Just thought I should share this. We have international students mixed with Finnish people in one class and we had to discuss some questions together. I realized there was a Korean guy and girl sitting next to me and my pal and we teamed up.
So there I was, staring a guy who looked a bit like Parting and we completed the discussion early, leaving some awkward silence because we had to wait for the other groups to finish as well. To fill the void I started chatting about their foreign exchange and after a brief exchange I just blurted the following line to the guy:
"I just _have_ to ask, do you follow any starcraft?"
I don't even remember what he said, something like "yeah I know what it is" and a smile.
Then I gushed a bit by telling him flash just won his first tourney in sc2, did he know about it. And he was just totally indifferent about the fact.
I know a Korean in my course as well. I brought up the topic of SC2 almost immediately. He knew about Flash, Jaedong, Boxer and other old school BW players. So that was nice.
On September 03 2014 01:36 Serejai wrote: So... you met a Korean and immediately asked if they know Starcraft? That's pretty racist.
Really? Racist? Calm down, dude. When people meet me abroad, the first things they talk about after they find out that I am Czech, is beer and soccer. It's stereotyping, but it's a nice icebreaker and for many Czech people both topics are spot on (not for me, but that's irrelevant). The only difference is that Koreans also look different than us, but it's not really like you could tell someone is Korean just by looking, there are many countries around where average people look similiar. So he probably had to ask/be told where the guy is from anyway. So where does the race exactly come in the equation?
On September 03 2014 02:44 Capped wrote: I met a black guy today and i was like YO DAWG RAP IS DOPE.
Well depending on what part of the UK you are in, I could see that being a legitimate exclamation. I thought it was a bit off until I saw OP is from Finland, in which case I can imagine that Korean exchanges may not be the most common thing in the world.
That being said, I caught up with some Koreans who studied abroad with me in China years after the fact. I wasn't into SC at the time I was abroad, really got a bit more of a glimpse into how it is more akin to WWF type wrestling than say Football/Soccer, at least for these two guys. They knew it, they knew a couple players, would watch it if it were on kind of a situation.
On September 03 2014 02:44 Capped wrote: I met a black guy today and i was like YO DAWG RAP IS DOPE.
Well depending on what part of the UK you are in, I could see that being a legitimate exclamation. I thought it was a bit off until I saw OP is from Finland, in which case I can imagine that Korean exchanges may not be the most common thing in the world.
That being said, I caught up with some Koreans who studied abroad with me in China years after the fact. I wasn't into SC at the time I was abroad, really got a bit more of a glimpse into how it is more akin to WWF type wrestling than say Football/Soccer, at least for these two guys. They knew it, they knew a couple players, would watch it if it were on kind of a situation.
Yeah i don't think this is as bad as some of the comments suggest. They were exchange students from Korea and Esports is a pretty big part of their culture? To ask if they know about Sc2 is not racist at all.
Pretty sure the thing about esports being a 'big part' of Korean culture is vastly overblown on TL :p I mean, it was never as popular as, say, soccer is in the big soccer nations, or basketball / baseball in the US or whatever; if you go around asking every Korean whether they know Starcraft, majority would probably think you're a bit strange... not really racist, but definitely weird.
Wow I did not expect this to spawn racist comments off the bat. I did ask them first if they were from Korea and we chatted a bit about Korea overall. I definitely didn't just look at their faces and shout "HEY U KNOW SC2?" And to my knowledge, everyone at least knows Starcraft so why not ask him if he watches any games.
Actually there has been a lot of Korean/Chinese foreign students at our school. I don't know why they picked Finland though.
On September 03 2014 02:44 Capped wrote: I met a black guy today and i was like YO DAWG RAP IS DOPE.
Well depending on what part of the UK you are in, I could see that being a legitimate exclamation. I thought it was a bit off until I saw OP is from Finland, in which case I can imagine that Korean exchanges may not be the most common thing in the world.
That being said, I caught up with some Koreans who studied abroad with me in China years after the fact. I wasn't into SC at the time I was abroad, really got a bit more of a glimpse into how it is more akin to WWF type wrestling than say Football/Soccer, at least for these two guys. They knew it, they knew a couple players, would watch it if it were on kind of a situation.
Nobody speaks like that in the UK and i would be slapped for sounding even remotely like it.
I didnt say it was racist btw, stereotyping though, sure.
On September 03 2014 03:02 Salazarz wrote: Pretty sure the thing about esports being a 'big part' of Korean culture is vastly overblown on TL :p I mean, it was never as popular as, say, soccer is in the big soccer nations, or basketball / baseball in the US or whatever; if you go around asking every Korean whether they know Starcraft, majority would probably think you're a bit strange... not really racist, but definitely weird.
Well I had the complete opposite experience and I think it depends on the age. When I did my erasmus exchange I asked all the korean exchange students about starcraft and every single one knew what it was and even the girls knew the famous players ;D I don't think it was weird, it even lead to glorious things like watching proleague streams together and having a LAN in the kitchen. One of the guys even told me that a highschool classmate of him was a practice partner for MBC but never managed to get through courage...
