Marauder don't need nerfing.
As for zealots, get charge and stop getting too many stalkers. I can't count how many times my marauder army lost against charged zealots and won against mass stalkers.
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ooni
Australia1498 Posts
Marauder don't need nerfing. As for zealots, get charge and stop getting too many stalkers. I can't count how many times my marauder army lost against charged zealots and won against mass stalkers. | ||
ExileStrife
United States170 Posts
I hope that makes enough sense to at least understand the general suggestion as well as how the concept behind it would work. I believe it would also provide an interesting new micro mechanic -- it would encourage keeping hotkeys of marauders and marines separate to maximize the amount of times they can fire while still moving the army around. | ||
Spaylz
Japan1743 Posts
As far as Roaches are concerned, Immortals counter them pretty well, but Zergs are still quite able to mass them up to "counter the counter". Immortals are cool, but if there are just too many roaches and you don't have a 100% Immortal composed army, you'll lose to this unit in mass. The main problem is, Terrans have Marauders, Zergs have Roaches, Protoss have nothing like that. They don't have this one unit that stands over the others. Zealots ? No way, you kinda need charge, then yeah they're deadly. But well, T2 + 200/200 and like 150 seconds upgrade time or so. Stalkers ? Much more of a support unit, great to have in a mix sure, but you'll never make a full-Stalker army as deadly as a full Roaches or a full Marauders army. Unless you get Blink, which brings me back to the Charge point. Sentry ? Support unit also. Don't get me wrong, Force Field and Guardian Shield are truely awesome, but Sentries won't bring the amount of damage you'd need to win a fight, any fight. In every game I see, Protoss is the race that has to mix up its army, for real, while Zerg and Terran can afford not to. edit : I say, add a 10 seconds (or maybe less, I say 10 because it's the cooldown of both Charge and Blink...) cooldown to the Marauders slow. This would still make it VERY efficient, would actually add some more micro to the game early on, and would make the Marauder mass slightly less strong. | ||
kickinhead
Switzerland2069 Posts
I CALL IMBA! | ||
Whiplash
United States2928 Posts
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kickinhead
Switzerland2069 Posts
On April 01 2010 07:46 Whiplash wrote: If the slow speed thing had to be researched that would prob stop a lot of the people complaining about marauders. Good ideaa imho. makes it harder to abuse stim+marauders. | ||
Amber[LighT]
United States5078 Posts
On April 01 2010 07:46 Whiplash wrote: If the slow speed thing had to be researched that would prob stop a lot of the people complaining about marauders. I find it funny that a lot of spells are provided without upgrade. I'd be willing to take a dive as a toss and have to research force field or guardian shield prior to use. Same thing with the Mothership abilities instead of killing the unit in every other possible way. Infestors have the same thing I think where all spells are already upgraded. What's the actual point of an infestation pit then... it has the mana upgrade? The Phoenix would need to keep it's spell though since it sucks on it's own | ||
praetor.at
Austria92 Posts
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zul
Germany5427 Posts
i want to buy lurkers. | ||
kickinhead
Switzerland2069 Posts
On April 01 2010 07:59 zul wrote: i want to sell roaches. i want to buy lurkers. done deal! ^^' | ||
Tinithor
United States1552 Posts
On April 01 2010 07:54 Amber[LighT] wrote: Show nested quote + On April 01 2010 07:46 Whiplash wrote: If the slow speed thing had to be researched that would prob stop a lot of the people complaining about marauders. I find it funny that a lot of spells are provided without upgrade. I'd be willing to take a dive as a toss and have to research force field or guardian shield prior to use. Same thing with the Mothership abilities instead of killing the unit in every other possible way. Infestors have the same thing I think where all spells are already upgraded. What's the actual point of an infestation pit then... it has the mana upgrade? The Phoenix would need to keep it's spell though since it sucks on it's own I think they wanted to make more spells used in sc2 than scbw so they make them more readily available. | ||
Chen
United States6344 Posts
On April 01 2010 07:11 Darpinion wrote: Show nested quote + On April 01 2010 07:02 OHtRUe wrote: On April 01 2010 06:54 theqat wrote: Yeah you can't have your cake and eat it too with the definition of micro. Either kiting is micro or it isn't. Not-micro is literally a-moving and not issuing any more orders. Kiting is micro. If you want to say that the micro is too easy then sure, fine, but it's micro. OK. SO for maruaders you have to kite against Zealots..... HUGE MICRO What is the difference between kiting a marauder, or kiting a hydra, or kiting a goon, or kiting a roach? I don't see why this is being complained about. Why aren't you bitching about goon micro being too simple? marauders slow targets, which makes kiting about 10 times easier. with their free slow as soon as you attack the units in front basically stop, which blocks the units in back, giving you a ridiculous amount of time to easily back up and fire again, repeating the process. any other unit, like hydras or goons, if you kite against a faster melee unit you are going to take hits, kiting just reduces the amount of hits you take. the marauder slow makes it so you can do the equivalent of vulture vs ling/slowlot micro against every ground unit there is, with marauders being significantly bulkier. for those of you talking about speedlots owning marauders, you obviously havent seen high level play. unless the marauders get surrounded by zlots or just sit there and get hacked at, marauders decimate chargelots with even a little micro, just kite backwards and they cant touch you after the one hit they get from charge. | ||
