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mrmin123
Korea (South)2971 Posts
Games are still going on so... yea.
Guys stop hating on Flash
I noticed some differences between the daily e-sports and fomos interviews (I only found out recently that they were different) so I've added them both in where applicable.
BeSt: "I will defeat Flash" My observer was too slow so I couldn't stop the nuke. (Fomos interview)
- It's the first time you've gotten to the ro8. ▲ It's the first time but I had to go through Survivor (TL note: or whatever you have to go through to get to ro32), ro32, and ro16. It's been an eventful road. ▲ (Fomos interview) It's the first time but there's been a lot of events this MSL. From Survivor to the ro16 team-kill, it's been very eventful and got a lot of attention, but I got the ro8 this way so I want to do well in the ro8 as well.
- Both your games were very close. ▲ To be honest, I was behind in both games. There were events that caught me off guard and I panicked a lot. I played on not certain that I could win. It's unfortunate that I had to beat my teammate Canata hyung but I'm glad I won.
- How was your game today? ▲ The map was good for Terran. I only got to practice a few games but the preparation was the same. - (Fomos interview) It must have been difficult to prepare for today's game. ▲ The map is good for Terran so preparing was difficult. I only got to play 3 or 4 games because of Proleague, but Canata hyung said it was the same for him. I didn't get to practice too much but I tried my best during the game, which I think let me win the game.
- You lost your expo to a nuke. Your reaction when that happened? - (Fomos interview) You got hit by nukes both games. ▲ When I heard that a nuke was launched I didn't have an observer at 1 o'clock. They were too far away so I didn't have a choice but to get hit by it. At first I thought I was just going to lose my probes but when I lost my Nexus I thought I was going to lose.
- There's a high chance that you'll meet Flash in the ro8. ▲ I've heard that if Flash qualifies for the ro8 there's a high chance that I could meet him. It's my first time facing him so I'm a little flustered, and I think he's a good player so I will prepare my best and try to qualify for the ro4. - (Fomos interview)Your thoughts on your ro8 opponent? ▲ My opponent hasn't been decided yet but I hear that if Flash wins there's a high chance that I'll play him. If we end up playing my opponent would be Terran so I'm confident. It would be the first time I play Flash so I'm a little flustered but I'll win and get to the ro4.
- You're the strongest Royal Roader candidate. ▲ People keep telling me to continue the legacy of getting the silver. They tell me to continue the legacy but I don't want to get the silver, I want the gold. I think it's more important to focus on the ro8 rather than on the legacy.
- Anything you'd like to say? ▲ I feel a bit sorry for Canata hyung since I won against him but he did his best, so I hope he continues to help me and I promise I'll get good results. Whenever Canata hyung plays against Protoss I'll help him so I hope he hope he doesn't take this too personally.
Source: dailyesports.com Source: fomos.co.kr
Kwanro: "I will definitely win this season."
- After 1 loss you won twice in a row to get to the ro8. ▲ I wasn't expecting much but I'm happy that I happened to get good results. Riding this energy through the ro8, ro4, and finals, I will definitely win this season.
- The reason you weren't expecting much? ▲ I'm in the process of training my body to be able to focus just on the game. That's why my control isn't perfect just yet. Despite that I won, so I think my condition will get better sooner.
- You must've been disappointed with your first loss. ▲ I wasn't too disappointed since I lost because I didn't play well. I still have a lot of games left. The Proleague is in the 2nd round and there's still the individual leagues. I think it would be adverse if I tried to hurry. I'm trying to enjoy my games.
- You had a memorable late-game oriented gameplan. ▲ That's just one of my many builds. I could've done 9drone, 12pool, or 3 hatchery. This was a build that would take advantage of a safe build from my opponent.
- As the last MSL's silver winner are you nervous now that the gold winner got knocked out? ▲ I am not nervous. Since I got silver last season my desire to win gold this season is large.
- It's your first interview after Stork's. ▲ I don't have anything to say (TL note: Yea, well... block of text incoming.) I felt sorry for myself. But I thought that I had the skills and even got to the finals last season. Stork might've made a mistake but I thought that I had to do well myself. Reading such an aggressive interview made me a bit bitter. (TL note (Fomos version): Stork was probably on edge when he had the interview but he had a very aggressive interview. I felt like I had to do better and it made me a bit bitter.) If the fans feel sorry for me I ask them to subscribe to my fan cafe. I got the silver last season but my fan cafe popularity is waning. I will try my best so I hope they support me. I don't hope that I ask that they support me (laughs).
- Anything you'd like to say? ▲ Despite it being Christmas, the Terran player hOn_sin helped me practice a lot. We're up against eStro in the Proleague. I believe winning helps one win more, so I hope I win. I'd also like to say thank you to my teammates that have helped me.
Source: dailyesports.com
Hwasin: "Kal is my worst opponent"
- Your feelings on getting to the ro8. ▲ I've gotten to the ro16 a lot but it's been a while since I've made it to the ro8. It's been said that I'm weak in this type of schedule but I won 3 games out of 5 so I think it's a good chance to change that.
- It seems like you guessed your opponent's strategy perfectly. ▲ Instead of increasing my practice time, I thought a lot more. I had a feeling my opponent would do a fast nexus without a gateway. I think I won the mindgame. Even if my opponent did a 1-base game I wouldn't be in a good position but I'd have plenty of room to catch up with so I chose that build.
- You've been doing well recently. ▲ I don't think I haven't been practicing too little recently. I've practiced so much I lost track. Effort is effort but I think being mentally firm has led to my good results.
- There's been a lot of instances where you couldn't get past the ro16. ▲ I have to post good results to say something to those people who think lowly of me, but I haven't had that chance until now. This time I will say all I want to say by doing well.
- You're meeting Kal, your teammate, in the ro8. ▲ It's put me in a dilemma. Out of the 8 players it's the player I wanted to face the least. He's the worst opponent to face. It's an individual league, so of course I want to do well and win, so I'll try my best.
- Source: dailyesports.com
Flash: "I've secured a seed so I'm satisfied." "Don't debase my effort with one bad comment."
- It's been 4 seasons since you've made it to the MSL ro8 ▲ It's been a while since I've secured a seed in both leagues. I've accomplished my first goal so I think all that's left is to move forward.
- You got into both the OSL ro4 and MSL ro8. ▲ I have a game tomorrow so I can't be satisfied yet. If I win tomorrow's game I'll be winning 3 series in a row so I think I'll be able to feel a big happiness for the first time in a while.
- Your opponent prepared a very tight build against you. ▲ At first I wasn't panicking but then I found out my turret didn't build and I panicked. You have to build the turret between workers on Match Point, but despite the fact that I told it to build one my SCV didn't build it so my opponent benefited greatly. ZerO definitely took advantage of this. I was disappointed after I lost, but I was thankfully able to steady my heart and secure the next game.
- If the turret built do you think you could've won? ▲ I don't think ZerO planned on attacking me that way. He told me during the pre-game chat that he just wanted to pressure me but when he saw that my SCV couldn't build the turret he attacked agressively. That's why during the second game I took special attention of that aspect as I played.
- During the OSL you had prepared a build and today you played my standard. Is this your mindgame? ▲ I felt like this would confuse my opponent. I had today's game in mind as well when I prepared the bunker rush against Jaedong, and I think it had good results.
- Now you have to face BeSt in the ro8. ▲ BeSt plays well against Terran. Historically I haven't won against him but he's not a player I think is unbeatable so I think I have plenty of chances to win.
- The maps favor BeSt. ▲ For the MSL maps it's alright playing against Zerg but playing versus Protoss is difficult, but like yesterday's game where I won against Jaedong despite the unfavorable map, I think I will put faith in my skill and play.
- You must want to win the MSL. ▲ I haven't made the gold my goal. My previous goal was to get seeded, and I know my career is still lacking. Even then instead of focusing on the gold I will focus more on trying my best to win the game in front of me.
- Any parting words? ▲ I was a little sorry because I had prepared a bunker rush build yesterday and so many fans had showed up. I was sad after seeing the fans become sad. Yesterday's build was a build that could've been played with even if it got blocked. That's why I prepared it so hard, but there were people that spoke ill of me just for bunkering (TL note: T_T don't hate guys). They even spoke ill of my parents, but I don't think anybody has the right to do that. Debasing my week's worth of effort with one bad comment is too much. I hope people don't do that from now on.
Source: fomos.co.kr
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Cool. Can you do khan/mbc interview along with this? Thx!
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woot! thanks for trans! i also would love to see Khan/MBC interview
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I actually did not really like BeSt's personality but he seems pretty all right in this interview.
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Thanks for the interview, I really hope Best can win the MSL this time. I think him vs Flash best of 5 would be awesome to watch.
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Hope Best can win the gold this time, he deserves it! Flash can win the OSL though.
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what does he mean he has never faced flash? he is probably the one player that flash never seems to beat
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On December 26 2009 19:37 losso wrote: what does he mean he has never faced flash? he is probably the one player that flash never seems to beat
I think he is referring to a series game like a Bo3 or Bo5.
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On December 26 2009 19:49 DoctorHelvetica wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 19:37 losso wrote: what does he mean he has never faced flash? he is probably the one player that flash never seems to beat I think he is referring to a series game like a Bo3 or Bo5.
oh ok ^^ that makes sense
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10387 Posts
Did Kwanro get fatter...?
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Nice translations : ) Kwanro kwanrolled himself vs Stork. Good to see him not have a mini-slump
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Flash's ELO is going to fall a bunch because of the one loss.
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What the hell, what is with Kwanro's picture? His eyes are vertically misaligned. They're different heights on his face, it's really creeping me out. Going to get a donut. Thanks for translations, Mr. Min.
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On December 26 2009 20:22 SimonB wrote:Flash's ELO is going to fall a bunch because of the one loss. w/e, nobody is going to be near his elo peak for a long time
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On December 26 2009 20:24 Amarxist wrote: What the hell, what is with Kwanro's picture? His eyes are vertically misaligned. They're different heights on his face, it's really creeping me out. Going to get a donut. Thanks for translations, Mr. Min.
Holy shit, you're right. It might be the camera angle but it looks like that...
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On December 26 2009 20:24 Crunchums wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 20:22 SimonB wrote:Flash's ELO is going to fall a bunch because of the one loss. w/e, nobody is going to be near his elo peak for a long time
Besides, it's cooler to hover over it and see that he hit his Elo peak 'vs Jaedong'
Nobody's breaking 2387 anytime soon. Probably ever, honestly.
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lol hwasin is gonna get crushed by kal
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can't wait for flash's. f5ing like crazy.
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On December 26 2009 20:27 Hinanawi wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 20:24 Crunchums wrote:On December 26 2009 20:22 SimonB wrote:Flash's ELO is going to fall a bunch because of the one loss. w/e, nobody is going to be near his elo peak for a long time Besides, it's cooler to hover over it and see that he hit his Elo peak 'vs Jaedong' Nobody's breaking 2387 anytime soon. Probably ever, honestly. LOL.
and humans are never gonna be able to land on the moon either!
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On December 26 2009 20:33 lazz wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 20:27 Hinanawi wrote:On December 26 2009 20:24 Crunchums wrote:On December 26 2009 20:22 SimonB wrote:Flash's ELO is going to fall a bunch because of the one loss. w/e, nobody is going to be near his elo peak for a long time Besides, it's cooler to hover over it and see that he hit his Elo peak 'vs Jaedong' Nobody's breaking 2387 anytime soon. Probably ever, honestly. LOL. and humans are never gonna be able to land on the moon either!
2387 might not fall before SC2 comes out is what he was saying.
On the other hand the sky might fall into the oceans before SC2 comes out as well.
