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So I've been playing the beta pretty much since they sent out the first invites, been enjoying it way more then HOTS despite my criticisms, straight to the point, what do you love, what do you hate, what do you think? Mid Masters baddy with my grand opinions am interested.
Protoss
- So far so good if not timid, liking the discussion on Warp Gate changes - Adept is cool, ability doesn't seem as "skill display" as Blink but with the latest change it's alot better, kinda wish it was faster (maybe at Twilight) - Super prisms are sick and are strong as hell, I like that, Protoss should be rewarded for spreading out on the map and multitasking - The Disruptor design is a bit wonky, my main complaint is the invulnerability, generally that's just not a good move in an RTS, it is infinitely better to watch/play against then the Colossus. - I really wish they would scrap Charge and put in Zealot legs for extra micro sexiness.
Terran
- Liberator is a bit OP against everyone it seems, but I like the design of the unit, and I was skeptical about Terran getting another strong Starport unit but it's cool, numbers can always be tweaked - Siege Tank drop thing needs to go, like immediately, it's just so bad, so un tank like, give the tank an actual meaningful buff so mech can be bad ass in LOTV with bigger more spread out maps. - I hate the Cyclone but it looks like they are serious about making it good so whatever - Scrap Thor, what the hell, the unit sucks, give Terran the Goliath, bio is already great, it's time for real concrete mech solutions (not saying mech isn't viable ftr)
Zerg
- Ravagers feel semi viable with the increased range, although I don't know with how slow the ability is if it's really a...good thing for the game? I mean it's a skill shot and it is pretty strong but why did the rip off Kog'Maw? Is that David Kim's champ of choice or something? - Lurkers are strong as hell even though over the last couple of weeks I find most diamond and up players are responding to them alot better, it makes ZvZ awesome and is a fantastic addition to the game. - Nerf Ultralisks, oh my God, it's just so damn beefy, it kinda makes ZvZ end game suck a little because whoever get's Ultras kind of just wins? - Corruptor ability is uninspired, lazy, and adds zero dimension to the game, they took a crap ability that did no damage to a crap ability that does a mock Void Ray attack. - Broodlords unusable on these larger maps, way way too slow - Remove Nydus Worm from the game, if sensible changes are never going to be on the table for this then just scrap it and work on Zerg drops which are way cooler and way easier to balance, the invulnerable thing is SO BAD lol
(Separating this bad boy for length, I feel strongly about this as Zerg may finally have good drop options)
- Overlord drop is an awesome step in the right direction but it's not implemented in the best way possible (in my opinion) no other race can drop so early and the Overlords are so slow that it opens up weird wonky cheese strategies but it's useless for reliable play. I propose the drop should be moved to Overseer as the same upgrade, that way it's 75 gas per drop ship, they move very quickly with speed which is another 100 gas commitment, mobile detection, but doesn't offer any direct combat based aid like Medivac healing or Warp Prisms as mobile staging grounds, they would merely be speedy drop ships that can detect, so it would remain very balanced, and give Zerg a strong but not OP mid to late game drop option.
Apologies for any bias or crying by the way, I want all of the races to be balanced and awesome after the beta (or at least awesomely designed and we can fuck with balance later)
My thoughts, whats your guys, tell meh, I wanna know now.
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Czech Republic12115 Posts
TL; DR: It's just bad, uninstalled the Beta and buying LotV because of single-player. I am not expecting any changes that would make the multi-player experience better.
Long version> - The pace for me is too fast(dia/masters in HotS, depends on how much I want to play fun stuff vs timings). - Disruptor is a bad designed unit(I am so shocked that they made ANOTHER bad designed unit in the game which is also a "ball" design unit). Yay, I have a kamikaze ball! >< You either hit or miss, if you hit you won(or the game is at least equal), if you miss you lost. Yay! Awesome!! - The beta has lag spikes and they are not addressed, yay! So the experience of playing Protoss is bad because of the state of the race and above all I receive lag spikes for several seconds without any "Surrender lag screen"(basically I don't see anything moving but, for some obscure reason, the enemy is having no lag day and is massacring my army). - Also I feel to be forced into 2 base all-ins by the game flow and I was more the "spoon" Protoss type. Basically I was playing mech games with Protoss - I used to go for invincible-hard-to-recover army where you have to be super sure about positioning and engaging and fighting. Now I cannot do this stuff anymore. - Also I still don't feel that my army is able to compete in several skirmishes vs same sized small groups of Terran/Zerg. - Still not fixing hard-counters(e.g. Mutaballs - the last time you could defend with anything else than phoenixes was WoL, yay)
I don't care about other races changes. Protoss! Though my hype level is Frozen right now, I just read the beta forum here and laugh. I am kinda in the state where the hope is starting to slowly die.
So in the end I am probably the best customer for Blizzard - someone, who buys the game and then forgets that it exists and will no longer complain about it.
