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On October 02 2011 19:23 noddy wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2011 19:19 Telcontar wrote: MKP won? Meh, this tournament isn't prestigious enough to make a dent in his kong status. So I assume MKP hit timings to kill DRG? Fair enough. Why play straightup when you know you have the weaker macro game? Another tool. MarineKing's macro is perfectly fine. He raped DRG in a macro game in the second game by the way.
Yeah i think MKP has great mechanics, both micro/macro. What kills him is his decision making. He tends to be too aggressive, and that sucks in T v T which explains his record sometimes.
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On October 02 2011 19:19 Telcontar wrote: MKP won? Meh, this tournament isn't prestigious enough to make a dent in his kong status.
Winning random tournaments has never counted towards getting out of the kong line. It's GSL or nothing.
Besides, he won that Gview thing recently as well.
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On October 02 2011 18:56 KimJongChill wrote: Wow, I did not expect these results at all. This is like the universe is folding in on itself. MKP to win GSL code S ???
20 Terrans are in Code S, He has no chance of winning one
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Oh DRG what happened to ezpz?
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On October 02 2011 19:46 AxionSteel wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2011 18:56 KimJongChill wrote: Wow, I did not expect these results at all. This is like the universe is folding in on itself. MKP to win GSL code S ??? 20 Terrans are in Code S, He has no chance of winning one
Lol hes already knocked out of this seasons code S. To be fair, i think the level in code S is so high, any player can go on to the semi finals. Everyone in code S is so good and i think the only difference is their preparation and such.
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This tournament sadly was not worth the money. The average game time was less than 10 minutes.
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This tournament was destroyed by all the all in builds and 2 base timings. Very sad to see the average game time being under 10 minutes. :S
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On October 02 2011 19:49 poorcloud wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2011 19:46 AxionSteel wrote:On October 02 2011 18:56 KimJongChill wrote: Wow, I did not expect these results at all. This is like the universe is folding in on itself. MKP to win GSL code S ??? 20 Terrans are in Code S, He has no chance of winning one Lol hes already knocked out of this seasons code S. To be fair, i think the level in code S is so high, any player can go on to the semi finals. Everyone in code S is so good and i think the only difference is their preparation and such.
Also he played his group before the BFH nerf to help his TvT though he is lucky that Puzzle fumbled a 4 gate or he would be in up/downs right now.
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Missed the finals; I'm veery surprised by the results but MKP fighting!
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On October 02 2011 19:32 Loodah wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2011 19:22 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:On October 02 2011 19:01 Loodah wrote:On October 02 2011 18:57 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:On October 02 2011 18:41 Loodah wrote:On October 02 2011 18:30 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:On October 02 2011 18:17 noddy wrote:On October 02 2011 18:14 FrostedMiniWheats wrote: So yeah....anyone still putting much stock in AoL lol? MKP 4-1 arguably the strongest zvt in the world. 3-0 MMA. DRG easily 2-0s MVP. Something is fishy Yeah, its about as credible as MLG. Comments like this are dumb. Progamers dont play to lose. Well apparently they aren't playing very hard to win. Nearly all of these games are oddly below expectation of the player. Why is that? Comparing this to MLG is foolish, they play standard there, sometimes better than at the gsl (probably because of the large audience). This just feels like a practice code-S. Fucking lame. HAHAHAHA saying that MLG is on the level of GSL code S is a bit ridiculous. MLG is not even close to the level of GSL level play. A lot of the MLG pool wouldn't even qualify for Code A. Learn to read, I'm talking about how the Koreans play while at MLG. MVP, Bomber, DRG, MMA, Losira. They play up to their level, of course it's usually only seen when they go up against each other as the foreigners can't push them to their limits. In some cases the games are better from them. Coca was thought to suck terribly at Zvt back then...owned puma and played good against bomber until the later stages of their games. Boxer did very nicely at Anaheim. Nada looked awesome as well, especially the win against Puma. Rain actually looked good