Hard to call for me both head and heart. I'd love to see Trap and Dear rekindle some of their old success but TY is one of my favorite players and I'd love for Maru to extend his GSL dominance.
On March 30 2019 13:25 Waxangel wrote: Super-late vs super-late could be interesting. Dear didn't really have to play it during his win-streak, and Maru looked disgusting as usual vs Neeb.
he needs to survive the timing from dear first tho
Time to see how Maru controls TY-style mass liberator/viking/ghost. TY already makes this style look crazy powerful, so it'll be neat to see how Maru does with it.
Wow Dear. I've never seen someone actually handle this terran style well. Parting got absolutely destroyed by it when he played TY, but he also didn't use blink DTs like Dear is.
On March 30 2019 13:38 Ben... wrote: Wow Dear. I've never seen someone actually handle this terran style well. Parting got absolutely destroyed by it when he played TY, but he also didn't use blink DTs like Dear is.
I'm not sure if that works that well if they were both even out of the midgame though.
i think the current state is gud.It just because of the protoss 's ability to play like zerg enables them to throw some stupid shits with minimal punishments
On March 30 2019 13:38 Ben... wrote: Wow Dear. I've never seen someone actually handle this terran style well. Parting got absolutely destroyed by it when he played TY, but he also didn't use blink DTs like Dear is.
I'm not sure if that works that well if they were both even out of the midgame though.
In the Parting game he had a base advantage but TY spammed turrets and focused more on liberators and basically denied Parting getting detection on the ghosts then slow pushed him with liberators and nukes. Basically any time Parting would attack TY would zone his army with a nuke. It was crazy.
Maru should have gotten another starport just to build non stop ravens the whole match. Would have probably helped a lot with both dts and anti armor!!
If you watch TY play that kind of style, he goes for extra orbitals so he doesn't run out of scans. Though he seems to be a level above everyone else at that ultra-late game ghost/viking/liberator stuff. He plays it a lot more passive than Maru did there.
I feel like maru forgot widow mines, they gain a lot of value in defending outlying bases and in that particular game the main since there is no way observers can get inside and you don't need to micro them.
The key in all these super lategames always seems to be attention. Whoever is on the attack, throwing harassment and multipronged attacks and so forth at the other guy, always seems to win. Even though it might be theoretically more efficient to defend and win after mining out, I've yet to see the progamer with the multitask to pull it off.
I guess the exception would be something like BL/Infestor, an army comp that is simply unbeatable no matter how the economy game goes. Relying on free units and/or spells goes a long way.
On March 30 2019 13:51 pvsnp wrote: The key in all these super lategames always seems to be attention. Whoever is on the attack, throwing harassment and multipronged attacks and so forth at the other guy, always seems to win. Even though it might be theoretically more efficient to defend and win after mining out, I've yet to see the progamer with the multitask to pull it off.
Arguably Scarlett vs Maru was like that and had the defender winning, but there were some oddities there.
On March 30 2019 13:51 pvsnp wrote: The key in all these super lategames always seems to be attention. Whoever is on the attack, throwing harassment and multipronged attacks and so forth at the other guy, always seems to win. Even though it might be theoretically more efficient to defend and win after mining out, I've yet to see the progamer with the multitask to pull it off.
Arguably Scarlett vs Maru was like that and had the defender winning, but there were some oddities there.
haha for game theory purposes, I would call that game a draw
On March 30 2019 14:01 Proko wrote: Man, this game was pretty confounding. Dear was way ahead in econ but he spent to much on econ and upgrades and had no army.
On March 30 2019 13:31 Ben... wrote: Time to see how Maru controls TY-style mass liberator/viking/ghost. TY already makes this style look crazy powerful, so it'll be neat to see how Maru does with it.
Have you watched Maru games? If anything TY's lategame on his best day would almost be as good as Maru's. Not the other way round...
Dear with the immaculate defense lol I'm reminded of game 1 of Rain vs Maru on Vaani Research Station in 2015 where Rain defended Maru's widow mine drops perfectly and went on to win the game
Dear being 20-0 in PvT, 125 days without a Korean terran beating a Korean protoss in an offline bo5+, none of the stats matter when it comes to GSL Maru.
