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On July 13 2011 14:21 Liquid`Jinro wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 04:05 TeWy wrote:On July 12 2011 01:08 Jsanko wrote: People were asking for patch, so they released one without any changes. It's sad that people idolize David Kim, a guy whose sole accomplishement was to dominate the first 3 weeks of Beta after several years of solo-practice. A guy who also said that it was no big deal if several units/abilities had no point whatsoever in high level multiplayer. With the exception of roaches to 2 food, warpgate research time increase, I can't think at one single change which was really good in the absolute since Beta. They always chose the solution of facility, the mindless 1 dimensional approach. Warpgate is tough to deal with in the beginning ? Increase the research time ad infinitim... Zerg have a hardtime against tanks ? Decrease the dmg... Against HSM? Decrease the dmg, make it useless if needed... etc etc... Eh, I actually agree with him that its not a big deal if some units are useless for competitive play... in 99% of situations. Ghosts in SC1 were useless most of the time but could still be made in that 1% and it was cool. People (except for Liquid`Drone of course :D!) thought queens were useless in SC1 for like 12 years then suddenly they are standard. And let's not forget scouts, devourers(except very rarely ZvZ), valkyries recently, etc. If anything, SC2 doesn't have enough fluff units yet.
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Seems like a small patch meant to fix small things. I am glad that the Pre-Igniter icon is getting a new icon. The old one never made sense. Get an upgrade with an orange flame to get blue flame? Confused me the first time that I saw a commentary where someone was doing a blue flame drop waaay back in the beta.
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On July 12 2011 04:05 TeWy wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 01:08 Jsanko wrote: People were asking for patch, so they released one without any changes. It's sad that people idolize David Kim, a guy whose sole accomplishement was to dominate the first 3 weeks of Beta after several years of solo-practice. A guy who also said that it was no big deal if several units/abilities had no point whatsoever in high level multiplayer. With the exception of roaches to 2 food, warpgate research time increase, I can't think at one single change which was really good in the absolute since Beta. They always chose the solution of facility, the mindless 1 dimensional approach. Warpgate is tough to deal with in the beginning ? Increase the research time ad infinitim... Zerg have a hardtime against tanks ? Decrease the dmg... Against HSM? Decrease the dmg, make it useless if needed... etc etc... Thats just selective memory, I can think of lots of good changes. The reduction to Thor size, for example, was a fantastic change. It made repairing thors less effective (a big issue at the time) and made them less of a clunky, annoying, dragoon-ai'd unit.
Raising priority on repairing SCVs was also fantastic. It lets SCVs operate as meat shields still, but prevents Zealot/Lings from running around like morons.
The adjusted Obs cost. Instead of just nerfing banshee timings they addressed a large issue of the protoss race.
I also thing the recent changes to Archon's were fantastic. Sure, there are some silly, one dimensional changes, but a lot of the changes have been thoughtful and effective. These are the changes that you forget WERE changes. That you just accept as how the game is.
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On July 13 2011 14:21 Liquid`Jinro wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 04:05 TeWy wrote:On July 12 2011 01:08 Jsanko wrote: People were asking for patch, so they released one without any changes. It's sad that people idolize David Kim, a guy whose sole accomplishement was to dominate the first 3 weeks of Beta after several years of solo-practice. A guy who also said that it was no big deal if several units/abilities had no point whatsoever in high level multiplayer. With the exception of roaches to 2 food, warpgate research time increase, I can't think at one single change which was really good in the absolute since Beta. They always chose the solution of facility, the mindless 1 dimensional approach. Warpgate is tough to deal with in the beginning ? Increase the research time ad infinitim... Zerg have a hardtime against tanks ? Decrease the dmg... Against HSM? Decrease the dmg, make it useless if needed... etc etc... Eh, I actually agree with him that its not a big deal if some units are useless for competitive play... in 99% of situations. Ghosts in SC1 were useless most of the time but could still be made in that 1% and it was cool. People (except for Liquid`Drone of course :D!) thought queens were useless in SC1 for like 12 years then suddenly they are standard.
Jinro giving a good point (again). Units that are useless now might not be useless later. IIRC at NASL Artosis mentioned that the first years of SC1, everyone said vultures are horrible and you shouldn't build them (i myself often was on the 'vultures are good' side back then but got shot down so i followed the majority)... now they are standard (i soooo could have been a progamer now ).
In a year or two, we might see ravens with HSM every game moving in front of the army and shooting their missiles into clumps of banelings waiting to run into the terran army, denying the green wave wiping the whole terran ball... or for something i can't even imagine now.