for once at Anaheim. The Koreans are forced to play better consistently in GSL than they do at MLG to win. They also have to refine their play MUCH MUCH more in GSL (which means a higher level of play if you don't follow that logic). No, CoCa was considered amazing at TvZ ever since he switched to SlayerS. It wasn't because of the big crowd lmfao. You should think before you post things like that. Why is this so hard for you to understand. The play demonstrated at MLG, and the play demonstrated in the GSL from the koreans (at least against each other) is of similar caliber. You know what they've practiced for in the gsl, the skills they've gained may have, I don't know, come with them to MLG...? I believe coca actually had just joined slayers around the time he went to MLG, prior to this he didn't show much of his zvt off and it was regarded as quite bad. So no. Also, who's to say the audience didn't play a factor in their performance. Maybe, just maybe, the incentive from the fans carries more weight than the same amount of money they'd get by advancing to the ro16 by winning this small tournament. No it's not. The same Korean players demonstrate better play at GSL. They have time to prepare / refine their play, and are not suffering from jet lag or lag (which has been a huge problem at every single MLG at one point or another). This makes the level of play higher. Seriously, are you even reading my posts? So you're basically saying - hey they have been practicing so the level of play must be similar... then right after you shit all over AoL because it's not a legit tournament? Forget reading my posts - are you even reading your own posts before you post them?? Doesn't sound like it. Also, CoCa was considered quite a good ZvT player even when he was on Zenex. In fact him and Puzzle usually alternated as the ACE for their team, because both of them showed well rounded play against terran. His ZvT obviously got better once he switched to SlayerS, but I don't know what you're talking about when you said his ZvT was bad before. Anyways, I suggest you read what you actually write. Even if they only cared about pleasing the fans (and.... not playing... well?), then AoL would still provide a proper incentive. It's a public tournament that thousands of people around the world watch. Hell, the VoDs are up on GOM just like any GSL match.
Aside from Columbus I don't recall anyone pulling the jet lag card. You need to work on your reading comprehension. I'm saying what is actually displayed when these competitors compete at MLG and at the GSL is similar. What was witnessed in the AoL is not, so much so that it's rather unusual. Of course the practice could have carried over into the AoL, but did the players actually follow through with play that reflects this? Ask yourself. At MLG, do the players show macro, micro, decision making and general style that matches up with their GSL counterparts? Yes. Did they really do that here in AoL? Not really. It's really as simple as that.
Boxer played better than I've seen him in a long time at the gsl while at Anaheim. People questioned Bomber's zvt? He 2-0'd Drg convincingly and I believe he 4-0'd coca while at Raleigh. Moon actually played better than he ever did in the gsl. Again, Rain, some of the best I've seen from him.
Coca's ZvT win rate is currently less than 50% including his recent turnaround games. Explain how his ZvT was considered good. Many people thought he wouldn't get out of his recent gsl group.
Having fans in front of your cheering, and chanting your name, watching you outside the booth, has got to be different than not seeing them at all. Hell, I recall numerous Koreans saying they wanted to return to MLG because of the crowds. That they didn't have this sort of recognition in Korea. The recognition they might get from a few vids in a small online(?) tournament that may never get back to them and what they might get from a large crowd of hundreds at a lan after walking out victorious from a booth to a roar of cheers and people chanting your name has got to be more incentive. Think a little.
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Wow, MKP finally won something, well done!
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On October 02 2011 20:04 Adreme wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2011 19:49 poorcloud wrote:On October 02 2011 19:46 AxionSteel wrote:On October 02 2011 18:56 KimJongChill wrote: Wow, I did not expect these results at all. This is like the universe is folding in on itself. MKP to win GSL code S ??? 20 Terrans are in Code S, He has no chance of winning one Lol hes already knocked out of this seasons code S. To be fair, i think the level in code S is so high, any player can go on to the semi finals. Everyone in code S is so good and i think the only difference is their preparation and such. though he is lucky that Puzzle fumbled a 4 gate or he would be in up/downs right now.
Or he would've beat Puzzle in a straight up game since his TvP his fine.
