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On July 08 2011 17:36 sluggaslamoo wrote:Show nested quote +On July 08 2011 16:47 Madder wrote:On July 08 2011 16:38 JiPrime wrote:On July 08 2011 16:36 Jayme wrote:On July 08 2011 16:32 JiPrime wrote:On July 08 2011 16:30 Yoshi Kirishima wrote:On July 08 2011 16:29 Goibon wrote: Ugh, i thought i'd never have to think about Kespa. I thought we were done with that organization. I was hoping i could come into SC2 as a spectator and enjoy the game without Kespa influence.
Oh well, all good things must come to an end eventually.
Hope this is BS. Don't worry about the bad things or things you don't like about Kespa, Kespa will be working under Blizzard not the other way Exactly. Kespa is under the mercy of Blizzard now, and Blizzard is a freaking christ-like for letting them get away with 10+ years of copyright infringement. Without which you wouldn't have a huge SC2 E-sport community based game that was initially based entirely on the name starcraft alone. I have my problems with kespa but don't act as if Blizzard didn't benefit hugely. As a follower of BW scene since its birth, I guarantee you that BW would've been a runaway success anyways, with or without Kespa. If there wasn't Kespa then some other organization might have done it. You don't honestly believe that, do you? Either way, besides KeSPA going down the shitter, too many good things have come out of this '10+ years of copyright infringement'. Actually if you look at the history kespa really hurt the BW scene when they came about, sure they made some changes, none of them really improved the scene, and those changes came at a large cost to OGN/MBC.
I think he was referencing the copyright infringement law case.
And I don't really care if Kespa come out or not, if they do they better come out with a bang, and more importantly why is this being kept secret? I don't see any reason for this.
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I just hope that GOMTV doesn't get mad and start (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻ because of this. Other than that - i wasnt here long enough to say if having kespa involved in sc2 a good or a bad thing.
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Based on what I read:
1) There's no evidence at all to suggest BW being abandoned. Nor is there any logical reason to assume it would be abandoned. Right now, Brood War still has higher viewership and popularity than SC2. Its a much 'safer' game economically.
2) GOM still has a contract for something like 1-2 more years? Since Blizzard made a big deal about respecting those contracts to begin with, I don't see how they can circumvent that.
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Please don't bring over the retarded Kespa rules for pro-gamers :/
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just wondering as a newer member of the esports community who didn't follow BW at all, why do people think that kespa is "evil" and something that would be bad for Starcraft 2? All I've managed to get is that they were strict in some way. But in regards to the article, I'm not going to really expect anything like this until something more concrete comes up. This seems sorta sudden and out of the blue for such big news. Hopefully we can see some more Korean leagues in the future though. The more the better!
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On July 08 2011 18:13 ReaperX wrote: Please don't bring over the retarded Kespa rules for pro-gamers :/
I agree, I dont like that part of Kespa at all.
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On July 08 2011 18:18 iba001 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 08 2011 18:13 ReaperX wrote: Please don't bring over the retarded Kespa rules for pro-gamers :/ I agree, I dont like that part of Kespa at all. Can you explain?
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I don't know why people are talking about Kespa taking over SC2. More likely is that Blizzard removes the exclusive rights part from their GOM deal and allows Kespa to host SC2 tournaments as well side by side with GOM. If most of the BW players were to switch the scene would be big enough for two tournaments to co-exist.
And IF Kespa was to run SC2 they would be forced to completely reform their way of doing things from the core, the progaming licence nonsense would have to go or atleast be changed, they wouldn't be able to shut existing SC2 teams out and basically they would have to forsake much if not all that allowed them to have an iron grip on BW for all these years.
It could be good though, a Kespa minus the stupid rules, slave-like player conditions and exclusive rights to the game could be ok. I can't see that happening though since that's what made Kespa what it is.
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I don't understand why they would abandon bw TT Unless the ratings are very low, but the fanbase is still enormous, I would say bigger than for sc2 for SK market, so I don't get why they wouldn't do both games ?
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BW no
Wasnt there some sort of atleast 2 year proleague thing for Broodwar still though? Or would it expire ..at around the same time as the GOMTV one?
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Thats pretty dirty if it is true. Gom still has sc2 for a bit longer and blizzard should be openly negotiating instead of dealing with kespa behind closed doors.
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On July 08 2011 18:19 zeru wrote:Show nested quote +On July 08 2011 18:18 iba001 wrote:On July 08 2011 18:13 ReaperX wrote: Please don't bring over the retarded Kespa rules for pro-gamers :/ I agree, I dont like that part of Kespa at all. That's actually the part that i would really want. can someone explain which rules you all are referring to, why they are bad, and why you people see kespa as "evil" anyway? I never played/watched bw.
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On July 08 2011 18:19 StyLeD wrote:Show nested quote +On July 08 2011 18:18 iba001 wrote:On July 08 2011 18:13 ReaperX wrote: Please don't bring over the retarded Kespa rules for pro-gamers :/ I agree, I dont like that part of Kespa at all. Can you explain? Players losing matches just because they typed ``a`` accidentally mid game? Saying PP instead of PPP and being punished for it? I don`t know who creates these rules and with what intent.
