When there were suddenly females in the recent trailers I was really surprised. But then again, both genders is now on the ' 'has to be in the game' list at ubisoft. Could have been worse and they would have been handed the sandbox list of doom .
Kinda mind that Vikings can have female Warriors. Even if this is some alternate past, where resources got scarce etc.
To bad they didn't get inspired by the real Berserkers when making the class. T.T
The fighting looks really brutal though I like it.
There actually were female Viking warriors. There is always doubt about any historical detail, but we've found a reasonable amount of evidence corroborating their existence. They were called shield maidens, and were referred to in the sagas quite a bit. Some grave findings (women buried with weapons and viking paraphernalia far from home) also confirm this.
And there are occasional records of female knights and women who fought in Japan (classically with the weapon the game give Nobushi). But I suspect the real reason for their inclusion in game is more about the fantasy than the reality. Which makes sense... it's a game all about the fantasy. :-P
"Real Berserker" is kind of an interesting historical debate. Some argue for the old interpretation of them as shirtless warriors (a la the Raider, or Leif Erickson's sister) and others argue the etymology and usage suggests elite guards armored like other Vikings (similar to the game's Warlord)
im going to sound like a huge neckbeard here but.... who did they mocap for their katana wielding samurai, because it's pretty bad.. the big "wtf is this" is when he flips his katana to hold it backhand and attack.. even for an anime this is absolutely ridiculous, but with the "realistic" aesthetic it just looks laughable.. first off, he's sacrificing all of his defense for this "attack".. second, it telegraphs the only two attack vectors that he could possibly strike at (which i'm pretty sure is why the katana is always worn with the edge facing up, it makes striking while drawing more unpredictable). third, try holding a katana backhand, it's heavy as hell and attacking one handed severely limits your swing without having the acceleration from the initial draw that makes one handed draw attacks situationally effective.. it's just a really really weak attack and a stupid stance, especially given there are like 12 different actual stances that they could have used to simulate "attacking the bottom left," including the super effective "holding your sword down and to the right with both hands, ready to strike or switch stances."
next.. he lets go of his sword ALL THE TIME while attacking.. like he'll do a standard overhead strike and just let go of his sword with his left hand before it connects which would 100% rob his attack of any strength or accuracy for... looking cool? no idea why this is the case, but just watch his hands as he attacks.. good form might not look as anime like as the game's current style, but the way the guy fights he would get bopped by any actual samurai in like one strike. it just kinda looks dumb with the game's aesthetic.
i have no idea how good the other fighters are, i only see people playing the samurai
There's actually a video somewhere of the guys doing Kingdom Come talking about that exact problem. Basically, it's like the unrealistic Dark Souls moves... partly to look cool, but mostly to help with telegraphic for the opponent. If any of these guys were fighting as cleanly or as fast as a real martial artist, parry and counterplay would be near impossible. + Show Spoiler +
This idea conforms to my idea from experiences in a variety of weapon-based martial arts (though not kendo yet any more seriously than casually sparring).
So yes, it's unrealistic, but it generally helps make the game less spammy so everybody isn't just fleching and battering each other to death. + Show Spoiler +
But yes, I have my moments where it bugs me too. Why can't you thrust, Longswordsman!
Also, this is a short but excellent video of a Conqueror showing off how to correctly engage when outnumbered, as played by a Dark Souls PvPer:
Lot of cues from fighting games. It's a mixed genre game, but probably more a fighting game than anything else.
I'm on the lookout for more actually good players who showcase the depth, of which I've found a few. I'll try to post some more when they come out. But in the spoiler I've put an example of the kind of decisions you're making: + Show Spoiler +
Say you're playing Berserker (Viking Assassin, dual axes, quick and fragile) versus a Warden (Knight Vanguard, longsword, versatile).