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Not rushing to any conclusions just yet as obviously a lot will be change, but I do believe the template of the game thus far is looking very promising. When things are worked out and tweaked to allow for as close to balanced play as possible I reckon we're going to have a really cool game that allows players to showcase their skill way more than ever before. Or at least I hope as much.
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Honestly, I would probably buy the game if the only thing they added was the lurker. It fills a hole that zerg has had forever, reliable, consistent, AOE ground defense and can be used offensively. Drops are pretty great as well, although it may come too early right now. I would be fine with it coming with lair.
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Zerglings should unload 2 at a time when dropping from overlords.
Lurker is a really good addition to zerg. ZvZ is atleast somewhat different with lurkers and ravagers.
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It is a bit volatile but some things looks very promising. I used to be very skeptical of the liberator but now I pretty sure it can be tweaked in to something awesome (basically to be what the siege tank is supposed to be). I am especially interested in the liberator ravager interaction.
As for protoss I am thinking about switching to protoss. Mainly for the interaction between blink stalkers and ravagers/lurkers/cyclones/liberators out in open (I got the same feeling I got as when I for the first time started to split bio against banelings) and how blink stalkers can work with disruptors. And of course I want to build Carriers :D
I don't really like the adept thought, I cant exactly say why but I don't like its ability and it just feels out of place.
Overall we have just so many units now that the games feels a bit clutery so I actually wouldnt mind if the removed some of them. As I have understood it the liberator basically competes (and outpeform?) with the siege tank and the Thor (and with the banshee? (parking a liberator behind a mineral line)). The colossus and the disruptor have basically the same role with the disruptor having bigger harassment potential. On the other hand this may increase diversity and giving players a chance to distinguish themselves more with more personal styles.
Last and least I just hate how a ball of cyclones and hellions looks <.<
That being said I have only played about 20 games and watched some archon mode :p
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What I dislike about LotV: - Forced to expand all the time. - Faster pace and no time to breath. - Tank based mech is dead due to Ravagers and Disruptors. - Combined mech attack upgrades removed thus making it even harder to use combined arms. - Harder to scout cheese in time due to 12 worker start. - More gimmicks that should not even be in the game like invulnerable nydus worms, and dropping already sieged up tanks. - Rewards APM over strategical/positional play.
What I would like to see instead - Increased Tank damage - Make Ravagers better against bio but worse against mech. - Make Disruptors not hard counter mech. - Cyclones should be better against air but worse against ground. - Remove Nydus worm invulnerability - Make every race start with a scout unit already built like in Age of Empires II. - Nerf Medivac speed boost so drops take more skill to use.
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On July 27 2015 14:56 jpg06051992 wrote: So I've been playing the beta pretty much since they sent out the first invites, been enjoying it way more then HOTS despite my criticisms, straight to the point, what do you love, what do you hate, what do you think? Mid Masters baddy with my grand opinions am interested.
Protoss
- So far so good if not timid, liking the discussion on Warp Gate changes - Adept is cool, ability doesn't seem as "skill display" as Blink but with the latest change it's alot better, kinda wish it was faster (maybe at Twilight) - Super prisms are sick and are strong as hell, I like that, Protoss should be rewarded for spreading out on the map and multitasking - The Disruptor design is a bit wonky, my main complaint is the invulnerability, generally that's just not a good move in an RTS, it is infinitely better to watch/play against then the Colossus. - I really wish they would scrap Charge and put in Zealot legs for extra micro sexiness.
Terran
- Liberator is a bit OP against everyone it seems, but I like the design of the unit, and I was skeptical about Terran getting another strong Starport unit but it's cool, numbers can always be tweaked - Siege Tank drop thing needs to go, like immediately, it's just so bad, so un tank like, give the tank an actual meaningful buff so mech can be bad ass in LOTV with bigger more spread out maps. - I hate the Cyclone but it looks like they are serious about making it good so whatever - Scrap Thor, what the hell, the unit sucks, give Terran the Goliath, bio is already great, it's time for real concrete mech solutions (not saying mech isn't viable ftr)
Zerg
- Ravagers feel semi viable with the increased range, although I don't know with how slow the ability is if it's really a...good thing for the game? I mean it's a skill shot and it is pretty strong but why did the rip off Kog'Maw? Is that David Kim's champ of choice or something? - Lurkers are strong as hell even though over the last couple of weeks I find most diamond and up players are responding to them alot better, it makes ZvZ awesome and is a fantastic addition to the game. - Nerf Ultralisks, oh my God, it's just so damn beefy, it kinda makes ZvZ end game suck a little because whoever get's Ultras kind of just wins? - Corruptor ability is uninspired, lazy, and adds zero dimension to the game, they took a crap ability that did no damage to a crap ability that does a mock Void Ray attack. - Broodlords unusable on these larger maps, way way too slow - Remove Nydus Worm from the game, if sensible changes are never going to be on the table for this then just scrap it and work on Zerg drops which are way cooler and way easier to balance, the invulnerable thing is SO BAD lol
(Separating this bad boy for length, I feel strongly about this as Zerg may finally have good drop options)
- Overlord drop is an awesome step in the right direction but it's not implemented in the best way possible (in my opinion) no other race can drop so early and the Overlords are so slow that it opens up weird wonky cheese strategies but it's useless for reliable play. I propose the drop should be moved to Overseer as the same upgrade, that way it's 75 gas per drop ship, they move very quickly with speed which is another 100 gas commitment, mobile detection, but doesn't offer any direct combat based aid like Medivac healing or Warp Prisms as mobile staging grounds, they would merely be speedy drop ships that can detect, so it would remain very balanced, and give Zerg a strong but not OP mid to late game drop option.
