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President Tayyip Erdogan angrily rejected Western criticism of purges under way in Turkey's military and other state institutions after a failed coup, suggesting some in the United States were on the side of the plotters.
The purges target supporters of U.S.-based Muslim cleric Fethullah Gulen, accused by Ankara of masterminding the July 15-16 coup. Turkey's Western allies condemned the coup, in which at least 246 people were killed and more than 2,000 injured, but they have been rattled by the scale of the crackdown.
The director of U.S. national intelligence, James Clapper, said on Thursday the purges were harming the fight against Islamic State in Syria and Iraq by sweeping away Turkish officers who had worked closely with the United States.
The head of U.S. Central Command, General Joseph Votel, said he believed some of the military figures whom the United States had worked with were in jail.
Speaking at a special forces headquarters in Ankara badly damaged by violence on the night of the coup, Erdogan on Friday condemned Votel's remarks.
"Instead of thanking this country which repelled a coup attempt, you take the side of the coup plotters. The putschist is in your country already," Erdogan said, referring to Gulen, who denies any involvement in the coup attempt.
"They (the critics) say ... 'we worry for (Turkey's) future'. But what are these gentlemen worried about? Whether the numbers of detained and arrested will increase? If they are guilty, they will increase," said Erdogan, who narrowly escaped capture and possible death on the night of the coup.
Ankara wants Washington to extradite Gulen, once a close ally of Erdogan and now an arch foe, to Turkey.
Asked about the U.S. comments on losing Turkish interlocutors, Turkish Prime Minister Binali Yildirim echoed Erdogan's feisty tone: "This is a confession. If the Gulenist generals are their friends, they are in the same class."
Yildirim also said Turkey would shut down an air base near Ankara which served as a hub for the coup plotters as well as all military barracks used by them.
Turkey announced late on Thursday a major shake-up of its armed forces, NATO's second largest, with the promotion of 99 colonels to the rank of general or admiral and the dishonorable discharge of nearly 1,700 military personnel over their alleged roles in the coup.
About 40 percent of all generals and admirals have been dismissed since the coup.
Defence Minister Fikri Isik told broadcaster NTV on Friday the shake-up in the military was not yet over, adding that military academies would now be a target of "cleansing".
The purges have also hit government ministries, schools and universities, the police, civil service, media and business.
The number of public sector workers removed from their posts since the coup attempt now stands at more than 66,000, including some 43,000 people in education, the state-run Anadolu news agency reported on Friday.
Interior Minister Efkan Ala said more than 18,000 people had been detained over the failed coup, and that 50,000 passports had been canceled. The labor ministry said it was investigating 1,300 staff over their possible involvement.
Erdogan says Gulen harnessed his extensive network of schools, charities and businesses, built up in Turkey and abroad over decades, to create a secretive "parallel state" that aimed to take over the country.
Erdogan's critics say he is using the purges to crack down indiscriminately on dissent and to tighten his grip on power.
With long land borders with Syria and Iraq, Turkey is a central part of the U.S.-led military operation against Islamic State. As home to millions of Syrian refugees, it is also the European Union's partner in a deal reached last year to halt the biggest flow of migrants into Europe since World War Two.
Turkey hosts U.S. troops and warplanes at Incirlik Air Base, from which the United States flies sorties against Islamic State militants in Iraq and Syria. Those air operations were temporarily halted following the coup attempt.
Attempting to reassure the United States, Foreign Minister Mevlut Cavusoglu said on Friday that Turkey's armed forces, "cleansed" of their Gulenist elements, would prove more "trustworthy ... and effective" allies against Islamic State.
Nevertheless, there is a growing anti-U.S. mood in Turkey which is likely to harden further if Washington refuses to extradite Gulen.
Several hundred flag-waving protesters staged a peaceful protest march near the Incirlik base on Thursday, chanting "Allahu Akbar" (God is greatest) and "Damn the U.S.A", the pro-government Yeni Safak newspaper reported. The protesters burned a U.S. flag.