Also, people now start to use overseers more for contamination. They aren't just quicker scout-overlords and mobile detection, they can delay the tech (and the following timing push) of your opponent significantly.
SC2 is currently in quite a good state, i can't think of anything that is really "imba", "broken" or completely useless (well, except for the medivac energy upgrade :p), if you are creative you can think of uses for every unit, eventhough you might not (yet) find a way to integrate it into standard play.
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On July 13 2011 16:35 Morfildur wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2011 14:21 Liquid`Jinro wrote:On July 12 2011 04:05 TeWy wrote:On July 12 2011 01:08 Jsanko wrote: People were asking for patch, so they released one without any changes. It's sad that people idolize David Kim, a guy whose sole accomplishement was to dominate the first 3 weeks of Beta after several years of solo-practice. A guy who also said that it was no big deal if several units/abilities had no point whatsoever in high level multiplayer. With the exception of roaches to 2 food, warpgate research time increase, I can't think at one single change which was really good in the absolute since Beta. They always chose the solution of facility, the mindless 1 dimensional approach. Warpgate is tough to deal with in the beginning ? Increase the research time ad infinitim... Zerg have a hardtime against tanks ? Decrease the dmg... Against HSM? Decrease the dmg, make it useless if needed... etc etc... Eh, I actually agree with him that its not a big deal if some units are useless for competitive play... in 99% of situations. Ghosts in SC1 were useless most of the time but could still be made in that 1% and it was cool. People (except for Liquid`Drone of course :D!) thought queens were useless in SC1 for like 12 years then suddenly they are standard. Jinro giving a good point (again). Units that are useless now might not be useless later. IIRC at NASL Artosis mentioned that the first years of SC1, everyone said vultures are horrible and you shouldn't build them (i myself often was on the 'vultures are good' side back then but got shot down so i followed the majority)... now they are standard (i soooo could have been a progamer now ). In a year or two, we might see ravens with HSM every game moving in front of the army and shooting their missiles into clumps of banelings waiting to run into the terran army, denying the green wave wiping the whole terran ball... or for something i can't even imagine now. Also, people now start to use overseers more for contamination. They aren't just quicker scout-overlords and mobile detection, they can delay the tech (and the following timing push) of your opponent significantly. SC2 is currently in quite a good state, i can't think of anything that is really "imba", "broken" or completely useless (well, except for the medivac energy upgrade :p), if you are creative you can think of uses for every unit, eventhough you might not (yet) find a way to integrate it into standard play.
Yeah I agree. I mean even in Sc2 look at infestors.. not many zergs used to build them now they are way more standard! I think that the "useless" units of today might be the "standard" units of tomorrow. Plus, it makes the game much more versatile imho. I mean you have the OPTION to build ravens with HSM, and let's see where that gets us
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To everyone complaining about name changes/clan support, if you really think they are adding that stuff before the expansion you're crazy, odds are they've already developed all of them, they're just waiting to add them
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I used to think infestor brood was op, and im a zerg player. My life changed when a grandmaster terran used ghosts on me. He emped half of my infestors and sniped 4 broodlords out of 6, the vikings and marines cleaned up the rest, at the same time he dropped me and i lost.
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On July 13 2011 17:19 Hashmeister wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2011 16:35 Morfildur wrote:On July 13 2011 14:21 Liquid`Jinro wrote:On July 12 2011 04:05 TeWy wrote:On July 12 2011 01:08 Jsanko wrote: People were asking for patch, so they released one without any changes. It's sad that people idolize David Kim, a guy whose sole accomplishement was to dominate the first 3 weeks of Beta after several years of solo-practice. A guy who also said that it was no big deal if several units/abilities had no point whatsoever in high level multiplayer. With the exception of roaches to 2 food, warpgate research time increase, I can't think at one single change which was really good in the absolute since Beta. They always chose the solution of facility, the mindless 1 dimensional approach. Warpgate is tough to deal with in the beginning ? Increase the research time ad infinitim... Zerg have a hardtime against tanks ? Decrease the dmg... Against HSM? Decrease the dmg, make it useless if needed... etc etc... Eh, I actually agree with him that its not a big deal if some units are useless for competitive play... in 99% of situations. Ghosts in SC1 were useless most of the time but could still be made in that 1% and it was cool. People (except for Liquid`Drone of course :D!) thought queens were useless in SC1 for like 12 years then suddenly they are standard. Jinro giving a good point (again). Units that are useless now might not be useless later. IIRC at NASL Artosis mentioned that the first years of SC1, everyone said vultures are horrible and you shouldn't build them (i myself often was on the 'vultures are good' side back then but got shot down so i followed the majority)... now they are standard (i soooo could have been a progamer now ). In a year or two, we might see ravens with HSM every game moving in front of the army and shooting their missiles into clumps of banelings waiting to run into the terran army, denying the green wave wiping the whole terran ball... or for something i can't even imagine now. Also, people now start to use overseers more for contamination. They aren't just quicker scout-overlords and mobile detection, they can delay the tech (and the following timing push) of your opponent significantly. SC2 is currently in quite a good state, i can't think of anything that is really "imba", "broken" or completely useless (well, except for the medivac energy upgrade :p), if you are creative you can think of uses for every unit, eventhough you might not (yet) find a way to integrate it into standard play. Yeah I agree. I mean even in Sc2 look at infestors.. not many zergs used to build them now they are way more standard! I think that the "useless" units of today might be the "standard" units of tomorrow. Plus, it makes the game much more versatile imho. I mean you have the OPTION to build ravens with HSM, and let's see where that gets us Well to be fair, people used infestors before aswell. But when patch 1.3.0 hit everyone started using them alot more. This has nothing to do with how the metagame has changed. Blizzard made the infestor alot more powerful through balancing.