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MrHoon
10183 Posts
I just read the Flash Interview and after reading the interview...
I honestly have no idea whether the interview will bring more antifans or the antifans will slowly disappear. It shows us why Zero won game 2 and also has small bits of Jaedong vs Flash
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On December 26 2009 20:45 MrHoon wrote: I just read the Flash Interview and after reading the interview...
I honestly have no idea whether the interview will bring more antifans or the antifans will slowly disappear. It shows us why Zero won game 2 and also has small bits of Jaedong vs Flash
As a Flash fan since near the beginning, I gotta say - when in doubt with Flash, assume more anti-fans.
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lol you Flash fans have a persecution complex even when he's dominating
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On December 26 2009 20:48 EvoChamber wrote: lol you Flash fans have a persecution complex even when he's dominating
The OSL thread from last night was pretty mean spirited.
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F5 F5 F5 F5 F5. Can't wait for the interview, thanks for the translations :D
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On December 26 2009 20:45 MrHoon wrote: I just read the Flash Interview and after reading the interview...
I honestly have no idea whether the interview will bring more antifans or the antifans will slowly disappear. It shows us why Zero won game 2 and also has small bits of Jaedong vs Flash
i hate being teased. *shakes fist*.
<3 mrhoon
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Ugh... fighting to stay up till the Flash interview is posted
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Thanks for the translations.
Waiting eagerly for interview with Flash.
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mrmin123
Korea (South)2971 Posts
Flash interview up! Thanks for waiting... it takes them around 20 minutes to post the interview up online, and another 20 or so for me to translate ;;
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Yesterday's build was a build that could've been played with even if it got blocked.
Think everyone sad about yesterdays game should thank JD for not blocking it instead of blaming Flash for everything :D
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Korea (South)3086 Posts
I feel so sorry for Flash.
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Haha the netizens are even crueler than TL it seems. At least I don't recall anyone here bashing Flash's parents.
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wtf?
Why are Netizens bashing Flash's parents?
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On December 26 2009 21:04 MrHoon wrote:the netizens are raping him so hard Times like these I wish TL can read korean so they could see how much shit progamers have to go through sometimes. Fortunately the netizen flames died out a little after Zero lost
Could you translate some netizen comments again? I think everyone misses them.
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On December 26 2009 21:10 SuperArc wrote: wtf?
Why are Netizens bashing Flash's parents?
because they can't vent their frustration on jaedong. the guy is just so lovable.
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Great interview by Flash.
I bet if it wasn't Jaedong but Shine or even Zero the guy would not get so much hate. But of course, it was beloved Jaedong who went down 2:0 so people are raging. Noone blames Jaedong that he got dominated. Of course it is Flash's fault that he won.
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You tell 'em Flash. Then you run them over with your new car that you bought with the money you won from triumphing in both leagues. That'll show 'em.
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MrHoon
10183 Posts
On December 26 2009 21:10 SuperArc wrote: wtf?
Why are Netizens bashing Flash's parents?
Netizen lol Flash's parents must of been pretty shitty parents to raise a guy who 7 raxes and can't play straight against the best player in the world Netizen shitty seeds come from shitty parents.
some stuff along the lines of that
@Evochamber Translating netizen comments right now would add more fuel to the fire + Show Spoiler +trust me man, you will regret it
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Kwanro: "I will definitely win this season."
Yep, in ugliness contest sure.
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just when it seemed that foreign fans might not be as retarded as koreans well done
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On December 26 2009 21:12 Lebesgue wrote: Great interview by Flash.
I bet if it wasn't Jaedong but Shine or even Zero the guy would not get so much hate. But of course, it was beloved Jaedong who went down 2:0 so people are raging. Noone blames Jaedong that he got dominated. Of course it is Flash's fault that he won. Wtf? People are raging at FlaSh not because he won, but HOW he won on Christmas. Seriously, is it just me or FlaSh fans just refuse to understand this?
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To be fair, at least nobody here was low enough to say anything about Flash's parents.
Or maybe they did and just got nuked, I don't know.
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LOL @ Netizen #1
so butthurt lmao
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On December 26 2009 21:21 roMAD wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:12 Lebesgue wrote: Great interview by Flash.
I bet if it wasn't Jaedong but Shine or even Zero the guy would not get so much hate. But of course, it was beloved Jaedong who went down 2:0 so people are raging. Noone blames Jaedong that he got dominated. Of course it is Flash's fault that he won. Wtf? People are raging at FlaSh not because he won, but HOW he won on Christmas.
He won first game straight and then 2nd by strategic play. What's wrong with it? People forget that to advance he had to win two games and not one. And Jaedong got rolled a week ago.
As I wrote above, if it wasn't JAedong there wouldn't be even half the hate he gets.
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And to think that Flash isn't even a man yet. He's only 17.
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On December 26 2009 21:17 Daemonarch wrote: Kwanro: "I will definitely win this season."
Yep, in ugliness contest sure.
weird looking for sure like two halves of his face weren't joined right. perhaps he was dropped as a baby.
...on purpose.
ima stork fan.
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On December 26 2009 21:24 Lebesgue wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:21 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:12 Lebesgue wrote: Great interview by Flash.
I bet if it wasn't Jaedong but Shine or even Zero the guy would not get so much hate. But of course, it was beloved Jaedong who went down 2:0 so people are raging. Noone blames Jaedong that he got dominated. Of course it is Flash's fault that he won. Wtf? People are raging at FlaSh not because he won, but HOW he won on Christmas. He won first game straight and then 2nd by strategic play. What's wrong with it? People forget that to advance he had to win two games and not one. And Jaedong got rolled a week ago. As I wrote above, if it wasn't JAedong there wouldn't be even half the hate he gets. So? How does it contradict what i wrote? Of course if it wasn't Jaedong the shitstorm wouldn't even exist. People expected a great series between the two best players in the world and they got a bunker rush. And once again it doesn't matter that JD got rolled a week ago. He surely saw his mistakes and he has been practicing for the whole week, even neglecting his practice for PL (see his interview when OZ beat Hite). He sure prepared very well.
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Flash needs more love in his life the guy can't spend time with his family and people are bashing his parents who didn't do anything wrong.
On December 26 2009 21:28 roMAD wrote:
So? How does it contradict what i wrote? Of course if it wasn't Jaedong the shitstorm wouldn't even exist. People expected a great series between the two best players in the world and they got a bunker rush. And once again it doesn't matter that JD got rolled a week ago. He surely saw his mistakes and he has been practicing for the whole week, even neglecting his practice for PL (see his interview when OZ beat Hite). He sure prepared very well.
Jaedong prepared very well yet losses in less than 10 minutes, that's how well prepare he is. You're saying that Jaedong saw mistakes in his play so he practice a week for it, Flash also likely to saw his mistake(being too standard) and practice the last week for it as well and gets flame for it?
From my perspective I'm thinking people were expecting too much of Jaedong and can't accept the fact that he's been raped 2:0 so now they're taking their rage on flash who did what he suppose to do and win. Christmas or not, it's just the normal round of 8 and if it's a special day to them then they seriously wouldn't have the progamer play on that day. These excuse of being "robbed" of a great series is seriously just an excuse, what's to say that the second game wouldn't end like the first game if flash practice for it instead of using his brain to play?
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What Flash did was cold-blooded as hell, and I respect that. He did what he thought would get him a win, and that's what he did: win. If you're a Flash fan, then you prefer him winning any way he can to him losing in a long, interesting game. Same goes for Jaedong fans who were watching for Jaedong.
Everyone else would have preferred a pair of long, interesting games between the two best players in the world at the height of their skills as opposed to one very disappointing game (disappointing on the level of entertainment, not necessarily because Jaedong lost). They watch professional SC looking for entertainment and they didn't get it. What exactly is so confusing about people being less than happy about that.
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On December 26 2009 21:28 roMAD wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:24 Lebesgue wrote:On December 26 2009 21:21 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:12 Lebesgue wrote: Great interview by Flash.
I bet if it wasn't Jaedong but Shine or even Zero the guy would not get so much hate. But of course, it was beloved Jaedong who went down 2:0 so people are raging. Noone blames Jaedong that he got dominated. Of course it is Flash's fault that he won. Wtf? People are raging at FlaSh not because he won, but HOW he won on Christmas. He won first game straight and then 2nd by strategic play. What's wrong with it? People forget that to advance he had to win two games and not one. And Jaedong got rolled a week ago. As I wrote above, if it wasn't JAedong there wouldn't be even half the hate he gets. So? How does it contradict what i wrote? Of course if it wasn't Jaedong the shitstorm wouldn't even exist. People expected a great series between the two best players in the world and they got a bunker rush. And once again it doesn't matter that JD got rolled a week ago. He surely saw his mistakes and he has been practicing for the whole week, even neglecting his practice for PL (see his interview when OZ beat Hite). He sure prepared very well.
Well, if he prepared so well, why he fell for the overlord snipe? It wasn't some generic 8-rax bunker rush or BBS cheese. It was carefully planed built which exploited the map. I would understand the rage if Flash just gamble and BBS JD. But he didn't, it was strategic play at its finest.
JD might practiced his ass off, but Flash obviously prepared better. Blaming Flash for doing his job better than JD is sad.
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On December 26 2009 21:28 Etopen wrote:Flash needs more love in his life the guy can't spend time with his family and people are bashing his parents who didn't do anything wrong. Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:28 roMAD wrote:
So? How does it contradict what i wrote? Of course if it wasn't Jaedong the shitstorm wouldn't even exist. People expected a great series between the two best players in the world and they got a bunker rush. And once again it doesn't matter that JD got rolled a week ago. He surely saw his mistakes and he has been practicing for the whole week, even neglecting his practice for PL (see his interview when OZ beat Hite). He sure prepared very well. Jaedong prepared very well yet losses in less than 10 minutes, that's how well prepare he is. You're saying that Jaedong saw mistakes in his play so he practice a week for it, Flash also likely to saw his mistake(being too standard) and practice the last week for it as well and gets flame for it? From my perspective I'm thinking people were expecting too much of Jaedong and can't accept the fact that he's been raped 2:0 so now they're taking their rage on flash who did what he suppose to do and win. Christmas or not, it's just the normal round of 8 and if it's a special day to them then they seriously wouldn't have the progamer play on that day. These excuse of being "robbed" of a great series is seriously just an excuse, what's to say that the second game wouldn't end like the first game if flash practice for it instead of using his brain to play? Read the post below you. FlaSh won the game because he prepared as well as Jaedong. But it doesn't take away the fact that he won very uninspiring for the fans. Of course i am upset that JD lost, but it's because he lost it this way and i am not blaming flash btw, a win is a win, but the majority of the fans (including me lol) wanted to see an epic game.
On December 26 2009 21:43 adelarge wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:28 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:24 Lebesgue wrote:On December 26 2009 21:21 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:12 Lebesgue wrote: Great interview by Flash.
I bet if it wasn't Jaedong but Shine or even Zero the guy would not get so much hate. But of course, it was beloved Jaedong who went down 2:0 so people are raging. Noone blames Jaedong that he got dominated. Of course it is Flash's fault that he won. Wtf? People are raging at FlaSh not because he won, but HOW he won on Christmas. He won first game straight and then 2nd by strategic play. What's wrong with it? People forget that to advance he had to win two games and not one. And Jaedong got rolled a week ago. As I wrote above, if it wasn't JAedong there wouldn't be even half the hate he gets. So? How does it contradict what i wrote? Of course if it wasn't Jaedong the shitstorm wouldn't even exist. People expected a great series between the two best players in the world and they got a bunker rush. And once again it doesn't matter that JD got rolled a week ago. He surely saw his mistakes and he has been practicing for the whole week, even neglecting his practice for PL (see his interview when OZ beat Hite). He sure prepared very well. Well, if he prepared so well, why he fell for the overlord snipe? It wasn't some generic 8-rax bunker rush or BBS cheese. It was carefully planed built which exploited the map. I would understand the rage if Flash just gamble and BBS JD. But he didn't, it was strategic play at its finest. JD might practiced his ass off, but Flash obviously prepared better. Blaming Flash for doing his job better than JD is sad. People are flaming FlaSh for a bunker rush instead of a great long game, jeez. How many times do i have to explain this to you FlaSh fans?
