2v2's future in SC2 - Page 2
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KinosJourney2
Sweden1811 Posts
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Al Bundy
7257 Posts
In my opinion, from a spectator point of view, 2v2 can be very entertaining; I love the combination of units from different races, and I love huge battles. Too bad you can't balance 2v2 without screwing 1v1 balance | ||
FaCE_1
Canada6118 Posts
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TurtlePerson2
United States218 Posts
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Ren91
United Kingdom190 Posts
However, I don't know if it would be possible, there's probably some majorly abusive builds that would be unstoppable/crazily good and people wouldn't say "people just need time to figure it out" they would just say that 2v2 is imba and go back to 1v1 . I think Beyonders idea of limiting double race could be an interesting idea. From what I've played (very little) the double race teams I've come up against are really strong. | ||
Shirolol
England504 Posts
Games can turn out to be a crazy fun game with everything you'd expect in a high level 1v1 just x2 but that rarely happens and the game is usually decided in the first 10 minutes, sometimes a LOT less. Someone mentioned bigger maps, this would be nice to see however they can't just be BIG they must also be designed well - maps are tough to balance in 2v2 because of the race/strategy combinations available but if blizzard or anyone for that matter ever wanted 2v2s to be taken seriously things would have to change. And no, just shared bases is certainly not the answer. On April 08 2011 01:30 Ren91 wrote: I think Beyonders idea of limiting double race could be an interesting idea. From what I've played (very little) the double race teams I've come up against are really strong. Double race isn't actually the problem at top levels, it's more about synergy of specific builds/rushes. Sometimes they involve double races but more often than not they don't, so that's kind of a non-factor. | ||
windsupernova
Mexico5280 Posts
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Toboe
United States276 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + I'll spoiler this rant because it doesn't have much to do with 2v2's place in the sc2 community, but probably will spawn a bunch of flaming and other reactions... Apparently scouting and proper mechanics are thrown out the window and cheeses become not just more powerful, but somehow magically "unstoppable" in any setting other than 1v1. I don't understand this. Of course cheese is more powerful when its less known. If someone 6 pools you and you've never heard of a 6 pool before, you're going to get messed up. People simply do not know all of the cheesy plays that exist in 2v2 yet, and with the lack of a strong community, it's difficult to figure out proper reactions to the ones that are known. Unless you've played hundreds of games in the 1v1 setting, you probably can't fend off even half of the cheeses out there - even if you know how, you just don't have the experience. So for so many people to play a few dozen 2v2 games (if that) and then declare it "cheese fest" is either asinine or reveals serious problems with scouting and knowing how to properly react. This is rather disappointing because at a point where the market is oversaturated with 1v1 content for sc2 (literally hundreds of streams/youtube channels and the sc2 tournament subforum is hyperactive with money tournaments) and it's beyond the point where any individual can keep up, and even material like sc2 center has a hard time keeping up with everything. And with NASL and other big circuits coming, the small amount of viewers (in proportion to the amount of content) is going to be split. Choices are good, but there's more to be done Expanding the audience base, in my opinion, is a very important obstacle that needs to be dealt with. I personally hope a 2v2 community that focuses on mechanics and teamwork can grow to exist and attract more people to sc2. Yes, this creates even more content, but it also creates material that isn't as similar to the rest of the content already out there. 2v2 is different enough that I believe it can attract people that are otherwise not interested in what's already out there. | ||
mintiefresh
Canada52 Posts
They should make "all-star" lineup team games similar to how the NHL/NBA does All-star games.... that would be ...if anything...interesting and fun to watch me thinks. | ||
Excalibur_Z
United States12181 Posts
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00Visor
4337 Posts
Give it time. | ||
Spartan
United States2030 Posts
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Chronald
United States619 Posts
2v2 is simply too fragile, even more so than 1v1 (I know right??), even with double racing banned cheese is the strongest strategy no matter what. Both teams have to cheese, which makes games very boring to watch and play. Honestly, 2v2 is fun for friends and shit but for competitive games that are meant to reflect skill and training, 2v2 is a joke. | ||
warshop
Canada490 Posts
On April 08 2011 01:12 Beyonder wrote: I would absolutely love for 2v2s to be incorporated in to clanwars again. It was fun in BW and it was even more fun in WC3! I believe that with decent maps (read: big!) this could be quite fun. As long as you do not allow double race (e.g., 2x protoss... uhm...). I completely agree with your post Beyonder. If maps were adjusted (bigger maps) to deny the too powerful early aggression, it would definitely be a lot more fun. With proper maps, this could be a lot of fun. | ||
FreezerJumps
Canada653 Posts
In BW, every pro team had a 2v2 pair. In general, these players were less successful in individual tournaments because they had to spend a lot of their time practising 2v2. It is unfair to the players on the 2v2 team. | ||
Chronald
United States619 Posts
On April 08 2011 03:27 warshop wrote: I completely agree with your post Beyonder. If maps were adjusted (bigger maps) to deny the too powerful early aggression, it would definitely be a lot more fun. With proper maps, this could be a lot of fun. Do you realize how hard balancing a 2v2 map would be to ensure that cheese isn't as strong? You would have to create a map that is balanced for EACH of the 2v2 MU's, which is more than the normal 5 MUs. Not only that, complex unit combos which never were even considered balance wise would have to be accounted for. I've played my fair share of 2v2 games (around 100) and most start with at least one person cheesing, and if you live through it you win. However, at a professional level, these cheeses would also not be amazingly strong, but they would also be exceptionally well timed. I think that people are trying to make something out of nothing personally. If you watch BW 2v2 it is a joke, the only good VoD was the one with Yellow doing that Larva Egg wall off against a, GASP! 4 pool... The fact is that team games are cheese games no matter what level you are at. | ||
Resilient
United Kingdom1431 Posts
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laegoose
Russian Federation325 Posts
I would absolutely love to see pros playing 2v2 in teamleagues. It's very action-packed and there are a lot of match-ups. Also it would be nice to see some mad builds and unit combinations. | ||
HEROwithNOlegacy
United States850 Posts
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VeNoM HaZ Skill
United States1528 Posts
On April 08 2011 03:30 FreezerJumps wrote: The definitive answer to this question is as follows: In BW, every pro team had a 2v2 pair. In general, these players were less successful in individual tournaments because they had to spend a lot of their time practising 2v2. It is unfair to the players on the 2v2 team. Reach played 2v2, so your point is void. But, seriously it is up to the player. So can you really say that when this "unfairness" is self-imposed? | ||
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