Apologies for any bias or crying by the way, I want all of the races to be balanced and awesome after the beta (or at least awesomely designed and we can fuck with balance later)
My thoughts, whats your guys, tell meh, I wanna know now.
I like most of your points, and I think everyone kinda agrees. Good post.
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Mid masters HotS, currently Diamond LotV.
Protoss I'll begin with the race I've been playing since WoL and am still playing in LotV. Adept : feels like a great addition to make gateway based armies viable, but I really dislike how strong adept timings can be. This could be mitigated by another upgrade needed to unlock full strength, why not something at templar archives ? I think the shade should not go through forcefields / (enemy ?) units too, that would allow some cute micro with blocking shades, whereas currently splitting adepts vs an unprepared opponent is like spelling an offensive gg. Disruptor : they should be fine after the change DK has talked about in his last community update, namely letting it retain invulnerability before shot but only speed bonus after shot. Warp prism : this is cute and the intention is sweet as always, but to be honest this is too strong. That long of a pickup distance is just absurd and while currently we probably don't see all its potential, Korean pros will just show how unrecoverably broken it is, with zero counterplay, especially once you have speed. Colossus : this is just a placeholder right now. It serves zero purpose. To be honest, the unit is still OK but it needs to be less expensive. At its current price with the need of an expensive upgrade for the range, it's just not worth it. Carrier : it's probably broken. Once you get ~8 carriers with proper support against any race it just feels like you won, and it's not too hard a task with the buffed build time. Maybe that could get some tweak too. Not a fan of the release interceptors thing that is rather unneeded and extremely forgiving with recall. Oracle : I really like stasis ward, and combining revelation + detection is interesting. It's still a unit I loathe because of how volatile it makes early game PvP, but I have to admit the new spells are quite nice.
Terran I have a lot of problems with how T is shaping out to be in LotV. Marauder nerf : I'm not sure I see the point, but why not... Reaper : I have no problem with the grenade stats, but does the knockback animation have to look so cartoonesque ? Ghost : I haven't seen much of the new snipe yet. I hope the unit gets some attention and becomes interesting in TvZ again. Liberator : Don't get me started on that thing. Liberators are just retarded. The amount of zone control they provide, with their ludicrous DPS, is out of this world. If the T player has a brain it's just so hard to play against Bio + some mines + Liberators as P because there is no way your stalkers can reach the liberators, to the point you kinda need air units. Not to mention the broken spots on some maps that you just can't deny without air units. I honestly would just like to see that unit gone. It's just everything the tank should have been, with frustrating design, anti-air abilities, retardedly high speed, the ability to be reactored and to fly. Does it sound right to you ? I don't even know how the unit can be redesigned/toned down, in my opinion it's hopeless. I'm not delusional, I know Blizzard will cling to that idea that a flying siege tank is awesome design, but this is not true. Cyclone : I don't like that unit either. Once they get their air upgrade, what's the downside of getting more cyclones ? It's just a massable, all-around unit with no real counterplay. Once again, the tank should be the ranged fearsome anti ground of mech, and the cyclone could have a goliath-ish role of good mid range anti-air and weak-ish anti-ground, whereas right now it's powerful long range all-around. Ridiculous. Pick-up siege tanks : I'm OK with picking up siege tanks to rescue them, but they should be dropped unsieged. Simple. Battlecruiser : I haven't seen much of the teleport ability, it's quite rare to see the T get a battlecruiser army. It looks silly, and it probably is, but if that can be an incentive for T players to go battlecruisers instead of liberators...