On March 30 2019 14:25 Anc13nt wrote: Nothing against Maru but I hope TY gets his vengeance against him. Winning 4 GSls would go against the universal balance.
Hahaha yeah! Anyone who doubt about Maru must be crazy, yeah Dear is okay-ish, got crazy TvP record but this is GSL playoffs, place where maru becoming absolute monster. Last game where Dear defended each mine drop with minimal losses and still got overwhelmed by Maru's insane macro..oh man what a game, and they say terran can't play macro, just play like Maru I guess.
On March 30 2019 14:26 pvsnp wrote: Even though I love Maru, I'd prefer it if Classic or Dark won. Maru has enough GSL trophies and those guys could really use one.
im cheering for not-serral and not-maru so we get total chaos in SC2 scene
On March 30 2019 14:25 Anc13nt wrote: Nothing against Maru but I hope TY gets his vengeance against him. Winning 4 GSls would go against the universal balance.
Naah mate looks to me like the GSLs dont carry their worth anymore with so many people around here saying its a regional tournament.
If anything with his recent losses it would be in favor of universal balance that Maru wins.
On March 30 2019 14:26 pvsnp wrote: Even though I love Maru, I'd prefer it if Classic or Dark won. Maru has enough GSL trophies and those guys could really use one.
im cheering for not-serral and not-maru so we get total chaos in SC2 scene
On March 30 2019 14:26 pvsnp wrote: Even though I love Maru, I'd prefer it if Classic or Dark won. Maru has enough GSL trophies and those guys could really use one.
im cheering for not-serral and not-maru so we get total chaos in SC2 scene
I can get behind that. New year, new champions.
I'm ok if Maru wins GSL till the day he retires. Just want to see one live in the studio.
On March 30 2019 14:26 pvsnp wrote: Even though I love Maru, I'd prefer it if Classic or Dark won. Maru has enough GSL trophies and those guys could really use one.
im cheering for not-serral and not-maru so we get total chaos in SC2 scene
I can get behind that. New year, new champions.
u gotta fuck up the game so badly so we could see new patch(insert race name here) player
On March 30 2019 14:26 pvsnp wrote: Even though I love Maru, I'd prefer it if Classic or Dark won. Maru has enough GSL trophies and those guys could really use one.
im cheering for not-serral and not-maru so we get total chaos in SC2 scene
I can get behind that. New year, new champions.
u gotta fuck up the game so badly so we could see new patch(insert race name here) player
Wonder how imbalanced things would have to be to make a foreign terran win something (or at the very least get SpeCial into a finals).
On March 30 2019 14:26 pvsnp wrote: Even though I love Maru, I'd prefer it if Classic or Dark won. Maru has enough GSL trophies and those guys could really use one.
im cheering for not-serral and not-maru so we get total chaos in SC2 scene
I can get behind that. New year, new champions.
u gotta fuck up the game so badly so we could see new patch(insert race name here) player
Wonder how imbalanced things would have to be to make a foreign terran win something (or at the very least get SpeCial into a finals).
well...given the current state of foreign terran...i'd say adding warhound would not make terran looks OP at all zerg and protoss foreigners just need to play better guys
On March 30 2019 14:26 pvsnp wrote: Even though I love Maru, I'd prefer it if Classic or Dark won. Maru has enough GSL trophies and those guys could really use one.
im cheering for not-serral and not-maru so we get total chaos in SC2 scene
I can get behind that. New year, new champions.
u gotta fuck up the game so badly so we could see new patch(insert race name here) player
Wonder how imbalanced things would have to be to make a foreign terran win something (or at the very least get SpeCial into a finals).
well...given the current state of foreign terran...i'd say adding warhound would not make terran looks OP at all zerg and protoss foreigners just need to play better guys
They could rework the cyclone yet again and give it the exact same stats as the warhound had, and I don't think many people would notice.
On March 30 2019 14:57 Die4Ever wrote: Just roll back to the point when he had 0 APM
I checked the VOD and didn't notice a point where he dropped to 0 APM. He was always doing something until the point he typed "PP". So this sounds like an excuse to me...