You have mobility and therefore initiative in starting combat unless she gets you in a corner. You have a few tools to do this: Running Leap: Light Attack -You run and bash them. Low damage, and if they parry it, the Warden has an autoriposte on top parries. But quick, so they might not catch on and parry in time. Either way, one of you will probably get chip damage. Running Leap: Heavy Attack -Run and smash them hard. More damage, but much easier to parry. Good against some classes, but weaker against the Warden because they have such a good top riposte. Feint: Running Leap: Heavy Attack -You do the above, but animation-cancel into some other move. Maybe you cancel into a side attack, or a zone attack, or a guard-break or grab. The very existence of this possibility makes the actual heavy leap more viable, since you can trick your opponent into thinking you're going for the other one. Dash: Guard Break -Run at them, use a dash, and punch them. If they're turtling, this can give you an opening for a hit. But if she sees the move coming, she can guard break at the same time to cancel your break. Dash: Guard Break: Grab -If you get off the guard break, you can also grab them and try to throw them into or off of something. Dash: Side attack -If they're guarding wrong, expecting a top attack jump, you can just start hitting from the side and start a wicked combo. I'm not sure if there's a way to do this off of a jump, but I think there might be. I know some classes can dodge and seamlessly attack. Zone attack -If their guard is good, you can try an unblockable zone attack, which sweeps your weapons in a circle, and is mostly used for killing minions. It is fairly short range, particularly with the Zerker, and will get you in attack range as well as burn a lot of stamina, but is very potent and cannot be blocked. Parry: Riposte -If you prefer to be reactive, you can just get in range (as if going for a zone or break) and then wait for them to attack. If they take the bait, you can parry and ripose. Zerker parry grants an automatic guard break, and is key to using the class at higher levels. Dodge + Parry: Riposte Combine these moves to drain enemy stamina and allow you to take openings. Simple blocks work too for particularly quick attacks. Bait shoulder charge: Dodge: Counter The Warden has a powerful shoulder charge. Trick them into thinking they can knock you off a cliff or get you in a corner, and suddenly you can use their motion to get to the side of them and land a heavy attack or start a light combo.
And this is literally one tempo of one matchup. Much of this is skill based (all parries and feints are tricky on timing) and the decision making is crazy and relies on reading enemy movements. The guard indicator exists, but is mostly a training tool... at the higher level you really need to be reading their body to see what moves they're going to do.
Beta ends on Sunday and release is Feb 14. If anybody wants a partner or somebody to show them the ropes, I'm Khanahar on Uplay.
General observations: Gameplay very fast, which makes it all the more painful when you screw up and get thrown against a wall. Overall, it honestly feels a ton like actual fencing, sport and HEMA. Little things like what it's like to fight a spear-user with a sword (that struggle to close distance, satisfyingly chopping them up when you manage it), or the satisfaction of pommel-striking them or parrying an attack and following up by using the grip of your sword like a hammer to execute them. I also take special satisfaction in chasing fleeing squishies who's bubbles you've invaded, then leap-attacking their heads off.
Specific observations on classes: Knights Warden (Longsword): My preferred class. Feels a little like playing Zerg... not really setting the pace, but reacting to my opponents bullshit and punishing them for it. Peacekeeper (Sword + Dagger): Really nimble, brutal at close range... really strong guard break (melee) followup. Weak defense, poor range. Conqueror (Flail + Shield): Tanky as all getout. Awesome shield charge gap-closer. Difficulty dealing quick damage and short range. Perk: RP as Diablo Crusader. Lawbringer (Poleaxe/Halberd): Not in Beta. Longer range, great bullying and space control. Also just looks awesome.
Vikings Raider (2h Axe): Powerful punishes, unblockable cleave, and a great 'grab and carry' that looks amazing. Think Diablo Barbarian. Berserker (2x 1h Axe): Good combos and guard breaks. Quite difficult to use, I've encountered few good ones. Warlord (Sword + Shield): Similar to Conqueror. Has a great headbutt move. Valkyrie (Spear + Shield): Not in Beta.
