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On May 07 2017 02:56 JimmyJRaynor wrote:Show nested quote +On May 07 2017 02:04 MassHysteria wrote: As for the Raptors defense being worse than last year, the main problem isn't really their defense, it's their offense. Great offense beats a great defense in this modern NBA. And with Derozan 's game not really being suited for the playoffs (his 2pt game becomes too ineffective b/c of more attentive D), and Lowry with his issues, they don't have enough firepower to hang with the top offenses. Them being the worst passing team in the league is no fluke. their offense was equally bad in last year's playoffs; they had really good defense last year and it allowed them to win more games in the playoffs and regular season. Joseph, Lowry, and Carroll are not as effective on defense this year compared to last year. Ibaka is no where near as good an interior defender as Biyombo. Fair enough, but just like last year they struggle to beat "normal offensive teams" and then lose to a top-10 offense. They just had to play CLE in the 2nd round this time.
edit:no shame in that btw, the Cavs are the Cavs, nearly unguardable. The way they have lost def looks worse this season.
edit2: yeah jimmyj, saying they need help on both sides is fair too. I like the author's take on that link too.
edit3: https://sports.vice.com/en_us/article/nba-defenses-cant-stop-the-spread-offense
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Boston sneaking into first in the east really hurt the Raps because now they get knocked out in the second against the Cavs instead of the third! At this point every team in the east's strategy should be to peak when LBJ slows down!
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On May 07 2017 06:43 JimmiC wrote: Boston sneaking into first in the east really hurt the Raps because now they get knocked out in the second against the Cavs instead of the third! At this point every team in the east's strategy should be to peak when LBJ slows down! Well last season the only other top 10 offense in the East besides the Raps was Cleveland. This season, Boston and the Wiz are also up there. So maybe the third round
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Sounds like Thunder 2.0 with Ibaka being one of the culprits there too.
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On May 07 2017 13:36 andrewlt wrote:Sounds like Thunder 2.0 with Ibaka being one of the culprits there too. Not really Ibaka's fault though, Raps have had this problem for years.
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Nice result for Coach of the Year. Spoelstra probably exceeded expectations the most, but he couldn't get it by himself because of his team's performance. I'm not sure D'antoni exceeded expectations but he fits the narrative.
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today's Raptors/Cavs game isn't sold out... and Jurassic Park has looked more like a bad picket line than a viewing party. Same thing happened to the Blue Jays when they tried to crank up ticket prices for the playoffs.
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Can Toronto just lose so we can stop talking about them?
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Oh they will, they had more fight in game 3 and 4, but without Lowry they had no hope. I'm interested to see if next round either team gives the a run. But I think it is a case that it is still Cavs way ahead of everyone else in the east. It's sure looking like GS vs Cavs part 2.
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On May 08 2017 07:19 MassHysteria wrote: Part 3*
yeah that!
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Toronto played better without Lowry. This ends the discussion about whether Toronto is better than last year. Indiana played Cleveland tougher than Toronto.
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I know Lebron destroyed them, but i really feel like they got beat at every non-Derozan position. If there are 10 on the court, and I can pick 5, 4 would probably have been Cavs.
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On May 08 2017 07:49 JimmyJRaynor wrote: Toronto played better without Lowry. This ends the discussion about whether Toronto is better than last year. Indiana played Cleveland tougher than Toronto.
Rolf, they lost to clevland last year they did this year. This year they didn't win at home and didn't have their best player. Perhaps they were marginally worse perhaps marginally better. Either way it doesn't matter they are not good enough to beat lbj led team. So they have to pick on overpaying Lowry ibaka to stay a top 4 team in the east, and hope blk finally shows some down grade before Lowry falls off. Or they start a painful rebuild. Tough decisions.
I hope they keep this core better to watch them try and fail to win then try to lose.
I do think this playoff ends the ridiculous 20 page argument about RJ being "one of the most important free agents" since he is barely if ever seeing the floor and even your twisted logic is that the only stay that matters ever is playoff minutes.
