Puma, why didn't you try to learn English?
All you had to do to keep your salary was say "Kingston Hyper X"
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Xpace
United States2209 Posts
Puma, why didn't you try to learn English? All you had to do to keep your salary was say "Kingston Hyper X" | ||
StarVe
Germany13591 Posts
On March 15 2013 21:18 Sated wrote: Show nested quote + On March 15 2013 21:02 Felix_ wrote: Good for DeMuslim Yesterday's stream viewers will understand. Why post something like that without giving any more details!? >_< EDIT: PuMa has been falling off a little recently, so it does make sense that they would want to renegotiate his contract. He obviously feels that he is worth more than whatever he was offered, either in terms of money or tournament playtime, so all I can really do is wish him the best of luck in getting what he wants with another team. + Show Spoiler [Football Analogy] + To be honest, PuMa's signing always felt to me like the kind of signings Manchester City made when they first got all their money. Manchester City couldn't immediately sign the very best players because, despite being able to offer really big wages and despite being a well-supported club in England, they didn't have the EU reputation nor the EU results to attract truly ambitious players. It wasn't until their EU reputation increased after the signing of several proven players for whom they often had to pay inflated transfer fees/wages (I'm think of players like Robinho, or even players like Wayne Bridge) that they were able to attract the attention of the world's best footballers. I think the parallels with EG's NA vs. KR reputation are fairly obvious..? Your analogy fails, Puma was probably the best signing EG made in SC2 so far in terms of the results it earned them. Yes, he fell off, but Puma was one of the best players back then. | ||
emc
United States3088 Posts
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Cauldron
Finland125 Posts
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jinsanity
United States137 Posts
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dabom88
United States3483 Posts
On March 15 2013 21:47 StarVe wrote: Show nested quote + On March 15 2013 21:18 Sated wrote: On March 15 2013 21:02 Felix_ wrote: Good for DeMuslim Yesterday's stream viewers will understand. Why post something like that without giving any more details!? >_< EDIT: PuMa has been falling off a little recently, so it does make sense that they would want to renegotiate his contract. He obviously feels that he is worth more than whatever he was offered, either in terms of money or tournament playtime, so all I can really do is wish him the best of luck in getting what he wants with another team. + Show Spoiler [Football Analogy] + To be honest, PuMa's signing always felt to me like the kind of signings Manchester City made when they first got all their money. Manchester City couldn't immediately sign the very best players because, despite being able to offer really big wages and despite being a well-supported club in England, they didn't have the EU reputation nor the EU results to attract truly ambitious players. It wasn't until their EU reputation increased after the signing of several proven players for whom they often had to pay inflated transfer fees/wages (I'm think of players like Robinho, or even players like Wayne Bridge) that they were able to attract the attention of the world's best footballers. I think the parallels with EG's NA vs. KR reputation are fairly obvious..? Your analogy fails, Puma was probably the best signing EG made in SC2 so far in terms of the results it earned them. Yes, he fell off, but Puma was one of the best players back then. Players are investments. You don't make investments based on how much exposure players generated for you in the distant past. You judge them on the recent past, current present, and what you think you can expect from them in the future. Puma doesn't speak English, stream, cast, go on e-sports shows on a weekly basis, tweet, interact with fans, etc. and didnt seem to have any indication that he would do so in the future, so the only way he could generate sponsorship exposure was with tournament results, so that's what he was judged on. The results in the recent past and present weren't good, and they probably didn't expect him to drastically improve, so when his contract ended and they were negotiating a new one, a pay cut was justified. | ||
UndoneJin
United States438 Posts
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HornyHerring
Papua New Guinea1053 Posts
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Abominous
Croatia1625 Posts
Thanks. | ||
dabom88
United States3483 Posts
On March 15 2013 22:08 HornyHerring wrote: If they're cutting Puma for no results and too high salary, players like Machine or Incontrol must be getting little to nothing in order for that statement to be justified. Please read the previous posts. They don't judge how much someone is worth based solely on tournament results. | ||
Kznn
Brazil9072 Posts
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Black[CAT]
Malaysia2589 Posts
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revel8
United Kingdom3022 Posts
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CruelZeratul
Germany4588 Posts
On March 15 2013 22:20 Kznn wrote: flash to replace him? With the new head coach it's got to be Fantasy . Unfortunately he is not looking so hot in SC2 right now. | ||
JustPassingBy
10776 Posts
On March 15 2013 21:47 Xpace wrote: I love it when Koreans learn English; there's a lot of money in tournaments outside Korea; it's a career opportunity for any pro-gamer. Plus, it doesn't hurt to have the most used language in the world in your repertoire, right? Polt, viOlet, MC, the star examples. Puma, why didn't you try to learn English? All you had to do to keep your salary was say "Kingston Hyper X" Are you sure about that? Because some sources claim that even the most spoken language (not the language with the most mother tongue speakers!) is still mandarin. source (for example): http://listverse.com/2008/06/26/top-10-most-spoken-languages-in-the-world/ | ||
HornyHerring
Papua New Guinea1053 Posts