Zerg Ravager : they feel strong again, but not too strong. I think they're in a good spot. Lurkers : the damage is really high, and dealt maybe a bit too quickly in the line. I'm overall OK with the unit though. The range upgrade could maybe return. Drops : ha ha ha ha ha ha. Who ever thought drops on hatch tech was a good idea ? It comes so early it's ridiculous. This is just gimmicky and only creates retarded speedling all-ins. Needs to be moved to lair tech without the slightest doubt. Zerg drop play should be a good midgame option, not an all-in tool. Invincible Nydus : ha ha ha ha ha ha. Make the nydus spawn quicker if you want, or cancellable with all money returned, or less expensive, but please not that change. Ultras : they're definitely strong, but since I go air every game I don't get to see them much. Same for the cracklings. Vipers : parasitic bomb and corruptors could maybe get some love to be able to fight with carriers + HTs ? I dunno, some people told me vipers + corruptors + lurkers does just fine against carriers + HTs, while at the highest level people seem to agree that carriers + HTs has no counter. Needs to be monitored.
Overall, the game is still good and quite fun, but it's just not as solid as HotS. Stale though HotS was, it is a solid RTS. LotV feels a lot more random, especially with the accelerated early game that makes scouting really difficult. 4 players maps with no forced spawns should really disappear now. The eco change is probably too harsh, when I secure my third is usually the time my main begins to run out so it still feels like I'm just forced to expand. Could be toned down a bit further so that there is more strategy about expanding than the current gamble you often have to take, just rushing out for expands even without the tools to defend it.
I still have hope, but "mech" needs to get a massive overhaul ; cyclones + liberators is not mech, and the tank needs to become dangerous again (buff the damage to 50 and see what happens).
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I'll only speak about mech.
I'm not a fan of the medivac tank compo. I wish I could see single target damage buff to siege tanks that does not affect the splash damage. Also I'd like to see the Cyclones being revolved about AA role and small AG support. Mech lacks AA not AG. Hopefully that can be implemented.
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I still don't like tank drop and the new tempest and uncertain about the cyclone. but the whole game feels really fun to play, action packed and you feel more in control imo
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On July 27 2015 20:32 ETisME wrote: you feel more in control imo I strongly disagree with that, I think HotS was far less volatile overall. What do you mean exactly ?
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HoTS Masters Mech Terran here. I played fair few LotV games (~250) and got some feedback after playing purely mech in all 3 matchups
----------- Terran: -----------
Cyclones: Bit too good vs ground, insane range. Its AA accessed bit late. I'd prefer if its ground was toned down for being cheaper or less supply costly myself. Its bit too all-round while lockon against air is bit unreliable because of lock on activation delay
Tanks: Being able to be picked up, I am not really big fan of but its acceptable; I'd prefer if it was directly buffed instead of mobility buffed myself. Liberator+tanks I fee do the job that a tank should do but its pretty good combination. Pickup should be sieged->unsieged only imo.
Liberators: Bit strong early game and mid game but its AA is bit underwhelming and seems like its AG is its highlight.
Raven: Made it few times in LotV pre-nerf, never made it after nerf. Not really worth the cost. In Hots, I made craptons of them as it was useful allround but lotv its rather useless as raven is still bad in low numbers.
Thor: Almost forgot about this unit; I seldom make them. Maybe 1 or 2 if i see opponent on 2 base muta and/or i am not entirely sure what is coming. Getting the Raven treatment late and midgame; never really made unless situation calls for it.
Ghost: I only use it for emp but movement speed buff is nice.
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----------- Zerg ----------- Invincible Nydus: I never had trouble with it since mech is so much more mobile now with medivac tank and liberators being able to zoom around, but it is annoying not being able to do anything other than try to wall it off when you see it morphing or zerg starts spamming it everywhere lategame to draw your army. All ins involving it is very powerful but not impossible to hold.
Viper: Parasitic bomb makes an already good unit really damn good. Saving grace is that it won't be able to spam as much binding cloud as before with same count but it obliterates any air in lategame when it gets there; If it didnt stack and didn't have long range on vipers, it wouldn't be so bad but when viper hits the field with infestors, BL+deathball seems to be almost unbeatable. Very map specific though. BL/viper/infestor is very strong in Terraforma because of narrow chokes that allow air units to go around but on open maps, very dealable with super mobile cyclone.
Lurker: At glance, seems rather useless with siege tank range and liberators, but unsuspecting cyclone/hellion frontline could be obliterated if they step in without scanning. Nice zone control tool. Tank looks from afar with envy from its damage. Nice addition to zerg arsenal, especially vs bio and cyclon/hellion style They should probably nerf its damage/tankiness/burrow time since I am seeing people just burrow infront of bio army since its decently tanky and requires scan to reveal. I do like powerful immobile units like siege tank and lurker though.
But one thing that I really think should be changed: Its spine speed is so fast you can't dodge it with stimmed bio even if you preemptively move units. That would allow bio to deal with it better.
Ravager: honestly, its not great unless you have mass ones so you can line aoe stack against mech. Zerg seems to have trouble hitting air unit with aoe because of visual differences and small radius. Devastitng if hit but you need a lot of these to chain it or its too squishy to do anything.
