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fw
Korea (South)1201 Posts
1 iloveoov SK Telecom T1 920.0 - 2 Xellos GO 702.0 +4 3 Nada P&C 701.0 -1 4 Nal_rA KTF Magic@s 604.5 -1 5 Kingdom SK Telecom T1 534.0 -1 6 JulyZerg P.O.S 530.0 -1 7 BoxeR SK Telecom T1 396.0 +1 8 Reach KTF Magic@s 376.0 -1 9 Yellow KTF Magic@s 339.0 +2 10 Midas GO 333.0 +11
11 Chojja KTF Magic@s 327.0 +3 12 TheMarine KTF Magic@s 319.5 - 13 Zeus KOR 318.5 - 14 GoodFriend P&C 311.0 -4 15 Control Hanbitstars 288.5 -6 16 Intotherainbow SK Telecom T1 250.0 - 17 Sync KTF Magic@s 249.0 - 18 Jju SOUL 214.0 +1 19 forU GO 210.5 +3 20 Junwi Hanbitstars 207.5 -2
21 Gorush GO 184.5 -1 22 doggi Khan 168.0 +3 23 Rage GO 160.5 - 24 Side KOR 156.0 - 25 kOs SK Telecom T1 136.0 +2 26 Mumyung SK Telecom T1 126.0 +1 27 TheWind SOUL 120.0 +3 28 Cloud KOR 114.0 New 29 Casy KOR 111.5 New 30 SaferZerg Khan 106.0 New
WCG Power !
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so who went up who went down i cant tell
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Basically Xellos, Midas and ForU went up due to WCG. Yellow and Chojja went up because they are doing good Kos is about to be back in shape, and TheWind...I don't know. because of the 2v2s
GoodFriend and Control went down a lot. Junwi a bit.
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no foreigners this time grrrrr and elky are out :/ but its not unfair since they havent been doing good lately..
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WCG is so ridiculously overrated it's not even funny.
By the way, seeing Reach actually moving DOWN in rankings just takes away alot of credibility.
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Top 3 Terran OMG! Oh well, it's kinda expected And Yellow's back $$$
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Well, at least Ogogo's not anywhere on that. Nice to see Control drop down after being ahead of kingdom and july a few months ago. Xellos should lose 10 ranks because he lost to rage(and iloveoov has been proven far superior to him in all 3 terran matchups).
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Sweden33719 Posts
Hah I think this is the first time that there's more tosses than zergs in top 10 o_O
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for winning wcg you get 300 points, more then any other tournament (i think so). and it is a lot easer then MSL or OSL.
KeSPA ranking sucks
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yeah xellos did a great job by wining WCG and iloveoov is really top1, xellos will never get 900pts
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HnR)hT
United States3468 Posts
On October 31 2004 07:18 tfeign wrote: WCG is so ridiculously overrated it's not even funny.
By the way, seeing Reach actually moving DOWN in rankings just takes away alot of credibility. Indeed. How is Reach still below Ra for instance? He's doing better in KT-KTF, and doing much better in OGN than Ra is doing on MBCG while doing somewhat better on MBCG than Ra on OGN. These rankings are completely bogus as far as I'm concerned.
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Long live midas, +11 is quite well
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Nada should have more GOOD TEAM-MATES!
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Well I guess that's because last year was Ra's year, and this actually concerns a year's record. (Plus Ra being 3rd place on recent MSL)
He'll lose his ranks pretty soon I think.
And yeah, WCG is weird. They get like additional 100 points for winning WCG Korea Prelim too
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clearly wcg count for way too much.
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Boxer and Yellow gaining points again.
Ahh I love it.
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the difference between nada and xellos is only a point.
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where the hell iloveoov get +200 points from others?? :O
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SaferZerg is new entry...Is it because of his top 4 rank in WCG prelim or OCL play-off? Congrats anyway
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I dont think WCGs counts to much. Remember to get to the WCGs finals you have to run the gauntlet that is the Korean WCGs prelims.
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u guyz should stop hating. xellos should be up there... ok well maybe top but so what.only beef u should have with this is reach going down cause he is on fire
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woh Boxer must have been in the top 10 for about 3 years now(??). Thats pretty amazing. Respect.
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I also don't think WCG winning point is unfair. Even winning OSL is harder than WCG, WCG is international tourney, Korean pros hardly know foreign players, not enough time for preparing WCG...etc... :S
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DJ_Heather indeed ;-) But, in reality WCG Finals looks like Brazil(Koreans) vs Luxembourg(Foreigners) ^^
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United States32511 Posts
kespa is a bad ranking anyway
pros have their up and down periods prtty unpredictably ;o
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No more non-koreans in top 30 wow.
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why is gorush so far bewhind? he has won all his recent matchs...