On March 30 2019 14:57 Die4Ever wrote: Just roll back to the point when he had 0 APM
Even if that's before the DTs walk in?
Didn't he lift 2 of the depots? Just the tank was sitting on one, I guess they'd have to see when he had 0 APM but I'm pretty sure he was doing stuff at that moment
I wonder if they have video recording of the computer
On March 30 2019 14:57 Die4Ever wrote: Just roll back to the point when he had 0 APM
Even if that's before the DTs walk in?
Didn't he lift 2 of the depots? Just the tank was sitting on one, I guess they'd have to see when he had 0 APM but I'm pretty sure he was doing stuff at that moment
I wonder if they have video recording of the computer
On March 30 2019 15:20 pvsnp wrote: Maru: Get your easy wins now Trap
Maru probably said that TY will proxy rax because he's behind on match point
Maru probably thinks TY isn't on his level, only Maru is smart enough to do that. And by smart I mean "get scouted instantly and lose the series."
Maru has won big series by proxying in situations where everyone in the world (except for his opponent apparently) expect it, so there must be something to it.
On March 30 2019 15:20 pvsnp wrote: Maru: Get your easy wins now Trap
Maru probably said that TY will proxy rax because he's behind on match point
Maru probably thinks TY isn't on his level, only Maru is smart enough to do that. And by smart I mean "get scouted instantly and lose the series."
Maru has won big series by proxying in situations where everyone in the world (except for his opponent apparently) expect it, so there must be something to it.
Well if he's playing Scarlett, then he can proxy and get scouted and shut down hard and still win anyway.
On March 30 2019 16:05 FrostedMiniWheats wrote: Less a teamkill gets him, the last player that can stop Maru is about to fall
You do realize there are Classic and Dark in the other semifinal :D?
Not convinced by Classic, who even in his 2018 form failed to take Maru out in the GSL. Meanwhile, Maru just cut through a guy who was 20-0 in PvT coming into this.
On March 30 2019 16:05 FrostedMiniWheats wrote: Less a teamkill gets him, the last player that can stop Maru is about to fall
You do realize there are Classic and Dark in the other semifinal :D?
Not convinced by Classic, who even in his 2018 form failed to take Maru out in the GSL. Meanwhile, Maru just cut through a guy who was 20-0 in PvT coming into this.
That was very disappointing from TY, Maru is way closer to his fourth consecutive title. I actually hope for Dark to eventually break all of his curses and triumph, eventually!
On March 30 2019 18:31 Poopi wrote: Fuck yeah Maru won!!! How is this even possible? Did Dear sweat too much on stage like BlizzCon 2016 all over again or Maru got into 2018 form again?
Too bad for TY but at least it should be an easier path for Maru to the finals
You should watch the Maru vs Dear series. It was really fukin good
Maru was 2018 form, mechanics wise, imo. Dear played so damn good - his defense was entering stats territory - but he was just overwhelmed by Maru's mechanics and micro. after game 2 Maru was firing on all cylinders
Trap was looking sharp too. I think he has a better chance of beating maru than TY would have
I think this is another Maru championship to be honest. I guess Trap does have the teammate advantage in the ro4 but so does Maru. TY was the only one who would be "favored" against him at this point.
On March 30 2019 18:31 Poopi wrote: Fuck yeah Maru won!!! How is this even possible? Did Dear sweat too much on stage like BlizzCon 2016 all over again or Maru got into 2018 form again?
Too bad for TY but at least it should be an easier path for Maru to the finals
Well, all the games of Maru v Dear can be summed into - I'm fine, I'm fine, I'm fine. WTF did just happen and why am I losing and where did he get those 40 additional supplies? What's happening?!
Honestly maru vs dear was great series, but 1 thing, tempest ht vs viking ghost, is most dullest end game armies composition ever, neither player can really engage, neither can transition into anything else and we get this back and forth dance for 30mins each time.
On March 31 2019 00:42 skdsk wrote: Honestly maru vs dear was great series, but 1 thing, tempest ht vs viking ghost, is most dullest end game armies composition ever, neither player can really engage, neither can transition into anything else and we get this back and forth dance for 30mins each time.