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On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:28 Etopen wrote:Flash needs more love in his life the guy can't spend time with his family and people are bashing his parents who didn't do anything wrong. On December 26 2009 21:28 roMAD wrote:
So? How does it contradict what i wrote? Of course if it wasn't Jaedong the shitstorm wouldn't even exist. People expected a great series between the two best players in the world and they got a bunker rush. And once again it doesn't matter that JD got rolled a week ago. He surely saw his mistakes and he has been practicing for the whole week, even neglecting his practice for PL (see his interview when OZ beat Hite). He sure prepared very well. Jaedong prepared very well yet losses in less than 10 minutes, that's how well prepare he is. You're saying that Jaedong saw mistakes in his play so he practice a week for it, Flash also likely to saw his mistake(being too standard) and practice the last week for it as well and gets flame for it? From my perspective I'm thinking people were expecting too much of Jaedong and can't accept the fact that he's been raped 2:0 so now they're taking their rage on flash who did what he suppose to do and win. Christmas or not, it's just the normal round of 8 and if it's a special day to them then they seriously wouldn't have the progamer play on that day. These excuse of being "robbed" of a great series is seriously just an excuse, what's to say that the second game wouldn't end like the first game if flash practice for it instead of using his brain to play? Read the post below you. FlaSh won the game because he prepared as well as Jaedong. But it doesn't take away the fact that he won very uninspiring for the fans. Of course i am upset that JD lost, but it's because he lost it this way and i am not blaming flash btw, a win is a win, but the majority of the fans (including me lol) wanted to see an epic game.
Sure I understand that. People have right to be disappointed but I don't understand all that hate that Flash gets. Seems pretty unfair to me.
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It'll make their destined MSL Bo5 all that much better :-)
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On December 26 2009 21:48 Lebesgue wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:28 Etopen wrote:Flash needs more love in his life the guy can't spend time with his family and people are bashing his parents who didn't do anything wrong. On December 26 2009 21:28 roMAD wrote:
So? How does it contradict what i wrote? Of course if it wasn't Jaedong the shitstorm wouldn't even exist. People expected a great series between the two best players in the world and they got a bunker rush. And once again it doesn't matter that JD got rolled a week ago. He surely saw his mistakes and he has been practicing for the whole week, even neglecting his practice for PL (see his interview when OZ beat Hite). He sure prepared very well. Jaedong prepared very well yet losses in less than 10 minutes, that's how well prepare he is. You're saying that Jaedong saw mistakes in his play so he practice a week for it, Flash also likely to saw his mistake(being too standard) and practice the last week for it as well and gets flame for it? From my perspective I'm thinking people were expecting too much of Jaedong and can't accept the fact that he's been raped 2:0 so now they're taking their rage on flash who did what he suppose to do and win. Christmas or not, it's just the normal round of 8 and if it's a special day to them then they seriously wouldn't have the progamer play on that day. These excuse of being "robbed" of a great series is seriously just an excuse, what's to say that the second game wouldn't end like the first game if flash practice for it instead of using his brain to play? Read the post below you. FlaSh won the game because he prepared as well as Jaedong. But it doesn't take away the fact that he won very uninspiring for the fans. Of course i am upset that JD lost, but it's because he lost it this way and i am not blaming flash btw, a win is a win, but the majority of the fans (including me lol) wanted to see an epic game. Sure I understand that. People have right to be disappointed but I don't understand all that hate that Flash gets. Seems pretty unfair to me. It is. But such is fans' nature.
On December 26 2009 21:49 VioleTAK wrote: It'll make their destined MSL Bo5 all that much better :-) Oh lol. Imagine super duper angry JD vs FlaSh in MSL finals. omg, triple 4 pool? LOL
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lol if you guys want an epic match every time rivals meet stick to WWE ffs. They play to win, not to be your personal entertainer. Jaedong got mind fucked, thats all there is to it.
I would also just like to add that LeeSsang is a joke. All of there games (except for that 1 game in RH3) have been total rape. From the top of my head: BO3 in GOM1, jd raped flash PL on Destination: jd raped flash MSL on NeoHarmony: flash raped jd another PL on Chupung: flash raped jd OSL on rotk (not sure on the map): jd raped flash plus this 2-0 rape.
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On December 26 2009 21:41 EvoChamber wrote: Everyone else would have preferred a pair of long, interesting games between the two best players in the world at the height of their skills as opposed to one very disappointing game (disappointing on the level of entertainment, not necessarily because Jaedong lost). They watch professional SC looking for entertainment and they didn't get it. What exactly is so confusing about people being less than happy about that. The confusing thing is to only find entertainment in standard, straight-up games. I for one do enjoy massively a short, intense, well-executed cheese. The last Flash vs Jaedong game was ten times more interesting than the first of their series.
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On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:43 adelarge wrote: Well, if he prepared so well, why he fell for the overlord snipe? It wasn't some generic 8-rax bunker rush or BBS cheese. It was carefully planed built which exploited the map. I would understand the rage if Flash just gamble and BBS JD. But he didn't, it was strategic play at its finest.
JD might practiced his ass off, but Flash obviously prepared better. Blaming Flash for doing his job better than JD is sad. People are flaming FlaSh for a bunker rush instead of a great long game, jeez. How many times do i have to explain this to you FlaSh fans?
Why they don't blame JD he didn't defend that?
And anyway, I don't have a problem with fans being upset about the game. I have problem with calling Flash fucking faggot or worse for that in like 20 pages of LR. I didn't see such hate after JD crushed Flash with 9-pool against Flash 14CC. On the contrary, everybody was laughing his ass off. Or the 3:0 GOM finals rape. Why people didn't blame JD for going fast mutas every game back then? Shouldn't he just go for more late game oriented built to give the audience better games?
Fucking double standards.
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On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:28 Etopen wrote:Flash needs more love in his life the guy can't spend time with his family and people are bashing his parents who didn't do anything wrong. On December 26 2009 21:28 roMAD wrote:
So? How does it contradict what i wrote? Of course if it wasn't Jaedong the shitstorm wouldn't even exist. People expected a great series between the two best players in the world and they got a bunker rush. And once again it doesn't matter that JD got rolled a week ago. He surely saw his mistakes and he has been practicing for the whole week, even neglecting his practice for PL (see his interview when OZ beat Hite). He sure prepared very well. Jaedong prepared very well yet losses in less than 10 minutes, that's how well prepare he is. You're saying that Jaedong saw mistakes in his play so he practice a week for it, Flash also likely to saw his mistake(being too standard) and practice the last week for it as well and gets flame for it? From my perspective I'm thinking people were expecting too much of Jaedong and can't accept the fact that he's been raped 2:0 so now they're taking their rage on flash who did what he suppose to do and win. Christmas or not, it's just the normal round of 8 and if it's a special day to them then they seriously wouldn't have the progamer play on that day. These excuse of being "robbed" of a great series is seriously just an excuse, what's to say that the second game wouldn't end like the first game if flash practice for it instead of using his brain to play? Read the post below you. FlaSh won the game because he prepared as well as Jaedong. But it doesn't take away the fact that he won very uninspiring for the fans. Of course i am upset that JD lost, but it's because he lost it this way and i am not blaming flash btw, a win is a win, but the majority of the fans (including me lol) wanted to see an epic game.
I want you answer me this; Why is it fine if Flash uses that game plan on other zergs then it's going to be fine but on Jaedong that it gets like this? Did he won both game like this? No, he didn't. Saying Jaedong was prepared as flash is kinda off, he prepared for the mid-late game but did he prepared for the early game? I think not.
Now another question is, what if these 2 matches were played on the same day? Will flash get the same hate as he does now? Jaedong fans are maybe ignoring the first game and saying that he's preparing better for these last 2 matches because of the 1 week period but isn't it his fault that he didn't prepare for the first match that well? I blame the 2 different week matches thing, if it was done on the same week and the result was the same then people might acknowledge flash or but most likely try to blame it on Jaedong's schedule. Yeah sure everyone is expecting a great long game but quit BASHING on the player on your own damn needs.
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On December 26 2009 21:54 iLoveKT wrote: lol if you guys want an epic match every time rivals meet stick to WWE ffs. They play to win, not to be your personal entertainer. Jaedong got mind fucked, thats all there is to it.
I would also just like to add that LeeSsang is a joke. All of there games (except for that 1 game in RH3) have been total rape. From the top of my head: BO3 in GOM1, jd raped flash PL on Destination: jd raped flash MSL on NeoHarmony: flash raped jd another PL on Chupung: flash raped jd OSL on rotk (not sure on the map): jd raped flash plus this 2-0 rape. Fans are fans. They watch for entertainment, that's why all the hate. I don't blame FlaSh, i am just upset how the game went. And showing that their games were always onesided rapes doesn't take away the hope of the fans that their next game might be epic, eh?
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you can't have a gatti vs. ward everytime.
sometimes it's just tyson vs. urkel.
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On December 26 2009 21:49 roMAD wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:48 Lebesgue wrote:On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:28 Etopen wrote:Flash needs more love in his life the guy can't spend time with his family and people are bashing his parents who didn't do anything wrong. On December 26 2009 21:28 roMAD wrote:
So? How does it contradict what i wrote? Of course if it wasn't Jaedong the shitstorm wouldn't even exist. People expected a great series between the two best players in the world and they got a bunker rush. And once again it doesn't matter that JD got rolled a week ago. He surely saw his mistakes and he has been practicing for the whole week, even neglecting his practice for PL (see his interview when OZ beat Hite). He sure prepared very well. Jaedong prepared very well yet losses in less than 10 minutes, that's how well prepare he is. You're saying that Jaedong saw mistakes in his play so he practice a week for it, Flash also likely to saw his mistake(being too standard) and practice the last week for it as well and gets flame for it? From my perspective I'm thinking people were expecting too much of Jaedong and can't accept the fact that he's been raped 2:0 so now they're taking their rage on flash who did what he suppose to do and win. Christmas or not, it's just the normal round of 8 and if it's a special day to them then they seriously wouldn't have the progamer play on that day. These excuse of being "robbed" of a great series is seriously just an excuse, what's to say that the second game wouldn't end like the first game if flash practice for it instead of using his brain to play? Read the post below you. FlaSh won the game because he prepared as well as Jaedong. But it doesn't take away the fact that he won very uninspiring for the fans. Of course i am upset that JD lost, but it's because he lost it this way and i am not blaming flash btw, a win is a win, but the majority of the fans (including me lol) wanted to see an epic game. Sure I understand that. People have right to be disappointed but I don't understand all that hate that Flash gets. Seems pretty unfair to me. It is. But such is fans' nature. Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:49 VioleTAK wrote: It'll make their destined MSL Bo5 all that much better :-) Oh lol. Imagine super duper angry JD vs FlaSh in MSL finals. omg, triple 4 pool? LOL
Perfect MSL Finals?: Game1: Flash > Jaedong (Bunker Rush) Game2: Flash < Jaedong (4 pool) Game3: Flash > Jaedong (Bunker Rush) Game4: Flash < Jaedong (4 pool) 16min total game time, 45min commercials. Game5: Flash <> Jaedong (JD 4 pool, Flash BBS... MBC ppp, commercials, restart game)
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- During the OSL you had prepared a build and today you played my standard. Is this your mindgame? ▲ I felt like this would confuse my opponent. I had today's game in mind as well when I prepared the bunker rush against Jaedong, and I think it had good results.