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It ranks based on a year. You guys forget last week, and bitch about "old" replays that were only played 2 months ago. Boxer went up over reach, that doesn't mean reach went down. Same with Nada, he didn't go down, xellos moved up.
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WTF Xellos no2 and yellow only 2+.Next month he should be like no4 or no5. KeSPA ranking SYSTEM sucks.Midas +11 WTF this looks like.
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Ogogo is gone
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On October 31 2004 10:06 Addicted`To`Zerg wrote: WTF Xellos no2 and yellow only 2+.Next month he should be like no4 or no5. KeSPA ranking SYSTEM sucks.Midas +11 WTF this looks like.
It's cause WCG gives you alot of points. That's why Ogogo moved up so much when he won WCG.
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I heard that the amount of the prize money is one of the factors used to make KeSPA rankings. And WCG's winning prize is kind of big..was it 25000$ or somthing?
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It's a good thing that ogogo isnt on this list any more. WCG is completely unfair. There are so many koreans who could have came to WCG and embarrass every single non korean and easily place top 3 (if they don't face other Koreans like foru did) and win a shitload of points, while players like Reach who placed 2nd on last OSL, busting his ass off to the current OSL to already be in the semifinal killing off former OGN champions one by one, and potentially even win the whole starleague and then actually end up moving down in the rankings. If you don't call this unfair then I don't know what is.
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Xellos is definetly top 5, but I dont think #2 looks "good". As for the top 3 being Terran, not sure about that. But, being that it is Oov, xellos, Nada it somewhat reflecs their TvT abilities. All 3 are capable of beating each other at any time, since neither of the 3 dominates any other player any more.
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WTF xellos is second and NaDa is third OMFG KeSpa suxx (300 points for WCG ????? for pros it is hard like win wgtour season )
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The koreans deserve quite a bit of points for WCG actually. They should get lots of points for the korean WCG, and an additional 5 for the grand finals of WCG! (Not ranks, just points) Har!
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where is ogogo ?? ?? ? ? he had enough points to be top 15 ?? ? ??
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MURICA15980 Posts
Doesn't matter if Xellos is second... it is by one freakin' point. I mean you can basically say they are tied. And those rankings aren't off by much... I mean Xellos is doing great lately.
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is there a kespa ranking after 30 ?
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where is ogogo can someone tell me ? ??
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Xellos & Midas Fighting~~!
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On October 31 2004 11:26 Klogon wrote: Doesn't matter if Xellos is second... it is by one freakin' point. I mean you can basically say they are tied. And those rankings aren't off by much... I mean Xellos is doing great lately. Sure , but i still think NaDa is better then Xellos (now it's very close)
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xellos not only won the wcg, he is doing great! Better than Nada in results and in game play....i watch the vods and think that atm xellos > nada
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On October 31 2004 07:18 tfeign wrote: WCG is so ridiculously overrated it's not even funny.
By the way, seeing Reach actually moving DOWN in rankings just takes away alot of credibility.
I SOO AGREE THAT WCG is SOO OVERRATED
geeeeeez
WCG...bashing other non-pros on a tournament that is one sided...and that improves the rating significantly?
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here are the teams :
KTF - Nal_Ra , Reach , Yellow , Chojja , The Marine , Sync SK1 - Iloveoov , Kingdom , Boxer , intotherainbow , k0s , Mumyung GO - Xellos , Midas , ForU , Gorush , Rage KOR - Zeus , Side , Cloud , Casy Hanbit- Control , Junwi Soul - JJU , TheWind Khan - Doggi , SaferZerg P&C - Nada , Goodfriend
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wow dude midas +11 wowowow thats gay-_-; just cause wcg or something eh?
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In order to qualify for WCG, they went through korean prelims which would have been very competitive considering the number of progamers + thousands of unknown korean gosus who enter offline or online.
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On October 31 2004 11:11 Nal_Testie wrote: The koreans deserve quite a bit of points for WCG actually. They should get lots of points for the korean WCG, and an additional 5 for the grand finals of WCG! (Not ranks, just points) Har!
Right, koreans prelims were prety hard!
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And still it is nowhere as hard as winning any korean league. Yet, winning WCG gives mountains more points than winning any Korean league does. Where is the fairness?
Winning WCG does NOT mean you're among the bests. Winning any korean starleague does.
Name me ONE korean starleague winner in the past that wasn't an outstanding, dominant player.
Now look at WCG's winner last year and you'll understand why winning WCG doesn't mean much. If you think that ogogo deserve the points that he got from winning WCG, then there's seriously something wrong with your logic.
Should winning WCG give points? Yes, of course, but nowhere even near the amount of points that kespa gives. Winning WCG is not an indication of extremely high skills or talents, just like ogogo proved last year.
