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What about something where you can upgrade the damage to be the charge on hit uses up some or all of the zealot shields.
This way the damage is done as a real initial boost for harassment, but then the zealot is also much easier to kill. If you are then using the zealot as more of a meat shield you can turn that ability off to save the shields.
I don't know how you'd have to adjust things, but basically give the zealot 30 shields and the ability can only be used when the zealot is at full shield so that if someone uses good micro to get the shield down you don't get that bonus damage.
Just trying to think of a way to get the damage boost but make a trade with health so that you can use the zealot as high damage harass or lower damage shield late game.
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On August 28 2015 04:17 GoodRamen wrote: Why not have charge be a passive speed boost as well as giving them the passive ability to not have their speed reduce by any spells? That seems to be a good buff to them.
Then it would be too hard to kite zealots. Its an interessting proposition and it might work, but I feel it removes too much important counterplay to the already powerful deathball
On August 28 2015 04:28 Allred wrote: I think a change so that the zealot charge does like 30 damage but only to armored units. ( or only to light units) This way good players can turn off charge and selectivly target high priority units. Charge would still be good for beginers since it is easy to use, but have a huge skill ceiling, similar to how there isn't really a ceiling to how well you split marines vs banes.
Another cool idea, but I don't see why its needed: zealots in the mid-lategame aren't supposed to be the bulk of the damage: rather, the squishy archons, high templar and robo/stargate units are. If anything, we should be finding a way to make the protoss deathball be weaker instead of stronger. Zealots already do a ton of damage when harassing. Another complaint from a lot of protosses these days is that there are too many actives on units that dont need it, and it feels like theyre playing a moba instead of a strategy game: void ray charge and immortal shields are the two most unnecessary actives, and they can just be replaced by a passive so that the protoss can focus on more relevant tasks and micro such as the disruptor, blink micro, forcefields, storms, and dealing with things around the map. A cool idea, but I'm afraid it would become one of these unecessary actives that protoss already has too many of.
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I really like this idea.
On a side note about Zealot/Adept overlap. The Adept is just a tankier roach with a teleport move. Completely horrible unit in every way. Regardless of whatever cheese it's part of, as far as its fit into the Protoss main army, it'll either be too cheap for its stats and thus overlap with the Zealot as the anchoring unit in a gateway composition, or it'll be too expensive for its stats and thus won't be part of the mid/late game gateway army. Or best case, it'll fill the same role as the Zealot just as well as the Zealot and thus be 110% pointless in a gateway army.
I hope it's not too late for the unit to be removed/reworked.
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As a biased as fuck protoss, I love the new charge. It's hilariously good.
Every game, charge first, warp prism, 4 zealot drop into chargelot archon with some adepts into storm.
Then I see hitman doing immortal zealot all in and I think 'imagine that with 30 damage charge....' NNnnnnggggghhhhhhhh
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A pure speed upgrade? I think this would be way too strong for Zealots.
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On August 28 2015 04:33 FLuE wrote: What about something where you can upgrade the damage to be the charge on hit uses up some or all of the zealot shields.
This way the damage is done as a real initial boost for harassment, but then the zealot is also much easier to kill. If you are then using the zealot as more of a meat shield you can turn that ability off to save the shields.
I don't know how you'd have to adjust things, but basically give the zealot 30 shields and the ability can only be used when the zealot is at full shield so that if someone uses good micro to get the shield down you don't get that bonus damage.
Just trying to think of a way to get the damage boost but make a trade with health so that you can use the zealot as high damage harass or lower damage shield late game.
i really like this suggestion, adds depth and multi-purpose to a pretty one-dimensional unit
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Zealots are already viable in the late game. They're a staple versus Terran and are useful versus all races as a mineral dump and harassment unit. Instead of making the Zealot even better, the logical choice is to fix the Adept which is overshadowing the Zealot and limiting its usage. Logic has never been Blizzard's strong suit. They're much better at making flashy things go boom.