Tier 1 drops: I've only seen it with gimmicky all in that is really obvious to see coming- Bunker at mineral line is must if you see this coming but shouldn't give that much trouble to prepared opponents-unless it is on 4 player map and you see it coming too late. Very powerful but i haven't seen it in normal play much other than a roach doomdrop that honestly woudl have been much better if nydused.
Ultras: Armor doesn't really affect mech play all that much due to strength of cyclone so no comment; Ultra-queen seems to last incredibly long time under siege tank fire but thats only time ive seen it.
BroodLord: To-Go Zerg deathball lategame, especially with the ranged buff. Viper/infestor/corruptor/BL is really hard to deal as mech with as para bomb air stack and/or fungal kills vikings and split vikings get picked off by corruptors and doesnt really allow focus firing (because split).
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----------- Protoss: ----------- Overall, I must say, I only really see all ins with this race. Its bit frustrating to play imo.
Adept: Boasted and advertised as all-round gateway unit that will allow protoss to have gateway power, I think doesn't really do that. It really is incredibly powerful early game, good midgame with shield upgrade, into not even worth building lategame as it does pitiful damage. It does soakup fucktons of damage though.
Certain all ins involving this unit feels really powerful such as shield upgrade timing or warp prism adept mass warp in and kinda limits what you can open with as bunkerless opening or cutting marine could mean a loss. Its ability is meh.
Against bio, its a different story. Each of them is cheaper than stalkers and is incredibly tank and bio seems to struggle against it when massed.
TL;DR: Basically an immortal for light units that fall into obscurity lategame. Makes early all ins stronger and... thats all.
Disruptor: Easy to dodge when you see it, rather useless unit. I haven't seen much of these
Collosus: Was bad vs mech before in hots, bad vs mech now.
Carrier: Short build time makes it bit frustrating to deal with as Cyclone AA is accessed very late. Release interceptor doesn't really expose carrier to any danger and is very powerful when released over production. As with any capital ship, it scales incredibly fast with more number it has and shorter build time only makes this problem higher. TBH, all the tvp either feels like 3 base carrier after adept/adept all in/blink all in. Widow mines deal with interceptors when there is less than 8ih carriers though.
Tempest: Really fast and has yamato on it. It still does near no damage and it feels better dealing with it wiht cyclone AA. Carrier is better so nobody really makes it.
Mothership: People actually build this now with speed buff. pretty powerful with carrier deathball army but w/e
Zealot: I never sen them made. No really reason to make them as adepts are only 25 gas more expensive.
OVERALL: I think its really fun game. Enough that I won't be going back on HotS. Mech isn't as defensive and is lot more mobile thanks to liberator being able to zoom up and zone out areas so tanks have time to siege and cyclone helps a lot to gain map control. I don't ever mass ravens now and stay fully defensive!
Action packed but bit hard to scout all ins. Sometimes you need to accept your loss.
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Losing interest, which is great for my other pursuits. David Kim reacts to loud nub whining rather listen to korean pros, so the game is a mess. HOTS makes more sense to me as a traditional RTS.
Cyclone, instant pickup and drop tank drops lol, Adept band-aid, forced expanding, Liberator, philosophy of injecting new units for no solid reason, eternal medivac buffs lol, zealots are better at harassing than zerglings lol, hard counter nature of SC2 design etc etc.
Ive seen enough of the Blizzard design/balance team to know that LotV looks more frustrating than a solid RTS. I hope they prove me wrong.
