A handful of surprises were in store on day three of HomeStory Cup VIII, with Europeans Mill.BabyKnight andEmpire|Happy topping their groups to ensure foreigner representation in the quarter-finals of the tournament.
Russian Terran Happy started his day by earning a 2-1 win over former GSL champion jjakji, favoring a mech style in the mirror match-up. He then clinched his quarter-final berth with a 2-1 victory over France's ToD that even included an unusual tie-game. Though ToD had Happy against the ropes on several occasions, Happy was able to turtle up and trump ToD in the late game.
BabyKnight went perfect in his group as he progressed to the quarters, defeating teammate Dayshi and then Liquid's HerO without dropping a map. His play against HerO was particularly notable, as he showed off clinical micro to dissect his Korean opponent and take the first place spot.
The other six spots in the quarter-finals were filled by Korean players, but not all the ones that were expected. While jjakji, HerO, Leenock, Symbol, HyuN, and TaeJa—all highly successful tournament players—were able to make it through, the most successful Korean of all in SK_MC dropped out of the tournament with losses to ToD and jjakji. DreamHack Summer champion Stardust also dropped out of the tournament, unable to overcome Symbol and TitaN.
Quarter-Finals Bracket
So We Meet Again - Quarter-Finals
The HomeStory Cup VIII quarter-finals features a series of rematches, some from as near as this very tournament and some ranging as far back as two years ago in the Code S finals. Here's a brief rundown of the match-ups.
Mill.BabyKnight vs. Azubu.Symbol
This is a rematch from just couple of days ago, as BabyKnightandSymbol faced off in the Ro32 of HomeStory Cup. BabyKnight managed to take a close 2 - 1 victory in that series, though given the circumstances it might not reveal too much about what might happen in their upcoming quarter-final match.
Harstem and NightEnD expressed their vexation as they casted the Ro32 series, noticing that BabyKnight wasn't playing the cleanest games, but was still solid enough on defense to defeat what were essentially 3-base "all-in" builds from Symbol involving mass tunneling claw roaches. Symbol seemed to realize the folly of his ways in later matches, switching to a more standard style where he expertly abused mutalisk tech switches to defeat HasuObs, Stardust, and TitaN.
Just knowing that Symbol can play both standard and aggressive styles (duh!) probably doesn't help BabyKnight too much, but one thing he might look to exploit is Symbol's willingness to take risks by going 3-hatch before pool. BabyKnight already used a cannon rush to hurt Symbol in their prior series (albeit, not against a 3-hatch-before-pool build), and there may be some mind-games revolving around that factor. Frequently an aggressive player in the GSL, Symbol will probably have a special all-in prepared for at least one of the games in the bo5 series.
This could be something of a breakout tournament for BabyKnight, who has shown us a lot of great matches but has never been able to make an eye-opening, deep run. Even though Symbol is a very accomplished player, he's definitely down from where he was at his peak, making this a great opportunity for BabyKnight. As for Symbol, the stakes are the same as always: finally winning a championship after numerous second place finishes.
Liquid`HerO vs. Liquid`TaeJa
The Liquid team-kill is a tradition of esports at this point, with HerO and TaeJa having met in five tournaments in the past. They managed to avoid each other for all of HotS so far, but a sixth meeting in the higher rounds of a foreign tournament was all but inevitable. Right now the head-to-head record stands at 11-5 in HerO's favor, with HerO having taken the last seven games consecutively.
Fans will certainly be pleased with how HerO has started to embrace his inner-MC, creating hype with frequent references to the coming of winter, the season where he won three of his four major titles. But despite HerO's past success in the colder months, even his staunchest supporters would have to admit he rolled into HSC without much momentum. His results ever since winning WCS America Season 1 have been good but not great, which compares poorly to TaeJa and his torrid summer.
Summer of TaeJa 2013 wasn't as intense as 2012, but it still ended up with TaeJa taking three major titles and defeating some of the best players WCS Korea had to offer (his masterful victory over SKT's Rain was particularly impressive). TaeJa has cooled down a bit since then with poor showings in WCS America S3 and the WCS Global Finals, but he still comes in with a far better recent tournament resume than HerO.
HerO's ability to take on TaeJa in a long game has to be questioned. He struggled against both Kas and Dayshi in macro games this tournament, with his deathballs looking strangely fragile. In contrast, TaeJa seems to be very comfortable playing long, standard games, and has a great understanding of how to turtle with ghosts and drive opponents insane. HerO has managed to take out TaeJa with aggressive tactics in the past, which may end up being the key to this series.