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Can't play in any outside events... plus their draconian in-game rules. There is a fixed number of teams as well. IIRC it's a pain to change teams also.
From liquipedia: In the Korean Brood War progaming circuit, the term progamer has stricter connotations than in other games. Aspiring players who may be skilled but not involved in the professional scene are known as amateurs. An amateur who wants to enter the professional scene must first gain a semi-professional license from KeSPA. Although the rules for acquiring this license have changed slightly over the years, one must either get top place in the Courage tournaments or in rarer cases be gifted a license from a pro-team to become a semi-pro. The professional teams then evaluate semi-pros and may choose to draft one onto their team, at which point they are considered a progamer and can play in KeSPA leagues. Progamers are differentiated by their place on the A-team, which is the roster of players that can play in Proleague matches, or the B-team, which serves as practice partners for the A-team and plays in the minor Dream League. Both A and B team members can compete in the individual leagues (OSL and MSL). Based on their performance and in-house ranking tournaments, progamers are shifted between the A and B teams by their coaches on a monthly basis.
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Blizzard seems so shady nowadays...
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On July 08 2011 18:15 Clank wrote: just wondering as a newer member of the esports community who didn't follow BW at all, why do people think that kespa is "evil" and something that would be bad for Starcraft 2? All I've managed to get is that they were strict in some way. But in regards to the article, I'm not going to really expect anything like this until something more concrete comes up. This seems sorta sudden and out of the blue for such big news. Hopefully we can see some more Korean leagues in the future though. The more the better!
Its not really exactly black and white. For once while Kespa did have quite strict rules they did take care of their players, but they also worked them a lot.
Its not that simple. As for why it would be bad for SC2.... well I don´t really know, basically it would change the way stuff is run now but also a lot of money and infrastructure would be poured in the SC2 scene.Errr... its really hard to explain, but it comes down to that SC2 pros would have to put up with more restrictions than now
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Not sure what to think about this, KeSPA definitely made some questionable decisions in BW but overall I think they did a decent job. No matter how much people hate KeSPA, they made BW in Korea what it is today and there's no denying that fact (sure, if KeSPA didn't do it someone else might have but KeSPA DID IT (and BoxeR)). After achieving that and having 10 years of experience doing it, I'd trust KeSPA to make SC2 good as well. Even right now I'd kill for a few of the KeSPA map-makers to start working on SC2.
Either way there should be more than one league in Korea, I hate that GOMTV has exclusive rights.
On July 08 2011 18:01 BreakerD wrote: 1. IMO I I think this is freaking fake.
2. We all know that games like BW and SC2 can not co-exist one has to die for the other to succeed, for example look at tourny's involving counter strike its either source or 1.6 (same thing goes for street fighter).
BW and SC2 has co-existed for a year now though without problems and I don't see why it couldn't continue to do so, so no we don't all know that. And KeSPA is managing a lot of games, so I think it's more likely they're just adding one more with SC2.
3. IFand when Kespa does take over sc2. It will be the end of foreign has sc2. Why I say this? Because the same thing happened to the foreign sc bw. When korea 1,2,3 every international tourny regarding BW in a dominate fashion it killed the foreign scene, no matter how hard the foreigners tried they could not catch up in skill level.
Good. Foreigners are in a much better position now to copy the Korean style of gaming houses and training so I doubt a skill-gap that big will happen here. And even if it did I wouldn't care, the higher the skill level is the better.
On July 08 2011 18:19 StyLeD wrote:Show nested quote +On July 08 2011 18:18 iba001 wrote:On July 08 2011 18:13 ReaperX wrote: Please don't bring over the retarded Kespa rules for pro-gamers :/ I agree, I dont like that part of Kespa at all. Can you explain? Many people also hate KeSPA because of what happened with GOMTV in BW, the majority of the KeSPA teams decided not to participate in the league for various reasons, officially I believe it was something like "players doesn't have time to practice/prepare/play in more leagues as there's already too many leagues and even more coming". But to almost everyone this just looked like "KeSPA killed GOMTV classic!". Plus they've made questionable decisions, like at a power outage they awarded the win to a player (and obviously a ton of people doesn't agree with that), chat rules were too strict and sometimes people would get disqualified by just typing something by a mistake. Working conditions for the players, etc, but I don't really know anything about that so won't talk about it.
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On July 08 2011 18:12 Ocedic wrote: Based on what I read:
1) There's no evidence at all to suggest BW being abandoned. Nor is there any logical reason to assume it would be abandoned. Right now, Brood War still has higher viewership and popularity than SC2. Its a much 'safer' game economically.
Well, it's on TV and SC2 isn't. So of course it has higher viewers. The question is how would they compare if they were both on TV, or if SC2 replaced BW. If this rumor is true then I guess Kespa did their research and it was favorable to SC2.
Considering than SC2 is the more popular game to play in Korea (pretty sure I'm remembering that right), and it has a brighter future (better graphics matters like it or not, expansions to come), and better foreign potential, it would make sense that Kespa want in on it.
Replacing BW would be quite surprising though. Perhaps they feel they can't really coexist, or maybe BW is just dying on its own.
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GOM have done a great job imo with sc2, I would hate to see the clowns from KESPA come in and ruin the party.
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