TL Mafia XLIV
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Player List 22. Foolishness Foolishness the Veteran Officer has been torn to pieces wtf? | ||
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On August 19 2011 05:08 GreYMisT wrote: Im not sure that 6 for 1 trade was good for us. sure killing the demon is good, but throwing one of our mods into the depths of hell? Cool, but what I actually asked was what do you think of the chances of Foolishness (he's actually in this game) as being the Town Vet? | ||
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-_- | ||
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Lucidity was there when I explained in AA why claiming green is extremely Anti Town. So what gives, Lucid? | ||
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No lynch should never happen except in certain cases at mylo. | ||
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What point are you trying to get at xtfftc? | ||
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On August 19 2011 08:37 Lucidity wrote: Well Well a lot of the players on TL are arrogant and aggressive... Not exactly the most encouraging atmosphere for new players to share their thoughts. But to anyone who might feel intimidated or hesitant to post... Don't. You have nothing to lose \;D/ And you'll actually be helping town. So post post. On that note, how do you feel about Lynch All Lurkers Curu? I asked you a question first. Where's your answer? I don't agree with policy lynches as a whole. When it's someone like Kenpachi who is harmful to Town whichever side he's on, I'd consider it, but a general lynch all lurkers policy is way too easily manipulated by Mafia. | ||
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On August 19 2011 08:40 Navillus wrote: Text wall So you're going to be the one to decide who we lynch out of the lurker list? And you decide that we have to implement lynch all lurkers? And if you want someone lynched, we have to lynch them? I don't think so. We've had a good track record of lynching scum near the start of the game and none of it has come from blind policy lynches. You don't want lurkers to be a problem, then don't be a lurker. Lynching someone simply for lurking is stupid, lynching someone who's lurking and looking scummy is good. @xtfftc Again any Townie should have the mindset that their life is expendable. If you are active and good enough to find a scum then die for it, you've provided a net gain for the Town. What you're proposing gives excuses for people to play a terrible playstyle for Town. | ||
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You expect people to answer your questions while refusing to answer back? Way to promote a good Town atmosphere. | ||
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chaos what's your opinion on Jackal? | ||
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On August 19 2011 23:39 Sevryn wrote: Right now DB is looking the scummiest imo and after what palmar did in Swedish house mafia I am inclined to trust him. That said if there is a good case against anyone else i would be willing to give DropBear another lookskie ## vote DropBear lol this is the scummiest vote I have ever seen. | ||
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Thanks for drawing Sevyrn out though. So Sevyrn, because Palmar was a Townie in a completely different game, you decide to trust him and sheep his vote blindly? | ||
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On August 20 2011 01:09 xtfftc wrote: Sorry but who/what is Nemesis? The picture explains it all. What do you think about Sevyrn? | ||
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Palmar why is DB scum over Sevyrn? He made a stupid policy post in Werewolves too and he was a Medic. | ||
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On August 20 2011 01:56 Palmar wrote: read both posts. notice the different attitude. He's calling shit stupid and has balls in werewolf and ptp2. He's being super-duper cautious this time around. READ THEM AGAIN NEMESIS, READ THEM I can see your point, but I don't think DropBear and Sevyrn can both be scum. Sevyrn's post was just such an awful "I don't want to be seen having an opinion, so I will make up a bad reason to follow Palmar and then excuse myself from doing anything else the rest of the day" vote that I'm far more convinced on him than Drop. But let's see how Droppy defends himself. | ||
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On August 20 2011 04:22 GreYMisT wrote: Alright I'm back and caught up, for the most part it seems. some stuff still confuses me though. Palmar, I think multiple people agree that we are going to need additional reasoning behind your HEAVY aggression on DB. Just because he posted a policy post is simply not enough. He did it in the werewolf game and flipped medic. That being said... DB, though I agree that a no-lynch must be avoided, I think electing an informal mayor is a terrible idea. the mayor could end up being mafia. Nominating yourself is a little bit odd, as well as supplying the reasoning "and most importantly I am town." This sounds like something someone would say who defiantly isn't town. additional to that is the fact that nominating yourself mayor makes you a very high priority target for the mafia on night1. Though i disagree with your reasoning and methods palmar, i am inclined to feel a bit wary about DB myself. I look forward to being potentially swayed by your evidence. So did you have something original to add in? All I see here is rehashing what everyone else has already said. Don't wait for Palmar to sway you and sheep him, make the case yourself. | ||
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On August 20 2011 06:52 BrownBear wrote: I asked for something of substance and this is what I got? Oh, you. Ok, something you've pulled out of my reasoning that really just wasn't there. You're saying I want to lynch someone inactive. Not necessarily true. Implied, maybe, but NOT what I said. Again, you really need to stop putting words in people's mouths. What I said there, and what anyone who took 5 seconds to think rationally got out of that sentence before you started spewing shit all over it, is that regardless of what I think about DropBear's alignment (and for the record, I think he's more green than not. Scummy, possibly, but not confirmed scum), I want to see people post more. We're on only 17 pages halfway through the first day, which is kind of sad. I want more content. DropBear's providing it. I'm for lynching any of the semi-actives - that is, the people who are just contributing one liners and sheeping along to do the bare minimum to fly under the radar. Inactives = people who haven't noticed the game's started yet, people in different time zones who are sleeping, or people who don't care about the game. No reason wasting a vote on them - modkills will get them soon enough. The real area where mafia are probably lurking are the semi-actives - the guys who have posted a few times to be able to say "hey, I was here", but haven't contributed anything of substance or worth to the discussion. That doesn't include DropBear right now. At the very least, he's provoking discussion both about his silly fake-mayor plan, and about whether or not he's red. He's defending himself and providing some alternate ideas. (Although, DropBear, "I will do so if it becomes necessary"? Really? That's not doing you any favors, bro). Right now, my list of semi-actives include: wherebugsgo, hiro protagonist, Foolishness, and JeeJee (when you read his posts, they don't contribute nearly as much as they do ask questions that go unanswered). I'm open to adding more to that list tho. So let's start talking about those guys! JeeJee is the most suspicious to me right now: He's posted the most, but I see not all that much in his posts... it looks to me as though he's trying to post while not adding anything of value to town discussion. Just a gut feeling, but I still feel a lot better about lynching him than I do DropBear. Anyway, long story short: You read things out of my post that didn't exist, those things are the entire basis of your case against me, your case against me sucks, gg, try harder. ##Vote: JeeJee I don't agree with lynch inactives. Way too easily manipulated by Mafia as every lurker would look the exact same and they could point you in the direction of one of them. Absolutely no discussion nor relevant information comes from simply policy lynching. The simplest way to deal with lurkers it to encourage people not do it. Everyone should know it's anti Town as hell to sit in the shadows and do nothing, so no Townie should be inclined to lurk anyways. If you can't keep interest, then ask to be replaced. Don't make us deal with you. Nobody else sees Sevyrn over there (hi Sevyrn!)? The worst reason for a vote I have ever seen in my life, followed by "I wasn't actually voting I was pressuring but I unvoted as soon as he made a post" followed by "I unvoted cause I don't want people to lynch me." | ||
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Vote Sevyrn for me then. Look at dem posts. | ||
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lynch sevyrn | ||
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I will be good Townie tmrw | ||
