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On March 01 2015 05:00 xuanzue wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2015 03:13 Cheerio wrote:On March 01 2015 02:55 xuanzue wrote: so, the PARNAS has 1 seat of 3787. and here people really like to sell like this guy was a real threat to Putin. So name me 3 most influentional oppositional leaders in Russia for the 27.02.2015 Gary Kasparov(1), and his twitter account. and Gennady Zyuganov(2) and any other guy (3)from the communist party. I'm pretty sure the 2nd political force in Russia is the communist party and they are more a real threat against Putin. I'm sorry, but the communist party is not real opposition. It's one of the many (some more, some less) fake, so-called "systematical opposition" parties, that are nothing but joke pretend-opposition parties. Both their leaders' and Kasparov's influence is nowadays much lower than either that of Navalny or Nemtsov.
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On March 01 2015 05:15 zeo wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2015 05:02 ImFromPortugal wrote:On March 01 2015 04:45 Falling wrote: @zeo I understand that his star had fallen, and so may be irrelevant in that sense. But what were his views that were so extreme that lead you to compare him to Alex Jones? NWO-believing, moon-landing faked, 9/11 truther Alex Jones? he believed that the russian government is corrupt ... i guess that's enough for zeo You do realize you are talking about someone that held a high ranking position in a government so bad, so corrupt, so awful that they made Putin look like the savior of Russia? It's like the perfect opposition for Putin, imagine how bad you have to be to make Putin look 90% approval rating good? Putin probably wishes these opposition leaders stay around forever. Wait there are people who actually think those approval ratings are legit?
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On March 01 2015 05:21 Djzapz wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2015 05:15 zeo wrote:On March 01 2015 05:02 ImFromPortugal wrote:On March 01 2015 04:45 Falling wrote: @zeo I understand that his star had fallen, and so may be irrelevant in that sense. But what were his views that were so extreme that lead you to compare him to Alex Jones? NWO-believing, moon-landing faked, 9/11 truther Alex Jones? he believed that the russian government is corrupt ... i guess that's enough for zeo You do realize you are talking about someone that held a high ranking position in a government so bad, so corrupt, so awful that they made Putin look like the savior of Russia? It's like the perfect opposition for Putin, imagine how bad you have to be to make Putin look 90% approval rating good? Putin probably wishes these opposition leaders stay around forever. Wait there are people who actually think those approval ratings are legit? They may or may not be actually legit, but if you speak/listen to the general public in Russia, you certainly get the impression that they are not that far off...
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On March 01 2015 05:15 zeo wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2015 05:02 ImFromPortugal wrote:On March 01 2015 04:45 Falling wrote: @zeo I understand that his star had fallen, and so may be irrelevant in that sense. But what were his views that were so extreme that lead you to compare him to Alex Jones? NWO-believing, moon-landing faked, 9/11 truther Alex Jones? he believed that the russian government is corrupt ... i guess that's enough for zeo You do realize you are talking about someone that held a high ranking position in a government so bad, so corrupt, so awful that they made Putin look like the savior of Russia? It's like the perfect opposition for Putin, imagine how bad you have to be to make Putin look 90% approval rating good? Putin probably wishes these opposition leaders stay around forever.
by forever you mean... kiled in mysterious circumstances or poisoned to death? do you think its hard for a dictator to have 90% approval rating? I see the same with the angolan cleptocracy and their followers and apologists make the same excuses as you.
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On March 01 2015 05:21 TwilightRain wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2015 05:00 xuanzue wrote:On March 01 2015 03:13 Cheerio wrote:On March 01 2015 02:55 xuanzue wrote: so, the PARNAS has 1 seat of 3787. and here people really like to sell like this guy was a real threat to Putin. So name me 3 most influentional oppositional leaders in Russia for the 27.02.2015 Gary Kasparov(1), and his twitter account. and Gennady Zyuganov(2) and any other guy (3)from the communist party. I'm pretty sure the 2nd political force in Russia is the communist party and they are more a real threat against Putin. I'm sorry, but the communist party is not real opposition. It's one of the many (some more, some less) fake, so-called "systematical opposition" parties, that are nothing but joke pretend-opposition parties. Both their leaders' and Kasparov's influence is nowadays much lower than either that of Navalny or Nemtsov. Nemtsov's Republican Party of Russia: Seats in the State Duma 0 / 450 Seats in the Regional Parliaments 1 / 3,787
More influential than the 92 Seats in the State Duma Communist Party? Really?