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Czech Republic12116 Posts
On August 28 2015 00:22 starimk wrote:Show nested quote +On August 27 2015 21:10 deacon.frost wrote: I mean charge is direct response in the game to concussive shells(from the design of the game) and it was buffed several times because of this skill. Lol, no. If you watch the 2007 SC-II alpha demo it's very clear that charge came first. Concussive shells didn't come out until the Battle Report in 2009. I was referring to that patch(1.3.0) where they introduced the "Charge hits at least once" mechanic. That is important. before the patch the zealots could be kited to death never hitting the bio. After that patch you could actually play a zealot/templar compositions and I dare to say that was the funniest PvT composition in SC2 untill Blizzard killed it.
On August 28 2015 19:31 summerloud wrote:Show nested quote +On August 28 2015 04:33 FLuE wrote: What about something where you can upgrade the damage to be the charge on hit uses up some or all of the zealot shields.
This way the damage is done as a real initial boost for harassment, but then the zealot is also much easier to kill. If you are then using the zealot as more of a meat shield you can turn that ability off to save the shields.
I don't know how you'd have to adjust things, but basically give the zealot 30 shields and the ability can only be used when the zealot is at full shield so that if someone uses good micro to get the shield down you don't get that bonus damage.
Just trying to think of a way to get the damage boost but make a trade with health so that you can use the zealot as high damage harass or lower damage shield late game. i really like this suggestion, adds depth and multi-purpose to a pretty one-dimensional unit Yes, give to each protoss unit an active ability so then we will see the true micro. Unless you want to remove some abilities it's very unfortunate to add more of them. I am not against micro but I would like to have some real micro, not some "now I will turn on ability on these units, MICRO GOD!!!!"
The idea sound nice though.
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On August 28 2015 22:24 deacon.frost wrote:Yes, give to each protoss unit an active ability so then we will see the true micro. Unless you want to remove some abilities it's very unfortunate to add more of them. I am not against micro but I would like to have some real micro, not some "now I will turn on ability on these units, MICRO GOD!!!!" The idea sound nice though.
thats not really an ability you have to turn on in battle, like the new immo barriers or void rays, but more of a pre-battle decision, like morphing hellions to hellbats
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Czech Republic12116 Posts
On August 28 2015 22:46 summerloud wrote:Show nested quote +On August 28 2015 22:24 deacon.frost wrote:Yes, give to each protoss unit an active ability so then we will see the true micro. Unless you want to remove some abilities it's very unfortunate to add more of them. I am not against micro but I would like to have some real micro, not some "now I will turn on ability on these units, MICRO GOD!!!!" The idea sound nice though. thats not really an ability you have to turn on in battle, like the new immo barriers or void rays, but more of a pre-battle decision, like morphing hellions to hellbats Oh, this way. I have high dosage of painkillers to keep my shoulder OKish so that's my excuse(and it's Friday hot afternoon at work :D). I still would like to see something else, but it's beta, we could try it, it could be good and playable. They can use the scythe from campaign to show the difference and during "morphing" they could prepare the scythe So the enemy knows what's the stuff incoming
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Good suggestion and well written post, Thanks!
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On August 28 2015 23:01 deacon.frost wrote:Show nested quote +On August 28 2015 22:46 summerloud wrote:On August 28 2015 22:24 deacon.frost wrote:Yes, give to each protoss unit an active ability so then we will see the true micro. Unless you want to remove some abilities it's very unfortunate to add more of them. I am not against micro but I would like to have some real micro, not some "now I will turn on ability on these units, MICRO GOD!!!!" The idea sound nice though. thats not really an ability you have to turn on in battle, like the new immo barriers or void rays, but more of a pre-battle decision, like morphing hellions to hellbats Oh, this way. I have high dosage of painkillers to keep my shoulder OKish so that's my excuse(and it's Friday hot afternoon at work :D). I still would like to see something else, but it's beta, we could try it, it could be good and playable. They can use the scythe from campaign to show the difference and during "morphing" they could prepare the scythe So the enemy knows what's the stuff incoming
there is a model for dark zealots thats used in the campaign that would be perfect for the damage-on-impact-chargelots
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