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On August 20 2011 23:38 chaos13 wrote: Let's take a brief look at the sevryn bandwagon. Did it build up quickly? Has there been any noticeable defense that appears flimsy or false or nervous? I don't think he's scum. Really? Since Sevyrn made that awful post there's been cases attempted on DropBear, BrownBear, Mig, Palmar calling everyone scum, it goes on. A DEFENSE THAT ISN'T FLIMSY? LOOK AT THIS SHIT: On August 19 2011 23:39 Sevryn wrote: Right now DB is looking the scummiest imo and after what palmar did in Swedish house mafia I am inclined to trust him. That said if there is a good case against anyone else i would be willing to give DropBear another lookskie ## vote DropBear On August 20 2011 03:41 Sevryn wrote: That was my whole point I didn't say it was a pressure vote untill after he responded and I took my vote off because palmar has a shitty case and I didn't want people to lynch me because they thought I was just bandwagoning LOOK AT THIS. THAT IS THE SCUMMIEST VOTE REASON ANYONE HAS EVER SEEN IN THE ETERNITY OF ANYTHING. That is an EVEN scummier unvote reason. He wants to leave his vote uselessly somewhere. Then replies that he knew it was useless, but he's unvoting because he doesn't want us to lynch him. This is the post that "convinced" Sevyrn to take his vote off DropBear: On August 20 2011 02:46 DropBear wrote: OK wtf Palmar? I actually don't understand. What is your problem with me exactly? Nearly all of your posts are one liners that are some variation of "Kill DropBear". The "not safe" post you link included a joke about Harry Potter, a complete throwaway vote on kitaman27 and a joke about sandroba's plans. My first post in this thread advocated forcing people to change their vote, how is that so incredibly safe compared PTP2? I don't actually understand your case, I will talk to you more if you actually come up with something. My posts are 2 pages after the game started. 2 pages. Half the players hadn't even posted yet and most of the ones who did posted nothing other than "/confirm". How do you expect me to have reads on people before they have even posted, through divination? Time travel? What's with the random defence of your actions at the end? It's like you know it's a stupid idea, but you're doing it anyway. Yeah bullshit, nothing here makes him look unscummy enough to cancel the "pressure vote" that Sevyrn knew was useless on him anyways. He unvoted because we were calling him out for his terrible voting and doesn't want to get lynched. | ||
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I like it. | ||
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On August 21 2011 02:26 Palmar wrote: chances of sevryn flipping scum: ~0.2% You seem awfully certain. You redFFing bro? | ||
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On August 21 2011 02:31 Palmar wrote: I'm pretty amazed that you don't see this, because normally your town play is relatively solid and your reads good. I see Sevyrn being scummy as all hell. His past games as Town he's looked scummy too, but in a different way. He's not afraid to put his vote on someone and keep it there unless someone brings up a better case against someone else. He defends his vote and attacks people who call his vote a sheep or bandwagon (him vs Lucidity in Kurumi's game). Here he's retracted his vote altogether, not made enemies with anyone calling him out for scuminess and disappeared forever. How do you not see this? | ||
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Sevyrn is radioactive and any scum buddies wouldn't openly defend him with a 10 foot stick. If not for the fact that you showed up as the next candidate and that I don't think you're capable of playing that badly, defending Sevyrn so hard when there is absolutely nothing Townie about him would look suspicious. | ||
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I'm asking for your thoughts on Sevyrn. Surely you have some thoughts on Sevyrn just from reading the thread like a good diligent Townie would be doing. I don't want a carefully crafted opinion or analysis, I want to know what you think about Sevyrn right now. | ||
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I like nard and Rayzor as lynches. Nard and Rayzor are both trying to plan where to point the finger for DB/Sevyrn lynches: On August 21 2011 04:55 RayzorFlash wrote: Town right now loses NOTHING by lynching Sev. If he flips red, we immediately know who to go after next, i.e. the people defending him, or the people trying to get someone else lynched first. If he flips green, we can target the ones who have most aggressively tried to get him lynched. Its a win-win situation. On August 19 2011 20:42 nard wrote: regarding the early accusations: i see nothing yet which lets me believe we have a scum for certain. but i am damaged from last mini mafia: if dropbear ever dies and turns out to be not scum, Palmar is on my hit list :D hiro protagonist receives the "page full of useless posts" award. Wait no, that goes to JeeJee. Or Vain. darkponcho? Oh, ohhh, chaoser and Mig! We expect more from you two. | ||
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On August 21 2011 08:26 Lucidity wrote: Hey guys. Sorry I've been afk. Was at a wedding today. It's 1:30am and I'm fucktried. Who are the 2 main suspects so that I can filter their posts? I don't want to make an absolutely useless vote. The two main suspects are Lucidity and Kurumi. | ||
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We only have two hours though, how many people are here? | ||
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On August 21 2011 10:14 Navillus wrote: Ok guys, all the scum voting for Sev obviously won't switch their votes, but if you are town and you are voting for sev please switch it's very unlikely that he's scum because he got bandwagoned so easily and when there were plenty of options he was the one bandwagoned, scum wouldn't let that happen to one of their own this will also let us get better reads on the people who leave their votes on sev. How are you so sure Sev isn't scum? I'm still leaning scum on him though his defense appears a lot more genuine now, I'd only consider switching because Rayzor looks scummy as fuck. | ||
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Did you just post that? Really? | ||
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....... Really? | ||
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I think one of chaoser and Mig is Mafia. The vibe I get is that one of them threw their vote uselessly onto the other, the other picked up on how the vote was for terribly shitty reasons and pegged the other as Mafia. I'll have to re-read the thread and their posts to form an opinion on which is which. Did everyone just forget about this guy? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=254174&user=53652 Every post he has made is useless and general up until the last few minutes, where he made a post that basically said "I'm going to vote for Rayzor wait I'm going to vote for Sevyrn I kinda think" then plopped his vote on Sevyrn without being willing to switch, preventing a possible Rayzor lynch. Let's not forget the people that disappeared around the time of Sevyrn's lynch either. We have Foolishness's hit to generate information, yes, but don't forget the information generated from our lynch. I'll be re-reading the thread now. | ||
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On August 23 2011 00:41 Jackal58 wrote: Mig/Vain. Either one. Pick one and lynch the fuck out of them. If Mig flips scum I'm willing to look at Palmar as more of a townie. If Vain flips scum I'm willing to give Foolishness another look see. Neither Foolishness nor Palmar give me a warm fuzzy feeling atm but looking at how Mig and Vain hammered home the lynch on Sevryn without so much as a howdy do I am pretty certain one of them is scum if not both. Where'd your Pyo accusation go? | ||
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On August 23 2011 00:56 Palmar wrote: Foolishness made some correct observations on day 1. In addition he claimed a shot in a way I don't think Scumishness would've done. However, the medic who saved him should absolutely claim at some point, I've not concluded how and when is the best point to claim. I think claiming before this night would be stupid. Perhaps just as this night ends in case he gets shot? I don't know. ....why are you blue fishing the Medic? Foolishness is in no danger of being lynched at the moment, there are a million scummier people in this Town. | ||
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I see no reason to disbelieve Foolisness's claim, especially with the RBer add-on. If no one gets RBed the rest of the game, he comes under suspicion and Foolishness makes sense as a N1 hit. I see no reason for the Medic to out himself to "confirm" a guy who shouldn't need to be confirmed at this point anyways. | ||
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As I said, one of Mig or Chaoser is probably scum because I don't think either is bad enough to park their vote on an OMGUS and not discuss anything else. I'm not ready to lynch him just based on lack of day 1 posting, he was completely invisible in WaW2 and AA (though to be fair AA was a PM game) on the first day of both games. I still need to read through but Personality has me kind of pissed off so I can't muster up the energy atm. My scumtell for Mig has always been if he doesn't catch a scum by day 2, he's probably scum. | ||