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On March 01 2015 05:28 zeo wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2015 05:21 TwilightRain wrote:On March 01 2015 05:00 xuanzue wrote:On March 01 2015 03:13 Cheerio wrote:On March 01 2015 02:55 xuanzue wrote: so, the PARNAS has 1 seat of 3787. and here people really like to sell like this guy was a real threat to Putin. So name me 3 most influentional oppositional leaders in Russia for the 27.02.2015 Gary Kasparov(1), and his twitter account. and Gennady Zyuganov(2) and any other guy (3)from the communist party. I'm pretty sure the 2nd political force in Russia is the communist party and they are more a real threat against Putin. I'm sorry, but the communist party is not real opposition. It's one of the many (some more, some less) fake, so-called "systematical opposition" parties, that are nothing but joke pretend-opposition parties. Both their leaders' and Kasparov's influence is nowadays much lower than either that of Navalny or Nemtsov. Nemtsov's Republican Party of Russia: Seats in the State Duma 0 / 450 Seats in the Regional Parliaments 1 / 3,787 More influential than the 92 Seats in the State Duma Communist Party? Really?
I think they meant that the communist party is controlled opposition.
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On March 01 2015 05:21 Djzapz wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2015 05:15 zeo wrote:On March 01 2015 05:02 ImFromPortugal wrote:On March 01 2015 04:45 Falling wrote: @zeo I understand that his star had fallen, and so may be irrelevant in that sense. But what were his views that were so extreme that lead you to compare him to Alex Jones? NWO-believing, moon-landing faked, 9/11 truther Alex Jones? he believed that the russian government is corrupt ... i guess that's enough for zeo You do realize you are talking about someone that held a high ranking position in a government so bad, so corrupt, so awful that they made Putin look like the savior of Russia? It's like the perfect opposition for Putin, imagine how bad you have to be to make Putin look 90% approval rating good? Putin probably wishes these opposition leaders stay around forever. Wait there are people who actually think those approval ratings are legit?
Again, you underestimate how Russian mentality works, how condensated external threat propaganda is happening there. His charts climbed up since Ukraine conflict started, the more Russians feel threatened by West the more they believe Putin is the solution to this imaginary threat. He have the support, no need for him to influence those charts in anyway.
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On February 28 2015 18:03 Saumure wrote:Show nested quote +On February 28 2015 17:45 Jetaap wrote: At this point I'm starting to think that the biggest threat for Europe is not ISIS, but Russia and putin going absolutely crazy ... Please, if that guy seriously was a threat to Putin, he would have let him live and fake the elections, like Bush.
And you showed how dumb you are.
That is curious I wonder if Putin really did have something to do with it or just some random guy killing him because he disagreed with his views.
User was warned for this post
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On March 01 2015 05:28 zeo wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2015 05:21 TwilightRain wrote:On March 01 2015 05:00 xuanzue wrote:On March 01 2015 03:13 Cheerio wrote:On March 01 2015 02:55 xuanzue wrote: so, the PARNAS has 1 seat of 3787. and here people really like to sell like this guy was a real threat to Putin. So name me 3 most influentional oppositional leaders in Russia for the 27.02.2015 Gary Kasparov(1), and his twitter account. and Gennady Zyuganov(2) and any other guy (3)from the communist party. I'm pretty sure the 2nd political force in Russia is the communist party and they are more a real threat against Putin. I'm sorry, but the communist party is not real opposition. It's one of the many (some more, some less) fake, so-called "systematical opposition" parties, that are nothing but joke pretend-opposition parties. Both their leaders' and Kasparov's influence is nowadays much lower than either that of Navalny or Nemtsov. Nemtsov's Republican Party of Russia: Seats in the State Duma 0 / 450 Seats in the Regional Parliaments 1 / 3,787 More influential than the 92 Seats in the State Duma Communist Party? Really? If you believe that party members in the parlament actually had any real influence on core politics in Russia for the last 8-12 years, you are sorely mistaken.