Hypothetical situations are great.
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United Kingdom16710 Posts
On October 02 2011 19:23 noddy wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2011 19:19 Telcontar wrote: MKP won? Meh, this tournament isn't prestigious enough to make a dent in his kong status. So I assume MKP hit timings to kill DRG? Fair enough. Why play straightup when you know you have the weaker macro game? Another tool. MarineKing's macro is perfectly fine. He raped DRG in a macro game in the second game by the way. I guess it's hard to gauge someone's ability in an area when you see so little of it. Most of MKP's 'macro game' wins have been because he crippled his opponents with timings and couldn't finish things then and there. I'm not saying that kind of playstyle is particularly bad or illegitimate, but it does make him a one-dimensional player. The reason he hit a slump a few months back is because people started figuring out his gimmicks. He tried to play a bit more standard, but that wasn't working out too well for him. Then he switched back to his usual style and it's been paying off lately. You have to give him some props for coming up with new timings, but that still doesn't mean he's not a one-trick pony. I guess I'm just disappointed that someone like MKP can have that kind of success in the game, playing the same way again and again for almost a year. That or I'm just disappointed with Blizzard for making a game that makes it possible.
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I just checked the results and I was like omgfwtf
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MKP is completely worthy of the Kong Line. He's winning "special events", that's a staple of the Kong.
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United Arab Emirates874 Posts
MKP for second again? I hope not! go MKP!!!
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On October 02 2011 19:19 Telcontar wrote: MKP won? Meh, this tournament isn't prestigious enough to make a dent in his kong status. So I assume MKP hit timings to kill DRG? Fair enough. Why play straightup when you know you have the weaker macro game?
Hold on a second. Did you just mock MKP based on games you didn't see? Impressive.
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On October 02 2011 20:17 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2011 19:32 Loodah wrote:On October 02 2011 19:22 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:On October 02 2011 19:01 Loodah wrote:On October 02 2011 18:57 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:On October 02 2011 18:41 Loodah wrote:On October 02 2011 18:30 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:On October 02 2011 18:17 noddy wrote:On October 02 2011 18:14 FrostedMiniWheats wrote: So yeah....anyone still putting much stock in AoL lol? MKP 4-1 arguably the strongest zvt in the world. 3-0 MMA. DRG easily 2-0s MVP. Something is fishy Yeah, its about as credible as MLG. Comments like this are dumb. Progamers dont play to lose. Well apparently they aren't playing very hard to win. Nearly all of these games are oddly below expectation of the player. Why is that? Comparing this to MLG is foolish, they play standard there, sometimes better than at the gsl (probably because of the large audience). This just feels like a practice code-S. Fucking lame. HAHAHAHA saying that MLG is on the level of GSL code S is a bit ridiculous. MLG is not even close to the level of GSL level play. A lot of the MLG pool wouldn't even qualify for Code A. Learn to read, I'm talking about how the Koreans play while at MLG. MVP, Bomber, DRG, MMA, Losira. They play up to their level, of course it's usually only seen when they go up against each other as the foreigners can't push them to their limits. In some cases the games are better from them. Coca was thought to suck terribly at Zvt back then...owned puma and played good against bomber until the later stages of their games. Boxer did very nicely at Anaheim. Nada looked awesome as well, especially the win against Puma. Rain actually looked good for once at Anaheim. The Koreans are forced to play better consistently in GSL than they do at MLG to win. They also have to refine their play MUCH MUCH more in GSL (which means a higher level of play if you don't follow that logic). No, CoCa was considered amazing at TvZ ever since he switched to SlayerS. It wasn't because of the big crowd lmfao. You should think before you post things like that. Why is this so hard for you to understand. The play demonstrated at MLG, and the play demonstrated in the GSL from the koreans (at least against each other) is of similar caliber. You know what they've practiced for in the gsl, the skills they've gained may have, I don't know, come with them to MLG...? I believe coca actually had just joined slayers around the time he went to MLG, prior to this he didn't show much of his zvt off and it was regarded as quite bad. So no. Also, who's