The crackdown on Gulenists pressed on unabated on Friday.
In the central city of Kayseri, a stronghold of Erdogan's ruling Islamist-rooted AK Party, police detained the chairman of furniture-to-cables conglomerate Boydak Holding and two company executives as part of the investigation into the "Gulenist Terror Group", Anadolu reported.
Prosecutors in the Aegean coastal city of Izmir issued orders to detain 200 police on Friday as part of the investigation targeting Gulenists, the Dogan news agency said.
In the Netherlands, a spokeswoman for the Gulenist community said supporters feared for their safety after dozens of death threats and acts of arson and vandalism in Dutch towns and cities in the past two weeks. Saniye Calkin said supporters in neighboring Germany were reporting similar incidents.
Germany is home to Europe's largest Turkish diaspora, while the Netherlands also has around half a million ethnic Turks.
Gulen, who has lived in self-imposed exile in the U.S. state of Pennsylvania since 1999, again maintained his innocence during an interview with Italy's Corriere della Sera newspaper, saying he had himself suffered from previous coups in Turkey.
Asked why his once-warm ties with Erdogan and the AK Party had turned sour, Gulen said: "It appears that after staying in power for too long, (they) are suffering from power poisoning."
Gulen, whose Hizmet (Service) movement stresses the need to embrace scientific progress and inter-faith dialogue, said he still strongly backed Ankara's bid to join the EU, saying this would buttress democracy and human rights in Turkey. uk.reuters.com I always wonder with someone like Erdogan whether he actually believes what he's saying or whether his echo chamber has become so twisted that he believes what he's saying.
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you literally said gulen schools are everywhere, and talked about strong presence, hinting influencing governments and what not. but even your oh-so-credible source says:
non muslim Bulgaria 4 schools / 7 mil pop Montenegro 1 / 0.5 mil pop Croatia 1 / 4 mil pop Greece 1 / 11 mil pop Macedonia 4 (+4 in muslim parts) / 2 mil pop (25% albanians) Romania 10 / 19 mil pop Serbia 2 (6 with muslim/albanian Kosovo) / 7 mil pop Slovenia 0 / 2 mil pop
muslim Albania 12 Bosnia 6 (0 in non-muslim parts) (Kosovo 4)
so that's 23 schools operating in a region with 52.5 million non-muslims. such wow, very amazing.
just to further prove how paranoid ur point seems to be, let me say that we have several american colleges in Croatia, where lectures and complete educational programs are in english, even tho there is no native english minority to warrant inclusion of the language as official language of use, like our constitution does with italian, hungarian or german for example... yet you dont see people running around and screaming CIA taking over the place.
as for muslim countries in the balkans, from my understanding of what gulen movement is supposed to be, i was even expecting more schools to be honest. i even looked at african states you mentioned, and numbers there are equally unimpressive, considering the populations.
p.s. you're from a country that banned intellectuals from traveling in 2016, you don't get to call african nations quote "third-world countries" /facepalm
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On July 30 2016 16:26 snailz wrote:you literally said gulen schools are everywhere, and talked about strong presence, hinting influencing governments and what not. but even your oh-so-credible source says: non muslimBulgaria 4 schools / 7 mil pop Montenegro 1 / 0.5 mil pop Croatia 1 / 4 mil pop Greece 1 / 11 mil pop Macedonia 4 (+4 in muslim parts) / 2 mil pop (25% albanians) Romania 10 / 19 mil pop Serbia 2 (6 with muslim/albanian Kosovo) / 7 mil pop Slovenia 0 / 2 mil pop muslimAlbania 12 Bosnia 6 (0 in non-muslim parts) (Kosovo 4) so that's 23 schools operating in a region with 52.5 million non-muslims. such wow, very amazing.just to further prove how paranoid ur point seems to be, let me say that we have several american colleges in Croatia, where lectures and complete educational programs are in english, even tho there is no native english minority to warrant inclusion of the language as official language of use, like our constitution does with italian, hungarian or german for example... yet you dont see people running around and screaming CIA taking over the place. as for muslim countries in the balkans, from my understanding of what gulen movement is supposed to be, i was even expecting more schools to be honest. i even looked at african states you mentioned, and numbers there are equally unimpressive, considering the populations. p.s. you're from a country that banned intellectuals from traveling in 2016, you don't get to call african nations quote "third-world countries" /facepalm
I said they have strong presence in Balkan & Central Asian countries which i am right. What is your point ? I really don't get it. For me its not normal for followers of an imam from eastern Turkey gathering so much fundings to open schools everywhere in the world. And i don't even understand how it is even comparable to American Collages. By the way i don't say they should be shut down, they do their all business legally so there is nothing can be done. And yes we are a 3rd world country as well, so what?