Empire|Happy vs. Quantic_HyuN
Here's another rematch from the very same tournament! When Happyand HyuN clashed head-on in the Ro32, sparks... didn't really fly. Instead, they played one of the most bizarre games of the tournament and perhaps in all of StarCraft 2. Happy seemed to have HyuN all but beat at the end of a base trade, left with only floating buildings but a vastly superior army. However, the HyuN was able to exploit the sheer expansiveness of Frost to play hide-and-go-seek for what seemed like forever, taking a new base on the opposite side of the map every time Happy came to tear one down. The end result was Happy GG'ing out, perhaps not so much because he had lost, but out of sheer frustration instead. While some fans found this game thrilling, caster HeRoMaRinE didn't even bother to hide his boredom with the very long and repetitive match. You can watch the VOD here, but it might tire you out before you even watch the quarter-finals.
That game didn't dissuade Happy from playing for super-long games and base trades against hi other opponents at HSC, and he came out victorious against jjakji and ToD in similar scenarios. We haven't checked the stats, but we're pretty sure Happy is averaging the longest game length by far this tournament. Viewers might want to allot an extra hour or two for this rematch between HyuN and Happy.
Leenock.fOu vs. mYi.jjakji
Holy s***. It's THE rematch.
Two years ago, the GSL was known as the tournament with the best players and best games in the world, but also the tournament the with the worst, god-awful finals in the world. For all the exciting matches and top-notch play in the lower rounds, the finals would always end up being one-sided stomps, either due to mismatches in skill or mind-games.
In Code S November of 2011, jjakji and Leenockchanged all that. The two combined to play an explosive and nail-biting TvZ series the likes of which had never been seen, a series which is still a classic today (GO WATCH IT ALREADY). Two years later, we finally have the rematch.
While jjakji defeated Leenock 4 - 2 in 2011, their careers couldn't have gone in more different directions. Leenock overcame the setback of finishing second in the GSL and went on to become one of the best international tournament players ever, perhaps not winning as many trophies as players like MC or TaeJa, but arguably winning more difficult tournaments.
On the other hand, jjakji basically fell off the map after his championship. For nearly two years after, he was more of a ghost of the past than a player with any presence in the present. But the death of NS HoSeo and a move to mYi, jjakji seems to have found a belated second wind. He came out of nowhere to place top six in WCS Korea, and has quietly snuck into HSC as a darkhorse contender to take it all (you can read more about jjakji's demise and revival in this previous article).
This long-delayed rematch doesn't come with either player at the peak of his powers, but it arrives at an intriguing point in time nonetheless. Leenock has struggled in HotS, looking far less dominant than he had been in WoL. Though he was still good enough to narrowly win DreamHack: Stockholm earlier this year, he has only declined since then. jjakji's experience has been almost exactly opposite, as he failed to get an immediate boost from HotS unlike many of his Terran peers. He has only recently come alive, showing occasional glimpses of his old, championship winning self.
At this crossroad, it's hard to tell who has the upper hand. Leenock is playing the worst he has in months, but he's still a formidable opponent. jjakji is playing the best he has in months, but he's still not up his old level. If Leenock wins, he'll try to use it as an opportunity to bounce back as a champion after months of poor results. If jjakji beats Leenock again, he'll have to remember not to squander the opportunity again.
Regardless of who wins, we hope for another epic series.
The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
- The already over-saturated Korean scene got injected further with 7 Kespa teams last year, further driving up the competition and thus the need to work harder. So yeah, I think to adapt Koreans are working a lot harder on average with better infrastructure to support their competitive environment.
- The WCS-system combined with more big Koreans joining foreign teams, the absence of IPL, MLG decreasing its sc2 support, and the future of Iron Squid being up in the air has pushed/left more room for the heavy-hitters of Korea to attend IEM and DH. Two tournaments, that for the longest time were lacking in top-tier participation (aside from Taeja, HerO, and MC at their high points). Back in 2011 and 2012, even with the respective time, I'd of never expected to see something like this at a DH:
- Naniwa, Scarlett, and a couple others are really good but I don't think any of them have the same spark and creativity that Stephano did in his prime (which was mostly 2012).
On November 17 2013 13:48 FrostedMiniWheats wrote: - Naniwa, Scarlett, and a couple others are really good but I don't think any of them have the same spark and creativity that Stephano did in his prime (which was mostly 2012).
Let me preface this by saying I am in no way a Naniwa fan. Frankly I can't stand the guy.
With that said, I think Naniwa's perserverence makes up for the lack of "spark" that Stephano had.
He came fricken ONE GAME away from winning Dreamhack Stockholm, made it into the top four of the last MLG (I think that was the last one?) and second at IEM New York defying my wildest expectation. I'd say in conclusion that part of the reason we haven't seen a foriegner victory so far this year (there's still a few possibilities such as Dreamhack Winter and Red Bull Battlegrounds) is a bit due to luck. In 2011 HuK combined skill with some pretty amazing opportunities, in 2012 I'll admit that Stephano didn't need much as far as luck went, but this year? Nothing seemed to go in favor of the foriegners.