- The maps favor BeSt. ▲ For the MSL maps it's alright playing against Zerg but playing versus Protoss is difficult, but like yesterday's game where I won against Jaedong despite the unfavorable map, I think I will put faith in my skill and play.
- Any parting words? ▲ I was a little sorry because I had prepared a bunker rush build yesterday and so many fans had showed up. I was sad after seeing the fans become sad. Yesterday's build was a build that could've been played with even if it got blocked. That's why I prepared it so hard, but there were people that spoke ill of me just for bunkering
Very insightful and informative comments about the Jaedong game IMO! I just feel a need to highlight them.
Metagaming as well as map imba seem to me like very good reasons for cheesing.
And big thanks for the interview translations, I read them all the time, but haven't said any thanks.
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LOL at Kwanro promising to take it all:-p
I'm sorry to see Hwasin vs Kal, but at least Kal's guaranteed a spot in the semis:-p This is his MSL!
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On December 26 2009 21:58 adelarge wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:43 adelarge wrote: Well, if he prepared so well, why he fell for the overlord snipe? It wasn't some generic 8-rax bunker rush or BBS cheese. It was carefully planed built which exploited the map. I would understand the rage if Flash just gamble and BBS JD. But he didn't, it was strategic play at its finest.
JD might practiced his ass off, but Flash obviously prepared better. Blaming Flash for doing his job better than JD is sad. People are flaming FlaSh for a bunker rush instead of a great long game, jeez. How many times do i have to explain this to you FlaSh fans? Why they don't blame JD he didn't defend that? And anyway, I don't have a problem with fans being upset about the game. I have problem with calling Flash fucking faggot or worse for that in like 20 pages of LR. I didn't see such hate after JD crushed Flash with 9-pool against Flash 14CC. On the contrary, everybody was laughing his ass off. Or the 3:0 GOM finals rape. Why people didn't blame JD for going fast mutas every game back then? Shouldn't he just go for more late game oriented built to give the audience better games? Fucking double standards. Because 2-hat muta is a fairly standard play and Flash couldn't defend it twice? Because FlaSh often went 14CC and he finally got payed for it? Tbh i do blame JD for not preparing for this. I am actually very surprised he wasn't at all prepared for such a situation. But that's not the case. I am just explaining the rage towards FlaSh. I don't blame FlaSh by any means.
On December 26 2009 21:58 Etopen wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:28 Etopen wrote:Flash needs more love in his life the guy can't spend time with his family and people are bashing his parents who didn't do anything wrong. On December 26 2009 21:28 roMAD wrote:
So? How does it contradict what i wrote? Of course if it wasn't Jaedong the shitstorm wouldn't even exist. People expected a great series between the two best players in the world and they got a bunker rush. And once again it doesn't matter that JD got rolled a week ago. He surely saw his mistakes and he has been practicing for the whole week, even neglecting his practice for PL (see his interview when OZ beat Hite). He sure prepared very well. Jaedong prepared very well yet losses in less than 10 minutes, that's how well prepare he is. You're saying that Jaedong saw mistakes in his play so he practice a week for it, Flash also likely to saw his mistake(being too standard) and practice the last week for it as well and gets flame for it? From my perspective I'm thinking people were expecting too much of Jaedong and can't accept the fact that he's been raped 2:0 so now they're taking their rage on flash who did what he suppose to do and win. Christmas or not, it's just the normal round of 8 and if it's a special day to them then they seriously wouldn't have the progamer play on that day. These excuse of being "robbed" of a great series is seriously just an excuse, what's to say that the second game wouldn't end like the first game if flash practice for it instead of using his brain to play? Read the post below you. FlaSh won the game because he prepared as well as Jaedong. But it doesn't take away the fact that he won very uninspiring for the fans. Of course i am upset that JD lost, but it's because he lost it this way and i am not blaming flash btw, a win is a win, but the majority of the fans (including me lol) wanted to see an epic game. I want you answer me this; Why is it fine if Flash uses that game plan on other zergs then it's going to be fine but on Jaedong that it gets like this? Did he won both game like this? No, he didn't. Saying Jaedong was prepared as flash is kinda off, he prepared for the mid-late game but did he prepared for the early game? I think not. Now another question is, what if these 2 matches were played on the same day? Will flash get the same hate as he does now? Jaedong fans are maybe ignoring the first game and saying that he's preparing better for these last 2 matches because of the 1 week period but isn't it his fault that he didn't prepare for the first match that well? I blame the 2 different week matches thing, if it was done on the same week and the result was the same then people might acknowledge flash or but most likely try to blame it on Jaedong's schedule. Yeah sure everyone is expecting a great long game but quit BASHING on the player on your own damn needs. Well, you know, JD in his interviews after their 1st game always told how hard he is preparing for his matches against FlaSh. This hyped people a lot. Nobody blamed FlaSh when he won the first game, it is sad and wrong to blame FlaSh for what he did, but fans are like this, there's nothing you can do. And you know if a grandmother had a penis she would be a grandfather. I can't tell what would have been if they played this series on the same day.
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The desire to see the top players in a long, intense game is of course highly understandable, but these kind of epic games can only result from a situation where both players are trying everything in their power to destroy their opponent but end up constantly blocking eachother.
People have blamed Flash for robbing them of an epic game by playing to win, but that doesn't make sense. If Flash hadn't been playing solely to destroy Jaedong then there'd be almost no chance of a really epic game anyway. The simple truth is that this time Jaedong was unable to block Flash's first attack and that was the end of the game. It's too bad, but no one should blame Flash for it. I guess most people angry at Flash are just angry at their favourite player losing like that (which is of course perfectly understandable), and hopefully don't seriously resent Flash.
It just goes to show that the stars really need to align for the kind of epic matches people had envisioned to actually happen. Hopefully it'll happen in the MSL now instead :D
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On December 26 2009 22:07 roMAD wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:58 adelarge wrote:On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:43 adelarge wrote: Well, if he prepared so well, why he fell for the overlord snipe? It wasn't some generic 8-rax bunker rush or BBS cheese. It was carefully planed built which exploited the map. I would understand the rage if Flash just gamble and BBS JD. But he didn't, it was strategic play at its finest.
JD might practiced his ass off, but Flash obviously prepared better. Blaming Flash for doing his job better than JD is sad. People are flaming FlaSh for a bunker rush instead of a great long game, jeez. How many times do i have to explain this to you FlaSh fans? Why they don't blame JD he didn't defend that? And anyway, I don't have a problem with fans being upset about the game. I have problem with calling Flash fucking faggot or worse for that in like 20 pages of LR. I didn't see such hate after JD crushed Flash with 9-pool against Flash 14CC. On the contrary, everybody was laughing his ass off. Or the 3:0 GOM finals rape. Why people didn't blame JD for going fast mutas every game back then? Shouldn't he just go for more late game oriented built to give the audience better games? Fucking double standards. Because 2-hat muta is a fairly standard play and Flash couldn't defend it twice? Because FlaSh often went 14CC and he finally got payed for it? Tbh i do blame JD for not preparing for this. I am actually very surprised he wasn't at all prepared for such a situation. But that's not the case. I am just explaining the rage towards FlaSh. I don't blame FlaSh by any means. Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:58 Etopen wrote:On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:28 Etopen wrote:Flash needs more love in his life the guy can't spend time with his family and people are bashing his parents who didn't do anything wrong. On December 26 2009 21:28 roMAD wrote:
So? How does it contradict what i wrote? Of course if it wasn't Jaedong the shitstorm wouldn't even exist. People expected a great series between the two best players in the world and they got a bunker rush. And once again it doesn't matter that JD got rolled a week ago. He surely saw his mistakes and he has been practicing for the whole week, even neglecting his practice for PL (see his interview when OZ beat Hite). He sure prepared very well. Jaedong prepared very well yet losses in less than 10 minutes, that's how well prepare he is. You're saying that Jaedong saw mistakes in his play so he practice a week for it, Flash also likely to saw his mistake(being too standard) and practice the last week for it as well and gets flame for it? From my perspective I'm thinking people were expecting too much of Jaedong and can't accept the fact that he's been raped 2:0 so now they're taking their rage on flash who did what he suppose to do and win. Christmas or not, it's just the normal round of 8 and if it's a special day to them then they seriously wouldn't have the progamer play on that day. These excuse of being "robbed" of a great series is seriously just an excuse, what's to say that the second game wouldn't end like the first game if flash practice for it instead of using his brain to play? Read the post below you. FlaSh won the game because he prepared as well as Jaedong. But it doesn't take away the fact that he won very uninspiring for the fans. Of course i am upset that JD lost, but it's because he lost it this way and i am not blaming flash btw, a win is a win, but the majority of the fans (including me lol) wanted to see an epic game. I want you answer me this; Why is it fine if Flash uses that game plan on other zergs then it's going to be fine but on Jaedong that it gets like this? Did he won both game like this? No, he didn't. Saying Jaedong was prepared as flash is kinda off, he prepared for the mid-late game but did he prepared for the early game? I think not. Now another question is, what if these 2 matches were played on the same day? Will flash get the same hate as he does now? Jaedong fans are maybe ignoring the first game and saying that he's preparing better for these last 2 matches because of the 1 week period but isn't it his fault that he didn't prepare for the first match that well? I blame the 2 different week matches thing, if it was done on the same week and the result was the same then people might acknowledge flash or but most likely try to blame it on Jaedong's schedule. Yeah sure everyone is expecting a great long game but quit BASHING on the player on your own damn needs. Well, you know, JD in his interviews after their 1st game always told how hard he is preparing for his matches against FlaSh. This hyped people a lot. Nobody blamed FlaSh when he won the first game, it is sad and wrong to blame FlaSh for what he did, but fans are like this, there's nothing you can do. And you know if a grandmother had a penis she would be a grandfather. I can't tell what would have been if they played this series on the same day.
lol wut? that's so random.
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On December 26 2009 22:11 mmgoose wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 22:07 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:58 adelarge wrote:On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:43 adelarge wrote: Well, if he prepared so well, why he fell for the overlord snipe? It wasn't some generic 8-rax bunker rush or BBS cheese. It was carefully planed built which exploited the map. I would understand the rage if Flash just gamble and BBS JD. But he didn't, it was strategic play at its finest.
