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| RemarK United States. November 13 2012 12:34. Posts 404 | Profile Blog # |
*Note: I originally posted this to my blog here on TeamLiquid because I felt it wasn't very in-depth and I didn't want to commit to updating it. However, I have gotten strong feedback that I should post it over here along with TAiLS' PvP Stargate build, so that is what I am doing now! Onto the guide:
There's been a lot of recent discussion about Parting’s immortal sentry all-in. After all-killing LG-IM in the GSTL, he gave an awesome interview that was full of confidence and personality – “In practice matches, I've performed around 70 Immortal timing attacks, and I have never seen anyone block one. There are no Zergs who can defend against my Immortal rush in Wings of Liberty." That quote led me to research this build in more depth, and after seeing an excellent post on the “All Things Protoss” subreddit, I decided to start learning the build and work on mastering more aggressive PvZ builds.
Build order skeleton:
+ Show Spoiler +Disclaimer: I think this goes without saying, but this push is designed to attack a Zerg who opened with a standard gasless triple hatch build. Against a 2-base Zerg, you must react to the fact that they could be going for fast Lair tech (Mutalisks, Infestors, Hydra + Nydus) or going for a hatch tech bust (Roach rush, baneling bust, or roach-ling all-in). Discussing how to react to 2-base Zerg is beyond the scope of this guide, however, I will say that Koreans facing this scenario in the GSL almost always go for fast Stargate with sentries into immediately Chronoboosting a Phoenix to scout what is going on, and then focus on countering whatever tech choice the Zerg went for.
Safer and more recent variant:
Thanks to TL-user oOOoOphidian for sending me this:
"Here are the most recent timings on his build. They're mostly the same as they were in September, but the small changes seem to help, especially the opener. The timings of the opener allow you to be completely safe against 14 pool, which the old opener did not (especially with Forge in main).
16 Nexus, Forge 17 Pylon, Gateway, Cannon 19 2x Gas 24 Core 30 Pylon 32 Stalker (Chrono once), Warp Gate 34 Robo (5:36), Gas Pylon, Sentry, +1 Attack, Pylon (at main ramp) Immortal, 3x Gateway (at main ramp), Sentry Immortal, 4th Gas, 2x Gate, Sentry (wg finish 8:00) Warp in 2 Sentries
Push at 8:50 with 7 Sentry, 3 Immortal, 1 Stalker to set up a single proxy pylon Rally warp prism and make 7th Gate Wall off natural with 2 more pylons, wall off rest of main with 1 more pylon Warp in 2 Sentries and 2 Zealots as you move out."
Greediest variant for maximum strength:
Thanks to Reddit user pandazrule93 for taking the time to write this up from a Parting VoD:
9 Pylon (in main) Chronoboost probes 3 times 17 Nexus 17 Forge in main 17 Pylon at nat 17 Resume probe production 18 Gate at nat 18/19 Cannon at nat 20 Double gas in main 23 Pylon at nat 24 Cybernetics core @ gateway 100% complete 26 Research +1 ground weapons 30 Research warpgate @ cybernetics core 100% complete 30 Stalker (optional chronoboost on it) 36 Robotics facility 36 1st gas at nat 36 Pylon - place this for partial wall-off at the top of your main ramp @100 gas start sentry 44 Add 2 gates 46 Build immortal + Chronoboost it 54 2nd gas at nat 54 Add 1 gate 60 Add 3 gates
Notes: Stop producing probes at full saturation (44) Go up to 3 immortals Push out at 8:50 with 3 immortals, 1 stalker, 1 zealot, 7 sentries Warp prism and observer after 3rd immortal Wall-off your natural (and main) as push leaves Hit at 10:00 - go straight for the Zerg's natural, don't waste time attacking his 3rd base (this lets you forcefield his ramp to isolate reinforcements if you get into position as well) All chronoboost on probes and then immortals. Your robotics facility should never stop being chronoboosted once the first immortal is started. Parting positions his stalker to deny overlord scouts, so don't keep it out on the map for very long
Tips / Tricks / Thoughts:
+ Show Spoiler +Here are some tips and tricks posted by Reddit user bearrosaurus (some slight paraphrasing on my part):
- Parting goes Nexus first, Forge in his main base, and no scouting until the 18 gateway to max his mining. All the scout does is look for the hatch building at the third, then it goes back home to mine.* - No +1 armor. It looks like all the chronoboosts are on probes, and then on the robo nonstop. - His stalker is placed to deny the overlord scout at 7 min. - Probes cut when the first Immortal finishes (44 probes).
*RemarK note: on ladder, I would be scared of not scouting for so long versus a Zerg player, so if you aren't comfortable with it, feel free to 9 scout or build a blind 13 Forge and scout with the probe that builds the Forge - the build will still work!