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Two days and only a single meta argument/accusation from Mig. ##Vote Mig | ||
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afk | ||
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If you're scum, feel free to continue. | ||
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On August 23 2011 07:08 Foolishness wrote: You were in DrH's experimental game with Mig. Does anything about his behavior this game resemble that game? I don't even remember tbh, I was trolling that entire game and trying to get Coagulation lynched. | ||
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Vain is someone we should look at, I have no idea why Palmar thinks xtffc is Town. | ||
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On August 23 2011 10:28 Mig wrote: I know some people are going to cry omgus omgus vote here but I wanted to go back and look through all the posts of the people jumping on my bandwagon first. And dropbear looks extremely scummy to me. Here are the points against him 1) His play at the start of the game. Dropbear starts the game off with fluff posts concerning no lynches and his mayor thing. While palmar is attacking him and generating actual discussion that can be used to find scum, db is deflecting the discussion onto unrelated subjects. And as soon as soon as palmar calls him out on this db tries to turn it around and tries to actually take credit for getting discussion started. When really he has done 0 scum hunting and all his posts are bland ways to look like you are contributing. 2) Contradictions. Look at some of these quotes by db. Ok so he wants to lynch hiro for not giving reasons for his sevryn vote, he also thinks there is no case against me. Then this is his post where he votes me on day2. Gives absolutely no reasons for voting me even though he had said earlier there was no case against me huh? What changed your mind dropbear? He also states he is fine with hiro now for trying to deflect the sevryn lynch when I had done the exact same thing. 3) Activity. Don't look at the amount of posts DB has overall but look at when he is active. He was extremely active right at the start of day 1 posting where he has a bunch of fluff and tried to claim town cred for it. However what about after that? He pretty much disappears then shows up right before the end of day 1 makes 2 short posts attacking hiro and chaoser and disappears. So he introduced 2 new candidates right at the end of the day BUT didn't stick around to actually push for their lynches. He knew sevryn was going to flip green and didn't want to get any backlash from it so instead he posted a couple short cases against people not in danger of being lynched and then vanished to let the town argue amongst themselves. And what about day2? We are 24 hours in and db has one post. This is classic mafia activity. Active right at the start of the game where he is trying to buy town cred for himself but once we get deeper in and real analysis starts he is completely MIA. So seriously look at DB's posts and ask yourself what his motivations are. Has he put any effort into scum hunting? Does he care if town makes the correct decisions? No. He comes in posts a ton at the start to buy credit but afterwards he basically sits out of the sevryn lynch, doesn't push for the people he actually thinks are scummy to be lynched at all and then on day2 he votes for me because it is a chance to jump on a bandwagon to get a strong town player lynched even though he had said earlier there was no case against me. #Vote Dropbear This is the best case posted yet IMO. I really don't like this post by Jackal: On August 23 2011 09:24 Jackal58 wrote: Sure I did. It was a coin flip between you and Vain. It was your late vote on Sevryn to hammer home a lynch when it was almost shifted to Rayzor. Explain please. Coinflip sure, but why Mig? If Town he is undoubtedly the stronger player than Vain. Mig had actually tried to start something about chaoser earlier, whereas Vain jumped in with an absolutely nonsensical post that was complete flip-floppery over Sevyrn/Rayzor yet conveniently landed his vote on Sevyrn and disappeared. He has also shown no interest or contributing or scumhunting, only in defending himself. Vain for sure looked worse than Mig and Mig is for sure the more dangerous player against Mafia. Yet you chose to put your votes on Mig when there was a wagon building up on him from Foolishness/chaoser rather than pursuing Vain. Can you explain this more? xtffc's "two town kills" slip definitely needs to be looked at, and I don't buy his defense. He describes town kills as kills that the Town makes, but that has absolutely nothing to do with modkills. Town does not control modkills, sick slip????? chaoser is a mostly meta argument but he has been so useless this game. His vote is an OMGUS onto Mig and he's done no real scumhunting or Town contributions of his own. Vain: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=254174&user=53652 0 contributions on day 1, a quickvote on Sevyrn when people were talking about scum likely avoiding the thread. He's become a bit more active now that people suspect him, but with still no relevant contributions. Plunks his top suspect as nard, where it can lie uselessly. DropBear wasn't even on my radar (I thought it was just something Palmar was doing to draw reactions) but Mig's post is excellent. I don't think a chaoser lynch will happen today, but I think any of Vain, xtfftc, or DB are great lynches for today. The Mig/xtfftc wagons ran concurrently, so one may be a case of scum trying to push a diversion wagon. | ||
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Hey chaoser, got any RELEVANT things to say? You know, about the people in this game. You still think your vote should lie on Mig? | ||
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##Vote Foolishness for Mayor | ||
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The case against Mig is mostly meta, and he's stepping out of his invisible play. chaoser's accusations read like one big OMGUS, voting Mig on meta reasons too after being accused for meta reasons, you don't think there's some lazy vote parking and contradiction there either? If there's a scum in that pairing I would lean heavily towards chaoser. | ||
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On August 23 2011 12:27 Foolishness wrote: I don't know what OMGUS means. If you care about the town then type out what you want to say, don't hide behind acronyms. Mostly meta? I accused him of bad posting yesterday. Chaoser found a contradiction today. No meta there. I look at his past games to verify my accusations. So far it's not in his favor. If his attitude this game was like when he was town (XLIII for example) then I would rethink my analysis and would not be pushing him this hard. In response to "you don't think there's some lazy vote parking and contradiction there either?" no I don't. If there is point one out to me. Chaoser found a contradiction in Mig's post. That's pretty good in itself. I bring forth these arguments about "meta" because they serve as further evidence that I'm on the right track. You clearly did not read the last paragraph of my previous post. I'm not building a case on this. I'm not building a case on this. I'm not building a case on this. My case is built upon his contradiction and bad day 1 posting. Everything else I've said only builds on top of that. Look at the big picture. The individual pieces are what make the big picture, and that's where you find the mafia. Examining one individual piece does not find you mafia. For those that are wondering, I think xtfftc is town at the moment. I'm not thoroughly convinced, but the evidence against Mig just fits too well together. Means Oh My God U Suck - basically that you vote for someone because they voted for you. As for meta, Kurumi's game was the only one where I've seen Mig actually matter Day 1. The other games I've played with him as Town - WaW2, AA, and somewhat Personality, Mig had been pretty much useless. Meta arguments can be spun either way for or against Mig. That it continued well into Day 2 prompted me to think he might be scum but he has come back and started contributing. Yeah it looks terrible that it was after he was called out for it, but that's not strong enough for me to put him above the other candidates. He has terrible posts, so do a plethora of other people. I'm not saying discard Mig completely because he's shown up, but he's not as high up the priority list for me. I did read the last paragraph of your post but I disagree with using it at all. BrownBear, Mig, chaoser, Jackal, chaos, and whoever else you named get scumpoints because you got shot? My first game I ever played with you I found out that the fact you weren't a N1 shot was an indication that you were likely Mafia, it's not unreasonable to expect people to figure these things out. Speculating on night hits is just silly. | ||