JD might practiced his ass off, but Flash obviously prepared better. Blaming Flash for doing his job better than JD is sad. People are flaming FlaSh for a bunker rush instead of a great long game, jeez. How many times do i have to explain this to you FlaSh fans? Why they don't blame JD he didn't defend that? And anyway, I don't have a problem with fans being upset about the game. I have problem with calling Flash fucking faggot or worse for that in like 20 pages of LR. I didn't see such hate after JD crushed Flash with 9-pool against Flash 14CC. On the contrary, everybody was laughing his ass off. Or the 3:0 GOM finals rape. Why people didn't blame JD for going fast mutas every game back then? Shouldn't he just go for more late game oriented built to give the audience better games? Fucking double standards. Because 2-hat muta is a fairly standard play and Flash couldn't defend it twice? Because FlaSh often went 14CC and he finally got payed for it? Tbh i do blame JD for not preparing for this. I am actually very surprised he wasn't at all prepared for such a situation. But that's not the case. I am just explaining the rage towards FlaSh. I don't blame FlaSh by any means. On December 26 2009 21:58 Etopen wrote:On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:28 Etopen wrote:Flash needs more love in his life the guy can't spend time with his family and people are bashing his parents who didn't do anything wrong. On December 26 2009 21:28 roMAD wrote:
So? How does it contradict what i wrote? Of course if it wasn't Jaedong the shitstorm wouldn't even exist. People expected a great series between the two best players in the world and they got a bunker rush. And once again it doesn't matter that JD got rolled a week ago. He surely saw his mistakes and he has been practicing for the whole week, even neglecting his practice for PL (see his interview when OZ beat Hite). He sure prepared very well. Jaedong prepared very well yet losses in less than 10 minutes, that's how well prepare he is. You're saying that Jaedong saw mistakes in his play so he practice a week for it, Flash also likely to saw his mistake(being too standard) and practice the last week for it as well and gets flame for it? From my perspective I'm thinking people were expecting too much of Jaedong and can't accept the fact that he's been raped 2:0 so now they're taking their rage on flash who did what he suppose to do and win. Christmas or not, it's just the normal round of 8 and if it's a special day to them then they seriously wouldn't have the progamer play on that day. These excuse of being "robbed" of a great series is seriously just an excuse, what's to say that the second game wouldn't end like the first game if flash practice for it instead of using his brain to play? Read the post below you. FlaSh won the game because he prepared as well as Jaedong. But it doesn't take away the fact that he won very uninspiring for the fans. Of course i am upset that JD lost, but it's because he lost it this way and i am not blaming flash btw, a win is a win, but the majority of the fans (including me lol) wanted to see an epic game. I want you answer me this; Why is it fine if Flash uses that game plan on other zergs then it's going to be fine but on Jaedong that it gets like this? Did he won both game like this? No, he didn't. Saying Jaedong was prepared as flash is kinda off, he prepared for the mid-late game but did he prepared for the early game? I think not. Now another question is, what if these 2 matches were played on the same day? Will flash get the same hate as he does now? Jaedong fans are maybe ignoring the first game and saying that he's preparing better for these last 2 matches because of the 1 week period but isn't it his fault that he didn't prepare for the first match that well? I blame the 2 different week matches thing, if it was done on the same week and the result was the same then people might acknowledge flash or but most likely try to blame it on Jaedong's schedule. Yeah sure everyone is expecting a great long game but quit BASHING on the player on your own damn needs. Well, you know, JD in his interviews after their 1st game always told how hard he is preparing for his matches against FlaSh. This hyped people a lot. Nobody blamed FlaSh when he won the first game, it is sad and wrong to blame FlaSh for what he did, but fans are like this, there's nothing you can do. And you know if a grandmother had a penis she would be a grandfather. I can't tell what would have been if they played this series on the same day. lol wut? that's so random. lol :-)
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On December 26 2009 21:57 Matoo- wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:41 EvoChamber wrote: Everyone else would have preferred a pair of long, interesting games between the two best players in the world at the height of their skills as opposed to one very disappointing game (disappointing on the level of entertainment, not necessarily because Jaedong lost). They watch professional SC looking for entertainment and they didn't get it. What exactly is so confusing about people being less than happy about that. The confusing thing is to only find entertainment in standard, straight-up games. I for one do enjoy massively a short, intense, well-executed cheese. The last Flash vs Jaedong game was ten times more interesting than the first of their series. To add up on that post, don't take this for you since I actually have a lot of respect for your posts and you obviously have quite a deep understanding of the game, but enjoying only long games is kind of shallow - like fan girls who want to see scourge killing vessels and stuff otherwise it's boring. People complaining about cheese not being entertaining have only themselves to blame for not finding the true entertainment that lies in cheese, especially when considering the context, playing habits, history between the players etc - that's here that cheese shines the most and really gets awesome.
Yeah I'm a huge cheese fan - the food as well as the playstyle.
Obviously if every game was over in 5 minutes it'd be horrible but right now I feel that Starcraft isn't too much cheese-oriented at all, if anything it's the other way around. So for me yesterday's game was very refreshing and much more entertaining than yet another straight-up game.
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On December 26 2009 22:11 mmgoose wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 22:07 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:58 adelarge wrote:On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:43 adelarge wrote: Well, if he prepared so well, why he fell for the overlord snipe? It wasn't some generic 8-rax bunker rush or BBS cheese. It was carefully planed built which exploited the map. I would understand the rage if Flash just gamble and BBS JD. But he didn't, it was strategic play at its finest.
JD might practiced his ass off, but Flash obviously prepared better. Blaming Flash for doing his job better than JD is sad. People are flaming FlaSh for a bunker rush instead of a great long game, jeez. How many times do i have to explain this to you FlaSh fans? Why they don't blame JD he didn't defend that? And anyway, I don't have a problem with fans being upset about the game. I have problem with calling Flash fucking faggot or worse for that in like 20 pages of LR. I didn't see such hate after JD crushed Flash with 9-pool against Flash 14CC. On the contrary, everybody was laughing his ass off. Or the 3:0 GOM finals rape. Why people didn't blame JD for going fast mutas every game back then? Shouldn't he just go for more late game oriented built to give the audience better games? Fucking double standards. Because 2-hat muta is a fairly standard play and Flash couldn't defend it twice? Because FlaSh often went 14CC and he finally got payed for it? Tbh i do blame JD for not preparing for this. I am actually very surprised he wasn't at all prepared for such a situation. But that's not the case. I am just explaining the rage towards FlaSh. I don't blame FlaSh by any means. On December 26 2009 21:58 Etopen wrote:On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:28 Etopen wrote:Flash needs more love in his life the guy can't spend time with his family and people are bashing his parents who didn't do anything wrong. On December 26 2009 21:28 roMAD wrote:
So? How does it contradict what i wrote? Of course if it wasn't Jaedong the shitstorm wouldn't even exist. People expected a great series between the two best players in the world and they got a bunker rush. And once again it doesn't matter that JD got rolled a week ago. He surely saw his mistakes and he has been practicing for the whole week, even neglecting his practice for PL (see his interview when OZ beat Hite). He sure prepared very well. Jaedong prepared very well yet losses in less than 10 minutes, that's how well prepare he is. You're saying that Jaedong saw mistakes in his play so he practice a week for it, Flash also likely to saw his mistake(being too standard) and practice the last week for it as well and gets flame for it? From my perspective I'm thinking people were expecting too much of Jaedong and can't accept the fact that he's been raped 2:0 so now they're taking their rage on flash who did what he suppose to do and win. Christmas or not, it's just the normal round of 8 and if it's a special day to them then they seriously wouldn't have the progamer play on that day. These excuse of being "robbed" of a great series is seriously just an excuse, what's to say that the second game wouldn't end like the first game if flash practice for it instead of using his brain to play? Read the post below you. FlaSh won the game because he prepared as well as Jaedong. But it doesn't take away the fact that he won very uninspiring for the fans. Of course i am upset that JD lost, but it's because he lost it this way and i am not blaming flash btw, a win is a win, but the majority of the fans (including me lol) wanted to see an epic game. I want you answer me this; Why is it fine if Flash uses that game plan on other zergs then it's going to be fine but on Jaedong that it gets like this? Did he won both game like this? No, he didn't. Saying Jaedong was prepared as flash is kinda off, he prepared for the mid-late game but did he prepared for the early game? I think not. Now another question is, what if these 2 matches were played on the same day? Will flash get the same hate as he does now? Jaedong fans are maybe ignoring the first game and saying that he's preparing better for these last 2 matches because of the 1 week period but isn't it his fault that he didn't prepare for the first match that well? I blame the 2 different week matches thing, if it was done on the same week and the result was the same then people might acknowledge flash or but most likely try to blame it on Jaedong's schedule. Yeah sure everyone is expecting a great long game but quit BASHING on the player on your own damn needs. Well, you know, JD in his interviews after their 1st game always told how hard he is preparing for his matches against FlaSh. This hyped people a lot. Nobody blamed FlaSh when he won the first game, it is sad and wrong to blame FlaSh for what he did, but fans are like this, there's nothing you can do. And you know if a grandmother had a penis she would be a grandfather. I can't tell what would have been if they played this series on the same day. lol wut? that's so random. In case you didn't get it, i explained the meaning in the next sentence.
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On December 26 2009 22:13 roMAD wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 22:11 mmgoose wrote:On December 26 2009 22:07 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:58 adelarge wrote:On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:43 adelarge wrote: Well, if he prepared so well, why he fell for the overlord snipe? It wasn't some generic 8-rax bunker rush or BBS cheese. It was carefully planed built which exploited the map. I would understand the rage if Flash just gamble and BBS JD. But he didn't, it was strategic play at its finest.
JD might practiced his ass off, but Flash obviously prepared better. Blaming Flash for doing his job better than JD is sad. People are flaming FlaSh for a bunker rush instead of a great long game, jeez. How many times do i have to explain this to you FlaSh fans? Why they don't blame JD he didn't defend that? And anyway, I don't have a problem with fans being upset about the game. I have problem with calling Flash fucking faggot or worse for that in like 20 pages of LR. I didn't see such hate after JD crushed Flash with 9-pool against Flash 14CC. On the contrary, everybody was laughing his ass off. Or the 3:0 GOM finals rape. Why people didn't blame JD for going fast mutas every game back then? Shouldn't he just go for more late game oriented built to give the audience better games? Fucking double standards. Because 2-hat muta is a fairly standard play and Flash couldn't defend it twice? Because FlaSh often went 14CC and he finally got payed for it? Tbh i do blame JD for not preparing for this. I am actually very surprised he wasn't at all prepared for such a situation. But that's not the case. I am just explaining the rage towards FlaSh. I don't blame FlaSh by any means. On December 26 2009 21:58 Etopen wrote:On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:28 Etopen wrote:Flash needs more love in his life the guy can't spend time with his family and people are bashing his parents who didn't do anything wrong. On December 26 2009 21:28 roMAD wrote:
So? How does it contradict what i wrote? Of course if it wasn't Jaedong the shitstorm wouldn't even exist. People expected a great series between the two best players in the world and they got a bunker rush. And once again it doesn't matter that JD got rolled a week ago. He surely saw his mistakes and he has been practicing for the whole week, even neglecting his practice for PL (see his interview when OZ beat Hite). He sure prepared very well. Jaedong prepared very well yet losses in less than 10 minutes, that's how well prepare he is. You're saying that Jaedong saw mistakes in his play so he practice a week for it, Flash also likely to saw his mistake(being too standard) and practice the last week for it as well and gets flame for it? From my perspective I'm thinking people were expecting too much of Jaedong and can't accept the fact that he's been raped 2:0 so now they're taking their rage on flash who did what he suppose to do and win. Christmas or not, it's just the normal round of 8 and if it's a special day to them then they seriously wouldn't have the progamer play on that day. These excuse of being "robbed" of a great series is seriously just an excuse, what's to say that the second game wouldn't end like the first game if flash practice for it instead of using his brain to play? Read the post below you. FlaSh won the game because he prepared as well as Jaedong. But it doesn't take away the fact that he won very uninspiring for the fans. Of course i am upset that JD lost, but it's because he lost it this way and i am not blaming flash btw, a win is a win, but the majority of the fans (including me lol) wanted to see an epic game. I want you answer me this; Why is it fine if Flash uses that game plan on other zergs then it's going to be fine but on Jaedong that it gets like this? Did he won both game like this? No, he didn't. Saying Jaedong was prepared as flash is kinda off, he prepared for the mid-late game but did he prepared for the early game? I think not. Now another question is, what if these 2 matches were played on the same day? Will flash get the same hate as he does now? Jaedong fans are maybe ignoring the first game and saying that he's preparing better for these last 2 matches because of the 1 week period but isn't it his fault that he didn't prepare for the first match that well? I blame the 2 different week matches thing, if it was done on the same week and the result was the same then people might acknowledge flash or but most likely try to blame it on Jaedong's schedule. Yeah sure everyone is expecting a great long game but quit BASHING on the player on your own damn needs. Well, you know, JD in his interviews after their 1st game always told how hard he is preparing for his matches against FlaSh. This hyped people a lot. Nobody blamed FlaSh when he won the first game, it is sad and wrong to blame FlaSh for what he did, but fans are like this, there's nothing you can do. And you know if a grandmother had a penis she would be a grandfather. I can't tell what would have been if they played this series on the same day. lol wut? that's so random. In case you didn't get it, i explained the meaning in the next sentence.
i can't for the life of me understand what it mean but may i use it as my sig?