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Russian Federation1607 Posts
Like: - Many and constant updates compared to HotS - 12 starting workers - Disruptor - Lurkers (though a little too strong) - Ravagers - Liberator - New Oracle - New Broodlord range - Banshee with speed - New Raven and Ghost - New Marauder - New Zergling adrenaline - New Overlord drops - New Viper ability
Don't like: - Lags in beta - New "cutted" economy - Adept - 8 Colossus range (Lurkers outrange Colossus) - Cyclone - Siege Tank drop - Invulnerable nydus - 8 armor Ultralisk
Don't know: - New Swarm Hosts - New Warp Prism, Immortal, Battlecruiser, Tempest, Carrier
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Terran
Marauder : with lurker in the game that wrecks bio, and adepts which are beefy as fuck, the nerf has no more point anymore Ghost : I like the new snipe. Need to see how it turns out Thor : still a big clunky unit. Siege tank : siege drop makes TvT completly nuts. It needs a number buff instead Liberator : same thoughts as the OP Cyclone : needs to shoot air from the start with overall reduced damage
General thoughts : it's impossible to play bio against zerg now, which is really sad
Zerg
Zergling : oh gawd crackling is sooo good. Didn't I say it was impossible to go bio against Z? xD Overlord drop : right idea wrong way to go. The allins are real. Hydra : like the new timings opened Lurker : need a slight health nerf (200 HP? oO) Ravager : they're quite good now. Maybe increase a tiny wee bit the skillshot damage Corruptor : still extremly boring Broodlord : still useless in most situations Roach : burrow speed is bullshit now, need a huge nerf Ultralisks : less armor more health. It's just eating everything now. Viper : Holy cow just remove this idiotic spell right now. With air units stacking, now it's impossible to go air against zerg. Infestor : still useless, could use an AA ability once the stupid viper spell is removed
General thoughts : the most powerfull and complete race in LOTV right now
Protoss
Zealot : like the speed Adept : they don't need an health buff, but a damage buff. And they should be unlocked with twilight, right now it's impossible for terran to exapnd before he gets freaking cyclones. Part from that, I like the unit. Disruptor : TERRIBLE TERRIBLE UNIT. Awefull design, not a needed unit. Give a dragoon instead. Colossus : I don't get why everyone seems to hate this unit. It's a very fine unit whenever it's not freely massed (HOTS PvP). It's useless now. Prism : meh. Much too strong for no reason. MSC : REMOVE IT ALREADY Carriers : hahaha... Where do I start? Oh Yeah : the only single unit in the game that can't be countered in large amounts. And the "send interceptor" ability is just ridiculously broken. Tempest : I don't like the idea of the spell. It's unfair you can just target a unit and kill it for free, and it make proxy tempest builds too strong Oracle : I looooove the statis ward. It's quite skill based, quite easily avoided with correct micro from your opponent (sending a lone marine before moving out) but it forces reactions from the ennemy. Love it.
General thoughts : just like HOTS, protoss are the most binary race in the game. Either they can be stupidly weak (liberator hello), either ridiculously strong (mass carrier lolololo)
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Would probably be masters HotS if I still played it. GM LotV (lol, that placement...)
Zerg+ Show Spoiler +Ravager+ Show Spoiler + hands down the most fun new unit. Really great, an insanely versatile unit in the right hands that requires control and allows counterplay. Possibly its shot is a tiny bit too easy to dodge, and the unit is a tiny bit too strong on a-move for my liking. Also the button spamming is a bit annoying, yet also somehow satisfying if you don't have a lot of other stuff to micro. Lurker + Show Spoiler + still a very good unit. It provides a solid splash option to zerg ranged, it is great at killing deathballs and introduces a lot of positional play. The resulting gameplay can be kind of stale however and the balance of the unit is peculiar. It ranges from feeling overpowered (e.g. against Protoss) to useless (e.g. against Terran Mech) and the unit is kind of buried so deep in the techtree that in many situations when you'd need it, you cannot really get to it. For me it didn't have the big splash I would have wanted it to have against Terran bio play, especially since bio uses tank drops and liberators these days excessively which are excellent hardcounters and so are medivac drops. Also the unit overlaps greatly at all ends, which doesn't make it a bad unit - and often the lurker is the best out of all the options - but often it feels very unnecessary. Another upside is all the little micro implemented into the unit. The attack is dodgeable and the hold fire when burrowed button may provide the one or other sick play. Invincible Nydus + Show Spoiler + I can't say I really like it. The Nydus is still killable fast after it pops, but it feels kind of stupid if you sit your army around a building nydus and then just wait 20seconds. Also loading up queens that instaheal the nydus after they unload may prove too strong. I guess I generally don't like the large-scale teleportation idea in an RTS game. It feels like it will just create problems, but doesn't really make the nydus worm a more interesting tool, e.g. for lategame. Hatch tech drops + Show Spoiler + Fun feature to play with, but I'm not sure if people like having zerglings in their walled off base 3mins into the game. It singlehandedly makes forge expands unviable in PvZ - which I think is actually good, it is just a more passive form of expanding but not a different playstyle - and punishes many other openings severely. Though it turned out quite defendable after a few weeks (but got me to LotV GM before that hehehe). Once again, my main beef with it is that I'm not that into large-scale army transportation in RTS games. It makes for cheap moves like doomdrops, negates Terrain features and puts everything on par with flying units which are actually designed to fill these jobs. Strategically it solves a lot of problems. Possible Island bases for Terran don't force you into mutalisks as much as previously and can be claimed by a single drone drop. (e.g. on