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Also is it just me or is this indicative of an extremely anti Town mindset? This is interesting. Can't say it wasn't welcome at the time considering how much Palmar was tunnelling me, but I go back to it and it feels rather strange. ... not a very town-centric viewpoint unless the guy with the most posts is really obvious scum (which Palmar isn't). From BrownBear. He welcomed/encouraged a vote on Palmar (who he doesn't think is scum) that he later slams for being a bad scummy vote. | ||
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Mig you know what regard I hold for you as a player, unless there is damning evidence or you openly declare your inactivity I'm going to be hesitant to lynch you. I voted for you because you were still contributing nothing well past your normally useless period, that reason disappeared so my vote moved. Easy enough to understand. | ||
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On August 23 2011 18:30 xtfftc wrote: Wall of text incoming: [spoiler] Of course townkills have nothing to do with modkills. Townkills are made by town, modkills by mods. What is the problem? You posted about "we need to get two town kills." That's taken to mean killing two townies - you tried to explain it away by saying town kills are kills controlled by the town = lynch and modkill. I pointed out modkill is not controlled by the Town, you agree with me. So...what did you mean by town kill? | ||
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Why pick this time to claim DT? You had all of 1 vote on you. | ||
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She said you were busy posting in your quicktopic. | ||
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DB's claim makes no sense at all to fake, it's a ridiculously nonsensical time to claim but he has no reason for faking it. | ||
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On August 23 2011 22:11 Palmar wrote: Millers do not know they are millers. How do you know this? Are Millers/Nosy Neighbors told they are such? | ||
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Wasn't obvious to me. | ||
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On August 23 2011 22:26 Jackal58 wrote: Who the hell scares you more as scum? Mig? Or Vain? I had issues with both. I asked the same question of both. I'm still undecided on both. DB vs SS Lynch SS. If he is not what DB presents him as we lynch DB. It's a 1 for 1 trade. Scum don't like 1 for 1 trades.I don't know why there is any issue with this. Inspite of Barundars best Ace impersonation lynching the DT first is stupid. Errandorr - Flavor text is the storyline in your role PM. Instead of - You are townie, you get a story. Vain does. I've said many times that Mig's meta is godawful for Mafia, he has to bus his teammates and make quality posts or he gets shot into the spotlight. Think of Vain like Kenpachi, no one expects him to do anything relevant and he flies under the radar. That scares me much more than someone who has to constantly post and contribute. | ||
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DB's claim at this point in time makes no sense for either side, which is why I can't fathom it. It makes infinitely less sense from a Mafia viewpoint though, so I'm inclined to believe his claim. He didn't try to push the person he got a red result on at all, content to sit back and watch someone else get lynched. His posting suggests that he didn't even consider his sanity, so that can't be the motivation behind it. I really can't make sense of DB's play. | ||
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On August 24 2011 01:09 DropBear wrote: Cos I'm an idiot. Can we drop it please. Forget it happened. Stop the derailment. Mafia will be laughin their arse off right now. Get back to scumhunting. RayzorFlash you have disappeared. ##Vote RayzorFlash Are you even reading the fucking thread? A RayzorFlash vote is useless at this point, RayzorFlash is not a top candidate, you like supersoft/Mig so you fakeclaim DT, fake a guilty on supersoft but vote Mig and now you're voting RAYZORFLASH? Build a good case against Rayzor if you want that to be the lynch. If you were suspicious enough about supersoft build a real case. If you are suspicious of Mig build a case. WHY RAYZORFLASH AFTER YOU DID A DROPDEAD (HAHAHAH GET IT???) RETARDED GAMBIT TO TRY TO ENFORCE YOUR SCUMREAD AGAINST SUPERSOFT/MIG? And then it comes out that you're actually the godamn MEDIC? Seriously DB what the HELL are you doing? | ||
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Envision the possibility of Mafia DB fakeclaiming DT to force a mislynch, then afterwards acting confused and blaming it on his sanity. We spend the next little bit trying to figure out his sanity, throwing the Town into more confusion/chaos/derailment, while he sits back and laughs. When his claim got pressured he folded realizing he had already fucked up by not previously acting like a DT whatsoever, so he claims the one thing that would save him: Medic protecting Foolishness. He could count on the real Medic not outing himself because THAT'S WHAT MEDICS ARE SUPPOSED TO PLAY LIKE. I hope to God this is what happened because your play as Town makes NO SENSE WHATSOEVER DB. Sigh. Will have to re-read to gauge reactions from people regarding this fakeclaim. | ||
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Keep this in mind if another Medic flips or claims. | ||
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On August 23 2011 21:43 Kurumi wrote: DB, didn't Foolishness claim RB? Unless supersoft flips RB You're fucked and You know it. But Supersoft might flip miller or regular goon(or anything else goes). I still don't know what the hell Kurumi was trying to say here, he also disappeared after someone asked him to explain. VE didn't weigh in at all on the situation, beyond posting some one liner. xtfftc conveniently fades into the background during the chaos, letting us forget about him and not posting at all. | ||
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On August 24 2011 04:12 hiro protagonist wrote: Ok, this town is full of WIFOM, and it has a name: Dropbear. This exact situation happened in wherewolfs. day2, someone claims DT, we keep him alive. Town then spends 2 days trying to decide if the claimer is telling the truth or not. we kill him 2 days later: he was a DT. Knowing this, I wish I would have lynched him right when he claimed. We would have lost a DT, but established an important meta: claims that cannot be confirmed must never happen! claims that cannot be confirmed must never happen I say there is a 50/50 chance that DB is scum. considering all thats happened today, thats good enough to lynch off of. ##Vote: DropBear DB, If you town, I am sorry, but you left us in a terrible situation. xtfftc defense has been fairly reasonable. he has not back away from what he said, and he seems to general feel that he has done nothing wrong. good on ya xtfftc, lets scum hunt. Also, apologies to GreyMist for calling him out when I didn't notice he was asking for a replacement. This post reeks of scum. | ||
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On August 24 2011 04:12 hiro protagonist wrote: Ok, this town is full of WIFOM, and it has a name: Dropbear. This exact situation happened in wherewolfs. day2, someone claims DT, we keep him alive. Town then spends 2 days trying to decide if the claimer is telling the truth or not. we kill him 2 days later: he was a DT. Knowing this, I wish I would have lynched him right when he claimed. We would have lost a DT, but established an important meta: claims that cannot be confirmed must never happen! claims that cannot be confirmed must never happen I say there is a 50/50 chance that DB is scum. considering all thats happened today, thats good enough to lynch off of. ##Vote: DropBear DB, If you town, I am sorry, but you left us in a terrible situation. xtfftc defense has been fairly reasonable. he has not back away from what he said, and he seems to general feel that he has done nothing wrong. good on ya xtfftc, lets scum hunt. Also, apologies to GreyMist for calling him out when I didn't notice he was asking for a replacement. You want to policy lynch on day 2, despite the fact that you've never mentioned policy lynches before (this would further stifle discussion as well). You use an example that you mislynched a DT to support your case against DB......? Beyond this being a terrible example (seriously how is mislynching a DT at all supportive of your point here?), the situation is completely different too, Nisani was in immediate danger of being lynched that's why he claimed. I fail to see how it's the same at all. Where did your 50/50 chance come from? You've never even mentioned DB before this post, suddenly you think he's 50/50 scum? I could understand this coming from someone like Palmar, who already leaned scum on him, but you have given nothing in regards to DB. I agree that DB's claim makes no sense as Town and that there is the chance he is gambiting scum, but I wouldn't even put it at 50/50 and I didn't like DropBear before this shit started. Finally the hedging your bet, "sorry if you're Town" already apologizing for what you must feel/know is a mislynch. Filtering your posts makes you look even worse, it's full of generalizations and "I'll do this when I feel like it" "I wasn't here because I was doing xxx." You ask a lot of questions but you rarely surrender a full analysis or opinion of your own. On August 23 2011 06:26 hiro protagonist wrote: btw, I will put up an analysis on xtfftc when I feel like it. What happened to this? | ||
