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On June 13 2018 20:14 Ej_ wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2018 20:13 Vindicare605 wrote: I really don't see how Terran is supposed to beat Protoss straight up on that map. Protoss Air is just so damn fast and provides such excellent map control.
Not losing your 3rd base to stalkers is a good start.
I don't get why TY chose that location for his 3rd. Conventional wisdom would've been to expand away from your opponent, not towards.
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On June 13 2018 20:13 Vindicare605 wrote: I really don't see how Terran is supposed to beat Protoss straight up on that map. Protoss Air is just so damn fast and provides such excellent map control.
just play like Maru
on that note if Classic wins the other semi's Zest has an actual chance of winning another GSL :o
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On June 13 2018 20:14 Ej_ wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2018 20:13 Vindicare605 wrote: I really don't see how Terran is supposed to beat Protoss straight up on that map. Protoss Air is just so damn fast and provides such excellent map control.
Not losing your 3rd base to stalkers is a good start.
I mean yea, but that's part of the thing with the air units I was talking about.
Oracles can just tag the army over and over, Protoss can expand freely and if Terran moves out at all the potential for counter attacks into recall is just that much stronger thanks to the size of the map.
Only way TY holds that attack with the supply he had was to see it coming already, in which case Zest can just hang back and take a 4th.
if TY counters, Zest can wipe out the CC and recall back in time to meet the Terran army walking over.
I dunno. the pure size and layout just plays to all of the strengths of Protoss in the match up. The later it goes the worse it gets imo.
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Seriously, Zest in GSL finals ...
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On June 13 2018 20:14 Mun_Su wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2018 20:07 Kommander wrote:On June 13 2018 20:04 Mun_Su wrote: last map is not a good map ? To play in? Yeah, nowadays no one wants to play on a 4 player spawn map. Not that bad in terms of watchability though. Thanks So the winner of this GSL (no matter who) will become a 3 times starleague winner right ?
Oh i forgot that Maru won OSL. so he can become a 4 times starleague champion
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Nice use of the Back to the Future music here.
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Zest on his way to become the uncontested GOAT
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On June 13 2018 20:15 Penev wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2018 20:13 Vindicare605 wrote: I really don't see how Terran is supposed to beat Protoss straight up on that map. Protoss Air is just so damn fast and provides such excellent map control.
just play like Maru on that note if Classic wins the other semi's Zest has an actual chance of winning another GSL :o
I mean that would be my strategy tbh. Just start going for Raven/Ghost/Viking from the outset and defend whatever nonsense my opponent throws at me.
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TY couldn't answer Zest's Stargate play, that's why he lost. He smashed down his collosus play.
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On June 13 2018 20:16 Vindicare605 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2018 20:14 Ej_ wrote:On June 13 2018 20:13 Vindicare605 wrote: I really don't see how Terran is supposed to beat Protoss straight up on that map. Protoss Air is just so damn fast and provides such excellent map control.
Not losing your 3rd base to stalkers is a good start. I mean yea, but that's part of the thing with the air units I was talking about. Oracles can just tag the army over and over, Protoss can expand freely and if Terran moves out at all the potential for counter attacks into recall is just that much stronger thanks to the size of the map. Only way TY holds that attack with the supply he had was to see it coming already, in which case Zest can just hang back and take a 4th. if TY counters, Zest can wipe out the CC and recall back in time to meet the Terran army walking over. I dunno. the pure size and layout just plays to all of the strengths of Protoss in the match up. The later it goes the worse it gets imo.
Even tho I agree overall, TY really had no excuse to not see that attack coming. To not have any vision of the rocks that lead straight to your 3rd was poor play. If Zest was ever going to attack, that was probably the most obvious route he would take. That spotter marine wasn't well placed.
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On June 13 2018 20:25 blooblooblahblah wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2018 20:16 Vindicare605 wrote:On June 13 2018 20:14 Ej_ wrote:On June 13 2018 20:13 Vindicare605 wrote: I really don't see how Terran is supposed to beat Protoss straight up on that map. Protoss Air is just so damn fast and provides such excellent map control.