Also I'm still bummed that Stephano lost to MVP at WCS EU Season 1. That coulda changed foriegner outlook for the entire year as far as I'm concerned.
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
KeSPA arrived and WCS came into existence - but you are WRONG!
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
A foreigner won 2013 MLG Summer Invite - but that was because there were no Koreans there All joking aside, it's probably because HotS was made to be more micro intensive and the APM of high level Koreans just blow away foreigners.
On November 17 2013 13:48 FrostedMiniWheats wrote: - Naniwa, Scarlett, and a couple others are really good but I don't think any of them have the same spark and creativity that Stephano did in his prime (which was mostly 2012).
Let me preface this by saying I am in no way a Naniwa fan. Frankly I can't stand the guy.
With that said, I think Naniwa's perserverence makes up for the lack of "spark" that Stephano had.
He came fricken ONE GAME away from winning Dreamhack Stockholm, made it into the top four of the last MLG (I think that was the last one?) and second at IEM New York defying my wildest expectation. I'd say in conclusion that part of the reason we haven't seen a foriegner victory so far this year (there's still a few possibilities such as Dreamhack Winter and Red Bull Battlegrounds) is a bit due to luck. In 2011 HuK combined skill with some pretty amazing opportunities, in 2012 I'll admit that Stephano didn't need much as far as luck went, but this year? Nothing seemed to go in favor of the foriegners.
Also I'm still bummed that Stephano lost to MVP at WCS EU Season 1. That coulda changed foriegner outlook for the entire year as far as I'm concerned.
I couldn't agree with you more. The more I watch Naniwa, the more I'm impressed. I thought Naniwa was done for when he kept getting knocked out in tourneys in 2012 ,but somehow he keeps climbing back;fighting off the top koreans on his way. Sure, Huk, Idra and Stephano had their moments, but Naniwa's consistent results puts him above all foreigners imo.
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
I really don't think it's any sort of hard work that makes a player better than another. If a player is good then he's good, if he's bad then he's bad. Simple as that. Koreans are just better than foreigners at sc2. That's all there is to it. There are those exceptions of course. Look at stephano. He only practiced a total of like one hour a day and he still destroyed koreans. Stephano is just food, while his foreigner friends just aren't as good. It has nothing at all to do with practice, just look at stephano.
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
you can't go for an imbalance composition in 2mu as Z.
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
I really don't think it's any sort of hard work that makes a player better than another. If a player is good then he's good, if he's bad then he's bad. Simple as that. Koreans are just better than foreigners at sc2. That's all there is to it. There are those exceptions of course. Look at stephano. He only practiced a total of like one hour a day and he still destroyed koreans. Stephano is just food, while his foreigner friends just aren't as good. It has nothing at all to do with practice, just look at stephano.
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
you can't go for an imbalance composition in 2mu as Z.
Didn't amount to much of anything as far as first places go for foreigners. Post-BL/Infestor 2012 only Nerchio, Stephano, and Snute won events over Korean competition in Premiere/Major events from what I see. Stephano is the best foreigner of all-time in sc2, and the other two remained top-tier foreigners into HotS.
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
I really don't think it's any sort of hard work that makes a player better than another. If a player is good then he's good, if he's bad then he's bad. Simple as that. Koreans are just better than foreigners at sc2. That's all there is to it. There are those exceptions of course. Look at stephano. He only practiced a total of like one hour a day and he still destroyed koreans. Stephano is just food, while his foreigner friends just aren't as good. It has nothing at all to do with practice, just look at stephano.
Yeah there is no way practicing actually makes the players better.
At least there isn't any mirror match-ups yet. Gonna be some sick games coming up, been up all night from overuse of coffee yesterday but hopefully the rush keeps me going for a few more hours. Once it starts I'll probably end up falling asleep and being pissed about it later on. lol
BabyKnight sounded so confident on stream last night, he might actually have the fortitude to withstand the onslaught of the Koreans and go to the finals.
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
stephano retired
Stephano wasn't the only successful foreigner of 2012.
Today should be awesome and I think Taeja will win. This HSC has been the best since a long time imo.
Also I think it's worth mentioning that 3 koreans in the ro8 were only 1 map away from bein eliminated. There were some really close series and I think the foreigners put up a great fight. 6/8 koreans looks one sided, but I don't think it was. I'm actually quite optimistic that we will have great foreign results in the future when I look at guys like HeroMarine, Dayshi, Titan and of course Babyknight and Happy.
On November 17 2013 13:48 FrostedMiniWheats wrote: - Naniwa, Scarlett, and a couple others are really good but I don't think any of them have the same spark and creativity that Stephano did in his prime (which was mostly 2012).
Let me preface this by saying I am in no way a Naniwa fan. Frankly I can't stand the guy.
With that said, I think Naniwa's perserverence makes up for the lack of "spark" that Stephano had.