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?______________________? | ||
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On August 24 2011 04:42 chaoser wrote: You all know where my vote stands and there it shall stay. Dropbear's odd timing and then his claim as the medic that saved Foolishness, combined with the fact that no one has counterclaimed it leads me to trust his claim. As a consequence of that I trust Foolishness to be town. Thanks for the post discussing nothing relevant to what's happened recently. We get it, you want to OMGUS Mig. | ||
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##Unvote Vote hiro protagonist | ||
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On August 24 2011 04:48 Kurumi wrote: ##vote Mig You sound like you want to lynch hiro but stealth vote for Mig? | ||
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You don't even have a post about Mig and suddenly he's your lynch target? Why? Cause he's the one with the most votes on him? | ||
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On August 24 2011 04:55 Kurumi wrote: We have important Foolishness+DropBear link on that lynch, couple of players who are here for a while (chaoser and Jackal58), the more we know about these people (who are quite active and well-spoken) the better for us. I dunno I should re-read the thread since I've got time now. I don't even know how to respond to this. I'm sorry for the spam GMarshal, I'm going to take a bit and cool off before I go into Personality Mafia mode. hiro protagonist or xtfftc, I will be willing to lynch either today. Mig if absolutely necessary but I don't feel strongly about him, DB if a Medic counterclaims. We have 6 hours to lynch, we need to stop dicking around. | ||
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On August 24 2011 07:10 Palmar wrote: I would very much want to lynch BrownBear, but I'm not sure I can build the support for that case today. Of the other candidates there are some for points and some against. Hiro Protagonist has either very much stepped up his scum play, or I'm right and he's town, I don't want to lynch him today. xtffcasdio is much more scummy than hiro. But there is a certain impulsiveness in his posts. I can't exactly put my finger on it, but he's not gone below the "fishy" category for me yet. Which leaves Mig. The entire argument against Mig, is that he has done very, very little fingerpointing that matters this game. Mig is one to usually tear up the thread as town and find scum left and right. He says he's fed up with mafia at the moment, but I mean, it's huge wifom if he's actually telling the truth in that regard. There are other daming things in Mig's play. He has stuck down a total of 3 fos's in this game. One on Sevryn, where he called him lolscum, only to back it off later and try to switch the town to lynch chaoser. I don't know if Mig ever thought he could sway town with this switch, but it sure didn't look like he was pushing it. Lastly he wrote an analysis on DropBear, who has... well... played questionably throughout the game. I don't really mind this case, what I mind is the fact that Mig was wrong again, and seemed to be going for a target that was easy to hunt down. As I said much earlier in the thread, I have a fuckton of respect for Mig as a player, and given that respect, I don't think he can have done the things he has done unless he is either completely and utterly fed up with the game, or just not town-aligned. I find the latter more likely. ##Vote Mig Palmar I agree with you completely about Mig playing much worse than his normal standards. But to accuse him because he is wrong (how do you know that? DB could be crazy gambiting scum still, you yourself had him as a strong scum read) is asinine, did you not think his case was good? It shows that he put thought into it and actually tried to contribute something rather than a throwaway analysis. He may be wrong, but his case was well thought out and made sense, so IMO he's doing it as more than just some throwaway to push the pressure off himself. Compare that with hiro's posts, which are thoughtless and literally throwaway posts. That said, Mig you seriously need to wake up, come into this thread, and make more of an effort. That you are channeling spurts of Kenpachi is seriously annoying. | ||
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On August 24 2011 07:47 Palmar wrote: I form opinions, and I then try to objectively read the thread after that, but it's hard. I'm not afraid of being wrong, and I've quite often been right. Maybe this is the game where I'm wrong on all accounts, but I expect others to be able to pick that up. Also, why do you basically declare me town? Do you know my alignment? Because I read you as Town and I'm pretty sure scum Palmar wouldn't be trying to antagonize everyone left and right. | ||
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hiro looks worse than Mig to me, I'd much rather him be the lynch today. I'm trying to explain to you why, you respond with "Curu doesn't want to lynch Mig, so let's lynch Mig." | ||
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I don't want to go back through the thread right now, but whoever said "Curu post your own opinions on hiro" GTFO, I led this lynch. | ||
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That actually blows my mind. In case it wasn't obvious, DON'T CLAIM TO BE A ROLE THAT YOU ARE NOT. | ||
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http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=254174&user=53652 Read this and ask yourself what are Vain's serious contributions? Nothing. His posts consist of calling Palmar Town, casually suggesting nard and xtfftc as scum. Actually, he suggests nard and xtfftc as his top two scumreads with "I dunno" as his third. Let's take a look at the voting thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=256518&user=53652 Oh cool, he has two votes, both of which were extremely late votes on the person who was going to get lynched already. So he gives his top two scumreads when asked (note that he has never surrendered anything willingly) but does -nothing- to try to push his "reads" or draw attention to them/himself. Other than that he says some stuff like "if supersoft is townie we're fucked" - note this is when DB said he had a red check on supersoft. Why is he posting like he thinks supersoft is a Townie? Every other post is completely worthless. Nard is also a topic for everyone but nothing ever solidifies on him. Everything from his first post drips scumminess. He goes through these pointless lists that do nothing, like this: + Show Spoiler + 2. foolishness, why do you think Mig's post is more scummy than the last few posts of servyn? i kinda understand why the post sounds scummy as it adds nothing new and tries to convince, but what is your opinion about servyn then? 3. mig, foolishness has a point which shouldn't be forgotten. "Foolishness - I don't really agree with you that Mig is scummy. Mig - Foolishness is right, you are scummy, don't ignore him" WHAT Other than that leaves vague statements about how Town is doing, deposits his vote uselessly, never tries to lead anything or express an opinion. Like wtf is this post: here are my notes on hiro, will read up on Mig now. i have no idea what agenda hiro is pushing, except a way to obvious scummy one. Every day he includes a list of people he would like to look into or follow up on, every day he manages to only discuss a little bit of useless info then deposit his vote somewhere useless. The case against xtfftc has been worn out, but here's the latest: On August 24 2011 09:22 xtfftc wrote: Palmar, are you happy to push Chaos13's lynch with the condition that in case he is town, you die next? This is not Pro Town at all and is not indicative of a Pro Town mindset. No Townie can be certain of anyone else's alignment, we have to push our strongest reads. If everyone operated under the condition that if you are wrong you get lynched, nobody would ever try to push their opinions or develop leads. BrownBear doesn't have a single original post or opinion after the throwaway on JeeJee. Yeah you post a wall of text everyday, but it's a post-by-post analysis on one single person. You criticize Palmar for tunnelvision but look at yourself dude, except you don't even seem interested in trying to push your one tunneled person while Palmar is actually trying to get them lynched. chaos13 seems to be 1% less useless than he is when he's playing as scum. VE and Kurumi, I don't even know. | ||