D&T). Ultralisk armor buff+ Show Spoiler + Unnecessary. It makes the ultralisk better against units it was already good before and combined with the marauder dual shot change goes overboard on the traditional MMM core composition. What I really don't like about it is that it provides no micro or mobility to the unit, it makes a clunky unit with little control needed/possible better and that's it. I guess I understand the intention behind it - Terrans should field higher tier options in the form of tanks, thors, ghosts, liberators - against the Ultralisk now that it really counters basic bio play. But I think this could have been done in a much more interesting way than an armor buff. Corruptor ability+ Show Spoiler + Can't say I have really used it, besides trying it out. Maybe it will become a thing. But I haven't really understood what I could use it for at the moment. I don't really dig the concept, it doesn't make the corruptor a more microable unit, though it may add something to its strategical value. However, a channeling ability used in enemy terrain is probably going to be really boring... Parasitic Bomb+ Show Spoiler + The spell feels too good against smaller air units, while not providing a lot against Captial Ships. One thing I really don't like is that the spell cannot target interceptors, because killing its interceptors should be a weakness of the carrier but you cannot do that with this tool designed to counter small aircrafts... The micro around it (splitting etc.) is well implemented though, maybe a radius nerf would put this spell more into balance. Otherwise, I like it and like the strategic positioning of it on the T3 Viper to shut down heavy air play, a department in which zerg has been lacking ever since the fungal nerfs of HotS. Tweaks to other units+ Show Spoiler + Maybe I'm forgetting something, but here it goes. The combined Hydralisk Upgrade was on my wishlist since HotS beta. Broodlords with 11range are probably necessary given how many longrange units terran has gotten and they don't really feel overpowered. Broodlords could already extend their range to ~13 with micro in HotS, so I feel like it is a minor buff. But I would need to check the exact implementation in the editor first to make a final statement. So far it looks ok. Adrenalin Glands to 40% might prove to be too strong and I'd rather liked the cost to be dropped to 100/100. Most of the stuff is solid, but not exciting. Swarm Hosts are probably broken at the moment, but maybe not. Not enough experience. Terran+ Show Spoiler +Cyclone + Show Spoiler +The unit is fun to play with, but that is probably because it is broken at the moment. Either (Z/P) players haven't figured out counterplay to it, or there is none. Initiating the attack from 9range and then endlessly kitting up to 15range is way too much and hardly anything can interact with the cyclone. It also allows Terran to presiege in the safest manner (no siege tension) and then just kite back with the cyclones who scout and clean the way to move forward. I believe a balanced version of the cyclone would be quite frustrating for both sides, because then the cyclone wouldn't kill anything fast (it can infinitely kite, so it cannot kill stuff fast) and the opponent would still not have a lot of counterplay and just try trade them down eventually. Playing against them feels a lot like old swarm hosts, and I think for zerg that is going to be the counter - swarm hosts, the only unit with enough range and little enough commitment to be useful against cyclones. Strategically the unit was great against Protoss, though the lack of early antiair on the current patch took a lot of that away. The unit has some potential, but the insanely long range (up to 15!) really makes it horrible to play against. Also the small micro interaction with the lock-on breaking when vision is lost is mildly interesting in the lategame, because of omnipresent scans. Liberator + Show Spoiler +The unit has potential, but the current build feels very rushed. As if the design team didn't have the unit planned and then quickly threw together a unit and made some basic tweaks so it didn't feel out of place initially. Nowadays with 2 of 3 TvZs being liberator rushes it does feel out of place with its 75dps + siege range. For context, that's more dps than 2 battlecruisers. Now I don't want to say the unit is necessarily broken and people are figuring out counters to rushes, but yes, the early cliff/air space abuse to checkmate mineral lines while forcing opponents into airtech probably is. And though this is a timing and not a stats problem, I would like this unit to get a more severe overwork (keep the design, nerf some stats, buff it in some other way) to put its stats more in line with the rest of the game. The current implementation basically means that Terran draws circles on the ground and the opponent than cannot touch those circles. What bigass no-micro-zones mean for the fun of the game goes hopefully without saying. Oh, and it has antiair too and sometimes counters its counters, forcing you to rush corruptors instead of mutas which then are useless and boring. BC Teleportation + Show Spoiler +Unnecessary and weird buff to an amove unit. Currently doesn't allow any countermicro, so basically you will never catch single BCs and you are just chasing them so that they recall. Probably won't see a lot of play and not what the BC needed, though at least it is something on an underused unit. Reaper Grenade + Show Spoiler +The counterbuff to the inherent reapernerf due to economy. I've seen those mass reaper plays against zerg, but haven't played or experienced them. Otherwise, the grenade has a very low impact on the game. It could be visually less comicky, the units bouncing around looks a bit stupid. But the ability is not bad. It's a button-click ability, but in general it's OK. Tankivacs + Show Spoiler +I'm on team "This is against the tanks identity, buff it in another way". Otherwise it is good for tanks. It is bad for certain gameplay (e.g. TvT) because it means more doomdrops. It is good for other gameplay, because tanks can be used with the army again (e.g. TvZ). It isn't broken or anything. Other stuff + Show Spoiler +Mass Raven is now probably useless, but it probably was useless before because of parasitic bomb and