He came fricken ONE GAME away from winning Dreamhack Stockholm, made it into the top four of the last MLG (I think that was the last one?) and second at IEM New York defying my wildest expectation. I'd say in conclusion that part of the reason we haven't seen a foriegner victory so far this year (there's still a few possibilities such as Dreamhack Winter and Red Bull Battlegrounds) is a bit due to luck. In 2011 HuK combined skill with some pretty amazing opportunities, in 2012 I'll admit that Stephano didn't need much as far as luck went, but this year? Nothing seemed to go in favor of the foriegners.
Also I'm still bummed that Stephano lost to MVP at WCS EU Season 1. That coulda changed foriegner outlook for the entire year as far as I'm concerned.
I couldn't agree with you more. The more I watch Naniwa, the more I'm impressed. I thought Naniwa was done for when he kept getting knocked out in tourneys in 2012 ,but somehow he keeps climbing back;fighting off the top koreans on his way. Sure, Huk, Idra and Stephano had their moments, but Naniwa's consistent results puts him above all foreigners imo.
All opinion based of course, but I believe Stephano was considerably more consistent then Naniwa. For about a year Stephano was the undesputed foreign bonjwa. When Naniwa enters people always wonder which Naniwa will be attending, the best foreigner in the world, or the one who gets cheesed and tilts hard.
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
More Koreans are going places. That's just the truth. Foreigners that won tournaments in 2012 generally did that at the least Korean saturated tournaments of the year. In 2011, even fewer Koreans were at events.
Not to mention that "fair amount" really does not mean very many. I think 2 Dreamhacks were the flagship wins for foreigners in 2012, which had about 10 Koreans between them.
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
stephano retired
Stephano wasn't the only successful foreigner of 2012.
Kespa guys then? Well, not them necessarily, but the fact that several Koreans chose to switch regions for WCS as a result.
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
Foreigners in general practice much less than Koreans on average. Ofc there will be anomalies like Genius being incredibly lazy.
To be fair to the foreign scene they are getting much better mechanically than before. Also there are more Koreans and less tournaments with less or no Koreans. to be really frank, HSC and IEMs used to have one of the weakest Korean lineups. you saw players like Shuttle getting a championship at IEM. If the top dog Koreans were allowed to come over at this pace, foreigners wouldn't have won any tournaments in 2011-2012.
Honestly, considering how foreigners haven't had a particularly good tournament, I'm still pretty happy at these brackets. A lot of old Korean favorites getting a second wind
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
I really don't think it's any sort of hard work that makes a player better than another. If a player is good then he's good, if he's bad then he's bad. Simple as that. Koreans are just better than foreigners at sc2. That's all there is to it. There are those exceptions of course. Look at stephano. He only practiced a total of like one hour a day and he still destroyed koreans. Stephano is just food, while his foreigner friends just aren't as good. It has nothing at all to do with practice, just look at stephano.
Please elaborate. I'm pretty sure practice and work ethic is almost entirely what makes Koreans have a significant step up over foreigners. Koreans aren't just born "better".
Sure Stephano is a unique exception, sometimes natural given talent and game sense can get rid of need to practice, that doesn't support your statement at all though because then you have to weigh in the fact that the overwhelming majority of Koreans pros are overall better than foreigners. I find it ridiculous to believe (no offence) that all of them are just "better".
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
I really don't think it's any sort of hard work that makes a player better than another. If a player is good then he's good, if he's bad then he's bad. Simple as that. Koreans are just better than foreigners at sc2. That's all there is to it. There are those exceptions of course. Look at stephano. He only practiced a total of like one hour a day and he still destroyed koreans. Stephano is just food, while his foreigner friends just aren't as good. It has nothing at all to do with practice, just look at stephano.
Please elaborate. I'm pretty sure practice and work ethic is almost entirely what makes Koreans have a significant step up over foreigners. Koreans aren't just born "better".
Sure Stephano is a unique exception, sometimes natural given talent and game sense can get rid of need to practice, that doesn't support your statement at all though because then you have to weigh in the fact that the overwhelming majority of Koreans pros are overall better than foreigners. I find it ridiculous to believe (no offence) that all of them are just "better".
Explain why Asians are naturally smarter than other people. My high school had a total of like 7 Asian kids and they took the top 7 rankings. I never saw them study at all. Any time I was out I would see them and they would even skip class. Asian people in general are just better than us at everything. Look at China, Japan, Korea. All are naturally smart, which is why they succeed so much. The same applies to Starcraft. Asians are just smarter and more talented than us.
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
I really don't think it's any sort of hard work that makes a player better than another. If a player is good then he's good, if he's bad then he's bad. Simple as that. Koreans are just better than foreigners at sc2. That's all there is to it. There are those exceptions of course. Look at stephano. He only practiced a total of like one hour a day and he still destroyed koreans. Stephano is just food, while his foreigner friends just aren't as good. It has nothing at all to do with practice, just look at stephano.