Xellos's 300+ point boost in rankings is just downright extremely unfair. But what's even more sad is seeing Midas moving up 11 spots in rankings, all the way into the top 10, when there are so many other people who deserve to be top 10 more than he does.
And that's not even mentioning that wcg's maps this year were heavily biased for terran. I would probably accept it if some korean zerg went to wcg and dominated the terrans and then got the major point boost for winning. But a couple korean terrans going to wcg beating a bunch of foreigners on maps that heavily favored their race and then go home with the biggest sum of money ever offered from winning a starcraft tournament, in addition to a huge unfair boost in rankings is just not right.
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fw
Korea (South)1201 Posts
imho, wcg should deserve but what makes wcg points overweighted in the end is that wcg korea involves abusings and lacks in quality of the preparations, which makes it a little unpredictable. pros don't usually spend much effects over other korean leagues. some anticipated players didn't even participated in (oov/reach this year, boxer last year). it's also 1 day off-line tourney with a lot of games (that's one of the reason pros don't spend the time in it. it is too tough tournament for 1 day to concentrate solely on it. i think they think it is a risky bet) , which raises the possibility of the random results on that day.
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You said that yourself - this is the tournament with the highest prize money awarded. So it makes sense to have the most points awarded, no? These guys are pro - they play for money. If you ask me, the rankings should be according to how much money the guys won - the guys with the most money won (over a period of, say, one year) should be the best pro players, no?
Furthermore, only the prelims for WCG should be worth more than any other prolegue since you play not only other pro gamers (which you've played with for some years now and know their style pretty well) but also with guys from a pool of thousand unknown gosu Korean dudes, some of which with skills no lower than the pro players.
If winning WCG was so easy (as you say) why didnt Nada for example just go there and get the money. The guy doesnt need $25K and a free trip to Frisco? Come on.
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On November 01 2004 01:09 chmmr wrote: You said that yourself - this is the tournament with the highest prize money awarded. So it makes sense to have the most points awarded, no? These guys are pro - they play for money. If you ask me, the rankings should be according to how much money the guys won - the guys with the most money won (over a period of, say, one year) should be the best pro players, no?
Furthermore, only the prelims for WCG should be worth more than any other prolegue since you play not only other pro gamers (which you've played with for some years now and know their style pretty well) but also with guys from a pool of thousand unknown gosu Korean dudes, some of which with skills no lower than the pro players.
If winning WCG was so easy (as you say) why didnt Nada for example just go there and get the money. The guy doesnt need $25K and a free trip to Frisco? Come on.
After reading just the first paragraph of your post I've decided that it's not worth it to continue reading.
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doesnt everybody care that there are no foreign in the list?
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why are u complaining....... like u can change it.. if u don't like it do'nt look at it oO
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On October 31 2004 14:03 readY_bg wrote: where is ogogo can someone tell me ? ??
He's been pushed off the list. He was never that great.
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Sweden33719 Posts
On November 01 2004 01:09 chmmr wrote: You said that yourself - this is the tournament with the highest prize money awarded. So it makes sense to have the most points awarded, no? These guys are pro - they play for money. If you ask me, the rankings should be according to how much money the guys won - the guys with the most money won (over a period of, say, one year) should be the best pro players, no?
Furthermore, only the prelims for WCG should be worth more than any other prolegue since you play not only other pro gamers (which you've played with for some years now and know their style pretty well) but also with guys from a pool of thousand unknown gosu Korean dudes, some of which with skills no lower than the pro players.
If winning WCG was so easy (as you say) why didnt Nada for example just go there and get the money. The guy doesnt need $25K and a free trip to Frisco? Come on. You are retarded. The prelim in WCG korea is 10 times as hard as the actual tournament (xellos said so himself).
Besides a) WCG does not give the most money b) The amount of prestige for winning WCG isn't even close to that of OGN/MBC/KT-KTF or even GhemTV/iTV (or well, it might be close to the later 2).
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Sweden33719 Posts
On November 01 2004 00:38 tfeign wrote: And still it is nowhere as hard as winning any korean league. Yet, winning WCG gives mountains more points than winning any Korean league does. Where is the fairness?
Winning WCG does NOT mean you're among the bests. Winning any korean starleague does.
Name me ONE korean starleague winner in the past that wasn't an outstanding, dominant player.
Now look at WCG's winner last year and you'll understand why winning WCG doesn't mean much. If you think that ogogo deserve the points that he got from winning WCG, then there's seriously something wrong with your logic.
Should winning WCG give points? Yes, of course, but nowhere even near the amount of points that kespa gives. Winning WCG is not an indication of extremely high skills or talents, just like ogogo proved last year.
Xellos's 300+ point boost in rankings is just downright extremely unfair. But what's even more sad is seeing Midas moving up 11 spots in rankings, all the way into the top 10, when there are so many other people who deserve to be top 10 more than he does.