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I think the craziest thing is that even the players didn't seem to think they could win. Reading their interviews after each game, they were all essentially saying: "No idea how we're going to win. Cavs are way better than us."
Terrible attitude.
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On May 08 2017 02:06 Jerubaal wrote: I'm not sure D'antoni exceeded expectations but he fits the narrative.
Preseason the Rockets were projected to be a 7-8 seed by most media outlets.
yahoo projects Rockets 7 seed
espn projects Rockets 8 seed
Virtually every media outlet said the Thunder would be better than the Rockets going into the season, but by mid season the consensus flipped to Westbrook's team being terrible and Harden having the significantly better supporting cast. The cast for both teams didn't change really at that point from where they were when the season started though. Expectations for D'antoni were also really low after his stints with the Lakers and Knicks, and the Rockets coming off a poor defensive year and losing Dwight Howard in the middle, only to get a coach not known for preaching hard nose defense.
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I think the most Lowry will get out of Toronto is $165 Million. The most another team can sign him for is 4 years and $152 million. The Raptors can sign him for 5 years and $205 million.
On May 08 2017 10:26 JimmiC wrote:Show nested quote +On May 08 2017 07:49 JimmyJRaynor wrote: Toronto played better without Lowry. This ends the discussion about whether Toronto is better than last year. Indiana played Cleveland tougher than Toronto.
Rolf, they lost to clevland last year they did this year. This year they didn't win at home and didn't have their best player. Perhaps they were marginally worse perhaps marginally better. Corey Joseph outplayed Lowry in this year's playoffs. Lowry put in another average playoff performance; in the playoffs Lowry is not their best player. he is just-a-guy who is injured in every playoff year.
They won 56 games and 10 playoff games last year while taking 2 games off the NBA champs. This year ain't close. Their defense declined substantially. like i said, Indiana played Cleveland tougher. We'll have a better idea how much worse the Raptors are once Cleveland's playoff run is finished.
On May 08 2017 15:41 Xeris wrote: I think the craziest thing is that even the players didn't seem to think they could win. Reading their interviews after each game, they were all essentially saying: "No idea how we're going to win. Cavs are way better than us." Terrible attitude. They miss Biyombo's interior defense
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This classic Jimmyj so I'll just post this once and stop. Of course they won more games in playoff last year they met the cavs a round later. And there best player missed the two games they played them closer (DD played much better in games 3-4 and that was not related to Lowry being out.
This is no numbers backing up your Corey Joseph outplayed Lowry BS. In fact it only takes looking back a few pages to have you state that he has fallen off a cliff and Delone Wright is much better and blah blah. Your constant need to post your opinions as facts and change the facts to how they suit your current mood is odd and annoying.
Biyombo helped, and played out of his mind last year playoffs. That being said overall I don't think his defense is better the Ibaka's and his overall game is certainly not. It is also a nonsensical to reply to Xeris.
Xeris: I agree they do sound beaten, I think it would be hard to bring back the exact same roster and expect anything different. The big swing and a miss was Carrol. The expectation of him being a 3 and d player that could spread the floor and help defend when the injuries have made him a non factor on both sides, and the contract hamstringing other moves.
For those interested on a good piece about the raptors without JimmyJ random "facts" about who played better. I'll PM with responses to his responses as I know no one is looking for Jimmi vs JimmyJ part 7.
https://www.thescore.com/nba/news/1296767-raptors-face-a-summer-of-question-marks
"there's more to it than that, though. Teams, in theory, shouldn't just roll over and give up. However, there's a harsh reality in the NBA that many sports fans just don't care for - that being, if you don't have a superstar, you don't win.
Yet there's also standard logic to questioning the value of giving an aging, presently injured player one-fifth of a billion dollars. And it's from that question that everything else will flow with the Raptors - whether it's Ibaka's future, possibly coach Dwane Casey's future, and whether valued role players like Patrick Patterson and P.J. Tucker are retained."
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