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<3 Flash
I really hope for a JD vs Flash final in the MSL. I'm guessing though that Flash will put more effort into OSL no doubt.
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On December 26 2009 22:25 mmgoose wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 22:13 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 22:11 mmgoose wrote:On December 26 2009 22:07 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:58 adelarge wrote:On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:43 adelarge wrote: Well, if he prepared so well, why he fell for the overlord snipe? It wasn't some generic 8-rax bunker rush or BBS cheese. It was carefully planed built which exploited the map. I would understand the rage if Flash just gamble and BBS JD. But he didn't, it was strategic play at its finest.
JD might practiced his ass off, but Flash obviously prepared better. Blaming Flash for doing his job better than JD is sad. People are flaming FlaSh for a bunker rush instead of a great long game, jeez. How many times do i have to explain this to you FlaSh fans? Why they don't blame JD he didn't defend that? And anyway, I don't have a problem with fans being upset about the game. I have problem with calling Flash fucking faggot or worse for that in like 20 pages of LR. I didn't see such hate after JD crushed Flash with 9-pool against Flash 14CC. On the contrary, everybody was laughing his ass off. Or the 3:0 GOM finals rape. Why people didn't blame JD for going fast mutas every game back then? Shouldn't he just go for more late game oriented built to give the audience better games? Fucking double standards. Because 2-hat muta is a fairly standard play and Flash couldn't defend it twice? Because FlaSh often went 14CC and he finally got payed for it? Tbh i do blame JD for not preparing for this. I am actually very surprised he wasn't at all prepared for such a situation. But that's not the case. I am just explaining the rage towards FlaSh. I don't blame FlaSh by any means. On December 26 2009 21:58 Etopen wrote:On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:28 Etopen wrote:Flash needs more love in his life the guy can't spend time with his family and people are bashing his parents who didn't do anything wrong. On December 26 2009 21:28 roMAD wrote:
So? How does it contradict what i wrote? Of course if it wasn't Jaedong the shitstorm wouldn't even exist. People expected a great series between the two best players in the world and they got a bunker rush. And once again it doesn't matter that JD got rolled a week ago. He surely saw his mistakes and he has been practicing for the whole week, even neglecting his practice for PL (see his interview when OZ beat Hite). He sure prepared very well. Jaedong prepared very well yet losses in less than 10 minutes, that's how well prepare he is. You're saying that Jaedong saw mistakes in his play so he practice a week for it, Flash also likely to saw his mistake(being too standard) and practice the last week for it as well and gets flame for it? From my perspective I'm thinking people were expecting too much of Jaedong and can't accept the fact that he's been raped 2:0 so now they're taking their rage on flash who did what he suppose to do and win. Christmas or not, it's just the normal round of 8 and if it's a special day to them then they seriously wouldn't have the progamer play on that day. These excuse of being "robbed" of a great series is seriously just an excuse, what's to say that the second game wouldn't end like the first game if flash practice for it instead of using his brain to play? Read the post below you. FlaSh won the game because he prepared as well as Jaedong. But it doesn't take away the fact that he won very uninspiring for the fans. Of course i am upset that JD lost, but it's because he lost it this way and i am not blaming flash btw, a win is a win, but the majority of the fans (including me lol) wanted to see an epic game. I want you answer me this; Why is it fine if Flash uses that game plan on other zergs then it's going to be fine but on Jaedong that it gets like this? Did he won both game like this? No, he didn't. Saying Jaedong was prepared as flash is kinda off, he prepared for the mid-late game but did he prepared for the early game? I think not. Now another question is, what if these 2 matches were played on the same day? Will flash get the same hate as he does now? Jaedong fans are maybe ignoring the first game and saying that he's preparing better for these last 2 matches because of the 1 week period but isn't it his fault that he didn't prepare for the first match that well? I blame the 2 different week matches thing, if it was done on the same week and the result was the same then people might acknowledge flash or but most likely try to blame it on Jaedong's schedule. Yeah sure everyone is expecting a great long game but quit BASHING on the player on your own damn needs. Well, you know, JD in his interviews after their 1st game always told how hard he is preparing for his matches against FlaSh. This hyped people a lot. Nobody blamed FlaSh when he won the first game, it is sad and wrong to blame FlaSh for what he did, but fans are like this, there's nothing you can do. And you know if a grandmother had a penis she would be a grandfather. I can't tell what would have been if they played this series on the same day. lol wut? that's so random. In case you didn't get it, i explained the meaning in the next sentence. i can't for the life of me understand what it mean but may i use it as my sig? It means that you can't tell what would have been because you never know, so the discussion about it is pointless. Sure you can, it's not mine anyway
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On December 26 2009 22:07 roMAD wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:58 adelarge wrote:On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:43 adelarge wrote: Well, if he prepared so well, why he fell for the overlord snipe? It wasn't some generic 8-rax bunker rush or BBS cheese. It was carefully planed built which exploited the map. I would understand the rage if Flash just gamble and BBS JD. But he didn't, it was strategic play at its finest.
JD might practiced his ass off, but Flash obviously prepared better. Blaming Flash for doing his job better than JD is sad. People are flaming FlaSh for a bunker rush instead of a great long game, jeez. How many times do i have to explain this to you FlaSh fans? Why they don't blame JD he didn't defend that? And anyway, I don't have a problem with fans being upset about the game. I have problem with calling Flash fucking faggot or worse for that in like 20 pages of LR. I didn't see such hate after JD crushed Flash with 9-pool against Flash 14CC. On the contrary, everybody was laughing his ass off. Or the 3:0 GOM finals rape. Why people didn't blame JD for going fast mutas every game back then? Shouldn't he just go for more late game oriented built to give the audience better games? Fucking double standards. Because 2-hat muta is a fairly standard play and Flash couldn't defend it twice? Because FlaSh often went 14CC and he finally got payed for it? Tbh i do blame JD for not preparing for this. I am actually very surprised he wasn't at all prepared for such a situation. But that's not the case. I am just explaining the rage towards FlaSh. I don't blame FlaSh by any means.
Exactly! JD read Flash like a book a take full advatnage of it. He didn't care about showing a great long back and forth games to fans in the slightest. Just as every profesional. Just as Flash yesterday.
The difference is, nobody called JD names for that. I'm just trying to explain why me (and many other Flash fans I believe) have problems with the hate. It's the hypocrisy of so many people in so many threads. If the majority was just genuinely upset about the quality of games like you, nobody would say a word.
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On December 26 2009 22:12 Matoo- wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:57 Matoo- wrote:On December 26 2009 21:41 EvoChamber wrote: Everyone else would have preferred a pair of long, interesting games between the two best players in the world at the height of their skills as opposed to one very disappointing game (disappointing on the level of entertainment, not necessarily because Jaedong lost). They watch professional SC looking for entertainment and they didn't get it. What exactly is so confusing about people being less than happy about that. The confusing thing is to only find entertainment in standard, straight-up games. I for one do enjoy massively a short, intense, well-executed cheese. The last Flash vs Jaedong game was ten times more interesting than the first of their series. To add up on that post, don't take this for you since I actually have a lot of respect for your posts and you obviously have quite a deep understanding of the game, but enjoying only long games is kind of shallow - like fan girls who want to see scourge killing vessels and stuff otherwise it's boring. People have complaining about cheese not being entertaining suck - it's their own fault for not finding the true entertainment that lies in cheese, especially when considering the context, playing habits, history between the players etc - that's here that cheese shines the most and really gets awesome. Yeah I'm a huge cheese fan - the dish as well as the playstyle. Obviously if every game was over in 5 minutes it'd be horrible but right now I feel that Starcraft is really not too much cheese-oriented at all, if anything it's the other way around, so for me yesterday's game was much more entertaining that another straight-up yawn game.
I think the informed argument for long games would be that it pushes both players as well as the game itself to their limits. It's not just big armies clashing that's exciting (though that's obviously part of the appeal), it's the fact that both players' bodies and minds are forced to reach deeper than they would have in a shorter game. It's in the late-game that the sweat starts to show. Plus late-game, with its developed economies and tech trees, has far more untapped potential (strategically as well as tactically), whereas early game and mid-game have been almost completely charted out.
Cheese can certainly be very entertaining (especially if the player cheesing is someone you like ). But it doesn't advance the boundaries of the game and it doesn't test the true limits of the players. Not to mention that the boundaries of the game can only be tested by the very highest caliber progamers, which Jaedong and Flash indisputably are. So I don't think an informed fan would argue against what Flash did, but they would argue that we missed out on a very rare opportunity to see how far deep this game, which we love but still don't fully know, can truly go.
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I can't believe that people are flaming Flash & his parents though. God there are too many retards out there! Flash beat Jaedong straight up no bullshit on Fighting Spirit and then he annihilated Jaedong's overlord on HBR followed by a nicely placed bunker.
Flash > Jaedong that series hands down. Now if people want to complain just hope for a Jaedong vs Flash series in MSL.
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On December 26 2009 22:27 adelarge wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 22:07 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:58 adelarge wrote:On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:43 adelarge wrote: Well, if he prepared so well, why he fell for the overlord snipe? It wasn't some generic 8-rax bunker rush or BBS cheese. It was carefully planed built which exploited the map. I would understand the rage if Flash just gamble and BBS JD. But he didn't, it was strategic play at its finest.
JD might practiced his ass off, but Flash obviously prepared better. Blaming Flash for doing his job better than JD is sad. People are flaming FlaSh for a bunker rush instead of a great long game, jeez. How many times do i have to explain this to you FlaSh fans? Why they don't blame JD he didn't defend that? And anyway, I don't have a problem with fans being upset about the game. I have problem with calling Flash fucking faggot or worse for that in like 20 pages of LR. I didn't see such hate after JD crushed Flash with 9-pool against Flash 14CC. On the contrary, everybody was laughing his ass off. Or the 3:0 GOM finals rape. Why people didn't blame JD for going fast mutas every game back then? Shouldn't he just go for more late game oriented built to give the audience better games? Fucking double standards. Because 2-hat muta is a fairly standard play and Flash couldn't defend it twice? Because FlaSh often went 14CC and he finally got payed for it? Tbh i do blame JD for not preparing for this. I am actually very surprised he wasn't at all prepared for such a situation. But that's not the case. I am just explaining the rage towards FlaSh. I don't blame FlaSh by any means. Exactly! JD read Flash like a book a take full advatnage of it. He didn't care about showing a great long back and forth games to fans in the slightest. Just as every profesional. Just as Flash yesterday. The difference is, nobody called JD names for that. I'm just trying to explain why me (and many other Flash fans I believe) have problems with the hate. It's the hypocrisy of so many people in so many threads. If the majority was just genuinely upset about the quality of games like you, nobody would say a word. Well, 2-hat muta is less cheesy than a bunker rush and OSL is much more popular than GOM has been. But of course this doesn't justify the hate and i feel sorry for FlaSh, especially when people bash his parents, seriously wtf?