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(Reuters) - Turkey has released more than 750 soldiers detained after an abortive coup, state media reported on Saturday, while President Tayyip Erdogan said he would drop lawsuits against people who had insulted him, in a one-time gesture of "unity".
More than 60,000 people have been detained, removed or suspended over suspected links with the failed putsch, when a faction of the military commandeered tanks, helicopters and fighter jets and attempted to topple the government.
Turkey's Western allies have condemned the coup, in which Erdogan has said 237 people were killed and more than 2,100 were wounded, but have been rattled by the scale of the resulting crackdown which has targeted supporters of Fethullah Gulen.
The U.S.-based Muslim cleric, accused by Ankara of masterminding the July 15-16 putsch, denies the charges and Erdogan's critics say the president is using the purges to clamp down on dissent.
Erdogan, meanwhile, has said it was "shameful" that Western countries showed more interest in the fate of the plotters than in standing with a fellow NATO member and has upbraided Western leaders for not visiting after the putsch. U.S. chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Joseph Dunford, a top military official, is due to visit Turkey on Sunday.
State-run Anadolu Agency reported that 758 soldiers were released on the recommendation of prosecutors after giving testimony, and the move was agreed by a judge.
Another 231 soldiers remain in custody, it said.
Turkey's military, the second-largest in NATO, has been hard hit in the wake of the coup, with about 40 percent of all generals and admirals dismissed. On Thursday, 99 colonels were promoted to the rank of general or admiral, following the dishonourable discharge of nearly 1,700 military personnel.
Turkish Defence Minister Fikri Isik told broadcaster NTV on Friday that the shake-up was not yet over, adding that military academies would now be a target of "cleansing".
Turkey's military is already stretched, facing violence in the mainly Kurdish southeast, and Islamic State attacks on its border with Syria.
The army killed 35 Kurdish militants after they attempted to storm a base in the southeastern Hakkari province early on Saturday, military officials said.
The head of the pro-Kurdish opposition told Reuters that the government's chance to revive a wrecked peace process with Kurdish rebels has been missed as Erdogan taps nationalist sentiment to consolidate support. uk.mobile.reuters.com
(Reuters) - Turkey's military commanders will report to the defence minister and military academies will be shut down, President Tayyip Erdogan said on Saturday, announcing moves aimed at bringing the military fully under civilian control after a failed coup.