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On March 01 2015 05:30 ImFromPortugal wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2015 05:28 zeo wrote:On March 01 2015 05:21 TwilightRain wrote:On March 01 2015 05:00 xuanzue wrote:On March 01 2015 03:13 Cheerio wrote:On March 01 2015 02:55 xuanzue wrote: so, the PARNAS has 1 seat of 3787. and here people really like to sell like this guy was a real threat to Putin. So name me 3 most influentional oppositional leaders in Russia for the 27.02.2015 Gary Kasparov(1), and his twitter account. and Gennady Zyuganov(2) and any other guy (3)from the communist party. I'm pretty sure the 2nd political force in Russia is the communist party and they are more a real threat against Putin. I'm sorry, but the communist party is not real opposition. It's one of the many (some more, some less) fake, so-called "systematical opposition" parties, that are nothing but joke pretend-opposition parties. Both their leaders' and Kasparov's influence is nowadays much lower than either that of Navalny or Nemtsov. Nemtsov's Republican Party of Russia: Seats in the State Duma 0 / 450 Seats in the Regional Parliaments 1 / 3,787 More influential than the 92 Seats in the State Duma Communist Party? Really? I think they meant that the communist party is controlled opposition. I don't know, people seem to think that just because a party is in the opposition they have to hate and undermine the ruling government. Not saying 'Putin is the devil' doesn't make you controlled opposition. Thats silly.
On March 01 2015 05:34 TwilightRain wrote: If you believe that party members in the parlament actually had any real influence on core politics in Russia for the last 8-12 years, you are sorely mistaken. They have more influence than random people on the street that nobody voted for.
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On March 01 2015 05:30 ImFromPortugal wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2015 05:28 zeo wrote:On March 01 2015 05:21 TwilightRain wrote:On March 01 2015 05:00 xuanzue wrote:On March 01 2015 03:13 Cheerio wrote:On March 01 2015 02:55 xuanzue wrote: so, the PARNAS has 1 seat of 3787. and here people really like to sell like this guy was a real threat to Putin. So name me 3 most influentional oppositional leaders in Russia for the 27.02.2015 Gary Kasparov(1), and his twitter account. and Gennady Zyuganov(2) and any other guy (3)from the communist party. I'm pretty sure the 2nd political force in Russia is the communist party and they are more a real threat against Putin. I'm sorry, but the communist party is not real opposition. It's one of the many (some more, some less) fake, so-called "systematical opposition" parties, that are nothing but joke pretend-opposition parties. Both their leaders' and Kasparov's influence is nowadays much lower than either that of Navalny or Nemtsov. Nemtsov's Republican Party of Russia: Seats in the State Duma 0 / 450 Seats in the Regional Parliaments 1 / 3,787 More influential than the 92 Seats in the State Duma Communist Party? Really? I think they meant that the communist party is controlled opposition.
The statements from the Communist party are write by radical zealots. the speech of the communist party repeats that they want to abolish the private property again, the banishment of the oligarchs and they want to set up a proletarian dictatorship. They denounced Putin in the last elections.
on the other hand Putin is really close to the oligarchs and recently has been reveled his contributions to Le Pen in France. those people believing that Putin is a commie is funny, but most funny will be to see the communist party rise again as soon as Putin falls, that seems to be in less of 2 years.
