'. I was attacked in multitudes of ways over the course of the entire thread and very very rarely was mod action every taken against the perpetrators, I knew my posts were being closely monitored and anything even close to insulting would get me banned. So go back and actually read my posts, or maybe you are talking about another Serbian poster?
Meanwhile the worst posters in Ukraine threads Ghan and sub40 will be happily around to shit up threads, if you wanted to remove Cheerio as a scapegoat to keep those two around and get rid of Nunez and me, fine. If someone actually has the audacity to call me biased then Ghan and sub40 go three levels above and beyond, I wouldn't have anything against not posting in those threads if those two also got removed. If some mod had politely sent me a PM to stop posting in Ukraine/Russia related threads I would have stopped posting, but apparently I got banned for a week for no post in particular, without any chance to defend myself while the worst of the worst shitposters get a free pass to shitpost. So Cheerio, if you are reading this know why you were banned.
This will be my last post on this subject, TL mods can do whatever the they want in General threads, they can impose whatever belief system they want, say wrong is right, tell people to say the moon is made of cheese or get banned for being biased in favor of rocks. Really, I'm content with posting in the dota and sports sections of this site and wish everybody the best. I didn't come to TL six/seven years ago because of politics, I came here for BW.
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One thing that the mods definitely need to do is add in an explanation on the ban in the thread. When it just says he's banned, on a post that doesn't look bad on its own, it raises questions. If the mod text had instead said the reason for the ban (that he'd been barred from gen discussion and Ukraine issues especially), there'd be a lot more understanding. While inviting discussion on moderation can cause problems, explaining things does much for legitimacy.
I concur with OP that there's an issue with certain problematic posters. I'd have preferred tighter moderation on them.
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That thread, the political thread, and most of those 'discussions' are shit. Cheerio definitely absolutely deserved punishment for violating that totally justified general forum ban. You could probably single out several other users for that too. Not based on their viewpoints, but just for the way they 'debate' and generally have a habit of turning threads to shit.
But I think a 90 day would have been better than a perm simply because he's been around 8 or so years, and the few posts I've seen of him outside of that thread were generally fine. I definitely don't think he deserves leinecy for so quickly breaking that, but I also don't think it's perm worthy.
not a hill to die on or anything, and tbh I don't know his moderation history so maybe that factors in, but just my $.02
also, an aside, but I think there should be links to the offending post when someone ends up in the ban bot feed.
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On March 19 2015 01:35 QuanticHawk wrote: That thread, the political thread, and most of those 'discussions' are shit. Cheerio definitely absolutely deserved punishment for violating that totally justified general forum ban. You could probably single out several other users for that too. Not based on their viewpoints, but just for the way they 'debate' and generally have a habit of turning threads to shit.
But I think a 90 day would have been better than a perm simply because he's been around 8 or so years, and the few posts I've seen of him outside of that thread were generally fine. I definitely don't think he deserves leinecy for so quickly breaking that, but I also don't think it's perm worthy.
not a hill to die on or anything, and tbh I don't know his moderation history so maybe that factors in, but just my $.02
also, an aside, but I think there should be links to the offending post when someone ends up in the ban bot feed.
I agree a link in the ABL post to the post that got someone banned would be a nice feature.
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On March 18 2015 19:23 zeo wrote: Please provide evidence that Cheerio was more polite than his 'Serbian opponents'. I was attacked in multitudes of ways over the course of the entire thread and very very rarely was mod action every taken against the perpetrators, I knew my posts were being closely monitored and anything even close to insulting would get me banned. So go back and actually read my posts, or maybe you are talking about another Serbian poster?
Meanwhile the worst posters in Ukraine threads Ghan and sub40 will be happily around to shit up threads, if you wanted to remove Cheerio as a scapegoat to keep those two around and get rid of Nunez and me, fine. If someone actually has the audacity to call me biased then Ghan and sub40 go three levels above and beyond, I wouldn't have anything against not posting in those threads if those two also got removed. If some mod had politely sent me a PM to stop posting in Ukraine/Russia related threads I would have stopped posting, but apparently I got banned for a week for no post in particular, without any chance to defend myself while the worst of the worst shitposters get a free pass to shitpost. So Cheerio, if you are reading this know why you were banned.
This will be my last post on this subject, TL mods can do whatever the they want in General threads, they can impose whatever belief system they want, say wrong is right, tell people to say the moon is made of cheese or get banned for being biased in favor of rocks. Really, I'm content with posting in the dota and sports sections of this site and wish everybody the best. I didn't come to TL six/seven years ago because of politics, I came here for BW. ahaha, well said buddy.
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to ban Cheerio and not to ban sub40 is not right imo.
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United Kingdom13774 Posts
Out of respect for the fact that they are veteran members, I also feel like their bans should both be reduced to 90 days. Both posts blatantly ignored the warning but I think they deserve some lenience.
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On March 18 2015 22:34 zlefin wrote: One thing that the mods definitely need to do is add in an explanation on the ban in the thread. When it just says he's banned, on a post that doesn't look bad on its own, it raises questions. If the mod text had instead said the reason for the ban (that he'd been barred from gen discussion and Ukraine issues especially), there'd be a lot more understanding. While inviting discussion on moderation can cause problems, explaining things does much for legitimacy.
I concur with OP that there's an issue with certain problematic posters. I'd have preferred tighter moderation on them.
I'd also like to support the notion that there needs to be a comment on the post referencing the reason for the ban, as TL has always used previously banned user posts as an example of what not to post, and that particular post doesn't exemplify it very well.
On March 19 2015 01:35 QuanticHawk wrote: That thread, the political thread, and most of those 'discussions' are shit. Cheerio definitely absolutely deserved punishment for violating that totally justified general forum ban. You could probably single out several other users for that too. Not based on their viewpoints, but just for the way they 'debate' and generally have a habit of turning threads to shit.
But I think a 90 day would have been better than a perm simply because he's been around 8 or so years, and the few posts I've seen of him outside of that thread were generally fine. I definitely don't think he deserves leinecy for so quickly breaking that, but I also don't think it's perm worthy.
not a hill to die on or anything, and tbh I don't know his moderation history so maybe that factors in, but just my $.02
also, an aside, but I think there should be links to the offending post when someone ends up in the ban bot feed.
Also +1 for the ABL link to banned post, if R1CH has any low work effort possibility of encoding that. Likewise, 90 days rather than Perm would seem appropriate, with the warning that will get permed after if posts in general again.
Otherwise thanks for modding as always, General Forum continues to provide epic amounts of facepalm.
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Not wanting wade into the question whether the bans are justified or not, I'd like to remind you that they can soon request to return to TL, which I'm sure is the real moment to show leniency. This means that at the end of the day, there isn't all that much difference between a perm and a 90 day.
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