Ahahaha the comments are great. I had a Chinese guy in my class in uni, he often used to bring around his friend after hours and we would all LAN DotA in the classroom. The one day I was skyping with my ex while I was working and I mentioned that I was going to go play DotA with the Chinese guys and he was like 'ask them if they play Starcraft!' At first I didn't want to claiming it was racist to assume they were Starcraft players just because they were Asian, but eventually I gave in and turned around and asked 'Hey Dong, do you or Zhixun play any Starcraft?'
On September 03 2014 02:44 Capped wrote: I met a black guy today and i was like YO DAWG RAP IS DOPE.
Well depending on what part of the UK you are in, I could see that being a legitimate exclamation. I thought it was a bit off until I saw OP is from Finland, in which case I can imagine that Korean exchanges may not be the most common thing in the world.
That being said, I caught up with some Koreans who studied abroad with me in China years after the fact. I wasn't into SC at the time I was abroad, really got a bit more of a glimpse into how it is more akin to WWF type wrestling than say Football/Soccer, at least for these two guys. They knew it, they knew a couple players, would watch it if it were on kind of a situation.
Yeah i don't think this is as bad as some of the comments suggest. They were exchange students from Korea and Esports is a pretty big part of their culture? To ask if they know about Sc2 is not racist at all.
Woah woah woah. Silvana is right. We don't talk about Maradona Messi is pretty much the modern day Bonjwa of footie, I'm sure you can agree with that at least.
On September 03 2014 03:02 Salazarz wrote: Pretty sure the thing about esports being a 'big part' of Korean culture is vastly overblown on TL :p I mean, it was never as popular as, say, soccer is in the big soccer nations, or basketball / baseball in the US or whatever; if you go around asking every Korean whether they know Starcraft, majority would probably think you're a bit strange... not really racist, but definitely weird.
I heard soccer came out 16 years ago and has to put up with that annoying "video games are a waste of time" stereotype from the older generations.
But in all seriousness, I'm pretty sure Korean pro-gamers are treated like celebrities/ actors in Korea.
On September 03 2014 03:02 Salazarz wrote: Pretty sure the thing about esports being a 'big part' of Korean culture is vastly overblown on TL :p I mean, it was never as popular as, say, soccer is in the big soccer nations, or basketball / baseball in the US or whatever; if you go around asking every Korean whether they know Starcraft, majority would probably think you're a bit strange... not really racist, but definitely weird.
I heard soccer came out 16 years ago and has to put up with that annoying "video games are a waste of time" stereotype from the older generations.
But in all seriousness, I'm pretty sure Korean pro-gamers are treated like celebrities/ actors in Korea.
No, there is at best a hand full of pro gamers who achieved notable celebrity status outside of the gaming world, while naturally there are much more actors that have equal or much greater celebrity status. It's just no comparison to the amount of celebrity actors and their fame. Yes, the most famous pro gamers are treated celebrity-like, but you really can not throw both things together as if they are the same. People just get the completely wrong image in their mind if you generalize and oversimplify it like that. For both BW and League there exists/existed a very romantic view of those games being accepted or ingrained in the culture in Korea.
This interview of Chobra by Thorin gives some nice perspective in my opinion:
On September 03 2014 01:36 Serejai wrote: So... you met a Korean and immediately asked if they know Starcraft? That's pretty racist.
1: Koreans are not a race. They are a nationality.
2: Racism is something like a value system that emphasizes a persons race to determine worth, or the belief that a person can be superior or inferior based on race. Assuming that a certain race (and koreans are not a race) plays StarCraft does not make one racist.
3. StarCraft is a bigger part of korean culture than it is of any other culture, including the one that the original poster is from - so he asked the korean about StarCraft. I met a german guy a few days ago, and I asked him if he was in to beer, because I've heard that beer is a big deal in Germany. And it was fine. There is nothing wrong with being curious about people from other cultures. If some one asks me if I am a socialist, since I am from Sweden, it won't offend me. It is only natural that he will ask, since Sweden has a socialistic culture.
4: There is never anything wrong with asking some one if he has a shared interest with you. And if he comes from a culture that is more likely to produce people with similar interests, then it makes sense to look in that area.
On September 03 2014 03:08 herMan wrote: Wow I did not expect this to spawn racist comments off the bat. I did ask them first if they were from Korea and we chatted a bit about Korea overall. I definitely didn't just look at their faces and shout "HEY U KNOW SC2?" And to my knowledge, everyone at least knows Starcraft so why not ask him if he watches any games.
Actually there has been a lot of Korean/Chinese foreign students at our school. I don't know why they picked Finland though.
It just means you're a racist without knowing it ! Don't worry tho, by today "standards" basically every normal person is a racist anyway.
I had a physics professor in college who worked on the LHC Atlas Project and so I talked to him about that a lot and about Korean culture in general. But when he asked why I was so interested in Korean culture I told him the truth, that I was really interested in the architecture, the society, but that mostly I was reeally into Starcraft and had been since I was in elementary school. He laughed a good hearty laugh until he couldn't breathe anymore. Then he said: "Oh, I see." I never asked him why that was so funny, but he still invited me to talk about physics all the time so that's cool. lol
I was at a Korean restaurant once and asked our waiter if he played starcraft. He responded with an enthusiastic "Yeah!" and asked if I was Chinese. I told him I was. He then asked if I knew Lim Yo Hwan and I was like Yeah that's Boxer! He then asked if I was Chinese again and I said yeah. I then challenged him to a game but he backed off.