One thought / comment I have on this build is that its effectiveness is directly correlated to how fast you can push out with it – if you aren’t succeeding with it, make sure that you are pushing out with the same amount of units at the same time that Parting does.
VoDs:
+ Show Spoiler +
Replays + Analysis:
+ Show Spoiler +Example of good macro execution - this replay is just me practicing the build with a friend in the game. It hits pretty much all the macro benchmarks PartinG does, and moves out with the right immortal count on time. RemarK vs Swarm - this replay was after I spent some time practicing the build versus my teammates and shows much better execution on the macro side than the other replays I have here. Disclaimer: the replays vs Dreamizer and Hawk are only my 2nd and 3rd time executing the build ever - they are NOT an example of a perfect or ever close to perfect level of execution of the build. The VoDs will be more helpful for learning the exact build, the replays are here simply to chronicle my own experiences with this build. RemarK vs MYiDreamizer – he played very interestingly. His response to this build was cutting lair + evo chamber, and never droning too hard. If I had read the situation properly, I could have just backed off after killing drones at his 3rd base and been ahead in both tech and economy. However, this was only my 2nd time trying the build and I overcommitted to aggression and lost the game. Also, my push was hitting later than it should so I believe just executing Parting’s build properly would have translated to a fairly straightforward win as well. RemarK vs QuanticHawk– I’m not sure if Hawk misread my build or just messed up his control by letting me get into a deadly position with my units (especially sentries), but this game could been a lot closer if he had more units and better positioning. He was going for a very ling-heavy defense, but could not directly engage my army when I first moved out and his attempt to get the lings past my wall was ineffective. This game I moved out faster than the first game versus Dreamizer, but I still need to improve things like preemptively placing my gateways to wall of at my main ramp and moving my army across the map in a tight ball formation.
Final Notes:
I’ll continue practicing the build over the coming days, and update this post with more replays + analysis as I can. Also, if anyone knows of more VoDs of this build, please post here or PM me so that I can add them to this post. I hope some of you join me in this conversation and post your results / replays with this build here for further discussion!
About me:
+ Show Spoiler +My name is Matthew "RemarK" Kramer, a Grandmaster Protoss player on the NA server. I come from a competitive Halo background and have been playing Starcraft II since 2010, starting out in bronze. If you want to learn more about me or support me, you can check out my hub thread here on teamliquid and comment! I am also a streamer (click here for my stream) - you can follow me on Twitter (@remarkiwa) for updates about when I will be going live or to further interact with me. Thank you so much for reading and I hope this guide was helpful! Last edit: 2012-12-15 14:14:52 |
| | Thug means never having to say you're sorry | Grandmaster Protoss for Team FXO: www.twitch.tv/tsremark | @FXORemarK |
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| Chylith Canada. November 13 2012 12:36. Posts 159 | Profile # |
| =D Really glad to see this and the other one in the strat section, thanks Remark! |
| | Goddamnit this is the most retarded thing I will read all week and it's only fucking tuesday. ~Hawk |
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| Chronos. United States. November 13 2012 13:17. Posts 704 | Profile # |
| Nice in-depth guide! I haven't been playing any Toss lately, but I might give this a shot for a bit just to see what it's like doing this ever infamous build. |
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| moskonia Israel. November 13 2012 14:26. Posts 930 | Profile # |
Thanks for this man! I was doing sub-optimal Immortal all-in for WAY too long, need to practice this now . |
| | "He who learns to walk, should never crawl again" | |
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| WolfBro United States. November 13 2012 15:12. Posts 53 | Profile # |
| I've been failing at this type of build every time I attempt it. Maybe this guide will change that, thanks! Got anything cooking for PvT? |
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| darkness Bulgaria. November 13 2012 15:26. Posts 2661 | Profile Blog # |
One thought / comment I have on this build is that its effectiveness is directly correlated to how fast you can push out with it – if you aren’t succeeding with it, make sure that you are pushing out with the same amount of units at the same time that Parting does.
---
Is that the key to execute it in a soulful way? :D |
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| SCRedditor United States. November 13 2012 15:28. Posts 50 | Profile # |
| Can you please just make a perfect execution against the AI replay? I can't seem to find any replay of someone with 3 immortal, 7 sentry, 1 stalker move out at 8:50. Last edit: 2012-11-13 15:28:30 |
| | Thanks to those that support me. For those that don't like me, please PM me. I always wish to kiss ass. |
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| RemarK United States. November 13 2012 18:17. Posts 404 | Profile Blog # |
On November 13 2012 15:28 SCRedditor wrote: Can you please just make a perfect execution against the AI replay? I can't seem to find any replay of someone with 3 immortal, 7 sentry, 1 stalker move out at 8:50.