This is so true, even disregarding the fact that the Terran side is significantly harder to control, it's just plain boring to watch
Just caught up with VODs. Jesus mr Maru you are a very good!! Also as NoRegret said right at the end, if you give Maru time to prepare he is even better, he looked very strong. I aslo thought as said by Tasteless that Dear actually played really well it was just Maru was just even better.
On March 31 2019 00:42 skdsk wrote: Honestly maru vs dear was great series, but 1 thing, tempest ht vs viking ghost, is most dullest end game armies composition ever, neither player can really engage, neither can transition into anything else and we get this back and forth dance for 30mins each time.
On March 31 2019 00:42 skdsk wrote: Honestly maru vs dear was great series, but 1 thing, tempest ht vs viking ghost, is most dullest end game armies composition ever, neither player can really engage, neither can transition into anything else and we get this back and forth dance for 30mins each time.
completely disagree.
lategame TvP is the best
Terrans will never be satisfied. Maru went 3-1, complained about TvP imbalance and then explicitly stated he'd rather play Trap than TY...nonsensical.
On March 31 2019 00:42 skdsk wrote: Honestly maru vs dear was great series, but 1 thing, tempest ht vs viking ghost, is most dullest end game armies composition ever, neither player can really engage, neither can transition into anything else and we get this back and forth dance for 30mins each time.
completely disagree.
lategame TvP is the best
Terrans will never be satisfied. Maru went 3-1, complained about TvP imbalance and then explicitly stated he'd rather play Trap than TY...nonsensical.
He complained that straight TvP is imbalanced (he might have a point or not, that's his opinion which carries weight), so he had to play unconventional to have a chance, and he'd rather play Trap because he feels his TvT is not as good as TY's. He said it many times. Makes total sense.
On March 31 2019 00:42 skdsk wrote: Honestly maru vs dear was great series, but 1 thing, tempest ht vs viking ghost, is most dullest end game armies composition ever, neither player can really engage, neither can transition into anything else and we get this back and forth dance for 30mins each time.
completely disagree.
lategame TvP is the best
Terrans will never be satisfied. Maru went 3-1, complained about TvP imbalance and then explicitly stated he'd rather play Trap than TY...nonsensical.
He complained that straight TvP is imbalanced (he might have a point or not, that's his opinion which carries weight), so he had to play unconventional to have a chance, and he'd rather play Trap because he feels his TvT is not as good as TY's. He said it many times. Makes total sense.
It makes zero sense
"play unconventional to have a chance"
You mean wipe the floor with Dear, literally the current best PvT player in the world who also played immaculately, 3-1?
By the way, Maru's "unconvention" was basically the same strategies he used to sweep Neeb in WESG and HerO in GSL
Maru dominated in his last 3 TvPs, which also happened to be against beasts in Neeb, HerO and Dear, and then he says TvP is imbalanced against terran...and he wants to play Trap instead of a slumping TY lol?
On March 31 2019 00:42 skdsk wrote: Honestly maru vs dear was great series, but 1 thing, tempest ht vs viking ghost, is most dullest end game armies composition ever, neither player can really engage, neither can transition into anything else and we get this back and forth dance for 30mins each time.
completely disagree.
lategame TvP is the best
Terrans will never be satisfied. Maru went 3-1, complained about TvP imbalance and then explicitly stated he'd rather play Trap than TY...nonsensical.
He complained that straight TvP is imbalanced (he might have a point or not, that's his opinion which carries weight), so he had to play unconventional to have a chance, and he'd rather play Trap because he feels his TvT is not as good as TY's. He said it many times. Makes total sense.
It makes zero sense
"play unconventional to have a chance"
You mean wipe the floor with Dear, literally the current best PvT player in the world who also played immaculately, 3-1?
By the way, Maru's "unconvention" was basically the same strategies he used to sweep Neeb in WESG and HerO in GSL
Maru dominated in his last 3 TvPs, which also happened to be against beasts in Neeb, HerO and Dear, and then he says TvP is imbalanced against terran...and he wants to play Trap instead of a slumping TY lol?