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On March 01 2015 05:35 zeo wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2015 05:30 ImFromPortugal wrote:On March 01 2015 05:28 zeo wrote:On March 01 2015 05:21 TwilightRain wrote:On March 01 2015 05:00 xuanzue wrote:On March 01 2015 03:13 Cheerio wrote:On March 01 2015 02:55 xuanzue wrote: so, the PARNAS has 1 seat of 3787. and here people really like to sell like this guy was a real threat to Putin. So name me 3 most influentional oppositional leaders in Russia for the 27.02.2015 Gary Kasparov(1), and his twitter account. and Gennady Zyuganov(2) and any other guy (3)from the communist party. I'm pretty sure the 2nd political force in Russia is the communist party and they are more a real threat against Putin. I'm sorry, but the communist party is not real opposition. It's one of the many (some more, some less) fake, so-called "systematical opposition" parties, that are nothing but joke pretend-opposition parties. Both their leaders' and Kasparov's influence is nowadays much lower than either that of Navalny or Nemtsov. Nemtsov's Republican Party of Russia: Seats in the State Duma 0 / 450 Seats in the Regional Parliaments 1 / 3,787 More influential than the 92 Seats in the State Duma Communist Party? Really? I think they meant that the communist party is controlled opposition. I don't know, people seem to think that just because a party is in the opposition they have to hate and undermine the ruling government. Not saying 'Putin is the devil' doesn't make you controlled opposition. Thats silly. Show nested quote +On March 01 2015 05:34 TwilightRain wrote: If you believe that party members in the parlament actually had any real influence on core politics in Russia for the last 8-12 years, you are sorely mistaken. They have more influence than random people on the street that nobody voted for. If you believe that influencing public perception and actions is an utterly irrelevant kind of influence, then yes, by your logic any single member of that sad circus that is the state duma has more influence than the afformentioned two.
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On March 01 2015 05:40 xuanzue wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2015 05:30 ImFromPortugal wrote:On March 01 2015 05:28 zeo wrote:On March 01 2015 05:21 TwilightRain wrote:On March 01 2015 05:00 xuanzue wrote:On March 01 2015 03:13 Cheerio wrote:On March 01 2015 02:55 xuanzue wrote: so, the PARNAS has 1 seat of 3787. and here people really like to sell like this guy was a real threat to Putin. So name me 3 most influentional oppositional leaders in Russia for the 27.02.2015 Gary Kasparov(1), and his twitter account. and Gennady Zyuganov(2) and any other guy (3)from the communist party. I'm pretty sure the 2nd political force in Russia is the communist party and they are more a real threat against Putin. I'm sorry, but the communist party is not real opposition. It's one of the many (some more, some less) fake, so-called "systematical opposition" parties, that are nothing but joke pretend-opposition parties. Both their leaders' and Kasparov's influence is nowadays much lower than either that of Navalny or Nemtsov. Nemtsov's Republican Party of Russia: Seats in the State Duma 0 / 450 Seats in the Regional Parliaments 1 / 3,787 More influential than the 92 Seats in the State Duma Communist Party? Really? I think they meant that the communist party is controlled opposition. The statements from the Communist party are write by radical zealots. the speech of the communist party repeats that they want to abolish the private property again, the banishment of the oligarchs and they want to set up a proletarian dictatorship. They denounced Putin in the last elections. on the other hand Putin is really close to the oligarchs and recently has been reveled his contributions to Le Pen in France. those people believing that Putin is a commie is funny, but most funny will be to see the communist party rise again as soon as Putin falls, that seems to be in less of 2 years.
They can still be controlled opposition ..the majority of russians don't want to have a new USSR so by keeping those clowns around they know there won't be a decent force with real politics that can take them out of power. The same can be seen in many african countries that pretend to be "democratic" but make sure the only opposition they get are from people they know won't be able to win any elections.
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On March 01 2015 05:48 TwilightRain wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2015 05:35 zeo wrote:On March 01 2015 05:30 ImFromPortugal wrote:On March 01 2015 05:28 zeo wrote:On March 01 2015 05:21 TwilightRain wrote:On March 01 2015 05:00 xuanzue wrote:On March 01 2015 03:13 Cheerio wrote:On March 01 2015 02:55 xuanzue wrote: so, the PARNAS has 1 seat of 3787. and here people really like to sell like this guy was a real threat to Putin. So name me 3 most influentional oppositional leaders in Russia for the 27.02.2015 Gary Kasparov(1), and his twitter account. and Gennady Zyuganov(2) and any other guy (3)from the communist party. I'm pretty sure the 2nd political force in Russia is the communist party and they are more a real threat against Putin. I'm sorry, but the communist party is not real opposition. It's one of the many (some more, some less) fake, so-called "systematical opposition" parties, that are nothing but joke pretend-opposition parties. Both their leaders' and Kasparov's influence is nowadays much lower than either that of Navalny or Nemtsov. Nemtsov's Republican Party of Russia: Seats in the State Duma 0 / 450 Seats in the Regional Parliaments 1 / 3,787 More influential than the 92 Seats in the State Duma Communist Party? Really? I think they meant that the communist party is controlled opposition. I don't know, people seem to think that just because a party is in the opposition they have to hate and undermine the ruling government. Not saying 'Putin is the devil' doesn't make you controlled opposition. Thats silly. On March 01 2015 05:34 TwilightRain wrote: If you believe that party members in the parlament actually had any real influence on core politics in Russia for the last 8-12 years, you are sorely mistaken. They have more influence than random people on the street that nobody voted for. If you believe that influencing public perception and actions is an utterly irrelevant kind of influence, then yes, by your logic any single member of that sad circus that is the state duma has more influence than the afformentioned two.