Please elaborate. I'm pretty sure practice and work ethic is almost entirely what makes Koreans have a significant step up over foreigners. Koreans aren't just born "better".
Sure Stephano is a unique exception, sometimes natural given talent and game sense can get rid of need to practice, that doesn't support your statement at all though because then you have to weigh in the fact that the overwhelming majority of Koreans pros are overall better than foreigners. I find it ridiculous to believe (no offence) that all of them are just "better".
Explain why Asians are naturally smarter than other people. My high school had a total of like 7 Asian kids and they took the top 7 rankings. I never saw them study at all. Any time I was out I would see them and they would even skip class. Asian people in general are just better than us at everything. Look at China, Japan, Korea. All are naturally smart, which is why they succeed so much. The same applies to Starcraft. Asians are just smarter and more talented than us.
There are many small factors that can make the difference. Also "several friends" is in no way representative. I had 1 asian freidn in class high school and he was at best good, probably just above average. There is no biological superiority in asians, or any other group.
EDIT: Also what do you mean by "the success so much"? What is so impressive about these three countries that Germany, Finland, UK, Brazil, Israel or Canada should feel bad about? (Well technically Israel is in Asia but from the context I assume you mean very far east Asia like CHina, Korea, Japan, not Iran, arabic countries or India).
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
Koreans play to live, those outside of Asia play for fun.
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
I really don't think it's any sort of hard work that makes a player better than another. If a player is good then he's good, if he's bad then he's bad. Simple as that. Koreans are just better than foreigners at sc2. That's all there is to it. There are those exceptions of course. Look at stephano. He only practiced a total of like one hour a day and he still destroyed koreans. Stephano is just food, while his foreigner friends just aren't as good. It has nothing at all to do with practice, just look at stephano.
Please elaborate. I'm pretty sure practice and work ethic is almost entirely what makes Koreans have a significant step up over foreigners. Koreans aren't just born "better".
Sure Stephano is a unique exception, sometimes natural given talent and game sense can get rid of need to practice, that doesn't support your statement at all though because then you have to weigh in the fact that the overwhelming majority of Koreans pros are overall better than foreigners. I find it ridiculous to believe (no offence) that all of them are just "better".
Explain why Asians are naturally smarter than other people. My high school had a total of like 7 Asian kids and they took the top 7 rankings. I never saw them study at all. Any time I was out I would see them and they would even skip class. Asian people in general are just better than us at everything. Look at China, Japan, Korea. All are naturally smart, which is why they succeed so much. The same applies to Starcraft. Asians are just smarter and more talented than us.
I completely disagree with u. There are smart ppl that don't study that much/ at all and are best at school. And they don't have to be asian. Also ur statement sounds pretty much like an excuse not to try ur very best to succeed, cuz asians are better anyways. And thats a pretty bad attitude to have. Asians seem to be work just harder in general. There are talented smart non-Asians just like ur mentioned Asians. And if a talented Asian also works hard he will be even better. Non-Asians just have to work as hard. Not make any excuses.... And thats what happens in sc2. I doubt that foreigners work as hard as Koreans do. Ofc there are exceptions. But thats why so few foreigners can take on Koreans.
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
I really don't think it's any sort of hard work that makes a player better than another. If a player is good then he's good, if he's bad then he's bad. Simple as that. Koreans are just better than foreigners at sc2. That's all there is to it. There are those exceptions of course. Look at stephano. He only practiced a total of like one hour a day and he still destroyed koreans. Stephano is just food, while his foreigner friends just aren't as good. It has nothing at all to do with practice, just look at stephano.
Please elaborate. I'm pretty sure practice and work ethic is almost entirely what makes Koreans have a significant step up over foreigners. Koreans aren't just born "better".
Sure Stephano is a unique exception, sometimes natural given talent and game sense can get rid of need to practice, that doesn't support your statement at all though because then you have to weigh in the fact that the overwhelming majority of Koreans pros are overall better than foreigners. I find it ridiculous to believe (no offence) that all of them are just "better".
Explain why Asians are naturally smarter than other people. My high school had a total of like 7 Asian kids and they took the top 7 rankings. I never saw them study at all. Any time I was out I would see them and they would even skip class. Asian people in general are just better than us at everything. Look at China, Japan, Korea. All are naturally smart, which is why they succeed so much. The same applies to Starcraft. Asians are just smarter and more talented than us.
I completely disagree with u. There are smart ppl that don't study that much/ at all and are best at school. And they don't have to be asian. Also ur statement sounds pretty much like an excuse not to try ur very best to succeed, cuz asians are better anyways. And thats a pretty bad attitude to have. Asians seem to be work just harder in general. There are talented smart non-Asians just like ur mentioned Asians. And if a talented Asian also works hard he will be even better. Non-Asians just have to work as hard. Not make any excuses.... And thats what happens in sc2. I doubt that foreigners work as hard as Koreans do. Ofc there are exceptions. But thats why so few foreigners can take on Koreans.