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BrownBear’s day 1 play was undeniably scummy – he does try to influence the lynch, but he’s careful to be skirting the edges around it and ensuring that none of the blame falls onto him. As noted before, he put a vote on JeeJee that was essentially a throwaway vote, one that he never backed up nor tried to actually get people to discuss. He does switch to Sevyrn but note the timing and attitude of his vote: it came when the wagon had firmly started with the initial few votes. It came at a time when the wagon began to look like it would be diverted and wasn’t picking up any more votes. It came at a time when wherebugsgo attempted to call attention onto Vain. It came at a time when Palmar attempted to call attention onto BrownBear himself. His post offered nothing new, simply rehashing all the arguments already existing around Sevyrn to make sure people didn’t forget to keep voting him. All along the game a common theme has been present with BrownBear’s posting: telling people to quit tunneling, and telling people to quit posting useless stuff (he does both himself). He kicks off day 2 saying this: On August 23 2011 06:36 BrownBear wrote: Anyway, I'm looking through xfftc, Mig, Vain, and Hiro's posts. A lot of you guys have already done this, but those of you who haven't should do so! This is a scum objective post. He has noticed people who he thinks have posted in a scummy fashion and felt the need to point them out to us, but made no effort to make the analysis himself (note that all these people had already been called out by someone else earlier). Why? He didn’t want to be seen at the head of a mislynch of the Townies on that list, and he didn’t want to actively push for a lynch of the scum on that list. Following up this post he made a big long wall of text about why xtfftc was scum, conveniently after a whole load of other people had already started the case. No mention of Mig, Vain, or Hiro, only xtfftc. I believe at this point it is a fair assumption to assume BrownBear is scum, based on his posts and what Foolishness has already pointed out. Now for the real and relevant meat of this post (note that all analysis is under the assumption of a scum BrownBear): At the point of his vote, the two top vote getters were 6 on Mig and 4 on xtfftc (including his); this was a clear attempt to avoid being seen on Mig’s votecount. Two explanations for this: 1) Mig is scum and this is a diversion wagon from Mig 2) xtfftc is scum and BrownBear wanted a quick infusion of Town cred; xtfftc was at that point unlikely to get lynched and he could later point out that “look I was trying to lynch xtfftc.” He never actually tried to push xtfftc or debate with anyone to change their votes there. Why do I believe that xtfftc was a very unlikely lynch at that point? Take a look at how the voters fell: Mig(6) Foolishness chaoser Jackal58 DropBear Varpulis Curu xtfftc(4) supersoft hiro protagonist VisceraEyes (unvoted) wherebugsgo BrownBear The numbers are deceptively close but take a look at who is actually voting for whom. Foolishness, chaoser, Jackal, and me are all on Mig; of these four, Foolishness is widely respected and had huge Town cred and weight, chaoser had been tunnelfucking Mig all game already with no signs of letting up, Jackal is a respected player, I was pretty loud and about in making sure my opinion was heard in the thread. Not to mention Palmar was a lynch Mig advocate, to add on another person who was loud and about and who most people thought of as Town. No offense to supersoft, hiro protagonist, wherebugsgo, or VisceraEyes (sorry but lol at the last one), but IMO their weight and influence with the Town was much lesser than that of the above voter list. Option 1 is of course still the more obvious and likely scenario, but if Mig were to flip Town I would take a hard look at xtfftc again. What piqued this train of thought from me? xtfftc’s posts and his general attitude, as well as really being given a “free pass” by many simply for being the wagon building at the same time as Mig. It’s been pointed out, but xtfftc’s first posts were basically offering up early excuses for why people would not be active or interested in stating their opinions. What Town purpose does this serve? None whatsoever, this strikes me as subtle pushing of Mafia objectives. Note the tone that he posts these posts in – very jokingly, roleplaying, hiding under a cover of non-seriousness. After everyone disagreeing with him and him being called out for it, he came back with this post: On August 19 2011 08:46 xtfftc wrote: I don't have anything to add really - as long as we're all active, all is good. I'd just bear in mind that people don't want to die, even in a game. Backtracking immediately, saying that his posts didn’t actually have any point, but still subtly pushing that lurking behavior is somehow okay. When asked about his opinion on lurkers, he posts this: On August 19 2011 18:06 xtfftc wrote: I already explained my position on lurkers and their effect on the game. Asking me to repeat myself is generating spam - and we all know who benefits from spam. Yeah he already explained his position; his position was that lurking is okay because some Townies might be too afraid to post. This is a very anti-Town stance and he clearly doesn’t want to push an environment that discourages lurkers, but he doesn’t want to be seen again promoting his former stance. So he merely says he’s already made his opinion clear as a cop-out; he doesn’t have to contradict himself or continue to draw heat for promoting a pro-lurker game. He makes a post saying he will vote Palmar (he does not actually do this btw). Look at this post: On August 20 2011 05:09 xtfftc wrote: ##Vote: Palmar … I'd also like to point out that it shouldn't be that difficult to convince me to switch to DropBear, considering DropBear's behaviour. Why is he waiting for someone to convince him to switch to DropBear? So he can be absolved of blame in a DropBear mislynch? After he is called out by supersoft for his vote on Palmar, a huge contradiction comes up: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=254174¤tpage=22#433 I really don’t understand what is going on in here at all. He thinks DropBear is scummy, he thinks Palmar had a strategy, he doesn’t really think Palmar is Mafia, but he’s going to vote for Palmar just because, he liked the way he attacked DropBear, he acknowledges Palmar wasn’t simply trolling or being a nuisance and that he was analyzing reactions and defenses. Then in the VERY SAME POST, he tells Foolishness to consider that Palmar is scum. When called out by Foolishness, he is very adamant in pointing out he did not accuse Foolishness of being Mafia and drops the topic completely rather than trying to argue his point (which was a giant contradiction anyways). When I asked him to tell me right then and there what he felt about Sevyrn, he said Mafia. The thing is, if he was already so sure in his mind that Sevyrn was Mafia, why was his vote not there? He had been doing his Palmar thing, no new information had come up between the time he voted Palmar and the time he told me he thought Sevyrn was Mafia, besides that his Palmar bit got shot down by Foolishness. Posts this: On August 22 2011 22:28 xtfftc wrote: Nah, I'm just bored of Supersoft. If anyone else has questions for me, I'd gladly answer them. Will gladly answer questions but won’t offer them unprompted by himself. He was very ready and willing to put his vote into Mig when he has never played with Mig before. A large part of the argument against Mig was that he was playing far, far below his usual Town standards; xtfftc does not know this, but he parks the vote there anyways. Note that he said he was suspicious of Rayzor before this but as no real argument had been brought up against him yet (and rather than bringing it up himself) he instead goes with the masses and puts a vote on Mig. A vote I’m convinced he doesn’t actually believe in. This post: On August 22 2011 23:30 xtfftc wrote: I was the first to point the finger at Rayzor, feel free to filter my posts and re-read my arguments against him. Quick to claim credit in case Rayzor flipped Mafia. He was not the first to point the finger at Rayzor, he asked him a question, said he was suspicious, then went and voted Mig. On August 24 2011 08:38 xtfftc wrote: We have 8 votes for Mig and 6 for Hiro. They are followed by DropBear and myself with 2 each. I am leaning towards Hiro at the moment. I can see how his voting pattern might actually make sense for a mafia player. He has taken a stance against pretty much everyone accused, so in a way he has pleased everyone without focusing on a specific target. Also, this: How can a 100% confirmed townie's death be better than a no-lynch? It's not like Hiro's death is going to give us some concrete information. So, ##Vote: hiro protagonist I will check the thread before I go to bed in ~45 minutes and I'll switch to Mig if we are facing the prospect of a no-lynch. What is going on here? I can’t believe I missed this at the time. He thinks Hiro is Mafia, but then look at his reply to Hiro. He calls Hiro a 100% confirmed Townie (I think under the assumption that Hiro’s self vote would show he is a Townie, but then why not try to convince people not to lynch Hiro?), says his death is not going to give any information, but decides to vote him anyways with the addendum that he’s willing to switch to Mig. Which brings us to today, where suddenly xtfftc has lost the resolve to vote for Mig. He is now pursuing Kurumi, despite being confident in voting Mig all of last day. What’s changed? Well for one people have started to link his wagon to Mig’s; he must surely realize that if Mig were to flip Town, he would look terrible. So now he’s campaigning against Kurumi instead of Mig, despite Mig being the “flavor of the day” (note that in past days he had NO PROBLEM voting with the masses, but today no no, don’t touch Mig). Not even a single mention of lynching Mig, instead actually chainsawing Mig’s attackers. I think I’ve exhausted the length of this post, there are many other things I’ve noticed over the course of my re-read but I believe this content is most relevant to the central topic today. Of the two, I definitely find xtfftc more scummy than Mig. However, under the assumption of a scum BrownBear, the situation for Mig looks a lot worse but there is also a possible alternate explanation. Note how BrownBear never addresses the points in Foolishness’s post about why he didn’t try to touch Mig, instead disappearing while allowing the Mig wagon to blow up. There is no attempted distancing from BrownBear. I am completely fine with lynching BrownBear or Mig today, but if Mig were to flip as Town I would say xtfftc is definitely scum. I won’t post an analysis of Mig here as Foolishness has already done a better job than I could. | ||