Erdogan, who made the comments in an interview with broadcaster A Haber, said Turkey's military academies would be replaced by a national defence university. The decision would be announced in the government's official gazette by Sunday. uk.mobile.reuters.com
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On July 30 2016 16:26 snailz wrote:you literally said gulen schools are everywhere, and talked about strong presence, hinting influencing governments and what not. but even your oh-so-credible source says: non muslimBulgaria 4 schools / 7 mil pop Montenegro 1 / 0.5 mil pop Croatia 1 / 4 mil pop Greece 1 / 11 mil pop Macedonia 4 (+4 in muslim parts) / 2 mil pop (25% albanians) Romania 10 / 19 mil pop Serbia 2 (6 with muslim/albanian Kosovo) / 7 mil pop Slovenia 0 / 2 mil pop muslimAlbania 12 Bosnia 6 (0 in non-muslim parts) (Kosovo 4) so that's 23 schools operating in a region with 52.5 million non-muslims. such wow, very amazing.just to further prove how paranoid ur point seems to be, let me say that we have several american colleges in Croatia, where lectures and complete educational programs are in english, even tho there is no native english minority to warrant inclusion of the language as official language of use, like our constitution does with italian, hungarian or german for example... yet you dont see people running around and screaming CIA taking over the place. as for muslim countries in the balkans, from my understanding of what gulen movement is supposed to be, i was even expecting more schools to be honest. i even looked at african states you mentioned, and numbers there are equally unimpressive, considering the populations. p.s. you're from a country that banned intellectuals from traveling in 2016, you don't get to call african nations quote "third-world countries" /facepalm What if I said "You wrote 'such wow, very amazing' while arguing about an event that left hundreds dead, so you don't get to complain about others attacking intellectualism"?
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On August 01 2016 03:34 Pyrrhuloxia wrote:Show nested quote +On July 30 2016 16:26 snailz wrote:you literally said gulen schools are everywhere, and talked about strong presence, hinting influencing governments and what not. but even your oh-so-credible source says: non muslimBulgaria 4 schools / 7 mil pop Montenegro 1 / 0.5 mil pop Croatia 1 / 4 mil pop Greece 1 / 11 mil pop Macedonia 4 (+4 in muslim parts) / 2 mil pop (25% albanians) Romania 10 / 19 mil pop Serbia 2 (6 with muslim/albanian Kosovo) / 7 mil pop Slovenia 0 / 2 mil pop muslimAlbania 12 Bosnia 6 (0 in non-muslim parts) (Kosovo 4) so that's 23 schools operating in a region with 52.5 million non-muslims. such wow, very amazing.just to further prove how paranoid ur point seems to be, let me say that we have several american colleges in Croatia, where lectures and complete educational programs are in english, even tho there is no native english minority to warrant inclusion of the language as official language of use, like our constitution does with italian, hungarian or german for example... yet you dont see people running around and screaming CIA taking over the place. as for muslim countries in the balkans, from my understanding of what gulen movement is supposed to be, i was even expecting more schools to be honest. i even looked at african states you mentioned, and numbers there are equally unimpressive, considering the populations. p.s. you're from a country that banned intellectuals from traveling in 2016, you don't get to call african nations quote "third-world countries" /facepalm What if I said "You wrote 'such wow, very amazing' while arguing about an event that left hundreds dead, so you don't get to complain about others attacking intellectualism"?
id say fair point, and well played
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On August 01 2016 05:56 snailz wrote:Show nested quote +On August 01 2016 03:34 Pyrrhuloxia wrote:On July 30 2016 16:26 snailz wrote:you literally said gulen schools are everywhere, and talked about strong presence, hinting influencing governments and what not. but even your oh-so-credible source says: non muslimBulgaria 4 schools / 7 mil pop Montenegro 1 / 0.5 mil pop Croatia 1 / 4 mil pop Greece 1 / 11 mil pop Macedonia 4 (+4 in muslim parts) / 2 mil pop (25% albanians) Romania 10 / 19 mil pop Serbia 2 (6 with muslim/albanian Kosovo) / 7 mil pop Slovenia 0 / 2 mil pop muslimAlbania 12 Bosnia 6 (0 in non-muslim parts) (Kosovo 4) so that's 23 schools operating in a region with 52.5 million non-muslims. such wow, very amazing.just to further prove how paranoid ur point seems to be, let me say that we have several american colleges in Croatia, where lectures and complete educational programs are in english, even tho there is no native english minority to warrant inclusion of the language as official language of use, like our constitution does with italian, hungarian or german for example... yet you dont see people running around and screaming CIA taking over the place. as for muslim countries in the balkans, from my understanding of what gulen movement is supposed to be, i was even expecting more schools to be honest. i even looked at african states you mentioned, and numbers there are equally unimpressive, considering the populations. p.s. you're from a country that banned intellectuals from traveling in 2016, you don't get to call african nations quote "third-world countries" /facepalm What if I said "You wrote 'such wow, very amazing' while arguing about an event that left hundreds dead, so you don't get to complain about others attacking intellectualism"? id say fair point, and well played Well, I didn't say that, so, you know
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Maybe it just me but this and the whole false scare of surrounding the nuclear armed NATO base. Why would Turkey want out of NATO?