cyclones and buffed carriers. The new autoturrets are pretty strong at harassing though, but I think they need a bit more lifetime again. Banshee speed... I guess why not. Armory Upgrades... Don't know, don't care. They should make a design decision and stick with it. Either Starport tech is part of Mech, or it isn't. Just decide and stick with it and balance around it, instead of using designs to balance. Protoss+ Show Spoiler +Adept + Show Spoiler +I think the upgrade with +50shields is over the top. Terran deals with it by EMPing, but the other two races have to deal with a tanky, ranged unit that hardcounters their light melee units. The shadow walking or whatever it is called could use a little more counterplay, but isn't all that problematic. The unit could use a little more micro-capabilities and be balanced around those instead of strong stats, e.g. the ability to teleport to the shadow at any moment in its lifetime. Also I would have liked the unit to be faster to compete with zerglings for mappresence, but it is what it is and that isn't all too bad. Protoss has longtime needed a second groundfocused, straight up costefficient unit on their gateway tech and the adept is just that. The overlap with the zealot in both, tanking role and to take down certain units like zerglings or marines in the early game does hurt the adept. Still, I need to emphasize that the unit fills an empty space by concept and that is good. Disruptor + Show Spoiler +Too hit-or-miss. The invulnerability is anti-trading and the unit still dies anytime no warp prism is present. Personally, I don't like the concept. It feels like a Protoss baneling but without the suicide dynamic which is the whole reason why banelings are so cool. The unit should be scrapped and Protoss should be given something else in my opinion. Or rather just redesign boring units like the Colossus and Archon and let the Templar take a more prominent role in Protoss build orders. Warp Prism pick up range + Show Spoiler +More ways to prevent units from dying is probably the wrong direction for protoss. Their units need to trade better when dying, not be invincible/uncatchable. But it provides micro which is good. And in the right hands this is going to be godlike! (e.g. with immortals). The thing itself is good, though I think 4-5range would be enough. Also it needs a nicer visual animation now, things just disappear and it is often unclear where they went. New Oracle + Show Spoiler +Stasis Field is a pure anti-micro spell and I don't really like it. The combination of revelation and envision sounds like a great idea, but the Protoss feedback hasn't been good on it, I guess due to DT rushes in PvP? The unit is still as annoying as ever, in particular when playing Terran. But the changes at least helps the unit to get a bit out of the early-rush-don't-use-again corner. Buffed Carrier + Show Spoiler +The unit feels very strong. The Interceptor AI is really good and makes it almost like a 14range unit, which makes it very hard to engage the Carriers without taking heavily losses initially. The unit feels very lowskill/lowmicro and very powerful at the moment, but this may wear off. The direction is the right one and finally targetswitching is reasonably possible. (tank god!) Other + Show Spoiler +Warpgate weakness doesn't really change a lot but its a tiny step in the right direction. I guess drops are now even stronger, lol. Colossus nerf... I have played against the nerfed colossus, it is still not superbad, but probably not efficient enough and it hasn't made the unit more interesting. Just worse. The new Tempest ability might be broken in the lategame and lead to swarm host like turtle play while the ability kills the opponent 1by1, but I honestly couldn't tell because noone builds them. Immortal barrier ability is good, but I really don't like the click-me-now-nature of it. Recall at 50energy is too cheap. This is going to be a real deal once the game is being figured out and protoss will just never lose their army when they attack. Zealot speed buff is nice but has a low impact. Economy+ Show Spoiler +I plainly don't like it that my bases run out of money so fast. The only upside is that ZvT it has gotten easier to just starve out the Terran when they start to just sit behind mines and tanks or whatever and hope you attack into them. The resulting gameplay still feels like a generic 3base build up and then you nomade around replacing your bases. First and Second bases often run out very fast and when you are not in a lead then the game often drags on on low economy but high production. This is particularily bad in vsT matchups, because if the Terran acquires another base (which he doesn't need to invest into) he can just mule hammer and have an insane income compared to a P/Z who is struggling to even afford the hatchery/nexus in these sitatuions. The 12worker start is over the top imo. It makes scouting hard and leads to some very strong allins fuelled by the higher economy, while tech comes out comparatively later and is thus often hard to reach. And again this change probably favors Terran who now have 12vs12 workers, when previously they'd be a few workers behind in this economic situation. Not the biggest of deals but it messes with balance a little. I personally think that both these changes don't achieve that much of what they were intented for - build ups still exist and take several minutes, 3basing is still a thing - but mess with balance and make the game very stressful even without interaction with your opponent.
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i beat gm players then lose to plat players, i think the ladder is still balancing itself.
they should buff tank and remove the drop gimmick, i dunno how long people have been asking blizzard to try out a tank buff but now is the perfect time to try it.
i dont want cyclone to be the main unit of mech
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mc said there are no good players in legacy. makes him bored
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I agree with you nearly completely. Great points. I play at the same level as you.
And, I can't outright tell what race you play based on your post, so I don't think it's whiny. My guess is Zerg, though?
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