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Marvel is getting bolder and bolder and the stories are getting grander and grander as new characters, groups, and alliances are introduced, and the Marvel Universe as adopted in the films are getting bigger and more complex. We are on the tail end of Phase 1 and we are kickstarting Phase 2 with the Marvel mega superfranchise. I dedicate this thread to have a discussion on this grand Marvel Universe, between comic geeks and film buffs and just about everyone enjoying the whole lot to discuss details regarding Marvel to connect all the films together: possible plots, villains, wishlists, arcs, etc. as these cannot be discussed in the individual threads about the films. Spoilers might be discussed, so be warned.
Here are the films so far (released and planned, excluding X-Men and [un]Fantastic universes):
1. Spider-Man (2002) 2. Hulk (2003) 3. Spider-Man 2 (2004) 4. Spider-Man 3 (2007)
Phase 1
5. Iron Man (2008) 6. The Incredible Hulk (2008) 7. Iron Man 2 (2010) 8. Thor (2011) 9. Captain America: The First Avenger (2011) 10. The Avengers (2012) 11. The Amazing Spider-Man (2012)
Phase 2
12. Iron Man 3 (2013) 13. Thor: The Dark World (2013) 14. Captain America: The Winter Soldier (2014) 15. The Amazing Spider-Man 2 (2014) 16. Guardians of the Galaxy (2014) 17. The Avengers 2 (2015)
Phase 3
18. Ant-Man (2015) 19. Captain America (???) 20. Thor 3 (???) 21. Avengers 3 (???)
(No News yet on Thor 3, CA 3, and Avengers 3)
Ok, let us not discuss what is out already since it's done and everyone knows about them. I would like to start the discussion by continuing from the films and see where Marvel will logically take this whole thing.
Let us start with the easy one, Iron Man 3. Pepper Potts or Happy Hogan dies. And Pepper might be pregnant. This will set up Iron Man's darker and more renegade personality in the next few Avengers. Also, a few originals from the Avengers might show up here to get a bit of introduction (and because Hawkeye and Renner was seriously dull, lol usb arrow!), maybe Antman and Wasp. Moreover, since Thor 2 is also underway, expect something Strange (wink wink) after the credits.
Thor 2: The Dark World is up next, and they will probably use it for the following: 1) expand on the beyond-Earth realm of Marvel; 2) legitimize Thor as god/king of Asgard (kill Odin? sad, but necessary) 3) redeem Loki. About Loki, I really think, fantastic as he is, is a bit underworked. He is a clever cunning deceptive devil in the comics, while in the films he just appears to be a diva. Although Marvel seems to be setting him up until the last Avengers. Also, official involvement of Dr. Strange in the entire arc.
CA: Winter soldier is a bit tricky. It is difficult to really pull this one off since CA is practically from another time. Though they will use this to build CA as the leader (to anyone who still doubts this, thinking it should be Iron Man or Thor or Hulk or whoever, read Thor Vol. 1 Iss. 390 [NOTE: he was able to wield Mjolnir (the only other one except Thor, along with Red Norvell, Beta Ray Bill), that's how awesome he is]). Also this is a good chance to develop some of the more "manual" characters - Black Widow, Falcon, ad Hawkeye (though we can use less of him really).
Now we go to the meaty parts. First: Guardians of the Galaxy. One would think that the Avengers-based Marvel is crowded enough as it is, but this is actually a good addition - as an introduction for Thanos, who is bound to be the main villain in Avengers 2. Include everyone, Star-Lord, Rocket Raccoon, Bug, Groot, Drax, Cosmo, Major Victory, everyone. And Thanos kills them ALL! This will set up what formidable epic movie Avengers 2 will be. Postcredit: Avengers, everywhere, shocked, lost, hopeless, meanwhile out there in the universe, Thanos courting the lovely Death, as is his only desire.
Second: The Big One. Avengers 2. After Thanos kills all of the Guardians, the Avengers have to summon everything they have. Can't really say enough about this except Thanos vs. The Avengers will be THE BEST EVER BATTLE IN THE HISTORY OF FILM*. Of course Thanos is defeated, but does not die. Enter... ULTRON. Oh my god!
Third: The Monster in the room. It is easy enough to forget about a solo Hulk after the disaster that was Ang Lee neon green Hulk and the "ok" Edward Norton film. But Hulk is too big too ignore (lol pun). Rumors have it that Avengers 3 is geared to include the return of the Hulk. Why return? Because he will be banished!!! The real problem with Hulk is that he really is too powerful on Earth. Therefore: Planet Hulk!!! Fucking bloody yes! Probably in Avengers 2, where Hulk smashes and gets more out of control than usual, postcredit he is sent outer space where he meets monsters equal to him. Also, revenge motives for the green monster.