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Honestly I don't get Erdogan's foreign policies at all. I get that he's using the coup to solidify his internal power. But the only thing separating them from Russia is Georgia. I mean atm he's really trying hard to make the USA as well as Germany angry, how dumb can you be? Maybe it's connected to Erdogan's dream of being a model-state for the middle east, with everyone there hating the US he hopes he finds some new friends who don't mind him becoming a dictator.
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United Kingdom13774 Posts
Conflict between Russia and Turkey is primarily naval. In fact, the major reason that Turkey went towards NATO in the first place was that the Soviet Union made an ill-planned gambit to try to take the Bosphorus passage from Turkey. After that NATO basically fast-tracked Turkey into its alliance despite being an obvious problem state. It has continued to be an obvious problem state.
Russia-Turkey relations are much better than Soviet-Turkey relations. They would have been much better if someone wasn't stupid enough to shoot down a Russian bomber for no good reason. But I doubt there's any real danger of another open conflict between the two in the near future. Crimea was a significant scare for Turkey because it changed the calculus of preparing for a Black Sea conflict in the region (Turkey has better equipment and more ships, Russian military strategy is generally superior, but with Crimea being under its direct control Russia gets a decisive boost). But there's also a lot of ongoing business deals in progress, including a potential gas pipeline that may or may not happen, and neither country really wants to compromise that right now.
But I don't think that Turkey is trying to fuck over its NATO contacts either. It just has a very solid hand in the refugee crisis that the EU created and it's playing aggressively for its own benefit. It's a little stupid but I think Turkey will get through this one fine.
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On August 01 2016 11:12 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: Maybe it just me but this and the whole false scare of surrounding the nuclear armed NATO base. Why would Turkey want out of NATO?
Who said that?
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Say his protesters and police support actually tried and stormed a US/NATO base where nuclear weapons are stored. They would fail miserably and the supporters would be gunned down before they got close but that would be seen by major NATO players like the US, France and so on as an act of War. Turkey would be out of NATO and it's funding and support within an hour and Turkey has neighbor like Syria, Iran, etc that aren't to happy with Turkey.
Let's go even further let's say the new Sultan want to try and capture those Nukes, which wouldn't happen. Ankara would make Baghdad shock and awe look like a test run.
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that's even beyond conspiracy theories. the police would've never received such an order and if they acted on their own Erdogan himself would have them shot. the world has passed/moved beyond acts of war some time ago(ever since terrorism threat was invented).
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that was to be expected. US screwed him with the kurds and EU screwed him with on Syria. he feels betrayed by every ally he's ever had, but he's not stupid nor crazy.
just couple years ago he built himself the largest palace ever https://news.vice.com/article/a-look-at-president-erdogans-opulent-615-million-palace-four-times-the-size-of-versailles Recep Tayyip Erdogan may have been elected Turkey's president in August, but he's only now getting settled in his new post. A $615 million brand-new palace — four times the size of Versailles, the gold standard of historical opulence — would make anyone a bit more comfortable.
Turkey inaugurated the mansion, which is called Ak Saray, or White Palace, in Ankara last week. At 3.1 million square feet, Ak Saray became the largest presidential residence in the world, surpassing the roost belonging to the sultan of Brunei, which had held the title since 1984.