I think that the main difference is that for most korean progamers, playing SC is kind of career path while for most foreigners it's something they do while studying or before they go study or generally as a fill in between moving on.
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
I really don't think it's any sort of hard work that makes a player better than another. If a player is good then he's good, if he's bad then he's bad. Simple as that. Koreans are just better than foreigners at sc2. That's all there is to it. There are those exceptions of course. Look at stephano. He only practiced a total of like one hour a day and he still destroyed koreans. Stephano is just food, while his foreigner friends just aren't as good. It has nothing at all to do with practice, just look at stephano.
Please elaborate. I'm pretty sure practice and work ethic is almost entirely what makes Koreans have a significant step up over foreigners. Koreans aren't just born "better".
Sure Stephano is a unique exception, sometimes natural given talent and game sense can get rid of need to practice, that doesn't support your statement at all though because then you have to weigh in the fact that the overwhelming majority of Koreans pros are overall better than foreigners. I find it ridiculous to believe (no offence) that all of them are just "better".
Explain why Asians are naturally smarter than other people. My high school had a total of like 7 Asian kids and they took the top 7 rankings. I never saw them study at all. Any time I was out I would see them and they would even skip class. Asian people in general are just better than us at everything. Look at China, Japan, Korea. All are naturally smart, which is why they succeed so much. The same applies to Starcraft. Asians are just smarter and more talented than us.
So much "positive" racism, it must suck for a normal asian to live up to stereotypes like these.
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
I really don't think it's any sort of hard work that makes a player better than another. If a player is good then he's good, if he's bad then he's bad. Simple as that. Koreans are just better than foreigners at sc2. That's all there is to it. There are those exceptions of course. Look at stephano. He only practiced a total of like one hour a day and he still destroyed koreans. Stephano is just food, while his foreigner friends just aren't as good. It has nothing at all to do with practice, just look at stephano.
Please elaborate. I'm pretty sure practice and work ethic is almost entirely what makes Koreans have a significant step up over foreigners. Koreans aren't just born "better".
Sure Stephano is a unique exception, sometimes natural given talent and game sense can get rid of need to practice, that doesn't support your statement at all though because then you have to weigh in the fact that the overwhelming majority of Koreans pros are overall better than foreigners. I find it ridiculous to believe (no offence) that all of them are just "better".
Explain why Asians are naturally smarter than other people. My high school had a total of like 7 Asian kids and they took the top 7 rankings. I never saw them study at all. Any time I was out I would see them and they would even skip class. Asian people in general are just better than us at everything. Look at China, Japan, Korea. All are naturally smart, which is why they succeed so much. The same applies to Starcraft. Asians are just smarter and more talented than us.
So much "positive" racism, it must suck for a normal asian to live up to stereotypes like these.
It is too stressful, but walking the road is the only way we can survive. We must change because the world won't. It is pretty much the same for everyone around the world, we are harder-working/smarter because we must. If we aren't we will starve or at the least never have a family.
White people just don't know how good they get it. lol
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
I really don't think it's any sort of hard work that makes a player better than another. If a player is good then he's good, if he's bad then he's bad. Simple as that. Koreans are just better than foreigners at sc2. That's all there is to it. There are those exceptions of course. Look at stephano. He only practiced a total of like one hour a day and he still destroyed koreans. Stephano is just food, while his foreigner friends just aren't as good. It has nothing at all to do with practice, just look at stephano.
Please elaborate. I'm pretty sure practice and work ethic is almost entirely what makes Koreans have a significant step up over foreigners. Koreans aren't just born "better".
Sure Stephano is a unique exception, sometimes natural given talent and game sense can get rid of need to practice, that doesn't support your statement at all though because then you have to weigh in the fact that the overwhelming majority of Koreans pros are overall better than foreigners. I find it ridiculous to believe (no offence) that all of them are just "better".
Explain why Asians are naturally smarter than other people. My high school had a total of like 7 Asian kids and they took the top 7 rankings. I never saw them study at all. Any time I was out I would see them and they would even skip class. Asian people in general are just better than us at everything. Look at China, Japan, Korea. All are naturally smart, which is why they succeed so much. The same applies to Starcraft. Asians are just smarter and more talented than us.
Here's a better one. Explain why Koreans own not just EU and NA, but other Asian countries as well? Nobody is in the same tier as Korea, the rest of the world is about 2-3 tiers below them on average. Code A and B Koreans can win tournaments with the most stacked of foreign competition.
Furthermore, even if you exclude Korea many would probably argue that Sweden is the best foreign country at sc2 and EU by far the best region. This is even with China being on the rise in 2013. If Asians are innately better at the game, why is this? Why are most of the top foreigners usually from EU?