http://drop.sc/274980
Good enough?  |
| | Thug means never having to say you're sorry | Grandmaster Protoss for Team FXO: www.twitch.tv/tsremark | @FXORemarK |
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| Shikada Serbia. November 13 2012 18:24. Posts 449 | Profile # |
Thanks for the builds  |
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| Anthonie Netherlands. November 14 2012 02:14. Posts 204 | Profile Blog # |
| Thanks for writing the build down as a guide~ Not sure how Parting was expecting to hide his build from the eyes of the VOD watchers.. |
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Mavvie Canada. November 14 2012 03:37. Posts 850 | Profile Blog # |
shit, a guide on it, i'm doomed T_T
well written + informative guide though!  |
| | Mavvie.439 ~ 2500+MMR [HOTS] Masters Zerg on NA ~ part of Bronze 3v3 team uwu ~ Feel free to add me to play some games ~~ Hyunstoppable? |
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| Mahv Denmark. November 14 2012 04:39. Posts 4 | Profile # | |
| | I am not young enough to know everything. |
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| Teoita Italy. November 14 2012 04:45. Posts 4220 | Profile Blog # |
On November 14 2012 04:39 nagthirteen wrote: Oh god.. Why?
In the words of Grubby himself..."well, Protoss struggles with infestor/broodlord a bit. YOU ASKED FOR IT ZERGS! YOU BROUGHT THIS ON YOURSELVES"
Anyway thanks for posting your guides are awesome  |
| | Protoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright. |
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Mavvie Canada. November 14 2012 05:10. Posts 850 | Profile Blog # |
On November 14 2012 04:45 Teoita wrote:In the words of Grubby himself..."well, Protoss struggles with infestor/broodlord a bit. YOU ASKED FOR IT ZERGS! YOU BROUGHT THIS ON YOURSELVES" Anyway thanks for posting your guides are awesome 
Just watch as every Zerg goes blind 2 base infestor into 2 base broodlord, to avoid dying to this :D |
| | Mavvie.439 ~ 2500+MMR [HOTS] Masters Zerg on NA ~ part of Bronze 3v3 team uwu ~ Feel free to add me to play some games ~~ Hyunstoppable? |
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| RageCommodore Germany. November 14 2012 05:40. Posts 823 | Profile # |
On November 14 2012 05:10 Mavvie wrote: Show nested quote +On November 14 2012 04:45 Teoita wrote: On November 14 2012 04:39 nagthirteen wrote: Oh god.. Why?
In the words of Grubby himself..."well, Protoss struggles with infestor/broodlord a bit. YOU ASKED FOR IT ZERGS! YOU BROUGHT THIS ON YOURSELVES" Anyway thanks for posting your guides are awesome 
Just watch as every Zerg goes blind 2 base infestor into 2 base broodlord, to avoid dying to this :D
I actually remember Bly going 2base Broodlords some time ago :D NEW META |
| | BW: sGs.sTaRfaLL SC2: NN_Commodore | fan of: Darkforce, DBS, KrasS, Delphi, Last, BoguS | Mass BC/ Ghost ftw! | song of the week: Imagine Dragons - Radioactive |
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| Dark Seraph United States. November 14 2012 05:48. Posts 30 | Profile # |
What's the best indicator(s) that this build is coming and what is the appropriate response as zerg? I play random please don't hate me  |
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| gobbledydook Australia. November 14 2012 05:53. Posts 342 | Profile # |
Best indicator:
suicide overlords into protoss base to see for yourself |
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| LOLingBuddha Netherlands. November 14 2012 05:54. Posts 679 | Profile # |
| hahah title of OP made me smile |
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| bertu Brazil. November 14 2012 06:31. Posts 582 | Profile # |
On November 14 2012 02:14 Anthonie wrote: Thanks for writing the build down as a guide~ Not sure how Parting was expecting to hide his build from the eyes of the VOD watchers..
While PartinG gets a bit ahead in the early game because he plays greedier (this is reflected in the guide), his true strength is exceptional micro and the decision to be more sentry/zealot heavy when the situation calls for it.
But obviously the "invencible" part and the "secret" mentioned in his inverteview are just to create hype. don't buy too much into it. : ) |
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Mavvie Canada. November 14 2012 06:32. Posts 850 | Profile Blog # |
On November 14 2012 05:48 Dark Seraph wrote:What's the best indicator(s) that this build is coming and what is the appropriate response as zerg? I play random please don't hate me 
Fast natural gasses, high sentry count, fast robo, no observers or warp prisms.
Best response? Probably to type GG and leave. Here's a guide on it: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=360647
There's a bunch of ways to defend it, generally either involving out-macroing it and getting a flank, or baseracing in some way. |
| | Mavvie.439 ~ 2500+MMR [HOTS] Masters Zerg on NA ~ part of Bronze 3v3 team uwu ~ Feel free to add me to play some games ~~ Hyunstoppable? |
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