Fourth: Thor dies. But don't be sad. He is a god. So he lives again, stronger (like Gandalf). Key stuff here would be Loki, Dark Energy, and Skrulls (to set up Ultron in A3).
Fifth, the big one, Avengers 3. Thor and Loki reunite. The Avengers are complete. OFFICIALLY THE BIGGEST BATTLE EVER AND THE BEST MOVIE IN THE HISTORY OF EVER!!!
* until Avengers 3
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Good stuff.
1. Spidey won't be out of Sony until after 2016. So Avengers 2 and 3 will have to do without him unless they do it later than that. Or you know what they say about money talking. I'm sure with the amount of money this is going to make, they will work something out.
2. I feel bad that Wasp and Ant-Man are not getting more attention. They are one of the founders of The Avengers, Ant-Man especially. But the film is getting a good shake, with Edgar Wright (Scott Pilgrim) directing.
3. Meanwhile, JLA is stuck in limbo. (http://badassdigest.com/2013/02/07/justice-league-may-be-looking-for-new-writers/). Imagine the envy there in DC.
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Personally, I think they should keep the superheroes disconnected. It basically diminishes the plots of any individual heroes movie/comic/story. I would really like to see different ways of doing superhero movies. We have all seen the great CGI and fancy stuff they've done with Marvel characters. I want to see a movie where they are much less like a generic super hero and more like actual people. Something darker. Sort of like batman, except him not wear a silly outfit.
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As an avid comic reader I always have troubles with watching the marvel films as they don't follow the comic canon, as I always think "yeah, that's not how it's supposed to be you stupid writers". I kinda have to mentally prepare before I watch one of those with "it's an alternative universe", but even then it's still hard.
Though I must say I was pleasantly surprised when I saw the destroyer in Thor, as it was kinda close to comic version.
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Ant-Man but not the Wasp? Interesting. And I thought they'd want a useful female to join the Avengers asap...
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On February 08 2013 16:15 Blargh wrote: Personally, I think they should keep the superheroes disconnected. It basically diminishes the plots of any individual heroes movie/comic/story. I would really like to see different ways of doing superhero movies. We have all seen the great CGI and fancy stuff they've done with Marvel characters. I want to see a movie where they are much less like a generic super hero and more like actual people. Something darker. Sort of like batman, except him not wear a silly outfit. Personally I don't think superhero films should be dark or grundgy at all, like the Batman "Nolanverse". And I really can't stop myself saying this, The Nolan trilogy sucked. Seriously. TDK was great only because of Heath Ledger. Remove him and that movie would be atrocious. Nolan is getting too much credit.
Going back. Of course you know that these characters are bound to be together one point or the other. The question is how does the director and the writers and producers strike the balance that they don't overlap and that even when one is naturally stronger, there is a part to play for everyone. Avengers succeeded in that.
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Heck yeah Ant Man! Definitely one of my favorite Marvel characters. Hope they do more on him for Avengers 3
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On February 08 2013 16:27 On_Slaught wrote: Ant-Man but not the Wasp? Interesting. And I thought they'd want a useful female to join the Avengers asap... women heroes + film = lose money
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+ Show Spoiler + The Illumanti are gonna send hulk off planet in Avengers 2. This will set up a Planet Hulk movie. When the hulk returns after hulk movie, this will set up the world war hulk scenario for the Avengers 3. Edit for Source:
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On February 08 2013 16:28 Gesamtkunstwerk wrote: Personally I don't think superhero films should be dark or grundgy at all, like the Batman "Nolanverse". And I really can't stop myself saying this, The Nolan trilogy sucked. Seriously. TDK was great only because of Heath Ledger. Remove him and that movie would be atrocious. Nolan is getting too much credit.
Waaa. Nolan is an amazing director! Memento, Insomnia, The Prestige, Inception (was just okay). I thought what he did with batman was about the best he could have done, but I'm really not much of a classic comic fan, so many may think he was not true to the comics. What is atrocious is all of these half-assed, plotless conglomeration. Not only are they no longer true to the comic, but they are also just silly.
Oh well, I suppose we'll disagree on this matter. Carry on the discussion!
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51318 Posts
Guardians of the Galaxy? Can honestly say i have not heard of that before. Isn't that just Avengers but without the super heroes we know? So confusing ;_;
I just want to see the new Amazing Spiderman, the first one was great, a real freshness and great movie. Reminded me exactly of the original Spiderman when i watched it, just great to see it on the big screen and with amazing effects. Im pretty standard like that xD
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On February 08 2013 18:12 Pandemona wrote: Guardians of the Galaxy? Can honestly say i have not heard of that before. Isn't that just Avengers but without the super heroes we know? So confusing ;_;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guardians_of_the_Galaxy_(2008_team)
The film seems to be using parts of the newest lineup. It's obviously not as well known or iconic as the Avengers, but I believe that's one of the smarter moves about it as there won't be as many getting annoyed with the movie plot ignoring or conflicting with established comics canon.