TY dominated his Ro16 group of death but losing to Trap means he's in a slump now?
On March 31 2019 00:42 skdsk wrote: Honestly maru vs dear was great series, but 1 thing, tempest ht vs viking ghost, is most dullest end game armies composition ever, neither player can really engage, neither can transition into anything else and we get this back and forth dance for 30mins each time.
completely disagree.
lategame TvP is the best
Terrans will never be satisfied. Maru went 3-1, complained about TvP imbalance and then explicitly stated he'd rather play Trap than TY...nonsensical.
He complained that straight TvP is imbalanced (he might have a point or not, that's his opinion which carries weight), so he had to play unconventional to have a chance, and he'd rather play Trap because he feels his TvT is not as good as TY's. He said it many times. Makes total sense.
It makes zero sense
"play unconventional to have a chance"
You mean wipe the floor with Dear, literally the current best PvT player in the world who also played immaculately, 3-1?
By the way, Maru's "unconvention" was basically the same strategies he used to sweep Neeb in WESG and HerO in GSL
Maru dominated in his last 3 TvPs, which also happened to be against beasts in Neeb, HerO and Dear, and then he says TvP is imbalanced against terran...and he wants to play Trap instead of a slumping TY lol?
Clearly you didn't read a word I wrote, so having a conversation is useless.
On March 31 2019 00:42 skdsk wrote: Honestly maru vs dear was great series, but 1 thing, tempest ht vs viking ghost, is most dullest end game armies composition ever, neither player can really engage, neither can transition into anything else and we get this back and forth dance for 30mins each time.
completely disagree.
lategame TvP is the best
Terrans will never be satisfied. Maru went 3-1, complained about TvP imbalance and then explicitly stated he'd rather play Trap than TY...nonsensical.
He complained that straight TvP is imbalanced (he might have a point or not, that's his opinion which carries weight), so he had to play unconventional to have a chance, and he'd rather play Trap because he feels his TvT is not as good as TY's. He said it many times. Makes total sense.
It makes zero sense
"play unconventional to have a chance"
You mean wipe the floor with Dear, literally the current best PvT player in the world who also played immaculately, 3-1?
By the way, Maru's "unconvention" was basically the same strategies he used to sweep Neeb in WESG and HerO in GSL
Maru dominated in his last 3 TvPs, which also happened to be against beasts in Neeb, HerO and Dear, and then he says TvP is imbalanced against terran...and he wants to play Trap instead of a slumping TY lol?
TY dominated his Ro16 group of death but losing to Trap means he's in a slump now?
TY hasnt been top 4 of any premier tournament since like the last GSL over 6 months ago
for a terran horseman, it sounds like a slump to me
On March 31 2019 00:42 skdsk wrote: Honestly maru vs dear was great series, but 1 thing, tempest ht vs viking ghost, is most dullest end game armies composition ever, neither player can really engage, neither can transition into anything else and we get this back and forth dance for 30mins each time.
completely disagree.
lategame TvP is the best
Terrans will never be satisfied. Maru went 3-1, complained about TvP imbalance and then explicitly stated he'd rather play Trap than TY...nonsensical.
He complained that straight TvP is imbalanced (he might have a point or not, that's his opinion which carries weight), so he had to play unconventional to have a chance, and he'd rather play Trap because he feels his TvT is not as good as TY's. He said it many times. Makes total sense.
It makes zero sense
"play unconventional to have a chance"
You mean wipe the floor with Dear, literally the current best PvT player in the world who also played immaculately, 3-1?
By the way, Maru's "unconvention" was basically the same strategies he used to sweep Neeb in WESG and HerO in GSL
Maru dominated in his last 3 TvPs, which also happened to be against beasts in Neeb, HerO and Dear, and then he says TvP is imbalanced against terran...and he wants to play Trap instead of a slumping TY lol?
TY dominated his Ro16 group of death but losing to Trap means he's in a slump now?
TY hasnt been top 4 of any premier tournament since like the last GSL over 6 months ago
for a terran horseman, it sounds like a slump to me
What about Trap then? He's in immaculate form but can't get a high tournament finish because of how underpowered protoss is?