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The only thing I can't see is both of them being Town since votes probably would've consolidated on one of them in that case, there was no need for scum to try to oppose either one. If both were to be scum though, I don't understand xtfftc avoiding Mig's wagon like the plague today, a red Mig flip would relieve a lot of pressure on him. | ||
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1) He's suspected 2) If Mig were to die and flip Town xtfftc would very likely be turbolynched There are many reasonable explanations for why Mig, if he is Town, was untouched by Mafia. I don't think that should be used as any indication. | ||
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chaos claim your flavortext please. Everyone post your opinion on Mig's claim, right now it strikes me as flailing scum (why not claim it as soon as you came under serious pressure?) but will have to reread both chaos and Mig with this possibility in mind. | ||
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xt it's because you're scummy as hell, and now you start a case against Kurumi instead of Mig (who you've been voting for last day) when people have started linking you as opposite alignments. | ||
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On August 27 2011 00:51 xtfftc wrote: Nard, what do you think of Mig's claim? Curu, check my voting history again, please. And I'm up for switching to BrownBear as well. What about your voting history contradicts my point? | ||
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What's changed in the situation is that people have started linking you two together as opposing day 2 wagons, which makes your initial push against Kurumi instead of Mig look scummy. | ||
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This is why at the moment I'd go for Mig. Although he improved after his early post about Sevryn, he did not provide anything substantial. Also, although a lot of people casted their vote for Sevryn and then went to bed, Mig did it in in the middle tha attempted switch to Rayzor. Actually this makes you look worse if Mig flips red, since you commented on your next leading wagon but never actually voted. Two scum wagons on day 2 is a very real possibility. Thanks for pointing that out for me, I missed it the first time around. Why is this thread so dead... | ||
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On August 27 2011 01:52 xtfftc wrote: So I was mafia because I voted Mig and now I'm mafia because I didn't vote Mig. And although you are basing your accusation on Foolishness' theory about the connection between the wagon for me and the reduced pressure on Mig, now you think I'm mafia even if Mig flips red. Right. I think you're Mafia because you've been scummy as hell. At first I thought about it from the you/Mig being opposite alignments angle and found that it wasn't implausible for you to be Mafia if Mig were to flip Town. Either way he flips you should still be a topic for discussion because there's reasonable explanations going both ways now. I'm not saying it's absolute but you should absolutely not be let off the hook no matter what Mig flips at this point. Also hi scumatlarge. | ||
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Trotske looks like a Townie who just afked to me. He wasn't afraid to make original contributions in calling Foolishness scum, though his argument was pretty much stretching a joke Foolishness made into looking like the truth and then calling Foolishness scummy for it. I think iGrok's continued play will give a much better picture of him. Lucidity is pretty antagonistic but does go out of his way to argue points not related to his own self defense, I'd lean slightly Town on him. | ||
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bum/BB still haven't weighed in at all, where you at bum? | ||
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He's been actively contributing to Town and pushing out his reads and analysis, all of which make sense. Forget that Foolishness is accusing you, read the thread, and post something actually relevant. | ||
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I'd like to hear from Rayzor/Nard/Vain/bumatlarge. IMO one of these should be the lynch tomorrow. | ||
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We need to make sure we get it right today. There's 5 possibilities I can see right now, I need Nard and Vain's claims before I say what they are. | ||
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Claims please. | ||
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##Vote nard | ||
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Nard today, only chance he's innocent is if he's a NN who randomly visited a dead person AND that kill was carried out by the Godfather. | ||
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I'd like to lynch bum then Pyo, remember that thing I typed way back when DB fakeclaimed DT about how claiming naive/insane DT is a great play for Mafia? Yeah. Convenient that the claim comes out after he's finally being called out for lurking all game and how it perfectly gives him an excuse to be a lurker. On August 31 2011 01:48 Pyo wrote: bumatlarge - no idea really, I thought BB was scum, but the sub (and the need to be subbed in the first place) has thrown me off so I don't really know. WBG's analysis of him felt like bullshit though. If bum flips red I'm pretty sure Pyo is red too, especially if Vain is Town (he was one of the first/only to vote Vain over nard). Also this is the dumbest reason to soft defend anyone I've ever seen. | ||
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On August 24 2011 03:37 Curu wrote: Actually this makes more sense to me the more I think about. If he was Mafia, he has an excuse for not being touched by Mafia because he led a mislynch and is under fire, he can get through 2-3 more people, claiming guilty on each one, then at the end claim he is actually paranoid and skate the rest of the way. Same scenario, except Pyo is claiming naive to escape the lynch rather than paranoid to get people lynched. Check out his posts: On August 20 2011 19:26 Pyo wrote: woah, woah, woah... BrownBear? I thought you wanted DropBear dead? Oh look, he doesn't want BrownBear dead. On August 21 2011 07:15 Pyo wrote: I'm confused. What do you mean by this? What exactly has changed that would warrant you changing your vote? The only thing I can see is that he's received the critical mass to actually have a lynch so he'll get lynched even if you change your vote. Are you trying to cover your tracks for if/when he flips green? Trying to set up Jackal for a fall after Sevyrn's flip. He does vote for Mig but very reluctantly and with "buts" all over the place. While voting for Mig in this post, he also tries to tell us to find someone else to lynch because he doesn't think Mig will get a majority: On August 24 2011 07:22 Pyo wrote: Wow, DT claim into medic claim? I don't think I believe him, but then again, if he's for real, he'll be dead by the hands of the mafia. I'm going to keep my vote on Mig. He's gone with the "I'm burned out on mafia" defense of his posting into one-liners, which is as scummy as anyone else here (except for DB's role claiming). That said, I don't think he's going to get enough votes to actually be lynched. Add onto voting Vain over nard and the soft defense of bumatlarge after the player switch (when he had said earlier he was very convinced by Foolishness and thought BB was scum). Everything adds up. I mentioned Vain so many times because he's been one of the scummiest and most useless people in the thread. I guess my posts helped drive Mafia to frame him though. | ||
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Pyo's still Mafia though. | ||
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On September 04 2011 11:01 Navillus wrote: ##Vote Bumatlarge wtf is this shit? And where are you Pyo? | ||
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Pyo says he is naive. He says so because he claimed he checked Vain green while chaoser got a Vain red. However, we know that bum framed Vain on the night chaoser checked him so assuming a sane chaoser Vain would have actually returned green to a sane DT. That means had Pyo actually thought it through he could not know that he is naive because no one that he had checked had flipped red yet. So why is he so sure that he is naive? Because one of his scumbuddies is in his "checks", so he scumslipped. He knows that one of them is red, so he knows if he were to claim DT it would be naive. At least one of Rayzor/Vain/Erandorr are scum, and his refusal to comment on any of them after I repeatedly asked him cements this. | ||