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I love your take on this and I hope the plot of the entire superfranchise follows this route. Having said that, Planet Hulk will really redeem Hulk. Though it would be such a waste of a good actor ni Mark Ruffalo to have him growling and huffing and puffing all the time. One of the charms of The Avengers is the exchange between Tony Stark and Bruce Banner.
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On February 08 2013 15:51 Gesamtkunstwerk wrote: Good stuff.
1. Spidey won't be out of Sony until after 2016. So Avengers 2 and 3 will have to do without him unless they do it later than that. Or you know what they say about money talking. I'm sure with the amount of money this is going to make, they will work something out.
2. I feel bad that Wasp and Ant-Man are not getting more attention. They are one of the founders of The Avengers, Ant-Man especially. But the film is getting a good shake, with Edgar Wright (Scott Pilgrim) directing.
3. Meanwhile, JLA is stuck in limbo. (http://badassdigest.com/2013/02/07/justice-league-may-be-looking-for-new-writers/). Imagine the envy there in DC.
1. Sony will not give up Spider-Man because it is their baby that makes a ton of money worldwide since it's one of the most iconic characters. The only time the movie rights reverts back to Marvel Films is if the studio has no plans to make another movie. I would love to see Spider-Man hook up with the Avengers and having him and the universe in the MCU, but at the same time, I'm fine with him not.
2. That will change upon release of the Ant-Man solo movie. It is the same as Thor and Captain America. The casual movie goer probably didn't give a shit about the two until the success of the Avengers. I remember an article stating that Thor and Captain America Netflix rentals raised during the success of Avengers since it got people curious. Now that we are in Phase 2 of the MCU, you can be assure that Thor and Captain America have become more popular because of the Avengers' success.
3. Warner Brothers stated that they are relying heavily on the Man of Steel's success. The initial plan was to create a JLA movie and then have the characters split into their solo movies.
On February 08 2013 18:12 Pandemona wrote: Guardians of the Galaxy? Can honestly say i have not heard of that before. Isn't that just Avengers but without the super heroes we know? So confusing ;_;
I just want to see the new Amazing Spiderman, the first one was great, a real freshness and great movie. Reminded me exactly of the original Spiderman when i watched it, just great to see it on the big screen and with amazing effects. Im pretty standard like that xD
It's the space version of the Avengers. The members have ties to Thanos, which makes sense to why they are getting their own movie and the possibility of them being in the Avengers 2. I am excited for this movie since it will be interesting how they will approach it. Having a release date in August is a same choice since that is the month that "risky" movies are released.
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On February 08 2013 16:15 Blargh wrote: Personally, I think they should keep the superheroes disconnected. It basically diminishes the plots of any individual heroes movie/comic/story. I would really like to see different ways of doing superhero movies. We have all seen the great CGI and fancy stuff they've done with Marvel characters. I want to see a movie where they are much less like a generic super hero and more like actual people. Something darker. Sort of like batman, except him not wear a silly outfit. Like Kick-Ass ? I liked it a lot.
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At some point I'd like to see Apocalypse come and beat the shit out of everyone for the X-Men to come in.
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On February 09 2013 03:16 Ratch! wrote: At some point I'd like to see Apocalypse come and beat the shit out of everyone for the X-Men to come in.
That would be cool except Sony owns the rights to X-Men. Besides, if the Avengers can take down Thanos, then Apocalypse will not be problem. In the comics, Thanos fought the entire Marvel universe and almost won. Meanwhile, Apocalypse lived mostly on Earth and hasn't done as much as Thanos. I think in battle, Apocalypse lacks the strength and abilities when you compare him to Thanos, who is on a cosmic level. If that is the case, then the Avengers have no need to call the X-Men. I wish Marvel studios had all the rights to their properties.
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On February 09 2013 05:31 zoLo wrote:Show nested quote +On February 09 2013 03:16 Ratch! wrote: At some point I'd like to see Apocalypse come and beat the shit out of everyone for the X-Men to come in. In the comics, Thanos fought the entire Marvel universe and almost won. Infinity gems/gauntlet helped in most cases.
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United Kingdom14464 Posts
How in the hell are they gonna get Rocket Raccoon to work in a live action screen? :p Though if they manage to get the log trap move in there somewhere from UMvC3 that would be fricking incredible.
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On February 09 2013 07:25 MCDayC wrote: How in the hell are they gonna get Rocket Raccoon to work in a live action screen? :p Though if they manage to get the log trap move in there somewhere from UMvC3 that would be fricking incredible. If they can make the Hulk work with CGI I'm sure they can make Rocket Raccoon work as well.
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