Not losing your 3rd base to stalkers is a good start. I mean yea, but that's part of the thing with the air units I was talking about. Oracles can just tag the army over and over, Protoss can expand freely and if Terran moves out at all the potential for counter attacks into recall is just that much stronger thanks to the size of the map. Only way TY holds that attack with the supply he had was to see it coming already, in which case Zest can just hang back and take a 4th. if TY counters, Zest can wipe out the CC and recall back in time to meet the Terran army walking over. I dunno. the pure size and layout just plays to all of the strengths of Protoss in the match up. The later it goes the worse it gets imo. Even tho I agree overall, TY really had no excuse to not see that attack coming. To not have any vision of the rocks that lead straight to your 3rd was poor play. If Zest was ever going to attack, that was probably the most obvious route he would take. That spotter marine wasn't well placed.
Absolutely, I'm not saying TY didn't get outplayed in that game, just the way that early game looked it really seemed like he was screwed no matter what he tried.
It really felt like the best option was to just turtle up and move out slowly knowing you're gonna have to face the Protoss deathball and beat it at some point.
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On June 13 2018 20:18 Penev wrote: Zest on his way to become the uncontested GOAT
Maybe in about 3 GSL wins
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Those games were even better than I expected. Zest having moments of looking like his old self. I just really don't want him to take it. My main hope is for Maru to be standing on a couple more discarded protoss corpses as he grasps another trophy.
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Now all we need is for Maru to be crushed under the mighty chin for best GSL Finals
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On June 13 2018 21:24 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2018 20:18 Penev wrote: Zest on his way to become the uncontested GOAT Maybe in about 3 GSL wins let us continue this discussion in other players' fan club threads
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On June 13 2018 20:49 Vindicare605 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2018 20:25 blooblooblahblah wrote:On June 13 2018 20:16 Vindicare605 wrote:On June 13 2018 20:14 Ej_ wrote:On June 13 2018 20:13 Vindicare605 wrote: I really don't see how Terran is supposed to beat Protoss straight up on that map. Protoss Air is just so damn fast and provides such excellent map control.
Not losing your 3rd base to stalkers is a good start. I mean yea, but that's part of the thing with the air units I was talking about. Oracles can just tag the army over and over, Protoss can expand freely and if Terran moves out at all the potential for counter attacks into recall is just that much stronger thanks to the size of the map. Only way TY holds that attack with the supply he had was to see it coming already, in which case Zest can just hang back and take a 4th. if TY counters, Zest can wipe out the CC and recall back in time to meet the Terran army walking over. I dunno. the pure size and layout just plays to all of the strengths of Protoss in the match up. The later it goes the worse it gets imo. Even tho I agree overall, TY really had no excuse to not see that attack coming. To not have any vision of the rocks that lead straight to your 3rd was poor play. If Zest was ever going to attack, that was probably the most obvious route he would take. That spotter marine wasn't well placed. Absolutely, I'm not saying TY didn't get outplayed in that game, just the way that early game looked it really seemed like he was screwed no matter what he tried. It really felt like the best option was to just turtle up and move out slowly knowing you're gonna have to face the Protoss deathball and beat it at some point.
The heavy gas investment in air means his storm will be late, and Oracle's and phoenixes aren't great fighting units, leaving you vulnerable to an early attack. So there are advantages and disadvantages of that play.
In that game, Zest abused the large map to expand very quickly, so he had an economic advantage. That made his air look stronger than it was.
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I'm really struggling here. On the one hand, I really want Classic to win the next match, but I really don't want a PvP finals. However, out of the remaining folks there I want Classic to win the whole thing. Sigh...guess I'm cheering for Classic.
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TY lost too much in the initial phase of the game whilst doing comparably gabarggio damage, but he was still quite ahead tech wise, with that said if TY had not lost his third so easily or if he had hit before storm, I think Zest would've lost the game. Pretty sure last minute storm saved his ass there.
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crazy and exciting series overall. i thought this was going to be a TY victory but damn! Zest looked strong today. wp!
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Practicing with Ryung really paid off.
I swear, Ryung is the best practice partner. His execution isn't good at all, but he knows the ins and outs of every build in the game up until the 9 minute mark.
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