Samurai Kensei (No-dachi (longer katana)): Classic Samurai. Combo-based, with 3rd attack finishers that are either unblockable or uninteruptible. Orochi (Katana): Ninjaesque Samuari. Very fast, hard to parry or interrupt. Low HP pool, and tends to run low on stamina. Shugoki (Kanabo (big club)): Not in Beta. Massive HP pool, and most attacks are uninteruptible. Can trade HP with you happily. Can bear hug you to crush you. Nobushi (Naginata (curve-blade spear)): Brutal long range bleed attacks. Get in range and punish her.
I so want this game to have great gameplay but in videos it looks so.. kinda..dull.. Hope i am very wrong because this is a type of game i really just love. Also cant really trust reviews these days, which is sad guess i will have to check out youtube. Would be nice if i could find some highlevel players because looking at noobs playing doesnt give a fair perspective. Perhaps i could find some links from this thread.
This game is one of the best gaming suprises I've ever had. I never knew it existed until a few days ago and now I can't stop playing. Like if Dark Souls and Street Fighter had a little simpleton baby. It has incredible graphics and design as well.
I've also not run into any sort of technical problems with the game at all so far. Kind of shocking considering Ubisoft and Uplay are involved...
The only thing that's clearly a turn off overall is the price. Im willing to pay it but for most people I don't think it's a $60 dollar game.
The game is a blast, but it is entirely a fighting game, and has a steep learning curve. The "moba" mode isn't really polished yet either, but it might get there eventually. It's pretty expensive and I think the new player experience will be atrocious if you're not in an ocean of noobs. Hopefully, the single player campaign can train people enough, as currently, most people don't even know how to properly dodge, parry or tech grabs.
Still, I'm really enjoying it, and bots are actually pretty good. You can train with them enough to beat a majority of the player base. Also, the performances on even poor PCs is impressive. This can easily run on 5-6 year old hardware, which is quite surprising considering the graphics.
I really hope this game takes off, as it could be a really unique esports to watch, but I'm not sure how well ubisoft can handle this. It would require lots of polishing for 4v4, a cheaper multi-player only edition, and new characters/factions along the way. Hopefully, one day we'll get to root for TL in a For Honor major =)
On February 11 2017 15:07 Foxxan wrote: I so want this game to have great gameplay but in videos it looks so.. kinda..dull.. Hope i am very wrong because this is a type of game i really just love. Also cant really trust reviews these days, which is sad guess i will have to check out youtube. Would be nice if i could find some highlevel players because looking at noobs playing doesnt give a fair perspective. Perhaps i could find some links from this thread.
Play the beta this weekend and find out!
As for good gameplay footage it's true that the reviewers are generally terrible. I'll see if I can find any good stuff... the Hall of Heroes guys are the most organized people taking the game seriously so far.
On February 11 2017 15:07 Foxxan wrote: I so want this game to have great gameplay but in videos it looks so.. kinda..dull.. Hope i am very wrong because this is a type of game i really just love. Also cant really trust reviews these days, which is sad guess i will have to check out youtube. Would be nice if i could find some highlevel players because looking at noobs playing doesnt give a fair perspective. Perhaps i could find some links from this thread.
Play the beta this weekend and find out!
As for good gameplay footage it's true that the reviewers are generally terrible. I'll see if I can find any good stuff... the Hall of Heroes guys are the most organized people taking the game seriously so far.
thx i downloaded beta and played around 30 min now.
Not sure i like it overall. Some parts of the game i love atleast, like blocking enemy attacks is fucking great. Not sure i know every move yet either, hopefully i dont. I saw for example bot hit a combo 3-chain attack and the third hit wasnt at the same place.
Can you block bodycheck? Maybe you do a bodycheck yourself to block it?
Anyway, this game reminded me that i truly miss a great multiplayer games and hopefully this might have put some thoughts into business for other developers.
EDIT: yeah i missed tons of moves, and just figured out advanded tranining.