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On December 26 2009 21:54 iLoveKT wrote: They play to win, not to be your personal entertainer.
I completely, completely agree with this. I think that in light of recent games (Best vs Canata, Flash vs Jaedong) people are forgetting this simple truth.
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And there you have it. Leave Flash the fuck alone. <3 Flash, so mannered & skilled
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On December 26 2009 22:34 roMAD wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 22:27 adelarge wrote:On December 26 2009 22:07 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:58 adelarge wrote:On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:43 adelarge wrote: Well, if he prepared so well, why he fell for the overlord snipe? It wasn't some generic 8-rax bunker rush or BBS cheese. It was carefully planed built which exploited the map. I would understand the rage if Flash just gamble and BBS JD. But he didn't, it was strategic play at its finest.
JD might practiced his ass off, but Flash obviously prepared better. Blaming Flash for doing his job better than JD is sad. People are flaming FlaSh for a bunker rush instead of a great long game, jeez. How many times do i have to explain this to you FlaSh fans? Why they don't blame JD he didn't defend that? And anyway, I don't have a problem with fans being upset about the game. I have problem with calling Flash fucking faggot or worse for that in like 20 pages of LR. I didn't see such hate after JD crushed Flash with 9-pool against Flash 14CC. On the contrary, everybody was laughing his ass off. Or the 3:0 GOM finals rape. Why people didn't blame JD for going fast mutas every game back then? Shouldn't he just go for more late game oriented built to give the audience better games? Fucking double standards. Because 2-hat muta is a fairly standard play and Flash couldn't defend it twice? Because FlaSh often went 14CC and he finally got payed for it? Tbh i do blame JD for not preparing for this. I am actually very surprised he wasn't at all prepared for such a situation. But that's not the case. I am just explaining the rage towards FlaSh. I don't blame FlaSh by any means. Exactly! JD read Flash like a book a take full advatnage of it. He didn't care about showing a great long back and forth games to fans in the slightest. Just as every profesional. Just as Flash yesterday. The difference is, nobody called JD names for that. I'm just trying to explain why me (and many other Flash fans I believe) have problems with the hate. It's the hypocrisy of so many people in so many threads. If the majority was just genuinely upset about the quality of games like you, nobody would say a word. Well, 2-hat muta is less cheesy than a bunker rush and OSL is much more popular than GOM has been. But of course this doesn't justify the hate and i feel sorry for FlaSh, especially when people bash his parents, seriously wtf? Yeah, seriously . Hopefully he didn't take it so badly...
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Someone should show BeSt how to hold microphone ^_^
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never really knew why flash/bisu get a ton of hate while jaedong and stork are loved by everyone, I like them all equally!
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On December 26 2009 22:49 adelarge wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 22:34 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 22:27 adelarge wrote:On December 26 2009 22:07 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:58 adelarge wrote:On December 26 2009 21:45 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:43 adelarge wrote: Well, if he prepared so well, why he fell for the overlord snipe? It wasn't some generic 8-rax bunker rush or BBS cheese. It was carefully planed built which exploited the map. I would understand the rage if Flash just gamble and BBS JD. But he didn't, it was strategic play at its finest.
JD might practiced his ass off, but Flash obviously prepared better. Blaming Flash for doing his job better than JD is sad. People are flaming FlaSh for a bunker rush instead of a great long game, jeez. How many times do i have to explain this to you FlaSh fans? Why they don't blame JD he didn't defend that? And anyway, I don't have a problem with fans being upset about the game. I have problem with calling Flash fucking faggot or worse for that in like 20 pages of LR. I didn't see such hate after JD crushed Flash with 9-pool against Flash 14CC. On the contrary, everybody was laughing his ass off. Or the 3:0 GOM finals rape. Why people didn't blame JD for going fast mutas every game back then? Shouldn't he just go for more late game oriented built to give the audience better games? Fucking double standards. Because 2-hat muta is a fairly standard play and Flash couldn't defend it twice? Because FlaSh often went 14CC and he finally got payed for it? Tbh i do blame JD for not preparing for this. I am actually very surprised he wasn't at all prepared for such a situation. But that's not the case. I am just explaining the rage towards FlaSh. I don't blame FlaSh by any means. Exactly! JD read Flash like a book a take full advatnage of it. He didn't care about showing a great long back and forth games to fans in the slightest. Just as every profesional. Just as Flash yesterday. The difference is, nobody called JD names for that. I'm just trying to explain why me (and many other Flash fans I believe) have problems with the hate. It's the hypocrisy of so many people in so many threads. If the majority was just genuinely upset about the quality of games like you, nobody would say a word. Well, 2-hat muta is less cheesy than a bunker rush and OSL is much more popular than GOM has been. But of course this doesn't justify the hate and i feel sorry for FlaSh, especially when people bash his parents, seriously wtf? Yeah, seriously . Hopefully he didn't take it so badly... yeah man im seriously concerned about this. I hope this wont distract him in his future matches.
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On December 26 2009 21:16 MrHoon wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:10 SuperArc wrote: wtf?
Why are Netizens bashing Flash's parents? Netizenlol Flash's parents must of been pretty shitty parents to raise a guy who 7 raxes and can't play straight against the best player in the world Netizenshitty seeds come from shitty parents. some stuff along the lines of that @Evochamber Translating netizen comments right now would add more fuel to the fire + Show Spoiler +trust me man, you will regret it Holy shit those netizens are mean! Thanks for the translations
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It's hard to remain frustrated with Flash when even -he- feels bad about how short the game was. Attacking his family is way overboard for something like that, though.
On the subject of BeSt vs Canata, since I was one of those people: It -is- sort of their job to be entertainers, and Canata's games in particular have a knack for being these drawn-out affairs. It might not be -nice-, but the anti-hype in itself keeps me interested in watching the game in a perverse way.
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netizens! oh, those guys are funny
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funny how everyone thinks its going to be flash vs jaedong in the finals, when he still has to get through best >
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Hong Kong20321 Posts
wtf someone must have photoshopped kwanro
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Well, other than Jaedong (maybe...), BeSt is one of the last capable of knocking Flash out. Flash has not beaten Best, EVER. I don't know why BeSt said that he never faced Flash before. He faced against Flash in the OSL and also defeated him in the proleague.
Apparently Flash lost because of a turret, AGAIN. Lolz. You'd think he learned his lesson after Flash v.s. Hyun...I won't add flame to the fire, but I can sympathize why Flash got flamed so hard after that 7rax. I was extremely disappointed. But insulting his parents was way over the line.
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MrHoon
10183 Posts
On December 27 2009 01:15 dukethegold wrote: Well, other than Jaedong (maybe...), BeSt is one of the last capable of knocking Flash out. Flash has not beaten Best, EVER. I don't know why BeSt said that he never faced Flash before. He faced against Flash to secure his silver medal (and also handing over the gold to July in the process) and also defeated him in the proleague.
Apparently Flash lost because of a turret, AGAIN. Lolz. You'd think he learned his lesson after Flash v.s. Hyun...I won't add flame to the fire, but I can sympathize why Flash got flamed so hard after that 7rax. I was extremely disappointed. But insulting his parents was way over the line. You misunderstood the interview, BeSt is saying that this is the first time they will meet in a BO5
And no, best did not play Flash in Ever 2008, he played Flash in Batoo 2008.
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On December 27 2009 01:22 MrHoon wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2009 01:15 dukethegold wrote: Well, other than Jaedong (maybe...), BeSt is one of the last capable of knocking Flash out. Flash has not beaten Best, EVER. I don't know why BeSt said that he never faced Flash before. He faced against Flash to secure his silver medal (and also handing over the gold to July in the process) and also defeated him in the proleague.
Apparently Flash lost because of a turret, AGAIN. Lolz. You'd think he learned his lesson after Flash v.s. Hyun...I won't add flame to the fire, but I can sympathize why Flash got flamed so hard after that 7rax. I was extremely disappointed. But insulting his parents was way over the line. You misunderstood the interview, BeSt is saying that this is the first time they will meet in a BO5 And no, best did not play Flash in Ever 2008, he played Flash in Batoo 2008.
Oh yes, I just checked the gamelist right before you posted and corrected mine.
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On December 26 2009 21:24 Lebesgue wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:21 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:12 Lebesgue wrote: Great interview by Flash.
I bet if it wasn't Jaedong but Shine or even Zero the guy would not get so much hate. But of course, it was beloved Jaedong who went down 2:0 so people are raging. Noone blames Jaedong that he got dominated. Of course it is Flash's fault that he won. Wtf? People are raging at FlaSh not because he won, but HOW he won on Christmas. He won first game straight and then 2nd by strategic play. What's wrong with it? People forget that to advance he had to win two games and not one. And Jaedong got rolled a week ago. As I wrote above, if it wasn't JAedong there wouldn't be even half the hate he gets.
I think Flash answered this question in his own answer. People came out on christmas day (in our cases we got up at like 3am christmas morning) to see the match-up and we saw that.
Is he wrong for wanting to win? No. Should he expect shit for it? Yes. Starcraft, at least professional sc, is a spectator sport. Without those fans players are playing on bnet for fun.
Having said that, it is clearly inappropriate for Flash to get the hate he does. I just hope that JD gets another shot at him in the MSL finals in a bo5 with everything on the line.
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On December 27 2009 02:05 On_Slaught wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:24 Lebesgue wrote:On December 26 2009 21:21 roMAD wrote:On December 26 2009 21:12 Lebesgue wrote: Great interview by Flash.
I bet if it wasn't Jaedong but Shine or even Zero the guy would not get so much hate. But of course, it was beloved Jaedong who went down 2:0 so people are raging. Noone blames Jaedong that he got dominated. Of course it is Flash's fault that he won. Wtf? People are raging at FlaSh not because he won, but HOW he won on Christmas. He won first game straight and then 2nd by strategic play. What's wrong with it? People forget that to advance he had to win two games and not one. And Jaedong got rolled a week ago. As I wrote above, if it wasn't JAedong there wouldn't be even half the hate he gets. I think Flash answered this question in his own answer. People came out on christmas day (in our cases we got up at like 3am christmas morning) to see the match-up and we saw that. Is he wrong for wanting to win? No. Should he expect shit for it? Yes. Starcraft, at least professional sc, is a spectator sport. Without those fans players are playing on bnet for fun. Having said that, it is clearly inappropriate for Flash to get the hate he does. I just hope that JD gets another shot at him in the MSL finals in a bo5 with everything on the line.
As I have already written above I understand that.
But I can't help to have a feeling that Flash is subject to double standards. I bet if it was Jaedong who won by cheese the shit-storm would be smaller (if it was also the case that it wa Jaedong who dominated Flash in the 1st game and not the other way).
Also, it wasn't some random cheese but well-crafted build that require lots of preparation and people are acting as if it was completely skill-less win
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Wow, another Flash vs Best showdown?
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The truth is, people who complain about it are selfish. Entertainment isn't measured in length and skill isn't measured in the ability to win standard.
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did any1 diss boxer's parents when he triple bunk rush yellow?
fans these days are just getting more and more retarded...
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United States12607 Posts
YEAH BEST!
I feel sorry for Canata too
keep truckin man, Royal Road time!!
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Despite my dislike over BeSt, I have to admit that he can very well knock out Flash out of MSL.
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Canada5565 Posts
Flash vs. Best is going to be good.
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Feel bad for Flash. There's a reason I don't mind Flash cheesing: He's proven that he can play straight up with the best of them and win. He's EARNED that respect. Shine on the other hand...