Because it has little to nothing to do with nature and more to do with culture (environment).
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
I really don't think it's any sort of hard work that makes a player better than another. If a player is good then he's good, if he's bad then he's bad. Simple as that. Koreans are just better than foreigners at sc2. That's all there is to it. There are those exceptions of course. Look at stephano. He only practiced a total of like one hour a day and he still destroyed koreans. Stephano is just food, while his foreigner friends just aren't as good. It has nothing at all to do with practice, just look at stephano.
Please elaborate. I'm pretty sure practice and work ethic is almost entirely what makes Koreans have a significant step up over foreigners. Koreans aren't just born "better".
Sure Stephano is a unique exception, sometimes natural given talent and game sense can get rid of need to practice, that doesn't support your statement at all though because then you have to weigh in the fact that the overwhelming majority of Koreans pros are overall better than foreigners. I find it ridiculous to believe (no offence) that all of them are just "better".
Explain why Asians are naturally smarter than other people. My high school had a total of like 7 Asian kids and they took the top 7 rankings. I never saw them study at all. Any time I was out I would see them and they would even skip class. Asian people in general are just better than us at everything. Look at China, Japan, Korea. All are naturally smart, which is why they succeed so much. The same applies to Starcraft. Asians are just smarter and more talented than us.
Here's a better one. Explain why Koreans own not just EU and NA, but other Asian countries as well? Nobody is in the same tier as Korea, the rest of the world is about 2-3 tiers below them on average. Code A and B Koreans can win tournaments with the most stacked of foreign competition.
Furthermore, even if you exclude Korea many would probably argue that Sweden is the best foreign country at sc2 and EU by far the best region. This is even with China being on the rise in 2013. If Asians are innately better at the game, why is this? Why are most of the top foreigners usually from EU?
Because it has little to nothing to do with nature and more to do with culture (environment).
Well the only logical conclusion here is that Koreans are smart-ass superhumans and we should crawl at their feet. Oh, wait...
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
I really don't think it's any sort of hard work that makes a player better than another. If a player is good then he's good, if he's bad then he's bad. Simple as that. Koreans are just better than foreigners at sc2. That's all there is to it. There are those exceptions of course. Look at stephano. He only practiced a total of like one hour a day and he still destroyed koreans. Stephano is just food, while his foreigner friends just aren't as good. It has nothing at all to do with practice, just look at stephano.
Please elaborate. I'm pretty sure practice and work ethic is almost entirely what makes Koreans have a significant step up over foreigners. Koreans aren't just born "better".
Sure Stephano is a unique exception, sometimes natural given talent and game sense can get rid of need to practice, that doesn't support your statement at all though because then you have to weigh in the fact that the overwhelming majority of Koreans pros are overall better than foreigners. I find it ridiculous to believe (no offence) that all of them are just "better".
Explain why Asians are naturally smarter than other people. My high school had a total of like 7 Asian kids and they took the top 7 rankings. I never saw them study at all. Any time I was out I would see them and they would even skip class. Asian people in general are just better than us at everything. Look at China, Japan, Korea. All are naturally smart, which is why they succeed so much. The same applies to Starcraft. Asians are just smarter and more talented than us.
Here's a better one. Explain why Koreans own not just EU and NA, but other Asian countries as well? Nobody is in the same tier as Korea, the rest of the world is about 2-3 tiers below them on average. Code A and B Koreans can win tournaments with the most stacked of foreign competition.
Furthermore, even if you exclude Korea many would probably argue that Sweden is the best foreign country at sc2 and EU by far the best region. This is even with China being on the rise in 2013. If Asians are innately better at the game, why is this? Why are most of the top foreigners usually from EU?
Because it has little to nothing to do with nature and more to do with culture (environment).
*Hopefully* he's being sarcastic.
It has everything to do with culture and environment, and nothing to do with Asian genetics. The idiot with the baseless story about 7 Asians skipping class and getting the best grades is either delusional or trolling.
Korea is dominating because the culture readily supports full-time SC2 gaming. End of story.
On November 18 2013 11:35 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:
On November 18 2013 05:53 ladysman09 wrote:
On November 18 2013 04:36 Incubus1993 wrote:
On November 17 2013 18:13 ladysman09 wrote:
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
I really don't think it's any sort of hard work that makes a player better than another. If a player is good then he's good, if he's bad then he's bad. Simple as that. Koreans are just better than foreigners at sc2. That's all there is to it. There are those exceptions of course. Look at stephano. He only practiced a total of like one hour a day and he still destroyed koreans. Stephano is just food, while his foreigner friends just aren't as good. It has nothing at all to do with practice, just look at stephano.
Please elaborate. I'm pretty sure practice and work ethic is almost entirely what makes Koreans have a significant step up over foreigners. Koreans aren't just born "better".