I've been in almost every test (including close technical alpha) and even with the current version of the game one thing they never managed to "fix": red NAT of death. Used to be even worse, but all the cool things you can experience on the battlefield are instantly thrown out of windows when you wait ages for a game or can't connect at all. Not sure why they didn't want to invest in dedicated servers in this case
On February 11 2017 21:30 OsaX Nymloth wrote: I've been in almost every test (including close technical alpha) and even with the current version of the game one thing they never managed to "fix": red NAT of death. Used to be even worse, but all the cool things you can experience on the battlefield are instantly thrown out of windows when you wait ages for a game or can't connect at all. Not sure why they didn't want to invest in dedicated servers in this case
Because then they have to provide servers and are responsible of those servers are shit.
Plus you enable a pirate scene if they can run the game on dedicated servers that don't check the legitimacy of a copy.
As with so many things in the end it comes down to $.
On February 12 2017 01:03 ETisME wrote: i felt the combat is fun but the tutorial doesn't offer enough to really help you mastering anything
There's an advanced tutorial and its basically mandatory. Also, if anybody wants tips, I'm pretty new to the whole fighting game genre but I'm generally versed in For Honor movesets. Add me if you want: Khanahar on Uplay.
Easy to miss but important stuff:
-Generally, orange means unblockable, white means uninterruptible, purple means bleed, blue means guard break (or guard break counter).
-Guard break counters a camping enemy. It will generally allow a free heavy attack. If you do a second guard break, you will knock them back; if they hit a wall this will stun them, and if they fall of a cliff they will die. Guard break can be countered. This is a little tricky to execute, and requires reading the character's body, not just the UI. You can also counter GB by just hitting them; it doesn't interrupt attacks in progress.
-Learn to feint. You can cancel heavy and some special attacks with the cancel/feint button. Follow up with something else. I'll often feint a heavy so they try to parry, then guard break them to guarantee a heavy.
-Learn to parry attacks. It allows a free hit generally, and also drains stamina. You can parry most unblockable attacks.
-An enemy at grey stamina is weaker in several ways. You can double guard break them to knock them down, then run at them (I usually break lock to do this) and hit them with a heavy attack or two.
-Use your dashes. (Characters with mobility only). A lot of downward attacks can be dodged, and dashes are a decent way of repositioning away from environmental hazards. They do have a recovery time though, so be careful of using them as a gap-closer.
-Remember that the best answer to a devastating heavy attack is often just to light attack them out of it. Watch out for white attack animations with the Warlord or Kensei and occasionally others; these attacks are uninterruptible.
-READ YOUR CHARACTERS MOVESET! It's available in the menu anytime, and it's really important to practice everything in it. I play Warden, which has a powerful shoulder charge and a devastating special top parry (but performed with light attack button). But I had to practice getting both of those right.
On February 11 2017 21:30 OsaX Nymloth wrote: I've been in almost every test (including close technical alpha) and even with the current version of the game one thing they never managed to "fix": red NAT of death. Used to be even worse, but all the cool things you can experience on the battlefield are instantly thrown out of windows when you wait ages for a game or can't connect at all. Not sure why they didn't want to invest in dedicated servers in this case
The explanation I've heard is that the system they've gone with is more standard for fighting games. Which is to say its good for the smaller matches (ensures everybody has same gamestate), but struggles sometimes with dominion etc. for connectivity reasons. I've also heard reports of difficulties with 1v1 matchmaking, but I haven't had any trouble personally.
On February 11 2017 22:03 Jockmcplop wrote: Its honour.
Whose honor?
The game looks really good, but I don't have a good enough PC to run it comfortably (a laptop with a 960M). Even simple duels vs AI are quite low FPS. If the single player is more than what I'm expecting it to be it could make me buy a computer.
Have you lowered all graphics to minimum manually? I've tested the game on similar hardware, and performance is not an issue for 1v1 or 2v2. I doubt it's CPU related, as laptops with 960m usually have a decent i7. The game runs fine on a 6870 and a 570 at least.