And I think Flash needs to learn one thing for sure if he wants to be a pro. Don't read fucking netizen comments. That's just a no-go. Pros don't do that. It will fuck with their heads. Focus on the job, not on the popularity contest. Wish someone close to him told him that and all the progamers in general. I see too many of them talking about going on forums and reading what ppl say. It's a dumb thing to do but understandable for their age.
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I just feel that no matter what Flash does, he gets hated on. Game 1 of this series: Oh Flash played so well but he's so boring. Game 2 of this series: Flash is a cheesy bastard, I hate him so much. What do you expect him to do?
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Turtle until late game so there's a big macro battle, but if he wins he's a turtle terran that any Cplayer on iccup could emulate.
Flash fans have long realized he's in a no win situation with the populous for almost no reason. His beautiful MnM play quelled the complaints for awhile but it's inevitable that he gets dogged on.
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lol Best looks like a malnourished go.go in that picture
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still wondering why best holds his mic like that
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if Best vs Flash is totally devoid of cheese, then im going to be seriously surprised
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They even spoke ill of my parent. Whatever gets the job done.
If Flash wins both of the next series I'll be really impressed. He's playing quarterfinal-semifinal level opponents and still winning. Jaedong 2-0 and Zero 2-1 and now he has to play Best and Calm in multi game series. He's really good.
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Taiwan619 Posts
Best seems rather inexperienced with a mic...
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BeSt you're winning streak against FlaSh ends here
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On December 26 2009 21:21 roMAD wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2009 21:12 Lebesgue wrote: Great interview by Flash.
I bet if it wasn't Jaedong but Shine or even Zero the guy would not get so much hate. But of course, it was beloved Jaedong who went down 2:0 so people are raging. Noone blames Jaedong that he got dominated. Of course it is Flash's fault that he won. Wtf? People are raging at FlaSh not because he won, but HOW he won on Christmas. Seriously, is it just me or FlaSh fans just refuse to understand this?
No need to be so condescending. I'm sure if you thought about it for a bit you would understand where our frustration with the venomous contempt is coming from.
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Flash obviously played really well in both series and simply outsmarted Jaedong with that build. He won the mindgames so big props to him. And netizens dragging his parents into this is so low. I really hope Flash doesn't end up reading those comments. At least he all but has the OSL gold to comfort him now unless Calm pulls some crazy shit.
However, some of the Flash fans here are just as annoying as the antifans. I mean, what is up with blaming Jaedong for not defending better? Saying that he wasn't prepared enough. It's not like proxy 7rax -> kill ovie -> bunker rush if 12 hatch, is some sort of super standard build for HBR that we've seen a thousand times and that Jaedong should have been expecting. Flash has played standard for pretty much every game in the last months so of course 12 hatch would have looked to be the logical choice. Like I said, props to Flash for winning the mindgames and Flash is the better player right now. I hope he doesn't let the haters get to him.
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On December 27 2009 07:29 Goragoth wrote: Flash obviously played really well in both series and simply outsmarted Jaedong with that build. He won the mindgames so big props to him. And netizens dragging his parents into this is so low. I really hope Flash doesn't end up reading those comments. At least he all but has the OSL gold to comfort him now unless Calm pulls some crazy shit.
However, some of the Flash fans here are just as annoying as the antifans. I mean, what is up with blaming Jaedong for not defending better? Saying that he wasn't prepared enough. It's not like proxy 7rax -> kill ovie -> bunker rush if 12 hatch, is some sort of super standard build for HBR that we've seen a thousand times and that Jaedong should have been expecting. Flash has played standard for pretty much every game in the last months so of course 12 hatch would have looked to be the logical choice. Like I said, props to Flash for winning the mindgames and Flash is the better player right now. I hope he doesn't let the haters get to him.
I don't think Flash fans are really blaming Jaedong for not playing better. The thing is, there are some people who were really really angry at Flash and blamed him for ruining christmas... and we were trying to point out that if you are going to be so upset with Flash for successfully attacking, why not blame Jaedong for unsuccessfully defending while your at it?
Does that really seem like so unreasonable a point?
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On December 27 2009 07:29 Goragoth wrote: Flash obviously played really well in both series and simply outsmarted Jaedong with that build. He won the mindgames so big props to him. And netizens dragging his parents into this is so low. I really hope Flash doesn't end up reading those comments. At least he all but has the OSL gold to comfort him now unless Calm pulls some crazy shit.
However, some of the Flash fans here are just as annoying as the antifans. I mean, what is up with blaming Jaedong for not defending better? Saying that he wasn't prepared enough. It's not like proxy 7rax -> kill ovie -> bunker rush if 12 hatch, is some sort of super standard build for HBR that we've seen a thousand times and that Jaedong should have been expecting. Flash has played standard for pretty much every game in the last months so of course 12 hatch would have looked to be the logical choice. Like I said, props to Flash for winning the mindgames and Flash is the better player right now. I hope he doesn't let the haters get to him.
Cheese in general is really common on 2 player maps. It's not more common than standard, otherwise the map would be DMZ, but the obvious threat is there and playing 12hatch/14cc/12nex is a bad idea with that threat there.
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On December 27 2009 07:29 Goragoth wrote: Flash obviously played really well in both series and simply outsmarted Jaedong with that build. He won the mindgames so big props to him. And netizens dragging his parents into this is so low. I really hope Flash doesn't end up reading those comments. At least he all but has the OSL gold to comfort him now unless Calm pulls some crazy shit.
However, some of the Flash fans here are just as annoying as the antifans. I mean, what is up with blaming Jaedong for not defending better? Saying that he wasn't prepared enough. It's not like proxy 7rax -> kill ovie -> bunker rush if 12 hatch, is some sort of super standard build for HBR that we've seen a thousand times and that Jaedong should have been expecting. Flash has played standard for pretty much every game in the last months so of course 12 hatch would have looked to be the logical choice. Like I said, props to Flash for winning the mindgames and Flash is the better player right now. I hope he doesn't let the haters get to him.
Noone sane is balming Jaedong for loss. It was just a response of some people to absurd statement that Flash ruined their christmas by cheesing.
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On December 27 2009 07:37 TwoToneTerran wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2009 07:29 Goragoth wrote: Flash obviously played really well in both series and simply outsmarted Jaedong with that build. He won the mindgames so big props to him. And netizens dragging his parents into this is so low. I really hope Flash doesn't end up reading those comments. At least he all but has the OSL gold to comfort him now unless Calm pulls some crazy shit.
However, some of the Flash fans here are just as annoying as the antifans. I mean, what is up with blaming Jaedong for not defending better? Saying that he wasn't prepared enough. It's not like proxy 7rax -> kill ovie -> bunker rush if 12 hatch, is some sort of super standard build for HBR that we've seen a thousand times and that Jaedong should have been expecting. Flash has played standard for pretty much every game in the last months so of course 12 hatch would have looked to be the logical choice. Like I said, props to Flash for winning the mindgames and Flash is the better player right now. I hope he doesn't let the haters get to him. Cheese in general is really common on 2 player maps. It's not more common than standard, otherwise the map would be DMZ, but the obvious threat is there and playing 12hatch/14cc/12nex is a bad idea with that threat there.
I was under the impression that 12 hatch is very standard play on HBR in ZvT (also, and I might be wrong here, but I am under the impression that 12 hatch is far less of a risky build than 12 nex/14 cc, the Zerg equivalent would be more like 3 hatch before pool, no?). I don't believe there was any reason for JD to expect cheese. In the end he ate a build order loss. Happens in ZvZ all the time. Still doesn't make it his fault for not "defending well enough". I seriously doubt any other Zerg in world would have fared better in his position so that's just a silly argument. So is blaming Flash for winning with a well thought out strategy of course. But just because one side is being unreasonable doesn't mean you should respond in kind.
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I was one of those fans who could not help but watched as the clock ticked toward game time between Flash vs Jaedong on X'mas day. I was not as disappointed as many of the fans, in fact I was not disappointed at all. I saw Flash who came with a thorough game plan and I saw Jaedong trying his best to defend the bunker rush. Wasn't it recently where Canata just tried to pull of the same thing on Jaedong on a different map and got completely demolished? Strategic play or cheese, whatever you want to call it -- it still requires as much practices as long drawn out game. Jaedong 4 pooled before. Flash has done other cheeses before. Aren't these unexpected plays what we all love so much about sc and that is why the game is still with us through all these years? Would it have been more satisfying if Jaedong 4 pool on 2nd game so we can get to see the 3rd game? Would people invalidate the win by Jaedong on the 2nd game then or would it be called a stroke of genius to simply all-in the 2nd game so that he only has to concentrate on practicing for game 3 only? I think, to hate or to say that we are disappointed, just imply how unappreciative we are or have been of the levels of game plays that we have been witnessing. These are professional players. They should be punished by their opponents for not scouting. They should be punished for greedy opening. They should be punished for making control mistakes, improper defense, bad simcity. I have learned to expect the unexpected and until these days, I can still be surprised from time to time.
It is normal to feel letdown when your expectation is not met; that feeling resides in all of us as a human nature. However, I think that level of unmet expectation is what keeps us drawn back to the next time they meet (hopefully in the Bof 5 in MSL finals).
Anyhow, I just felt like I have been reading so much angry/hate posts that I just thought I would share this with everyone. Of course, you can disagree with me as you are entitled to your opinion. Just like how I am entitled to mine.
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United States12607 Posts
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WTF? I didn't find that funny at all.
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On December 27 2009 08:11 Goragoth wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2009 07:37 TwoToneTerran wrote:On December 27 2009 07:29 Goragoth wrote: Flash obviously played really well in both series and simply outsmarted Jaedong with that build. He won the mindgames so big props to him. And netizens dragging his parents into this is so low. I really hope Flash doesn't end up reading those comments. At least he all but has the OSL gold to comfort him now unless Calm pulls some crazy shit.
However, some of the Flash fans here are just as annoying as the antifans. I mean, what is up with blaming Jaedong for not defending better? Saying that he wasn't prepared enough. It's not like proxy 7rax -> kill ovie -> bunker rush if 12 hatch, is some sort of super standard build for HBR that we've seen a thousand times and that Jaedong should have been expecting. Flash has played standard for pretty much every game in the last months so of course 12 hatch would have looked to be the logical choice. Like I said, props to Flash for winning the mindgames and Flash is the better player right now. I hope he doesn't let the haters get to him. Cheese in general is really common on 2 player maps. It's not more common than standard, otherwise the map would be DMZ, but the obvious threat is there and playing 12hatch/14cc/12nex is a bad idea with that threat there. I was under the impression that 12 hatch is very standard play on HBR in ZvT (also, and I might be wrong here, but I am under the impression that 12 hatch is far less of a risky build than 12 nex/14 cc, the Zerg equivalent would be more like 3 hatch before pool, no?). I don't believe there was any reason for JD to expect cheese. In the end he ate a build order loss. Happens in ZvZ all the time. Still doesn't make it his fault for not "defending well enough". I seriously doubt any other Zerg in world would have fared better in his position so that's just a silly argument. So is blaming Flash for winning with a well thought out strategy of course. But just because one side is being unreasonable doesn't mean you should respond in kind. the player with a 1-0 lead cheeses alot. its pretty common cause you have another game in your back pocket if you fail, and your opponent probably has an ultra-planned out build that hes been practicing forever that will be completely worthless once you cheese.
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Flash is a baller. ^_^ Hope he takes this MSL. Tx for the interview.
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On December 27 2009 07:15 pathy wrote: Best seems rather inexperienced with a mic...
At least he has one unlike Flash LOL
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Yes, love flash now. made jaedong look like a chump
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On December 27 2009 09:50 writer22816 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2009 07:15 pathy wrote: Best seems rather inexperienced with a mic... At least he has one unlike Flash LOL
reporters hold it up for him.
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