to say the audience didn't play a factor in their performance. Maybe, just maybe, the incentive from the fans carries more weight than the same amount of money they'd get by advancing to the ro16 by winning this small tournament. No it's not. The same Korean players demonstrate better play at GSL. They have time to prepare / refine their play, and are not suffering from jet lag or lag (which has been a huge problem at every single MLG at one point or another). This makes the level of play higher. Seriously, are you even reading my posts? So you're basically saying - hey they have been practicing so the level of play must be similar... then right after you shit all over AoL because it's not a legit tournament? Forget reading my posts - are you even reading your own posts before you post them?? Doesn't sound like it. Also, CoCa was considered quite a good ZvT player even when he was on Zenex. In fact him and Puzzle usually alternated as the ACE for their team, because both of them showed well rounded play against terran. His ZvT obviously got better once he switched to SlayerS, but I don't know what you're talking about when you said his ZvT was bad before. Anyways, I suggest you read what you actually write. Even if they only cared about pleasing the fans (and.... not playing... well?), then AoL would still provide a proper incentive. It's a public tournament that thousands of people around the world watch. Hell, the VoDs are up on GOM just like any GSL match. Aside from Columbus I don't recall anyone pulling the jet lag card. You need to work on your reading comprehension. I'm saying what is actually displayed when these competitors compete at MLG and at the GSL is similar. What was witnessed in the AoL is not, so much so that it's rather unusual. Of course the practice could have carried over into the AoL, but did the players actually follow through with play that reflects this? Ask yourself. At MLG, do the players show macro, micro, decision making and general style that matches up with their GSL counterparts? Yes. Did they really do that here in AoL? Not really. It's really as simple as that. Boxer played better than I've seen him in a long time at the gsl while at Anaheim. People questioned Bomber's zvt? He 2-0'd Drg convincingly and I believe he 4-0'd coca while at Raleigh. Moon actually played better than he ever did in the gsl. Again, Rain, some of the best I've seen from him. Coca's ZvT win rate is currently less than 50% including his recent turnaround games. Explain how his ZvT was considered good. Many people thought he wouldn't get out of his recent gsl group. Having fans in front of your cheering, and chanting your name, watching you outside the booth, has got to be different than not seeing them at all. Hell, I recall numerous Koreans saying they wanted to return to MLG because of the crowds. That they didn't have this sort of recognition in Korea. The recognition they might get from a few vids in a small online(?) tournament that may never get back to them and what they might get from a large crowd of hundreds at a lan after walking out victorious from a booth to a roar of cheers and people chanting your name has got to be more incentive. Think a little.
It's hard for me to take your response seriously when you think that nobody showed good decision making, macro micro, or general style.
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On October 02 2011 20:21 Telcontar wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2011 19:23 noddy wrote:On October 02 2011 19:19 Telcontar wrote: MKP won? Meh, this tournament isn't prestigious enough to make a dent in his kong status. So I assume MKP hit timings to kill DRG? Fair enough. Why play straightup when you know you have the weaker macro game? Another tool. MarineKing's macro is perfectly fine. He raped DRG in a macro game in the second game by the way. I guess it's hard to gauge someone's ability in an area when you see so little of it. Most of MKP's 'macro game' wins have been because he crippled his opponents with timings and couldn't finish things then and there. I'm not saying that kind of playstyle is particularly bad or illegitimate, but it does make him a one-dimensional player. The reason he hit a slump a few months back is because people started figuring out his gimmicks. He tried to play a bit more standard, but that wasn't working out too well for him. Then he switched back to his usual style and it's been paying off lately. You have to give him some props for coming up with new timings, but that still doesn't mean he's not a one-trick pony. I guess I'm just disappointed that someone like MKP can have that kind of success in the game, playing the same way again and again for almost a year. That or I'm just disappointed with Blizzard for making a game that makes it possible.
Those kind of players should always play a role in RTS games. It's not as though he's skilless, he is just stylistic.
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