He exactly knows how it works, there is no reason to think otherwise based on his deep knowledge of Russia and it's affairs. It's just his choice to ignore it and believe in what he believes.
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On March 01 2015 05:00 xuanzue wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2015 03:13 Cheerio wrote:On March 01 2015 02:55 xuanzue wrote: so, the PARNAS has 1 seat of 3787. and here people really like to sell like this guy was a real threat to Putin. So name me 3 most influentional oppositional leaders in Russia for the 27.02.2015 Gary Kasparov(1), and his twitter account. and Gennady Zyuganov(2) and any other guy (3)from the communist party. I'm pretty sure the 2nd political force in Russia is the communist party and they are more a real threat against Putin. nice joke.
1) Navalny 2) Nemtsov 3) Khodorkovsky
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On March 01 2015 05:48 TwilightRain wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2015 05:35 zeo wrote:On March 01 2015 05:30 ImFromPortugal wrote:On March 01 2015 05:28 zeo wrote:On March 01 2015 05:21 TwilightRain wrote:On March 01 2015 05:00 xuanzue wrote:On March 01 2015 03:13 Cheerio wrote:On March 01 2015 02:55 xuanzue wrote: so, the PARNAS has 1 seat of 3787. and here people really like to sell like this guy was a real threat to Putin. So name me 3 most influentional oppositional leaders in Russia for the 27.02.2015 Gary Kasparov(1), and his twitter account. and Gennady Zyuganov(2) and any other guy (3)from the communist party. I'm pretty sure the 2nd political force in Russia is the communist party and they are more a real threat against Putin. I'm sorry, but the communist party is not real opposition. It's one of the many (some more, some less) fake, so-called "systematical opposition" parties, that are nothing but joke pretend-opposition parties. Both their leaders' and Kasparov's influence is nowadays much lower than either that of Navalny or Nemtsov. Nemtsov's Republican Party of Russia: Seats in the State Duma 0 / 450 Seats in the Regional Parliaments 1 / 3,787 More influential than the 92 Seats in the State Duma Communist Party? Really? I think they meant that the communist party is controlled opposition. I don't know, people seem to think that just because a party is in the opposition they have to hate and undermine the ruling government. Not saying 'Putin is the devil' doesn't make you controlled opposition. Thats silly. On March 01 2015 05:34 TwilightRain wrote: If you believe that party members in the parlament actually had any real influence on core politics in Russia for the last 8-12 years, you are sorely mistaken. They have more influence than random people on the street that nobody voted for. If you believe that influencing public perception and actions is an utterly irrelevant kind of influence, then yes, by your logic any single member of that sad circus that is the state duma has more influence than the afformentioned two. Influencing public perception? I highly doubt people took them that seriously. If one of them were to say 'government is corrupt' people would nod their head or something but obviously no one took them seriously enough to vote for them. These are extremely low numbers.