Sure Stephano is a unique exception, sometimes natural given talent and game sense can get rid of need to practice, that doesn't support your statement at all though because then you have to weigh in the fact that the overwhelming majority of Koreans pros are overall better than foreigners. I find it ridiculous to believe (no offence) that all of them are just "better".
Explain why Asians are naturally smarter than other people. My high school had a total of like 7 Asian kids and they took the top 7 rankings. I never saw them study at all. Any time I was out I would see them and they would even skip class. Asian people in general are just better than us at everything. Look at China, Japan, Korea. All are naturally smart, which is why they succeed so much. The same applies to Starcraft. Asians are just smarter and more talented than us.
Here's a better one. Explain why Koreans own not just EU and NA, but other Asian countries as well? Nobody is in the same tier as Korea, the rest of the world is about 2-3 tiers below them on average. Code A and B Koreans can win tournaments with the most stacked of foreign competition.
Furthermore, even if you exclude Korea many would probably argue that Sweden is the best foreign country at sc2 and EU by far the best region. This is even with China being on the rise in 2013. If Asians are innately better at the game, why is this? Why are most of the top foreigners usually from EU?
Because it has little to nothing to do with nature and more to do with culture (environment).
*Hopefully* he's being sarcastic.
It has everything to do with culture and environment, and nothing to do with Asian genetics. The idiot with the baseless story about 7 Asians skipping class and getting the best grades is either delusional or trolling.
Korea is dominating because the culture readily supports full-time SC2 gaming. End of story.
He's not. He's been trolling ever since the WCS global finals LR thread, maybe even before. I'm surprised so many people took the bait on this thread.
It's utterly ridiculous to think that Asians are naturally smarter. However, in many Asian cultures, there's tendency toward working/practicing/studying hard, and that's generally why the Asians-are-naturally-smart stereotype exists. Even though it's a positive stereotype, it's still offensive because it undermines the hard work that a lot of Asians put into whatever they're trying to accomplish, when they're just written off as "naturally gifted".
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
I really don't think it's any sort of hard work that makes a player better than another. If a player is good then he's good, if he's bad then he's bad. Simple as that. Koreans are just better than foreigners at sc2. That's all there is to it. There are those exceptions of course. Look at stephano. He only practiced a total of like one hour a day and he still destroyed koreans. Stephano is just food, while his foreigner friends just aren't as good. It has nothing at all to do with practice, just look at stephano.
Please elaborate. I'm pretty sure practice and work ethic is almost entirely what makes Koreans have a significant step up over foreigners. Koreans aren't just born "better".
Sure Stephano is a unique exception, sometimes natural given talent and game sense can get rid of need to practice, that doesn't support your statement at all though because then you have to weigh in the fact that the overwhelming majority of Koreans pros are overall better than foreigners. I find it ridiculous to believe (no offence) that all of them are just "better".
Explain why Asians are naturally smarter than other people. My high school had a total of like 7 Asian kids and they took the top 7 rankings. I never saw them study at all. Any time I was out I would see them and they would even skip class. Asian people in general are just better than us at everything. Look at China, Japan, Korea. All are naturally smart, which is why they succeed so much. The same applies to Starcraft. Asians are just smarter and more talented than us.
As an Asian I really resent comments like this. Also you could be more specific with your positive racism. Instead of saying Asians you could say northeast Asians because Asia is a lot bigger than the 3 countries that you mentioned
On November 17 2013 13:09 Incubus1993 wrote: The work ethic of foreigners must be absolutely awful, or Koreans just work that much harder. There hasn't been a single 1st place finish for a foreigner in 2013. There was a fair amount in 2011 and 2012, what happened?
I really don't think it's any sort of hard work that makes a player better than another. If a player is good then he's good, if he's bad then he's bad. Simple as that. Koreans are just better than foreigners at sc2. That's all there is to it. There are those exceptions of course. Look at stephano. He only practiced a total of like one hour a day and he still destroyed koreans. Stephano is just food, while his foreigner friends just aren't as good. It has nothing at all to do with practice, just look at stephano.
Please elaborate. I'm pretty sure practice and work ethic is almost entirely what makes Koreans have a significant step up over foreigners. Koreans aren't just born "better".
Sure Stephano is a unique exception, sometimes natural given talent and game sense can get rid of need to practice, that doesn't support your statement at all though because then you have to weigh in the fact that the overwhelming majority of Koreans pros are overall better than foreigners. I find it ridiculous to believe (no offence) that all of them are just "better".
Explain why Asians are naturally smarter than other people. My high school had a total of like 7 Asian kids and they took the top 7 rankings. I never saw them study at all. Any time I was out I would see them and they would even skip class. Asian people in general are just better than us at everything. Look at China, Japan, Korea. All are naturally smart, which is why they succeed so much. The same applies to Starcraft. Asians are just smarter and more talented than us.
you use a sample size of 7 people and then apply it to a whole race, wow.