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Maybe they'll reverse the burrow movement and roach speed icons.
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AH, wonderful. The only three things I have been concerned with in the past 6 months are: 1. Universal Healthcare 2. Gay marriage legislation 3. The icon for Infernal Pre-Igniter.
At least I can rest a little bit easier.
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Sooo.....
1) Roach speed and burrow move icons still wrong 2) Zerg buildings still have no own portrait
But give terran new icons......why no love for zerg?
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On July 13 2011 18:51 Darclite wrote: AH, wonderful. The only three things I have been concerned with in the past 6 months are: 1. Universal Healthcare 2. Gay marriage legislation 3. The icon for Infernal Pre-Igniter.
At least I can rest a little bit easier.
You really value universal healthcare over the pre-igniter icon?
How do you even sleep at night?
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The fact that the blue flame icon is of a red flame has always confused me a bit. It's nice that they're fixing it. xD
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On July 13 2011 17:19 Hashmeister wrote:Yeah I agree. I mean even in Sc2 look at infestors.. not many zergs used to build them now they are way more standard! I think that the "useless" units of today might be the "standard" units of tomorrow. Plus, it makes the game much more versatile imho. I mean you have the OPTION to build ravens with HSM, and let's see where that gets us
Yeah, but that was a change due to patching ( they increaed FG damge to armored), BW got its last patch years ago, and its metagame evolution was due to player, not to patch...
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On July 13 2011 20:02 IGotPlayguuu wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2011 17:19 Hashmeister wrote:Yeah I agree. I mean even in Sc2 look at infestors.. not many zergs used to build them now they are way more standard! I think that the "useless" units of today might be the "standard" units of tomorrow. Plus, it makes the game much more versatile imho. I mean you have the OPTION to build ravens with HSM, and let's see where that gets us Yeah, but that was a change due to patching ( they increaed FG damge to armored), BW got its last patch years ago, and its metagame evolution was due to player, not to patch...
It was not because of the increase of damage to armored, it was cutting the duration in half making it much more useful as a dps spell rather than just a hold.
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On July 13 2011 19:56 Philosophy wrote:Sooo..... 1) Roach speed and burrow move icons still wrong 2) Zerg buildings still have no own portrait But give terran new icons......why no love for zerg?
Because they are already fuck!ng bored of zergs and their whines lol. Joke ofc
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I wonder why they dont implement team stats for team games. When watching a team rep and the score screen its very hard to get a picture of the overall team performance because you have to add all the individual players stats. Especially if it is a 4v4!
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So the PTR is working for other people? I'm getting an error message during patching. This is just after I installed the relocalizer...
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can somebody check, if the drone still has an increased attack delay?
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it been a long time we didnt have balance patch...
i think its abouth time to fix some things.. like infestors spam.. fg ...
so infestor nerf (but then marines will be OP agean) so...
marines nerf
maby colloss nerf or force feadls...
i think seige tanks need buf 60 dps vs armored...
plenty of time pased and no balance changes in my opinion all this staf i mentioned need nerf..
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On July 13 2011 20:56 Doodsmack wrote: So the PTR is working for other people? I'm getting an error message during patching. This is just after I installed the relocalizer...
Yeah I get the error message at 99% that I'm sure you're also getting.
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