On March 31 2019 00:42 skdsk wrote: Honestly maru vs dear was great series, but 1 thing, tempest ht vs viking ghost, is most dullest end game armies composition ever, neither player can really engage, neither can transition into anything else and we get this back and forth dance for 30mins each time.
completely disagree.
lategame TvP is the best
Terrans will never be satisfied. Maru went 3-1, complained about TvP imbalance and then explicitly stated he'd rather play Trap than TY...nonsensical.
He complained that straight TvP is imbalanced (he might have a point or not, that's his opinion which carries weight), so he had to play unconventional to have a chance, and he'd rather play Trap because he feels his TvT is not as good as TY's. He said it many times. Makes total sense.
It makes zero sense
"play unconventional to have a chance"
You mean wipe the floor with Dear, literally the current best PvT player in the world who also played immaculately, 3-1?
By the way, Maru's "unconvention" was basically the same strategies he used to sweep Neeb in WESG and HerO in GSL
Maru dominated in his last 3 TvPs, which also happened to be against beasts in Neeb, HerO and Dear, and then he says TvP is imbalanced against terran...and he wants to play Trap instead of a slumping TY lol?
TY dominated his Ro16 group of death but losing to Trap means he's in a slump now?
TY hasnt been top 4 of any premier tournament since like the last GSL over 6 months ago
for a terran horseman, it sounds like a slump to me
What about Trap then? He's in immaculate form but can't get a high tournament finish because of how underpowered protoss is?
That's what I'm saying. Trap is playing in top form, and Maru claims that Terran is at a disadvantage against protoss, but then he goes on to say that he'd rather face a top form protoss player instead of a slumping terran player in the next round
how does that make sense? If protoss really is at such an advantage against terran, why would any terran player, especially the best TvT player in the world according to aligulac, want to face a strong protoss player over a slumping terran player?
On March 31 2019 00:42 skdsk wrote: Honestly maru vs dear was great series, but 1 thing, tempest ht vs viking ghost, is most dullest end game armies composition ever, neither player can really engage, neither can transition into anything else and we get this back and forth dance for 30mins each time.
completely disagree.
lategame TvP is the best
Terrans will never be satisfied. Maru went 3-1, complained about TvP imbalance and then explicitly stated he'd rather play Trap than TY...nonsensical.
He complained that straight TvP is imbalanced (he might have a point or not, that's his opinion which carries weight), so he had to play unconventional to have a chance, and he'd rather play Trap because he feels his TvT is not as good as TY's. He said it many times. Makes total sense.
It makes zero sense
"play unconventional to have a chance"
You mean wipe the floor with Dear, literally the current best PvT player in the world who also played immaculately, 3-1?
By the way, Maru's "unconvention" was basically the same strategies he used to sweep Neeb in WESG and HerO in GSL
Maru dominated in his last 3 TvPs, which also happened to be against beasts in Neeb, HerO and Dear, and then he says TvP is imbalanced against terran...and he wants to play Trap instead of a slumping TY lol?
TY dominated his Ro16 group of death but losing to Trap means he's in a slump now?
TY hasnt been top 4 of any premier tournament since like the last GSL over 6 months ago
for a terran horseman, it sounds like a slump to me
What about Trap then? He's in immaculate form but can't get a high tournament finish because of how underpowered protoss is?
That's what I'm saying. Trap is playing in top form, and Maru claims that Terran is at a disadvantage against protoss, but then he goes on to say that he'd rather face a top form protoss player instead of a slumping terran player in the next round
how does that make sense? If protoss really is at such an advantage against terran, why would any terran player, especially the best TvT player in the world according to aligulac, want to face a strong protoss player over a slumping terran player?
Dude Maru does not have best TvT. It's actually his worst matchup since the last big revamp. Plus he said numerous times he hates playing TvT and he is uncomfortable vs TY. On the other hand with proper preparation he can beat any protoss in the world. And did you watch the series vs Dear? All he said was true. Terran has to play weird and early/mid game pushes to stand a chance to win. If T gets in the late game even or at a disadvantage (which is always the case unless successful harass due to state of the game) it's auto-loss...