Besides 1,000 rooms, decorative green granite inlays, and bathrooms with silk wallpaper, the palace boasts a squad of servants and a $185 million, custom-built Airbus jet. The combined cost of Ak Saray and the jet surpasses the GDP of 12 countries, according to World Bank figures. yes, the dude has some illusions de grandeur issues but he's not suicidal. he will do what he always did: use his position, his country resources and the turkish citizens to make himself richer.
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On August 02 2016 04:32 xM(Z wrote:that was to be expected. US screwed him with the kurds and EU screwed him with on Syria. he feels betrayed by every ally he's ever had, but he's not stupid nor crazy. just couple years ago he built himself the largest palace ever https://news.vice.com/article/a-look-at-president-erdogans-opulent-615-million-palace-four-times-the-size-of-versailles Show nested quote +Recep Tayyip Erdogan may have been elected Turkey's president in August, but he's only now getting settled in his new post. A $615 million brand-new palace — four times the size of Versailles, the gold standard of historical opulence — would make anyone a bit more comfortable.
Turkey inaugurated the mansion, which is called Ak Saray, or White Palace, in Ankara last week. At 3.1 million square feet, Ak Saray became the largest presidential residence in the world, surpassing the roost belonging to the sultan of Brunei, which had held the title since 1984.
Besides 1,000 rooms, decorative green granite inlays, and bathrooms with silk wallpaper, the palace boasts a squad of servants and a $185 million, custom-built Airbus jet. The combined cost of Ak Saray and the jet surpasses the GDP of 12 countries, according to World Bank figures. yes, the dude has some illusions de grandeur issues but he's not suicidal. he will do what he always did: use his position, his country resources and the turkish citizens to make himself richer. How did the EU screw him on Syria when he was found to be supplying radical rebels with weapons and spend his time bombing Kurds instead of ISIS?
Same with the US really. They allied with the Kurds to fight in north Syria and then he proceeded to bomb them. He could have just sat back, give them north Syria and be rid of the problem in Turkey.
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On August 02 2016 04:32 xM(Z wrote: US screwed him with the kurds and EU screwed him with on Syria. he feels betrayed by every ally he's ever had, but he's not stupid nor crazy.
Dunno, that sounds pretty stupid to me.....
Btw. what happened to the Erdogan screwed incompetent EU leaders over with Syrian refugees theory?
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On August 02 2016 04:32 xM(Z wrote:that was to be expected. US screwed him with the kurds and EU screwed him with on Syria. he feels betrayed by every ally he's ever had, but he's not stupid nor crazy. just couple years ago he built himself the largest palace ever https://news.vice.com/article/a-look-at-president-erdogans-opulent-615-million-palace-four-times-the-size-of-versailles Show nested quote +Recep Tayyip Erdogan may have been elected Turkey's president in August, but he's only now getting settled in his new post. A $615 million brand-new palace — four times the size of Versailles, the gold standard of historical opulence — would make anyone a bit more comfortable.
Turkey inaugurated the mansion, which is called Ak Saray, or White Palace, in Ankara last week. At 3.1 million square feet, Ak Saray became the largest presidential residence in the world, surpassing the roost belonging to the sultan of Brunei, which had held the title since 1984.
Besides 1,000 rooms, decorative green granite inlays, and bathrooms with silk wallpaper, the palace boasts a squad of servants and a $185 million, custom-built Airbus jet. The combined cost of Ak Saray and the jet surpasses the GDP of 12 countries, according to World Bank figures. yes, the dude has some illusions de grandeur issues but he's not suicidal. he will do what he always did: use his position, his country resources and the turkish citizens to make himself richer. Holey Moley. How can a population support a president who spends 615 million on a palace? In my country people are already angry at politicians for getting free cars.
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United Kingdom13774 Posts
Four times the size of Versailles and only $615 million. That's sort of impressive in its own right, actually.
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United States40776 Posts
You don't spend that kind of money on a house you mean to vacate. It makes a statement.
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