It's not racism to make assumptions based on culture and ethnicity. It's still considered rude by some to make these assumptions, but it all depends on who you're talking to.
On September 03 2014 01:14 herMan wrote: Just thought I should share this. We have international students mixed with locals in one class and we had to discuss some questions together. I realized there was an american guy and girl sitting next to me and my pal and we teamed up.
So there I was, staring a guy who looked a bit like Triple H and we completed the discussion early, leaving some awkward silence because we had to wait for the other groups to finish as well. To fill the void I started chatting about their foreign exchange and after a brief exchange I just blurted the following line to the guy:
"I just _have_ to ask, do you follow any WWE?"
I don't even remember what he said, something like "yeah I know what it is" and a smile.
Then I gushed a bit by telling him Hulk Hogan would be returning to WWE, did he know about it. And he was just totally indifferent about the fact.
When I played ArcheAge in Korea everytime I talked to someone and told them where I live they all told me about how one of their football players played for the local club and basically asked me what my favourite club was. They didn't even ask if I like football, they just assumed I did because I told them that I'm German.
Never once has the thought crossed my mind that it was racist, I think it's pretty natural to try and go for the "most common denominator" to find something to talk about. I'm not the biggest football fan but I knew enough about all that to keep the conversation going and I made a couple of online friends that way.
I hear things like how a lot of Americans don't even know who George Washington and Abraham Lincoln were. How is that even possible, they're printed on our money lol...
On September 03 2014 19:45 SoSexy wrote: Are people really complaining about racism here?
Politically correctness has fucked up this world
Agreed I'm glad people have already picked up on how retarded Serejai's 'racist' point was.
Political correctness really has gone too far these days and shit like racism just gets yelled when its not even relevant. Racism is discriminating based on colour/nationality or hating, stereotyping is assuming something about someone based on their colour/nationality.
No, racism does not necessarily mean "discriminating based on colour/nationality or hating", that's racial discrimination, which is related but not exactly the same. Racism is judging someone according to his/her race (hence the word... race-ism), which OP was doing, not that it was malicious or generally offensive or anything.
On September 03 2014 19:45 SoSexy wrote: Are people really complaining about racism here?
Politically correctness has fucked up this world
Agreed I'm glad people have already picked up on how retarded Serejai's 'racist' point was.
Political correctness really has gone too far these days and shit like racism just gets yelled when its not even relevant. Racism is discriminating based on colour/nationality or hating, stereotyping is assuming something about someone based on their colour/nationality.
Remember that time when Serejai made a joke and everyone attacked it for the entirety of the thread because the satire was too subtle?
On September 03 2014 23:09 ragz_gt wrote: No, racism does not necessarily mean "discriminating based on colour/nationality or hating", that's racial discrimination, which is related but not exactly the same. Racism is judging someone according to his/her race (hence the word... race-ism), which OP was doing, not that it was malicious or generally offensive or anything.
He's not judging, he's assuming he knows starcraft >< Basically what you say is his post was racist but not in a malicious or offensive way. I didn't knew racism could be like that, but as I said ealier, nowadays everyone is racist. Antiracism is going so far (it's a business now so it has to create racism to thrive) nowadays that it's a new form of racism.
I highly doubt that Male Koreans in the age group of 20-30 have never played Broodwar in their life At the very least, they have to have heard about it
I'm Korean and have been asked about sc2...not so much broodwar. 'tis a pity.
I'm like Jadeong? They're like, yeah he's alright. I'm like golden mouse? They're like what's that? I'm like Flash? They're like, yeah he's alright but meh. I'm like Bisu? They're like who? I'm like Stork? They're like, oh he's in Korea somewhere right but he sucks? ...Then I'm like what's a lurker? And they're like people who just scan forums? And I'm like you blaspheming newb go die. Then they're like chill it's sc2 not bw. Then I punch 'em in the face, say gg no re, and never talk to 'em again.
Nowadays I just say I've heard of it but don't follow the scene much. The conversation usually just ends as "oh...cool." I prefer it that way.
And everyone in Korea knows about BroodWar/SC2. If they don't, then they're weird and you shouldn't like 'em.
Edit: Unless they're like 6 or 60 years old. Everything else in between counts though.
Pretty sure that Koreans don't know who Flash is, cause they call progamers by their actual names. He would have known jaedong cause that's his name AND id
On September 03 2014 23:09 ragz_gt wrote: No, racism does not necessarily mean "discriminating based on colour/nationality or hating", that's racial discrimination, which is related but not exactly the same. Racism is judging someone according to his/her race (hence the word... race-ism), which OP was doing, not that it was malicious or generally offensive or anything.
Koreans still aren't a race, they are a nationality with a culture
On September 04 2014 22:04 .Sic. wrote: Pretty sure that Koreans don't know who Flash is, cause they call progamers by their actual names. He would have known jaedong cause that's his name AND id