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Pokebunny
United States10654 Posts
On March 15 2013 20:49 Zealos wrote: Show nested quote + On March 15 2013 19:53 dabom88 wrote: On March 15 2013 19:49 Defacer wrote: On March 15 2013 19:36 Rannasha wrote: On March 15 2013 19:23 Technique wrote: On March 15 2013 19:08 dabom88 wrote: On March 15 2013 18:48 Technique wrote: On March 15 2013 18:33 dabom88 wrote: On March 15 2013 18:27 Technique wrote: On March 15 2013 17:58 saltis wrote: I guess that is a warning signal for Huk to stop playing LOL too. No cause he ain't Korean. In sc2 only Koreans are held to a high standard. Posts like this are the reason why there needs to be a mod note on top of this topic. Once again, every progamer is judged on whether they're bringing EG (or any e-sports team) more money than they're paying them. It's called Return on Investment (ROI). This return is based off EG Brand Exposure and EG Sponsorship exposure, which can be judged in numerous ways, including tournament results. They didn't think Puma was bringing in enough of a return, so they tried to negotiate a lower salary to reflect what he was bringing in for them. Puma said no, so they let him go. They didn't just kick him out for not producing results like people who post stuff like this seem to think. He's still #12 in the tournament earnings, only other EG member higher is Stephano who played in way more tournaments. What he's achieved in the past matters less than the results he's achieving now when negotiating a new contract, which reflect the state Puma is in in the present and what they can expect of him in future. He hasn't placed high in tournaments since March of 2012. He hasn't been producing many results in general. He can't speak English, he never streamed much, barely tweeted, was not part of any promotional team activities, and in all this time did not really make any visible effort to become better at speaking English like other fellow Koreans on foreign teams (MC, Polt, Crank, HerO, JYP, GanZi just to name a few) have. As a result, the only thing he had to offer in brand/sponsorship exposure was game and tournament results. And when he hasn't been winning important games, such as in Korea's most prestigious team league, or placing high in tournaments in the past year, he wasn't generating enough brand and sponsor exposure to justify how much they were paying him. So, and I can't believe I'm repeating this again, they offered him a lower salary to better reflect his current state and the return on the investment they expected from him over course of the new contract period. He refused, and since they expected to lose money on their investment in Puma with his current salary, they had to let him go. You are only proving my initial point... Koreans are held to a much higher standard compared to foreigners... Highly achieved Korean player starting to win less? Ok take a big cut in your paycheck or leave the team... That's all this is... It's not like anyone besides Stephano done well in EG lately and Puma most likely already makes less than most foreigners... hence why they say he's ''one of the highest paid Korean on our team''. Of course Koreans are held to higher standards, the average Korean player is a lot less marketable than the average foreign player of similar skill. To expose the public to your sponsors you need to either win a lot or stream a lot and interact with fans. The EG foreigners do a very good job at making themselves and their sponsors visible. The Koreans not so much, partly due to the language barrier, partly due to the fact that Koreans tend to not show their personality as much. Ummm ... I can barely remember seeing Puma stream games, let alone mention sponsors or exhibit any kind of personality. Already, I've seen Jaedong's stream up longer and more often than Puma's. I think Huk is eventually going to get a slap on the wrist, too. I don't think EG is going to tolerate players that get paid very well, don't post results AND don't proactively promote their sponsors or increase their exposure. People can complain all they want about IdrA or InControl or Demuslim but those guys plug Raidcall and show off their Razer wares constantly. They're doing the dirty work of pimping sponsors while players in Korea are underperforming and acting like delicate, mute snowflakes. And the important thing is, even if Huk or ANY OTHER PLAYER does get a "slap on the wrist" in the form of a lower salary, which probably does happen or has happened in the past, you wont hear about it because that's bad publicity for EG, and the players are NDA'd from revealing their salary or specifications about contract negotiations. The only time you would hear about a lowered salary is if they leave the team. Why should the salary of players be public information exactly? Because it helps players negotiate - if ppl knew how bad some salaries were... | ||
dabom88
United States3483 Posts
On March 15 2013 22:20 Kznn wrote: flash to replace him? Iirc, in his prime, Flash was making over 200k annually from salary alone. Even if it has probably dropped since then, Flash still probably makes a higher salary than any single player on EG. Kespa teams have quite a bit of money. Except maybe Team 8, who are directly sponsored by Kespa, but even they might not make it if they don't find a sponsor soon. Kespa probably won't back them forever. Jaedong was on Team 8, which is probably why he accepted EG's offer. And even then, negotiations were done through Kespa, and they made it so that he's technically on loan for a year, and would be contractually obligated to come back to Team 8 if they find a sponsor. EG probably can't afford Flash. | ||
Torte de Lini
Germany38463 Posts
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dabom88
United States3483 Posts
On March 15 2013 22:27 HornyHerring wrote: I stand by what I said, don't care that EG has players and "players". Well then you would be wrong on both counts. They don't judge based solely on results. And Incontrol at least is valuable to EG and is probably making good money from them. Not something huge, but enough to sustain a comfortable lifestyle and support a family. Don't know about Machine. | ||
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