And that's not even mentioning that wcg's maps this year were heavily biased for terran. I would probably accept it if some korean zerg went to wcg and dominated the terrans and then got the major point boost for winning. But a couple korean terrans going to wcg beating a bunch of foreigners on maps that heavily favored their race and then go home with the biggest sum of money ever offered from winning a starcraft tournament, in addition to a huge unfair boost in rankings is just not right. Not the most money...
KT-KTF is WAY, WAY, WAY more lucrative ;O Btw, Sync won an OGN Starleague and he wasn't really outstanding (well he sure as hell was on a roll that league but like he wasn't as dominating as boxer etc, and garimto, yellow AND boxer were actually slumping in that league iirc so yeah).
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Just for the record, Korean prelims being the harder part of WCG was my point as well.
>> KT-KTF is WAY, WAY, WAY more lucrative ;O That's VERY VERY VERY specific. Where do you get your info from?
I get mine from here (yes, it's the internet, so maybe there're sources more reliable than that) http://joongangdaily.joins.com/200401/14/200401140123078779900090609061.html
Nada won $29K from the KT-KTF league ("a record in the single domestic game league in the five-year history of computer game tournaments in Korea"), but:
- he made that much because he went undefeated all the way, getting extra prizes for winning streaks. - the tournament is 3 months - this is the record, ok? nobody else has ever made that much from a single tournament.
So stating this is MUCH MUCH MUCH bigger than WCG is pure nonsense (except if the numbers are wrong). Trying to bash & undermine WCG is just retarded, the scope of the tournament, the prizes and the media exposure are huge.
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On November 01 2004 05:44 Cambium wrote: Show nested quote +On October 31 2004 14:03 readY_bg wrote: where is ogogo can someone tell me ? ?? He's been pushed off the list. He was never that great.
0gogo is doing very well the last 10 matches i've seen of him. really should be higherranked.
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On November 01 2004 09:33 2ndFoundation wrote: Show nested quote +On November 01 2004 05:44 Cambium wrote: On October 31 2004 14:03 readY_bg wrote: where is ogogo can someone tell me ? ?? He's been pushed off the list. He was never that great. 0gogo is doing very well the last 10 matches i've seen of him. really should be higherranked.
Winning a teamleague game here and there doesn't count for shit, and it shouldn't either, that's why he's not on the list. And he shouldn't have been there for as long as he was either.
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ogogo must be there he has increadible zvt !!!!!! one of the best I have ever seen
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On October 31 2004 08:26 vanilica_scg wrote: yeah xellos did a great job by wining WCG and iloveoov is really top1, xellos will never get 900pts Agreed.
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On November 01 2004 00:38 tfeign wrote:
Winning WCG does NOT mean you're among the bests. Winning any korean starleague does.
Name me ONE korean starleague winner in the past that wasn't an outstanding, dominant player. .
Uh.. I think Skelton won one long ago. First few starleague winners werent that dominant until Box and Garim started
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On November 01 2004 14:20 SuperJongMan wrote: Show nested quote +On November 01 2004 00:38 tfeign wrote:
Winning WCG does NOT mean you're among the bests. Winning any korean starleague does.
Name me ONE korean starleague winner in the past that wasn't an outstanding, dominant player. . Uh.. I think Skelton won one long ago. First few starleague winners werent that dominant until Box and Garim started
No Skelton never won an OSL. The first few starleague winners were Grrr, Garimto, and Boxer in that order and they were all pretty dominant.
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2 Xellos GO 702.0 +4 10 Midas GO 333.0 +11
Only for WCG ?
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damn, 3 tosses in top 10, has that happened before?
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GOGO Chojja !!
No non-korean this time or I just missed that ?
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On November 01 2004 16:03 Make7UpYours wrote: Show nested quote +On November 01 2004 14:20 SuperJongMan wrote: On November 01 2004 00:38 tfeign wrote:
Winning WCG does NOT mean you're among the bests. Winning any korean starleague does.
Name me ONE korean starleague winner in the past that wasn't an outstanding, dominant player. . Uh.. I think Skelton won one long ago. First few starleague winners werent that dominant until Box and Garim started No Skelton never won an OSL. The first few starleague winners were Grrr, Garimto, and Boxer in that order and they were all pretty dominant.
And FreeMura
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On November 01 2004 20:30 NotSorry wrote: damn, 3 tosses in top 10, has that happened before?
Just look at the KeSPA's ranking on 2003/09
1 [ReD]NaDa 2 SlayerS_`BoxeR` 3 [NC]...Yellow 4 ChoJJa 5 [Oops]Reach 6 H.O.T.Forever 7 XellOs[yG] 8 Junwi_[saM] 9 Nal_rA 10 ZeuS
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In 2004/03's ranking, there are even 4 tosses in top 10
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