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THE HELL Are you kidding me? Oh look Pyo posts fishing for the Traitor to claim the night before lylo. | ||
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Why would you be advising the Traitor on how to play the night before lylo? Or at all? | ||
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If the two claimed DTs do not die/are not blocked tonight, one of them is most likely fakeclaiming Mafia. There is no way Mafia is going to let the DTs get a check off for lylo. The possibilities I see: If both die or one is blocked and one dies, we should take a heavy look at the surviving one. Heavier for chaoser than Pyo since chaoser has claimed both an innocent and a guilty result. Gmarshal said naïve DTs will always return green no matter what, so chaoser cannot be naïve. If Mafia left him untouched, there’s a very high chance he is Mafia especially with the Framer dead. If Pyo is left untouched, then he is either Mafia or Mafia would know he is naïve, which means one or more of the people he checked previously (Vain/Rayzor/Erandorr – I’m 90% sure Vain is Town, so that leaves Rayzor and Erandorr there) are Mafia. If Pyo dies and flips DT and chaoser is blocked, I think we should consider chaoser Town. If chaoser were Mafia, they would surely consider that Pyo dying and flipping DT would look chaoser look way bad. If chaoser dies and flips DT and Pyo is blocked, he may be sane, meaning the scumteam is within Rayzor, supersoft, me, and Kurumi. I find that scenario highly unlikely since that would mean a Rayzor/supersoft/Kurumi scumteam; I see no reason why Kurumi, if he was a scum Vig, would claim his shot. Supersoft has looked Town. More likely that one of the people he investigated is the Godfather or was framed into innocence. Likewise I think if chaoser dies and flips DT and Pyo is not blocked, we should consider Pyo Town as a chaoser DT flip would put a lot of pressure on Pyo. 3 DTs is not out of the realm of possibility, especially considering Mafia had a Framer and could very well have a Godfather, and that Pyo may be naïve. If neither dies and neither is blocked, I would suspect chaoser way harder than Pyo since there is no chance chaoser is naïve while Pyo may be. If both claimed block one is obviously lying so I would go after Pyo since he has looked scummier than chaoser thus far. If Pyo is scum I would lean towards a Pyo/Erandorr/Rayzor or xt. Supersoft and xt are the two responsible for Pyo’s no lynch, but I highly doubt that two Mafia would be putting their vote elsewhere. More likely that he was bussed by at least one Mafia member and they got insanely lucky that three Townies derped their way to a no vote modkill. I feel like supersoft is more likely Town than xt. Pyo never voted for Rayzor despite saying he was a suspect and that Rayzor was the next most likely wagon. If chaoser is scum I would towards a Rayzor/chaoser/Kurumi scumteam. I highly doubt both Pyo and chaoser are both scum and if chaoser is scum and Pyo is Town then that confirms supersoft and xt as Town. The third member of that team is hard to peg but Kurumi is the one I can see most connected to chaoser. Rayzor and chaoser soft defended each other all past day. Then again both Pyo and chaoser have ties to Rayzor as well, with Pyo offering up chaoser as a lynch despite never mentioning or questioning him before and stating many times that: On September 03 2011 11:00 Pyo wrote: I'm pretty sure that the scum team can be found within Rayzor, supersoft, chaos13 and Navillus I was going to write up more analysis of them but i ran out of time. Chaoser already pointed this out. Pyo didn’t want to switch his vote to Rayzor despite him being the only likely lynch besides Pyo; his vote stayed on Rayzor. I highly, highly doubt both Pyo and chaoser are Mafia, but both have connections to Rayzor. If there is no clear night actions painting chaoser as scum, I would like to lynch Pyo or Rayzor. They are the scummiest pair. | ||
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On September 05 2011 13:27 Pyo wrote: If he hadn't the game would be over if mafia used both their KP... 3 modkills means we're in LyLo so we can't afford to lynch me now - we also can't afford to no lynch. After tonight it will be 4 - 3, so if there are any traitors present at all (who will likely push for a no-lynch), it's game over. The only hope is for mafia to kill off said traitors. *crosses fingers* Forgot to mention this, Pyo is basically telling the Traitor that the only way Town can win is if Traitor doesn't claim and gets shot (ie encouraging him to claim so Mafia won't hit him). There is no reason for a Townie to post this. | ||
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There is no reason you should do that as Town on godamn LYLO. Explain. | ||
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Rayzor and chaoser scum or Rayzor and Pyo scum, either way Rayzor is the one I am sure of. ##Vote RayzorFlash | ||
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On September 06 2011 22:35 Kurumi wrote: we have 2 dts and we are killing the one which gave us a red lynch? chaoser did not give us a red lynch. chaoser gave us a red check who turned out to be framed. | ||
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You yourself said if there was a Traitor alive at the start of this day game is already over. Why would you switch your vote to Erandorr if you believed chaoser was scum? If your assumption of Rayzor Town is true, then you should know getting him to vote chaoser would be much easier than getting him to vote Erandorr. Pretty hilarious that the reason Rayzor self voted was so the Mafia team could claim him as Traitor to stop his lynch when their Traitor fishing the previous night pulled up a blank. Rayzor/Pyo scumteam, let's do it. | ||
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Let me explain to you why your reasoning is faulty. It's lylo for Town, not scum. So if the scumteam was going to go try to save Rayzor and try to go for a win today, they would've told the third member to bus Rayzor rather than give up both. Because lynching Rayzor doesn't lose the game for them, it just removes on of their three chances. | ||
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Three scum left with two under heavy fire in lylo, optimal play would be to get those two to try to swing the lynch onto a Townie while the third less suspected member stays back/buses so if the win attempt fails then scum still have a chance to win. You know that the game is over for Town already if there is a Traitor, yet you claim Rayzor is the Traitor and that's why we shouldn't lynch him. LOL. If Rayzor was the Traitor nothing we can do would save the game for Town anyways. For us to have a chance to win, Rayzor has to be either Mafia or Town. It's hilarious that you called him the Traitor instead of Town; even you know he's far too scummy to outright call Town. Even if you considered him to be Town, you change vote to Erandorr after no one picked up your chaoser wagon even though chaoser is your "#1 choice" and Rayzor was up for voting chaoser. Yet you try to do Erandorr to see if anyone would follow you on that too, and when no one did you switch back to chaoser. Who you didn't even suspect or mention until people started calling for your lynch. Yeah no. We need to ensure this Rayzor lynch goes through today. | ||
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You hear them footsteps? They roarin' like thunder cause we comin' for you | ||
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On September 08 2011 11:12 RayzorFlash wrote: You won't get a chance, its game over... Why won't people just trust me for once, XD Nah | ||
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Every external party I talked to on Skype figured out I was scum cause I just went along with chaoser's claim without doubting it lol. | ||
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Foolishness gave our team such a headache, we had to sink 3 KP into him to finally put him in the grave but not before he got Mig and BB and was on to Erandorr. Funnily enough, Palmar had the entire scumteam when he died (thanks Kurumi) but he was never going to convince anyone. His reason for me and Mig being scum was cause we usually agree with him and this game we didn't haha. | ||
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-I started the Sevyrn mislynch -I argued with Foolishness that his speculation that the fact he got shot meant chaoser/BB/Mig were scum was ridiculous (lol) -I deflected the Mig wagon onto hiro protagonist -I blatantly defended Mig -I tried to paint xtfftc as scum when Mig was getting lynched -Pushed hard for Pyo's DT claim as fake when chaoser's claim was more suspect especially after the Varpulis flip and was 100% fake after xtfttc's death (2 Sane DTs, 2 Medics, Watcher, Tracker, 2 Vigs, not possible in a balanced game) Apparently my Town meta is scummy-but-not-scum enough to let me get away with a lot of shit as Mafia . | ||
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