Or do you mean influencing public perception like Madona or Shakira asking you to plant trees in Africa or something? Yeah people would send money for trees to be planted in Africa but who would vote for Shakira?
edit: I can see how they would highly rated and listened to in the Putin is evil crowd, but that crowd is really small and broken up in Russia
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On March 01 2015 05:53 Narw wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2015 05:48 TwilightRain wrote:On March 01 2015 05:35 zeo wrote:On March 01 2015 05:30 ImFromPortugal wrote:On March 01 2015 05:28 zeo wrote:On March 01 2015 05:21 TwilightRain wrote:On March 01 2015 05:00 xuanzue wrote:On March 01 2015 03:13 Cheerio wrote:On March 01 2015 02:55 xuanzue wrote: so, the PARNAS has 1 seat of 3787. and here people really like to sell like this guy was a real threat to Putin. So name me 3 most influentional oppositional leaders in Russia for the 27.02.2015 Gary Kasparov(1), and his twitter account. and Gennady Zyuganov(2) and any other guy (3)from the communist party. I'm pretty sure the 2nd political force in Russia is the communist party and they are more a real threat against Putin. I'm sorry, but the communist party is not real opposition. It's one of the many (some more, some less) fake, so-called "systematical opposition" parties, that are nothing but joke pretend-opposition parties. Both their leaders' and Kasparov's influence is nowadays much lower than either that of Navalny or Nemtsov. Nemtsov's Republican Party of Russia: Seats in the State Duma 0 / 450 Seats in the Regional Parliaments 1 / 3,787 More influential than the 92 Seats in the State Duma Communist Party? Really? I think they meant that the communist party is controlled opposition. I don't know, people seem to think that just because a party is in the opposition they have to hate and undermine the ruling government. Not saying 'Putin is the devil' doesn't make you controlled opposition. Thats silly. On March 01 2015 05:34 TwilightRain wrote: If you believe that party members in the parlament actually had any real influence on core politics in Russia for the last 8-12 years, you are sorely mistaken. They have more influence than random people on the street that nobody voted for. If you believe that influencing public perception and actions is an utterly irrelevant kind of influence, then yes, by your logic any single member of that sad circus that is the state duma has more influence than the afformentioned two. He exactly knows how it works, there is no reason to think otherwise based on his deep knowledge of Russia and it's affairs. It's just his choice to ignore it and believe in what he believes. Is that the impression that you've got? I've got the impression that he hasn't been following the inner-political happenings in the last decade in Russia nearly close enough to understand how the system actually works nowadays and give any kind of "qualified" opinion. That's why I'm not gonna argue on that point anymore.
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The land of freedom23126 Posts
On March 01 2015 05:59 Cheerio wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2015 05:00 xuanzue wrote:On March 01 2015 03:13 Cheerio wrote:On March 01 2015 02:55 xuanzue wrote: so, the PARNAS has 1 seat of 3787. and here people really like to sell like this guy was a real threat to Putin. So name me 3 most influentional oppositional leaders in Russia for the 27.02.2015 Gary Kasparov(1), and his twitter account. and Gennady Zyuganov(2) and any other guy (3)from the communist party. I'm pretty sure the 2nd political force in Russia is the communist party and they are more a real threat against Putin. nice joke. 1) Navalny 2) Nemtsov 3) Khodorkovsky
Nemtsov past was playing too much against him, I'd argue that it's Navalny and noone close. Ryzhkov has okay reputation, so he's kinda high there and people tend to listen to him, and probably, okay, Khodorkovsky is top-3, just because there is noone better.
Nemtsov was awful in public speaking as well, God damn it. Anyway, rest in peace.
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wait, a topic where u can expect criticism of russia? i wonder if zeo will get involved! oh, wait...
seriously though, i dont agree with russia bashing and jumping to conclusion at all, but reading pages 3 through 5 is even worse. i've honestly never seen TL tolerate someone so blatantly biased for this long... that turkey apologist lasted like what, a week? i thought 200 pages of derailment on ukraine crisis was enough. pls don't let another potentially interesting topic get shut down because of an individuals subtle subject steering and flame baiting
also, on point, this sounds about right
On February 28 2015 21:28 Cheerio wrote: It's not that Putin had him shot, it's that he was shot because of Putin, or rather because of his opposition to him. The atmosphere of hate in Russia towards West, Ukraine, Russian liberals and democrats is just astounding. Coupled with the rise of nationalism this event was kind of expected, but this is not what Kremlin wants, because it provokes more protest and that would provoke more violence, and again more protest. That's the kind of sequence of events that brought Yanukovich down.
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