Odds
Canada1188 Posts
On April 01 2010 07:43 Spaylz wrote: Immortals do not beat Marauders... Microed properly, a Marauder ball can prevent any Immortal from hitting them more than 5 times, seriously. The slow is too damn effective, Terrans don't even bother making Marines anymore, most of the game I play and watch are Marauders + Medivacs and sometimes a few tanks. That counters pretty much any non-cheesy strat. Yeah, that army which contains absolutely no anti-air units counters any non-cheesy strat. Try building a Stargate. Phoenixes will rescue you from his medivacs and snipe his tanks easily if you get a couple. Also, if he has 100% marauder composition, why exactly can't you have 100% immortal and zealot composition? Hell, you can probably even build a Mothership and cause him all kinds of problems. | ||
shmoo
United States139 Posts
They are strong enough to tank against every matchup. Marauder - 100/25/30 125 Stalker - 125/50/42 80/80 Marauder > Stalker - marauder beats stalker 1v1 even though the stalker costs more Marauder > Zealot - due to the slow Marauder > Sentry Marauders beat every unit from the gateway including units that are more expensive. The charge upgrade is required to make zealots not useless against them when massed. Marauders force protoss to go robo, which then opens them up to banshee harass. The slow really should be researched, same cost and time as charge imo. | ||
Tinithor
United States1552 Posts
On April 01 2010 08:19 shmoo wrote: Marauders are too powerful for how easy they are to mass. Marauders are used in every matchup no matter what the opponent is going. They are strong enough to tank against every matchup. Marauder - 100/25/30 125 Stalker - 125/50/42 80/80 Marauder > Stalker - marauder beats stalker 1v1 even though the stalker costs more Marauder > Zealot - due to the slow Marauder > Sentry Marauders beat every unit from the gateway including units that are more expensive. The charge upgrade is required to make zealots not useless against them when massed. Marauders force protoss to go robo, which then opens them up to banshee harass. The slow really should be researched, same cost and time as charge imo. Having the slow from marauders be an upgrade doesn't seem too bad imo, but they can't nerf marauders anymore than that or terran will just get run over early... | ||
Spaylz
Japan1743 Posts
On April 01 2010 08:14 Odds wrote: Show nested quote + On April 01 2010 07:43 Spaylz wrote: Immortals do not beat Marauders... Microed properly, a Marauder ball can prevent any Immortal from hitting them more than 5 times, seriously. The slow is too damn effective, Terrans don't even bother making Marines anymore, most of the game I play and watch are Marauders + Medivacs and sometimes a few tanks. That counters pretty much any non-cheesy strat. Yeah, that army which contains absolutely no anti-air units counters any non-cheesy strat. Try building a Stargate. Phoenixes will rescue you from his medivacs and snipe his tanks easily if you get a couple. Also, if he has 100% marauder composition, why exactly can't you have 100% immortal and zealot composition? Hell, you can probably even build a Mothership and cause him all kinds of problems. Yeah, try to handle a mid game Marauder push if you're going air. You will never have enough units to kill the whole army before it destroys half your base. Not to mention Marines covers air units pretty well. Do I need to compare the cost of Marines with Phoenix and Void Ray with you ? Cheesy included air, sir. And LOL on the Phoenix suggestion. I feel like I should tell you man, PHOENIX SUCKS. And finally, "Also, if he has 100% marauder composition, why exactly can't you have 100% immortal and zealot composition?" Oh, I don't know, probably because you can't two or three rax Immortals and spam them without having like three bases ? Check out how much an Immortal costs, how much slower it is, how much more time you'll need to get your first one out before the Terran has enough Marauders to kill it. Also, while you can mass Zealots, they're worthless against Marauders without Charge, and even then they can be handled by good micro. Immortals are just like Marauders, only slower, a LOT more expensive and with no effects attached to their attack aside from the (very good) extra damage to armored. They can't attack air, which makes the Protoss vulnerable to it, BUT like I said you can't mass them up as quickly and as effectivly as Marauders. | ||
Chen
United States6344 Posts
On April 01 2010 08:14 Odds wrote: Show nested quote + On April 01 2010 07:43 Spaylz wrote: Immortals do not beat Marauders... Microed properly, a Marauder ball can prevent any Immortal from hitting them more than 5 times, seriously. The slow is too damn effective, Terrans don't even bother making Marines anymore, most of the game I play and watch are Marauders + Medivacs and sometimes a few tanks. That counters pretty much any non-cheesy strat. Yeah, that army which contains absolutely no anti-air units counters any non-cheesy strat. Try building a Stargate. Phoenixes will rescue you from his medivacs and snipe his tanks easily if you get a couple. Also, if he has 100% marauder composition, why exactly can't you have 100% immortal and zealot composition? Hell, you can probably even build a Mothership and cause him all kinds of problems. are you retarded? seriously people that have never played the game or watched a high-level player stream should be banned from posting. get phoenix vs terran? thats the biggest joke i've heard yet. he needs 4-5 marines max to shut down any phoenix, plus you can't "easily snipe his tanks with a couple" of phoenix, they do like 10 damage, so good luck killing a tank before your air units get shredded. and mothership? really? just shut up seriously. stargate+fleet beacon+insane cost for what.. a unit that gets insta-killed by vikings that he can mass from the starports that he already has? | ||
t3hw0lf
United States45 Posts
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